Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread
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@DCHawker said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
If that is what we end up with post portal, then it is going to be a long season. Even with Self coaching, I don’t think that is close to a 20 win team. As you note, no outside shooting. Even worse, that’s 3 small guards and a 4 that doesn’t rebound. Udeh’s not great either. Rolling the dice going all in on Ingram and Dickinson. Whiffed on the first and may on the second, as well. Going to have to find some size and athleticism from someone who doesn’t stay in the draft.
Yup, that lineup is brutal for shooting. To think I was worried about shooting last season! This is worse.
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@BShark said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
Back to canceling the season. Bill definitely won’t add any other players. We are doomed.
LMAO , thee you go again - -
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@rockchalkjayhawk said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
The wing spot is a bit of a mystery with our freshmen, plus the Timberlake addition.
He could start, but with what I’m reading he would ideally be a sixth man?
Were not including Timberlake in this remember? - he is transfer portal
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@jayballer67 said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
@rockchalkjayhawk said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
The wing spot is a bit of a mystery with our freshmen, plus the Timberlake addition.
He could start, but with what I’m reading he would ideally be a sixth man?
Were not including Timberlake in this remember? - he is transfer portal
Sure, no prob. Include Timberlake.
I just didn’t want another transfer speculation thread, that’s all. Was hoping to discuss our current starters, and see how that changes over the next month as we add players to the team.
No worries, these threads evolve. I get it!
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Top of the thread edited for clarity … as i was half asleep when i started it. zzz.
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@rockchalkjayhawk said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
With sooo many moving parts, I thought it would be entertaining to predict potential starting lineups — with ONLY guys on the current roster. No cheating and inserting Hunter until if and when he signs on the dotted line!
Mine:
PG: Dajuan Harris
SG/CG: Elmarko Jackson
SG/CG: Chris Johnson or whichever freshman stands out
Wing-ish: KJ Adams
Center: Ernest Udeh
Analysis: there is basically zero 3 pt shooting skill in this mix of players. That’s an issue. From what I’m reading about Elmarko, he’s going to have a big learning curve playing without being ball dominant. There are some downhill players in the mix though. That’s good. And I don’t love that mix of KJ and Udeh. I’d prefer a four out rotation.
Nothing about KJ’s game is a wing other than his size.
As of today, KU has Dejuan Harris, Kyle Cuffe, KJ Adams, Ernest Udeh, and Zuby Ejiofor as returning players. They have Elmarko Jackson, Chris Johnson, Marcus Adams, Jamari McDowell as incoming freshmen and Nicholas Timberlake as an incoming transfer for the new players.
With that group, right now, I’d go with Harris, Timberlake, Marcus Adams, KJ Adams, and Ernest Udeh for my starting 5. I’d rather have Jackson off the bench so he can spell Harris and gradually learn to play off the ball without that being his primary role. You’d still have Cuffe in an emergency at PG. Johnson and McDowell would then primarily sub at the 2 and 3 spots. Michael Jankovich could also in theory play that spot in a pinch. That leaves Zuby as the lone big off the bench.
As of today, this is a team that would probably do well to finish in the middle of the Big 12.
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I suppose if we can only use players we know will be on the roster next year my guess at the starting lineup would be Harris, Elmarko Jackson, Nick Timberlake, KJ Adams, and Ernest Udeh. However, with Udeh’s foul problems he will only be on the floor 10 minutes a game, meaning a more common lineup will be Harris, Jackson, Timberlake, Marcus Adams, and KJ Adams. Of course, this lineup WILL change with the portal so the posts now are meaningless outside of having fun shooting the breeze. Maybe we won’t get our most desired targets, but we will get a couple players who will compete for starting roles.
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Possibly two freshmen starting?
PG Dajuan Harris
SG Arterio Morris or Elmarko
SF Nick Timberlake
F Marcus Adams
C Udeh
Sixth men: Morris or Elmarko / KJ (just don’t want him and Udeh in at the same time. maybe i’m wrong)
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With Morris in the mix, I’d update my line up to Harris, Morris, Timberlake, KJ Adams, and Udeh with Jackson, Marcus Adams, and Ejiofor as the bench guys getting rotation level minutes.
