Vick Coming Back
-
Best case scenario for everyone involved. Amazing. Happy to have him back under conditions. I expect a HUGE jump from him. A motivated Vick is scary.
-
KUSTEVE said:
@BShark We could do the two lineup thing, like Tucky did a few years back. We’re deep as the ocean.
Key difference: Self is an actual coach. I’m not convinced with Calipari. LOL.
I beat Self only rolls 9 deep. Someone will be upset. Or Silvio won’t be eligible… Stuff will work itself out. Expect 0 minutes from Agbaji, Mitch and Cunliffe. 10th guy is probably McCormack. But man yeah talk about a loaded roster.
-
We only go 10 deep for sure. I’m interested to see the minutes distribution. Team is versatile as hell. Interested in what a 5 guard switch everything lineup would look like with Grimes, Vick, Garrett, K.J. and Cunliffe would look like. Won’t happen, but it’s there lol.
On the flip side, you can go BIG with Grimes, Vick, K.J., Bi Dave and Doke.
Uber fast/athletic/big with Dotson, Moore, Grimes, K.J. and De Sousa.
Defensive team with Grimes, Garrett, K.J., Dedric and Doke.
Possibilities are endless with this group. Chemistry is going to be the key. And I think we have enough role players and good passers/playmakers to make that a non issue.
This team has the potential to legitimately be the best offensive and defensive team in the country. I wonder what Vegas odds look like now. Kentucky moved into best odds after Reid Travis committed, but I bet this puts us back in first.
Props to Self for making this happen and the Vick’s for being willing to make this work. A motivated Senior Vick is as good as landing a 5 star recruit. At least, I sure hope so.
-
I think this is a good move for all parties, obviously Vick has had his issues with Coach and gotten into trouble at times but I never liked the idea of giving up on him. This could shake up the line up, how many players will be in the rotation. Self has liked his 7 or 8 rotation most years but he have to play 9, which is good imo with our tough SOS. I’d put money on Agbaji redshirting and Mitch maybe smart to do so if DeSousa can go as well. Can Sam redshirt, even tho he sat out his transfer year? I honestly didn’t think he was going to get a ton of PT with or without Vick ether way. I’d say a line up of Dotson, Vick, Grimes, D Lawson and Doke is looking pretty good with K.J., Moore, DeSousa and Garrett getting most the bench play but I wouldn’t sleep on Garrett starting over Dotson at PG ether. I think Charlie will be the third option at the spot. Man this team team is easily as deep as coach Self has had here, right up there with 07 and 08.
-
FWIW, I think Grimes will end up with minutes at PG now just to keep him on the floor. Which means a battle throughout the season between Moore and Dotson. Might be as simple as riding the hit hand for that day.
Easily the deepest team we have ever had under Self. I honestly don’t know what to do. Selfs biggest issue coaching this team will be finding minutes for everyone.
Garrett might even struggle to see the floor if he doesn’t get his jumper up to standards this summer.
My brain hurts thinking of the options. I would pay money just to watch practices this year. Might have two top 10 teams playing each other everyday at practice this year.
-
@Kcmatt7 https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/college-basketball-odds-duke-kentucky-and-kansas-big-favorites-to-make-it-to-the-2019-final-four/
We were 6-1 odds b4 Vick, so I’ll bet we’ll be favored ahead of Tucky and Dook now.
-
@KUSTEVE I would think so.
-
@Kcmatt7 It feels like Xmas.
-
@kjayhawks I do think Sam could redshirt technically. He didn’t his first year. Would be crazy to have 3 redshirts… but not impossible. Self has to have a nonstop smile going right now. And, in theory, it would be smart for those three to redshirt and get their masters or have the option to be a grad transfer if that’s what they would like to do.
-
@KUSTEVE Bill has made it a routine of giving us a Christmas present late in the year. Guy always has an ace up his sleeve.
-
Cunliffe can RS, but he is more likely to transfer after this season than do that.
-
Woodrow said:
Wow. I am completely shocked. Wonder what Grimes and Dotson think about this…
Will be interesting to see how all this plays out.
I don’t think this effects Dotson or Grimes at all. – Vick played the 3 more then anything, and chances are he will share playing time at the 3 again. – ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
-
BShark said:
Woodrow said:
Wow. I am completely shocked. Wonder what Grimes and Dotson think about this…
Will be interesting to see how all this plays out.
