OU, Texas to the SEC?
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@bskeet said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
I notice that several schools are paired with KU when speculating about Big 10 additions. No one is talking about Notre Dame. They’ve been independent, but weren’t they a part of the Big10 basketball schedule and didn’t they join the Big10 football schedule this past year due to COVID? Would that perhaps make them a candidate or are there unsurmountable obstacles?
Yes, their quasi-deal with the ACC stipulates if they join a conference, has to be the ACC
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Ah-- it was the ACC they were playing with. Sorry for the confusion!
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@FarmerJayhawk All day long we take that nugget. Btw, thanks for the nugget. Question though, why would UVA want to move from the ACC?
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@nwhawkfan nah, the Big12 is toast.
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@BShark I like it.
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Texas Tech , TCU , & Baylor all have already reached out to the Pac 12. - -You guys I know not on the Football side , BUT believe it or not - if this turns out which simply looks like it’s happening - -I’m actually miss the K-State / KU rivalary - - no more K-State ? - - - -sooooo many years just won’t seem right. - - Isn’t that rivalry one of the oldest - I know - -but it just won’t seem right
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I think KU and KState will find a way to play one another annually if they aren’t in the same conference after the dust settles. Similar to how Iowa St and Iowa are currently.
It will be interesting to see whether the P12 takes TCU or Baylor since they are religious universities. If the B12 conference dissolves, the best-case scenario for KState might be getting into the P12.
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@KirkIsMyHinrich said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
I think KU and KState will find a way to play one another annually if they aren’t in the same conference after the dust settles. Similar to how Iowa St and Iowa are currently.
It will be interesting to see whether the P12 takes TCU or Baylor since they are religious universities. If the B12 conference dissolves, the best-case scenario for KState might be getting into the P12.
TCU and Baylor are not religious schools in the same way BYU is. Neither school has the same level of code of conduct BYU has. TCU isn’t even dry campus, it has coed dorms, and is typically ranked as one of the better party schools in the country. TCU is basically a religious school in name only. Baylor is a lot more strict in that regard as it is a dry school and doesn’t have coed dorms, but it still doesn’t approach BYU.
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I didn’t say either of them were religious schools in the same way BYU is. TCU is a private Christian University. Baylor is a private Baptist University. Maybe that won’t be an issue for the P12, but I’m not sure. You seem pretty sure.
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Thia is going to be some BS if they leave immediately and we dont get a showdown with Beard. https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/31868545/source-oklahoma-sooners-texas-longhorns-verge-making-sec-move
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@Texas-Hawk-10 Hmm. Code of Conduct and Baylor doesn’t really seem to jibe.
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@KirkIsMyHinrich said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
I didn’t say either of them were religious schools in the same way BYU is. TCU is a private Christian University. Baylor is a private Baptist University. Maybe that won’t be an issue for the P12, but I’m not sure. You seem pretty sure.
Are seriously trying to explain the culture of two Texas schools to someone who grew up in Texas and basically lived here my entire life?
Again, TCU is a Christian school in name only. I have spent plenty of time on both campuses as well as several other Christian universities in the region. TCU has very few of thallmarks of a Christian university. There is no other Christian school I have ever been to that is a wet campus. There is no other Christian school I have been to that has coed dorms. TCU being a “Christian” school will not be a stumbling block for the P12 looking at them.
Baylor has a lot more of the hallmarks such as being dry and not having coed dorms. They also have an on campus seminary, but that’s part of why they’re officially the largest Southern Baptist school in the world. Baylor however is nowhere near as strict on a lot of other policies that you’ll find at other Christian schools such as chapel and a code of conduct.
The reason I bring up BYU is because they have made multiple attempts to join the PAC only to be rejected because of their religious affiliation. TCU would not have those issues, but Baylor likely would.
The biggest issue however and why the PAC 12 won’t add any Big 12 school is California bill AB1887 which prohibits state funded California schools from traveling to play in states with LGBT discrimination laws in place. All current states within the Big 12 footprint are on that list and why KU can’t play UCLA, Cal, or any other public school in California.
Even if the 12 schools voted 12-0 to admit these schools, California law will pretty much keep the PAC 12 from expansion.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 I didn’t really read your response, but I’m just going to tell you: the reason I don’t engage you very frequently on buckets is because I believe you get into arguments with people in bad-faith. In other words, the points in question aren’t really up for debate in your mind, but rather you just have a need to prove that you are right and the other poster is wrong. Consequently, I don’t find discussions with you to be particularly informative/constructive or fun at all.
I think it will be interesting to see what happens with the remaining B12 teams. Have a good day.