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I’m breaking the rules and predicting. Anyone think KJ would ever come off the bench? Say we get Tyson and Hunter what on earth happens?
Juan
Morris
Timberlake
Tyson
Hunter
Backups: Elmarko, Marcus, KJ, Udeh
That’s title worthy
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BUMBPPPP
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Might have to remove Udeh from your rotation predictions. Pains me to say it. We will see.
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@BShark said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
Might have to remove Udeh from your rotation predictions. Pains me to say it. We will see.
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@BShark NOOOOOO! He has the best potential defensively.
I figured Zuby would transfer based on the tweets you’d mentioned not Udeh.
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@kuballin10 said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
@BShark NOOOOOO! He has the best potential defensively.
I figured Zuby would transfer based on the tweets you’d mentioned not Udeh.
Now that we are here I think Udeh is more likely. Bill will try to keep him though I am sure.
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Why couldn’t Udeh or Zuby redshirt this Season and stay/develop more ? - -Huner only gonna be here a year anyways
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In one of there threads, IIRC, someone said Zuby was developing ahead of Udeh before an injury. ???
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@BShark this is not right!
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@Crimsonorblue22 said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
@BShark this is not right!
Would bet money we lose Udeh. He loves it here but his guardian thinks he is a starter.
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So self doesn’t develop anymore, just gets one yr guys from portal he can pay every yr?
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This is the new way. past wild wild west
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@Crimsonorblue22 said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
So self doesn’t develop anymore, just gets one yr guys from portal he can pay every yr?
Udeh would stay, probably not up to him though.
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We are the new kentucky
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Nice lineup change! More TK…today hopefully.
Juan — assists and defense
Elmarko (Morris?) — scoring, slashing, hopefully some defense
Timberlake — shooting
Marcus Adams — shooting
Hunter — scoring, rebounding
Bench: Elmarko, KJ, Udeh
Can this lineup cut it defensively?
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@Gorilla72 said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
In one of there threads, IIRC, someone said Zuby was developing ahead of Udeh before an injury. ???
He was, before Zuby got hurt last season, he was the one that started getting most of the back up minutes.
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@jayballer67 said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
Why couldn’t Udeh or Zuby redshirt this Season and stay/develop more ? - -Huner only gonna be here a year anyways
Hunter has 2 years of eligibility. Even if he didn’t come here, it was very likely that one of Udeh or Zuby would’ve transferred out anyway because they both wouldn’t be starters here.
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My personal preference if KU is indeed going to lose either Zuby or Udeh is to lose Udeh. I think he has the lower ceiling of the two. In his limited minutes, Zuby put up dominant rebounding numbers whereas Udeh was a below average rebounder, not as bad as KJ, not not that much better either. Zuby was also the much better shot blocker than Udeh was.
Udeh was a little ahead of Zuby offensively, but Zuby wasn’t bad at 65% from the field and was better at the FT line, although both were bad at the FT last season.
Personally, I think Zuby is the better overall prospect and has the higher ceiling between he and Udeh and my personal choice would be to keep Zuby and let Udeh find somewhere else if it comes to that.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 Interesting. I can see what you are saying but to me Zuby is the safer prospect but Udeh has the higher ceiling. Udeh’s physical tools and athleticism give him the potential (ceiling) to turn into something great. Zuby can be and was already becoming a solid college big man who can be a strong rebounder and good finisher down low but there wasn’t the same spark when he was on the floor. He has yet to get me to the edge of my seat the way Udeh did in spurts last year. I’m sure the injury was a big part of that.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 You getting them confused?
Udeh was the 6-11 guy who’d block shots (often get way out of position and whiff as well) and throw down some lobs.
Zuby may have rebounded better but Udeh had some quick hands getting steals at the top on switches a few times.
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@benshawks08 I agree. Zuby has a higher floor, but lower ceiling. Bill hates mistakes, so Zuby played early. Had he not got injured, I’m not sure Udeh would’ve got any run. I’m a fan of Udeh, I think he can be a star at this level if he stays four years. Zuby can be a McCormack level player in my estimation. Good enough to win you a national title, but not to carry you there. Pdg players
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@kuballin10 said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
@Texas-Hawk-10 You getting them confused?