I don’t think Dotson and Grimes are too worried. Zero chance Cunliffe plays now though and I bet Agbaji takes a RS.
You would think almost a certainly he would look to red shirt now
-
Gorilla72 said:
But Charlie Moore already has #2!
that’s not gonna change - - Vick will have a different number
-
BShark said:
Gorilla72 said:
But Charlie Moore already has #2!
Vick has to change numbers and do summer school. Maybe he will reach some kind of a turning point. If he finds another gear watch out.
only needs 12 hours in Summer School to graduate - if he can get his head on right , this team is just insane - -need consistency from him though , no more disappearing acts in game time - -better defense
-
BShark said:
DOTSON, VICK, GRIMES, DEDRIC, DOKE.
BENCH: Garrett, KJ, Moore, Silvio
DEEP BENCH: Mitch, Cunliffe, McCormack, Agbaji
GOOOOOOOOOOOOOD LAWD HAVE MERCY @jayballer73
LAWD HAVE MERCY IS RIGHT. - - these team has so many different combinations it can run out - - so , so , so , deep. just an complete 360 from last year. I feel this team can be so aggressive defensively I mean really get after it cause of their depth not having to worry so much about their foul situation. Thing is though Vick’s starting is not a given, he is going to have to earn the spot , maybe the competition is what he needs - does give us that experience though for sure. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
-
jayballer73 said:
BShark said:
Gorilla72 said:
But Charlie Moore already has #2!
Vick has to change numbers and do summer school. Maybe he will reach some kind of a turning point. If he finds another gear watch out.
only needs 12 hours in Summer School to graduate - if he can get his head on right , this team is just insane - -need consistency from him though , no more disappearing acts in game time - -better defense
To graduate while still doing all his SR year work too right? Like, he was pretty behind.
-
@Woodrow K J has considered him self a guard yet he can play the 3 you might see KJ having backup at the 2 spot in certain situations , he can for sure can compete for the 3 - I’m sure Coach has told Vick that he is going to have to earn that spot. - -Coach is just not going to let him walk back in and just give him that position. - We shall see how it plays out - -crazy competition but what a great position to be in. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
-
LOL - - -WOWZA IS RIGHT - -MAYBE EVEN A WOWZA- - - - WOWZA LOL. – ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
-
@Kcmatt7 – Sooooo , many options - - -combinations -it could be crazy.
-
I did hear the team voted
-
Crimsonorblue22 said:
I did hear the team voted
lol
-
KUSTEVE said:
@Kcmatt7 It feels like Xmas.
You mean it’s not lmao. - - -I mean " - - JUMPIN - - -GEE - - HOSSA - - -FATS " - - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
-
"I told him I’d sleep on it. Certainly I did,” Self said. “I feel not only is it the best choice for him, but us. I did it with total support from all his teammates.”
-
Did not see this one coming. Hopefully he can bump his shooting to 40% and be a defensive specialist.
-
Sounds to me like Vick had absolutely nowhere to go and he’s completely at Self’s mercy. This is a win-win situation for Self and Vick if there ever was one.
But it does have the stinch of the Bagley/Carter scenario. Biggest difference is there aren’t any potential lottery picks vying for the same PT as Vick.
-
I am sure you meant a 180 degree turn from last year. BTW, he needs 12 credit hours AFTER Summer school which is pretty dang good.
-
A couple things on this.
-Vick will have to earn everything. From his number to minutes to looks.
-If it doesn’t work, he’s gone. Degree or not. Nobody really knows how far away from a degree he is. That’s a FERPA violation. These things absolutely don’t leak in any concrete way. Anyone who says they know is party to a crime.
-From a basketball standpoint, this is a low risk, high reward play. I think we end up with a small guard, Grimes, Vick, Lawson, Doke playing most of the minutes.
-Along those lines, averages will be stupid. Anyone who cites an average without context doesn’t understand basketball. Ignore them. Look at who plays against different teams that play different styles. Yeah, it’ll take some work but none of you want to come across as morons, right?
-1-13, it’s the most talented squad in the country. Not sure anyone is that close. However, people don’t play 13. We’ll only play 9 at most: Moore, Dotson, Grimes, Vick, Garrett, Lawson, Lawson, Silvio, Doke.
-Vick “should” be better this season for a couple reasons. He’ll be able to plan exclusively as a guard/wing and has every incentive to do those things well plus be a good teammate. He immediately adds shooting and defensive ability. Otherwise he won’t play.