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@approxinfinity 18 month?
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@BShark anyway A and M would back out join us and maybe sayyyyyy Colorado? Or somebody else? Not worth it?
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@Crimsonorblue22 said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
@BShark anyway A and M would back out join us and maybe sayyyyyy Colorado? Or somebody else? Not worth it?
We’re peacing out of the Big 12 if possible. Marriages of convenience don’t last ¯_(ツ)_/¯
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@Crimsonorblue22 augh haha thank you. I missed that
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Rip big 12
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@KirkIsMyHinrich As with everybody else, you have to sort through the chaff to find the wheat. For example, the point about Calif law was important.
I agree that there is a short fuse when anyone ventures an opinion on something he perceives as his bailiwick. But I have noticed that with almost everyone who writes long expository posts.
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Another thing this is going to do , if the Conference dissolves after Texas & Oklahoma bolt to the SEC. Which I fully believe , I don’t think there would be any saving the Big 12 if they leave for the SEC. - Soo with no more Big 12 - -there goes the Big 12 tourney in the Sprint Center. Been a Stable for the community along time . No more Conference tourneys there, No more 2nd home advantage for KU. Where is it that the Big 10 has their post Season Conference tourney ?
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KU has most B1G Presidents/Chancellors on board.
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Just read an article written by David Briggs " The Blade " Toledo Ohio . Wasn’t the best of things we as KU fans would like to read or believe BUT art the same time brings out some kind of harsh but yet very realistic points that wouldn’t make things very favorable in our favor for joining the Big 10. Which gets a person to thinking - - - if we as KU didn’t get accepted into the Big 10 assuming this all goes down then exactly where DO WE GO ? Here is the things he had to say. Again kind of not so good but yet has valid points…
He said his 1st thought about the Big 10 answer to the SEC adding OU & Texas was the Big 10 adding KU & Iowa State - his 1st thought that it was a bad idea. Then he said after sitting back and thinking moe about it he thought would be a TERRIBLE IDEA for the Big 10. Saying that would be like doing expansion for the sake of Expansion. He said if the Big 10 countered the SEC adding Oklahoma & Texas by adding Ku & Iowa State would be like answering a Nuclear strike with a water Balloon.
Briggs says Expansion is all about Money & Power , with Football driving the train he Says what would the Big 10 be adding by adding KU & Iowa State ? Topeka Market ? - Kansas City ? saying that the Big 10 wouldn’t be creating near enough value to it’s TV deal to offest the 2 extra mouths to feed.
This doesn’t shine a very good spin for us , but yet in a way you can see his point , Makes me feel not quitet as sure about us landing being accepted into the Big 10. Again if that turns out to be so - - then where do we go ?
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Briggs needs to think a little harder. The media landscape is about to change very quickly. Basketball will become more valuable in the event of a breakaway. The B1G institutions like what we bring in research $. The big concern from their side a decade ago was facilities. That’s no longer an issue. In fact, it’s actually a positive now. Rock Chalk Park is an elite facility and capable of holding meets and tournaments at the conference or national level.
With streaming, media markets aren’t nearly as important as they were 10 years ago. It’s just as easy for a KU alum in Chicago to watch KU as it is an alum in LFK. It’s going to be very important to get eyeballs and sell subs to services like ESPN+.
Not guaranteeing we go to the Big Ten. I think the ACC is also a legit option.
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Some interesting conversations I heard a National sports talk show off 1490 FM here in Topeka , every Sunday Night. - -It was mentioned that I guess said to the big 12 that in order for them to stay in the Conference or at least one major sticking point for them to stay would be - - they want their share of conference revenue to increase. - -Every member of the big 12 right now gets 37 million - -Oklahoma & Texas want their shares to be increased to 56 Million… The Host of this talk show said that he was sure that the other members of the Big 12 he was sure probably wouldn’t have a problem with that realizing that they are the Big brother of the league. But what’s to say he said would keep them from bolting in 2025 even if you gave them the increase for the SEC or Pac 12 or the ACC in 2025 when it’s time for the rights to be renewed.
Another interesting tidbit they came out with about Oklahoma & Texas bolting for the SEC. - - Seems like the Texas legislature has introduced a bill that states that for a Conference team to switch leagues that it would have to be passed by the Texas Legislature - - the interesting thing about this is this could be really interesting cause they named one of the legislators is a grad from like Texas Tech - -Another from TCU - - Another from Baylor and yet another from another Texas lol - -sounds like these guys wanting to play hard ball about letting Texas transfer out of Conference. - The pushing to rush this bill through they said OMG that’s funny.