Udeh was the 6-11 guy who’d block shots (often get way out of position and whiff as well) and throw down some lobs.
Zuby may have rebounded better but Udeh had some quick hands getting steals at the top on switches a few times.
Zuby had a block rate of 12.5% while Udeh was 7.7% so no, I’m not getting them confused. Udeh may have made more highlight level plays than Zuby, but Zuby is much more consistent and sound on that end of the floor than Udeh is. Udeh is a flashier player no doubt, but big men like home haven’t necessarily torn the house down with scoring. Doke never averaged more than 13.7 ppg. Zuby can be a guy that can average a double-double by his senior season, I don’t see Udeh ever being that type of player because of his rebounding.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
Doke never averaged more than 13.7 ppg.
I am sure most KU fans’ memories have built that higher in their minds!
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@Texas-Hawk-10 I dunno, the eye test sure tells me Udeh is better than Zuby. Stats can be misleading sometimes and this might be one of those times. Consider this, a lot of Zuby’s minutes were early season against non-con schedule, some much easier opponents there that skew the numbers. 7 Rebs against ND St, 5 against Texas So. He did have 5 rebs against Duke which is great but also two TOs. Udeh logged 4 Blocks that Duke game! Many of Udeh’s minutes were in the heart of conference schedule and much tougher competition.
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@RockkChalkk said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
@Texas-Hawk-10 I dunno, the eye test sure tells me Udeh is better than Zuby. Stats can be misleading sometimes and this might be one of those times. Consider this, a lot of Zuby’s minutes were early season against non-con schedule, some much easier opponents there that skew the numbers. 7 Rebs against ND St, 5 against Texas So. He did have 5 rebs against Duke which is great but also two TOs. Udeh logged 4 Blocks that Duke game! Many of Udeh’s minutes were in the heart of conference schedule and much tougher competition.
The eye test also tells me that Zuby was getting the back up 5 minutes ahead of Udeh before he hurt his foot. Zuby’s best overall game of the season came against Indiana and Trayce Jackson-Davis who was a consensus 1st team All-American last season. His second best overall game was against OSU in the Big 12 opener.
A lot of Zuby’s advanced numbers on defense are very comparable to what Doke did as a freshman. One thing that Zuby has that’s not an easily teachable trait is instincts and Zuby was light years ahead of Udeh as far as defensive instincts go.
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@kuballin10 said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
@Texas-Hawk-10 You getting them confused?
Udeh was the 6-11 guy who’d block shots (often get way out of position and whiff as well) and throw down some lobs.
Zuby may have rebounded better but Udeh had some quick hands getting steals at the top on switches a few times.
I will say this - it DID seem like he came up with more steals from a guy that size that you wouldn’t think about. - -I really hate to lose either one of these guys though is they both 4 year players, and w have seen thee types develop before into pretty solid payers - -( umm does Azulbuike ring a bell lol- - McCormack ? ) – I know like some have said I GUESS it’s a business but these are suck likeable guys.
Kida wonder with all these transferring out - -and then guys who really didn’t want to leave it seems ( Cuffe ) - kinda pushed out , just wonder some where down the line this doesn’t come back and bite us in the ass
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Back to the original purpose of this thread. New line up with Hunter Dickinson involved now for me would be:
Starters G: Harris G: Morris G: Timberlake F: KJ Adams C: Dickinson
Bench Rotation G: Jackson F: Marcus Adams F: Udeh/Ejiofor
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@jayballer67 said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
@kuballin10 said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
@Texas-Hawk-10 You getting them confused?
Udeh was the 6-11 guy who’d block shots (often get way out of position and whiff as well) and throw down some lobs.
Zuby may have rebounded better but Udeh had some quick hands getting steals at the top on switches a few times.
I will say this - it DID seem like he came up with more steals from a guy that size that you wouldn’t think about. - -I really hate to lose either one of these guys though is they both 4 year players, and w have seen thee types develop before into pretty solid payers - -( umm does Azulbuike ring a bell lol- - McCormack ? ) – I know like some have said I GUESS it’s a business but these are suck likeable guys.