-Holy s#!+ we’re loaded.
-
Vick is the difference between a paper team and a real one.
Back when Brown found him, he was a future PG; then Self put him through the play-out-of-position at the 2-3 for 3 years. Board rats forget he is really a PG. Like Devonte and Tyshawn he is primed for a great 4th season at the point, after serving as domestique at the 2.
Vick at point would be cruel MUA most games!
Self will probably start out playing him as a sixth man at all perimeter positions to show Grimes and Dotson they aren’t ready.
-
jaybate 1.0 said:
Vick is the difference between a paper team and a real one.
Back when Brown found him, he was a future PG; then Self put him through the play-out-of-position at the 2-3 for 3 years. Board rats forget he is really a PG. Like Devonte and Tyshawn he is primed for a great 4th season at the point, after serving as domestique at the 2.
Vick at point would be cruel MUA most games!
Self will probably start out playing him as a sixth man at all perimeter positions to show Grimes and Dotson they aren’t ready.
Vick was never considered a PG. He was recruited as a 2/wing.
-
I’m happy. Him leaving was strange the way it went down. We’re loaded.
-
@BShark Nice edit…lol.
-
-
@FarmerJayhawk I’m not trying to be confrontational, but the 12 hours remaining for Vick to graduate was a quote from Self that was published on KUSPORTS: "After the summer session, Vick will be just 12 hours shy of graduating, Self said."Perhaps I am ignorant, but I wouldn’t think it would make any of us guilty of any crime by quoting what our head coach said.
-
@BShark I never thought Vick had the handles to play point. Just my opinion.
-
There’s an empty seat at scorer’s table. Life is a good.
Two months ago we had lost all five starters. The Board was expressing nervousness. The continuation of The Streak looked weak.
Today we have 40% of the starters returning. The Board is on board and happy and supportive. The Team has been Tweeked, The Streak may peak.
Does it get any better than this in the off season? RCJHK!
-
-
Who else votes to skip the football season and just start our D1 basketball season in August? For the first time ever, I’m thinking basketball in the summer, not KU football. I’ve got our starters as Dok, Dedric, Vick, Grimes and a PG to be determined by fall practice. If KJ or someone else beats Vick for the start at the 3 fine, but until then Vick’s my guy. Vick’s big game experience is going to be important early in the season, i,e, Michigan State. Another season of leaving the opponents open-mouthed on defense when Vick slips along the baseline for another backdoor jam. Grimes showed during the FIBA tournament that he looks to pass to his teammates, so I expect to see Grimes getting many assists to Vick. By the way, Coach Self successfully juggled playing time for the U18 team that was loaded with talent. I did think he took advantage of the situation and played Grimes, Robinson-Earl and Hurt together a lot. RCJHB 2018-19
-
@stoptheflop Man oh man, I like the way you think.
-
Just for discussion purposes… Anyone see this as possibly being a negative. Vick played 30-35 minutes a game last year had the green light and everything. Now he’s walking into a situation where he will get let’s say 20 minutes a game and his shot selection will have to change as well as his defensive intensity / effort. I could easily see a situation where Vick gets into the season and becomes a “bad seed” ( for lack of better term) in the locker room.
I know most think this could only be a positive but I’m not sold on that. Chemistry is a huge X factor when trying to cut nets down.
-
@Woodrow No, because Self laid out a bunch of conditions for Vick to return and if Vick doesn’t meet those conditions, Self will boot him off the team.
-
@Woodrow I actually see it as more the opposite. A guy who was ushered to the door. Who now has come back on the coach’s terms. Who sees that he needs to perform on the court and in the locker room to get what he wants. It’s as moment that forges maturity — or as @Texas-Hawk-10 said, he’s gone. I think this is a “trust Self” moment.
-
@Woodrow Coach Self knows his players better than any of us and I trust he took all of Vick’s traits into account when he invited him back to the team. I like Vick and like that he will continue to be the third or fourth scoring option when he’s on the court, even with our much younger personnel. Dedric, Grimes, Dok and PG will be the offensive focus, with Vick positioning himself for the open 3 or a pass at the rim. Brilliant, just brilliant. Coach likely has a plan for Vick to work on the skills that the NBA found deficient. Vick will be the icing flower on the birthday cake that everyone keeps eyeing.