Another thing they said was OK Oklahoma says OK Texas can’t go - - that’s fine - -Oklahoma says we go and just take our little Sister - - Oklahoma State. BUT the question then becomes - - does the Big 10 WANT Oklahoma State instead of Texas - - this just took another twist - going to be interesting. - - I still think in the end they go BUT ya just never know
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@jayballer67 said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
BUT the question then becomes - - does the Big 10 WANT Oklahoma State instead of Texas
Assume you mean SEC?
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@mayjay said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
@jayballer67 said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
BUT the question then becomes - - does the Big 10 WANT Oklahoma State instead of Texas
Assume you mean SEC?
ya that’s what I meant tp put - -flat screwed that up huh lol. - -the question becomes does the SEC want Oklahoma State with Oklahoma ? - -I also remembered the other legislator referring to my other post about Texas , the legisliture having to pass before they could join the SEC & that other one that I was referring about he is a grad from Texas A & M. - So you have Texas Tech - -TCU - - Baylor - & Texas A & M all there and they would have to vote in favor in the legislature to allow Texas to join the SEC - -they are trying to rush the bil through to get put in place. - -Like I said I think when it’s all said and done they wil go - - BUT might cause some snags for awhile
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Its over OU, Texas pulling out. Whether it happens before 2025 is going to be hotly decided
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@BeddieKU23 said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
Its over OU, Texas pulling out. Whether it happens before 2025 is going to be hotly decided
I think it’s inevitable. They can’t say they’re leaving now or they’re on the hook for any damages, but I’d be really surprised if they’re in the league a year from now.
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Will be interesting to see how it plays out.
Per ESPN
“The possibility remains that they pay the $75-80 million penalty for leaving early, while also giving the required 18 months’ notice, per Big 12 bylaws.”
This was interesting…
“Some have speculated that this is the first legal maneuver, and the possibility also exists that if the Big 12 dissolves before 2025, OU and Texas would no longer be bound to stay through the duration of the contract.”
“The move might be costly for Oklahoma and Texas. Under Big 12 bylaws, they have to give the league 18 months’ notice that they’re leaving. The two schools signed agreements with the Big 12 that granted their first- and second-tier media rights to the league through June 30, 2025, and the Big 12 would own their rights until the deal expires – even if they leave.”
The last part about the Big-12 owning their rights even if they leave makes, wow. I bet they are hoping the Big-12 dissolves…
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@BeddieKU23 Funny thing will be if the B12 somehow ends up surviving even as a lesser conference… Which is something I think is a real possibility.
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I personally think the B12 stays alive - even if we leave.
- KSU
- ISU
- TTU
- TCU
- Baylor
- Houston
- UCF
- Cincinnati
- SMU
- OSU
- WVU
There is a future if enough schools want to stay.
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If Bob Bowlsby was a good commissioner, the Big 12 would be calling up Arizona, Arizona St., Utah, and Colorado along with Houston, SMU, Cincinnati, and UCF to expand as much as possible regardless of what KU, ISU, and WVU do.
The benefits for the PAC schools would be better exposure instead of the “PAC 12 After Dark” time slots which would be help recruiting and marketing. Without OU and Texas, the Big 12 would have to add Houston and SMU to keep asuch of a presence in those two cities as possible. Cincy is a program that would likely step up the way TCU did after joining and would give WVU a regional team. UCF is a strong program, and having a school on an island isn’t something that’s an issue for the Big 12 considering WVU’s situation. Memphis would probably be a a back up plan for UCF if geography is a factor.
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@BeddieKU23 said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
Its over OU, Texas pulling out. Whether it happens before 2025 is going to be hotly decided
well If Texas & Oklahoma wanna pay their 80 million each then we will see them in the SEC by 2022. - Which probably they will cause of the SE has mentioned would be worth it for sure.
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@Kcmatt7 said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
I personally think the B12 stays alive - even if we leave.
- KSU
- ISU
- TTU
- TCU
- Baylor
- Houston
- UCF
- Cincinnati
- SMU
- OSU
- WVU
There is a future if enough schools want to stay.
I don’t see West Virginia - -more apt to go back and be in the ACC
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Keep us in the above list and add Boise State, BYU, Colorado and Colorado State, and/or Arizona and Arizona State
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Can confirm KU has no interest in extending its GoR with the Big 12 at this time.
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@FarmerJayhawk said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
Can confirm KU has no interest in extending its GoR with the Big 12 at this time.
What is GoR Farmer ? - -little thick here lol
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@jayballer67 said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
@FarmerJayhawk said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
Can confirm KU has no interest in extending its GoR with the Big 12 at this time.