Kida wonder with all these transferring out - -and then guys who really didn’t want to leave it seems ( Cuffe ) - kinda pushed out , just wonder some where down the line this doesn’t come back and bite us in the ass
The long term issue with having both Ejiofor and Udeh is they play the same position, amd were in the same class. One would eventually transfer out anyway over a lack of playing time. This is why coach generally like have their depth staggered in regards to player at the same position as opposed to two guys in the same class like we have with these two.
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@rockchalkjayhawk lets add McCullar and call it a wrap.
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@approxinfinity said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
@rockchalkjayhawk lets add McCullar and call it a wrap.
Done and done!
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@Texas-Hawk-10 said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
Back to the original purpose of this thread. New line up with Hunter Dickinson involved now for me would be:
Starters G: Harris G: Morris G: Timberlake F: KJ Adams C: Dickinson
Bench Rotation G: Jackson F: Marcus Adams F: Udeh/Ejiofor
Timberlake at the 3 guy ?
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@approxinfinity said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
@rockchalkjayhawk lets add McCullar and call it a wrap.
That would be my #1 target
esp if another player in the fold exits.
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Maybe jumping the gun a little bit, but it seems fairly likely Mgbako will be a Jayhawk on Friday so an updated projection.
Starters:
G- Harris
G- Morris
F- Mgbako
F- KJ Adams
C- Dickinson
Rotation players
G- Jackson
G- Timberlake
F- Marcus Adams
F- Udeh
Deep Bench
G- Johnson
G- McDowell
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@approxinfinity said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
@rockchalkjayhawk lets add McCullar and call it a wrap.
Ok let’s say this ALL together lol - -KEVIN IS NOT I repeat- - NOT COMING BACK - -there now don’t you feel better lol
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I think a million dollar reduction in salary is crazy high. Heck if they fired him he could probably collect better than that even if the U protested.
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For what it’s worth, I wonder if the freshmen will get a lot of play early to acclimatize themselves to KU ball and (later) AFH. There’s not much at stake in Puerto Rico and the exhibition game. It could build “team”. Then we see “the best of the best”. Thoughts?
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I know it’s not likely to happen, but it’d still argue that KJ needs to come off the bench. By the looks of Self’s offseason take charge attitude, I think he’s ready to move on from KJ as a starter.
Starters:
G- Harris
G- Morris
F- Timberlake
F- Mgbako
C- Dickinson
Rotation players
G- Jackson
wing/big - KJ
F- Marcus Adams
F- Udeh
Deep Bench
G- Johnson
G- McDowell
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@Gorilla72 yeah I expect a VERY long bench in PR. Reduce the risks of getting anyone hurt
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@rockchalkjayhawk said in Off-season starting lineup ever changing thread:
I know it’s not likely to happen, but it’d still argue that KJ needs to come off the bench. By the looks of Self’s offseason take charge attitude, I think he’s ready to move on from KJ as a starter.
Starters:
G- Harris
G- Morris
F- Timberlake
F- Mgbako
C- Dickinson
Rotation players
G- Jackson
wing/big - KJ
F- Marcus Adams
F- Udeh
Deep Bench
G- Johnson
G- McDowell
I think wee gonna see El Marko over Morris
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Well, that lock of getting MM was a bit off the mark! So, just like going into last year, i have concerns about 3 pt shooting with this roster.
Back to this lineup:
Starters
G- Dajuan Harris
G- Arterio Morris
F- Nicolas Timberlake (it’s all i can do to NOT call him Justin!)
F- KJ Adams (somebody has to play here)
C- Hunter Dickinson (better not be a freaking bust!)
Rotation players
G - Elmarko Jackson
Wing - Marcus Adams Jr.
Needed: A backup big
Deep Bench (we’ll see if they are deep, or less deep)
G- Chris Johnson
G- Jamari McDowell
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With this mornings news, new line up should be
G- Harris
G- Morris
F- McCullar
F- KJ Adams
C- Dickinson
Bench (Rotation level minutes)
G- Jackson
G- Timberlake
F- Marcus Adams
Deep Bench
G- Johnson
G- McDowell
F- Braun
A rotation quality 5 should be the final piece to this puzzle.