-
I posted before that it would be difficult to pass on a good 3 point shooter and a starter that played over 30 mpg on the team that made it to the Final Four. I also posted that if he comes back he will be on a short leash which also appears to be true.
More to your point, worst case scenario, he gets suspended from the team but stays in school and graduates in December since he will need only 12 credit after Summer school, something I am sure Coach Self has taken into consideration. Best case, he explodes and leads KU to a National title and plays himself into the draft with a real chance this go around and a fresh college degree to boot. Not that much and an easily mitigable risk and potentially a big reward.
-
KUSTEVE said:
@FarmerJayhawk I’m not trying to be confrontational, but the 12 hours remaining for Vick to graduate was a quote from Self that was published on KUSPORTS: "After the summer session, Vick will be just 12 hours shy of graduating, Self said."Perhaps I am ignorant, but I wouldn’t think it would make any of us guilty of any crime by quoting what our head coach said.
Oh yeah, my mistake. That’s what I get for skimming after one too many last night haha
-
@stoptheflop na, I’m voting no – Call me a sadist I guess , go ahead tell me I am - -it’s ok but I still want my football Season I’m just an overall College sports junkie. I’ll back my teams no matter how bad it gets.
Please don’t think I’m trying to insinuate this about you or anyone here but like I say I’ll back my teams no matter what if they are really good OR really bad that’s a true fan - not a closet bandwagon fan who wants to cheer when a team is only good.
Again I am for sure not saying your that way or anyone here is that way BUT there are people that ARE that way -I have no time for them .Maybe that’s why I look forward to the basketball season every year cause I know we will ALWAYS compete and challenge. - -Yet I love my College football I’ll be right there either at the home games every Saturday or at home watching the boys on TV or listening on the radio - -I’ll still be there.
A perfect example of what I’m talking about. The year that little pig school - -K- Straight - you know the one. - -President Nixon’s favorite High School.- -Anyways the year they finally broke our streak of straight wins at Allen Filed House West - -what was it 22? - -23? - Well that year when they beat us - all the little mice ran to their closets - - -foot lockers brush the moth balls off that store musty K-Straight gear put them on thumped their little mousy chests talking all kinds of smack. - -I just laughed said year strut your shit - beat your little purple chest cause it will be another 23 years before you can do it again lmao. - -THAT’S what I’m talking about, cause the following year they had to scurry and put their gear back away when we whupped their ass again. - THAT’S the true definition of a CLOSET FAN - -BANDWAGON FAN
So yes please I’ll go ahead and struggle through football but let me watch them play it out please - -good ol College Junkie lol - -OR Sadist - whichever lol. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
-
I’ll watch it too. Go to a few games, those kids work hard too. I have a few favorites.
-
@HighEliteMajor “I think this is a “trust Self” moment.”
I am very impressed with how many of these you have been finding. You changing the colors of your lenses?
-
This is one of those “Self moments.” This is one more action showing Self has his players’ back. He pretty much wrote off Vick, and not just because Vick announced he was leaving. Vick didn’t seem to relate to Self last year… we all saw that. Not only did Vick hurt himself, he hurt his teammates because he wasn’t playing anywhere near his capabilities.
I’m optimistic about this move, and I’m glad to see our last scholarship go to Vick. Yes… he didn’t step up last year. But he’s young and young players often need time to sort themselves out. Vick really didn’t need to sort his game out much, it was mostly himself that needed the help!
As much as Self wants to help his players, I don’t think he would have taken back Vick if he didn’t feel very sure that Vick was 100% reformed!
I’m pretty sure I have an idea on how Self left things with Vick when he left. Self told him what he would need from him if he wanted to come back. What he needed from Vick was for Vick to grow up considerably. A tiny taste of the big world outside of the fairytale of Lawrence, along with the harsh reality that he hasn’t created a solid path to make a living in basketball yet surely helped Vick see the light.
This may be the news that will help us make the Final Four two years in a row! Who knows?! But I have faith in Self that he is bringing Vick back under the right conditions.
We will be looking for offense this coming year, especially from trey. If Vick really gets near his capabilities, he could very well lead the team in scoring!
Welcome back, Vick!
-
@jayballer73 I’ll come around a little bit when fall practice starts and we start getting some new information. I just feel sorry for our football players who put their hearts and souls into practices and games and get very little in return. Seeing less than 10,000 fans in Memorial Stadium is heartbreaking. I’m glad you still support the football team. I’ll try to be a better fan and find something to be positive about.