What is GoR Farmer ? - -little thick here lol
Lol no worries my dude. It’s the grant of rights, so us signing over our tv deals to the league because we’re all more valuable together than individually
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@FarmerJayhawk said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
@jayballer67 said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
@FarmerJayhawk said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
Can confirm KU has no interest in extending its GoR with the Big 12 at this time.
What is GoR Farmer ? - -little thick here lol
Lol no worries my dude. It’s the grant of rights, so us signing over our tv deals to the league because we’re all more valuable together than individually
So I guess what your saying then is that KU also has no intention or want to renew after current runs out. More or less just dissolve the Big 12 and look elsewhere ? - -Is that right ? Or no saying they want the Big 12 to band together ? - this crap is just I dunnoa. Personally I almost feel like saying screw it and everyone ttry and find new desginations
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@Texas-Hawk-10 said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
If Bob Bowlsby was a good commissioner, the Big 12 would be calling up Arizona, Arizona St., Utah, and Colorado along with Houston, SMU, Cincinnati, and UCF to expand as much as possible regardless of what KU, ISU, and WVU do.
With the Arizona schools in the Pacific Time zone for most of the basketball season, that would make it tough for them to move to an earlier time slot even if they were to switch conferences. They really can’t start games at 5PM local time.
Utah and Colorado could work, but only if WVU leaves for the ACC. I just don’t know how a college conference stretches across three time zones and makes that work.
I think there is an opportunity to expand east, but it is dependent on landing schools like Houston, Memphis, Cincinnati, perhaps Marshall and others.
The Big 12 could survive, but probably not at the P5 level.
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@justanotherfan said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
@Texas-Hawk-10 said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
If Bob Bowlsby was a good commissioner, the Big 12 would be calling up Arizona, Arizona St., Utah, and Colorado along with Houston, SMU, Cincinnati, and UCF to expand as much as possible regardless of what KU, ISU, and WVU do.
With the Arizona schools in the Pacific Time zone for most of the basketball season, that would make it tough for them to move to an earlier time slot even if they were to switch conferences. They really can’t start games at 5PM local time.
Utah and Colorado could work, but only if WVU leaves for the ACC. I just don’t know how a college conference stretches across three time zones and makes that work.
I think there is an opportunity to expand east, but it is dependent on landing schools like Houston, Memphis, Cincinnati, perhaps Marshall and others.
The Big 12 could survive, but probably not at the P5 level.
It’s actually not difficult to schedule Arizona schools in midweek games. Big Monday games start at 8pm Central Time which is 6pm in Arizona. That’s genuinely not an issue in basketball and when most national Big 12 games air during the week.
As for travel, if you expand, you expand to 16 and set up 4 divisions with 4 teams. Let’s say for example a 16 team Big 12 (minus Texas, OU, KU, and ISU) those divisions could look like:
Arizona, Arizona St., Utah, and BYU in a western division.
Baylor, Houston, SMU, and TCU in a southern division.
Texas Tech, OSU, KSU, and Colorado in a northern division.
WVU, Cincy, UCF, USF/Memphis in an eastern division.
In football for example, you’d play your division every year (3 games) and 2 teams from the other divisions (6 games) for a 9 game schedule. For eastern and western division teams, that’d be one road trip a year out west.
In sports like basketball, with a 16 team conference, you’d play your division teams twice and everyone else once so that’d be two trips per year across multiple timezones for the east and west teams.
In some of the smaller Olympic sports, allow teams associate memberships in other leagues to reduce travel costs or just make an unbalanced schedule where an easy or west team is only traveling east or west once per season max since not ever school competes in every sport.
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@jayballer67 said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
@FarmerJayhawk said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
@jayballer67 said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
@FarmerJayhawk said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
Can confirm KU has no interest in extending its GoR with the Big 12 at this time.
What is GoR Farmer ? - -little thick here lol
Lol no worries my dude. It’s the grant of rights, so us signing over our tv deals to the league because we’re all more valuable together than individually
So I guess what your saying then is that KU also has no intention or want to renew after current runs out. More or less just dissolve the Big 12 and look elsewhere ? - -Is that right ? Or no saying they want the Big 12 to band together ? - this crap is just I dunnoa. Personally I almost feel like saying screw it and everyone ttry and find new desginations
My impression from KU is plan A) B1G plan
ACC plan C) pray
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listening to regional sports talk right now. They say that 4 years is laughable , saying no way will Oklahoma & Texas stay in the Big 12 till 2025 & I agree - -no way this thing runs it’s course. - -SEC willing to help pay their buy out no problems. Better Scenario more then likely Oklahoma & Texas WILL BE playing ball in the SEC in 2022 - -they don’t give a crap about giving any 18 month notice here again any penality face SEC will step in and help out.
They also saying NO WAY was Bowlsby in total dark about these going on’s - He knew - -no way did he not know something about this . - -Think quite possibly that KU ends up in the Big 10 not feeeling quite as well about that now as I was yesterday but hope that it turns out that way
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@jayballer67 said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
listening to regional sports talk right now. They say that 4 years is laughable , saying no way will Oklahoma & Texas stay in the Big 12 till 2025 & I agree - -no way this thing runs it’s course. - -SEC willing to help pay their buy out no problems. Better Scenario more then likely Oklahoma & Texas WILL BE playing ball in the SEC in 2022 - -they don’t give a crap about giving any 18 month notice here again any penality face SEC will step in and help out.
They also saying NO WAY was Bowlsby in total dark about these going on’s - He knew - -no way did he not know something about this . - -Think quite possibly that KU ends up in the Big 10 not feeeling quite as well about that now as I was yesterday but hope that it turns out that way
I completely believe Bowlsby was totally in the dark given his last handling of issues. Bowlsby was probably 4th out of 5 among the P5 commissioners and that’s only because of what Larry Scott did to the PAC in making them completely irrelevant and leaving them in a position where there’s speculation about the Big 12 raiding them.
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Well, we are “out”…the question is just where we are going to be “in”. If it is the “Big XII” (or other non-P conference) we are going to be on the stepping stone to death…be it slow or fast depending on where we land. If we don’t make the B1G or the SEC our athletic programs are going to take a MAJOR hit…to the tune of as much as $30M PER YEAR!! I certainly can’t write a check to cover that! Can you? The people over on KU Sports seem to think that we’re going to be “OK”…I don’t know if they are in denial or really just don’t understand what college sports have become…a BIG BUSINESS. And, in BIG BUSINESS, the “little guy” (read: Non P Conferences) really doesn’t seem to have much of a chance. Not only would we not have a plate at the table, we wouldn’t have a table!! Not trying to be an alarmist, but with I think no more than a 50-50 chance for landing in the B1G and even less for the SEC, I hope our new AD is in 24/7 mode!
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@ICTJayhawk said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
Well, we are “out”…the question is just where we are going to be “in”. If it is the “Big XII” (or other non-P conference) we are going to be on the stepping stone to death…be it slow or fast depending on where we land. If we don’t make the B1G or the SEC our athletic programs are going to take a MAJOR hit…to the tune of as much as $30M PER YEAR!! I certainly can’t write a check to cover that! Can you? The people over on KU Sports seem to think that we’re going to be “OK”…I don’t know if they are in denial or really just don’t understand what college sports have become…a BIG BUSINESS. And, in BIG BUSINESS, the “little guy” (read: Non P Conferences) really doesn’t seem to have much of a chance. Not only would we not have a plate at the table, we wouldn’t have a table!! Not trying to be an alarmist, but with I think no more than a 50-50 chance for landing in the B1G and even less for the SEC, I hope our new AD is in 24/7 mode!
Goff isn’t really on this issue. Girod however…
There’s significant interest from B1G Presidents in adding KU. Nobody knows if it’ll happen or not, but looks good as of 9:54 PM 7/26
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@ICTJayhawk said in OU, Texas to the SEC?:
Well, we are “out”…the question is just where we are going to be “in”. If it is the “Big XII” (or other non-P conference) we are going to be on the stepping stone to death…be it slow or fast depending on where we land. If we don’t make the B1G or the SEC our athletic programs are going to take a MAJOR hit…to the tune of as much as $30M PER YEAR!! I certainly can’t write a check to cover that! Can you? The people over on KU Sports seem to think that we’re going to be “OK”…I don’t know if they are in denial or really just don’t understand what college sports have become…a BIG BUSINESS. And, in BIG BUSINESS, the “little guy” (read: Non P Conferences) really doesn’t seem to have much of a chance. Not only would we not have a plate at the table, we wouldn’t have a table!! Not trying to be an alarmist, but with I think no more than a 50-50 chance for landing in the B1G and even less for the SEC, I hope our new AD is in 24/7 mode!
Oh agree for the most part. - -I think NO CHANCE for the SEC , don’t think the powers to be are even digging into that possibility. Which leaves the Big 10 - - The Pac 12 - - or the ACC. - -I to think it’s looking like right now we are a 50/50 with the Big 10
