Exposed again
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I told you Tech was the Conference sleeper. Worst loss at AFH in a long time.
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@drgnslayr This has become a recurrent theme - and, unfortunately, perhaps the identity of this team. TTU has scored more than 85 only twice this season, against mighty FAU and Savannah St! Even in the TX win, we gave up 85 to them and they have trouble scoring against anyone (only game they scored more was against Northwestern State). Gave up 95 to ASU on at AFU.
No resistance against penetration and no blocking out. Gave up 18 ORBs. TTU missed 38 shots from the floor plus a few missed FTs. Doke garnered just 4 of those missed shots. Fully healthy or not, that isn’t acceptable. Whether driving into the paint or positioning for rebounds, it seems like our guys are allergic to contact.
Don’t know if that will or can change with the current line-up - perhaps de Sousa or Preston will at least be willing to mix it up, even if they don’t really know what they are doing on the floor…
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@BeddieKU23 Vick had his worst game of the year, yet I found myself being a lot more steamed at Svi. How many times did Svi have a chance to cut the lead, and just didn’t deliver? I found myself wanting to see a lot more Sam last night, and less Svi and Vick. Oh well. The world didn’t end last night. This is going to be a challenging year for us.
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@KUSTEVE I was more upset that 6’8" Svi was seldom helping Dok or ML rebound. Missed shots I can handle. Watching your big guys get mauled is another thing altogether.
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@mayjay Let’s face it - Svi is a 3 point shooter. He is a liability on defense, he doesn’t drive to the basket very well, and his short arms don’t help him to rebound. He is a great offensive weapon when the shots are falling. When they aren’t, well… All the people who think De Sousa will languish on the bench should ponder how badly we got beat on the boards last night.
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KUSTEVE said:
@BeddieKU23 Vick had his worst game of the year, yet I found myself being a lot more steamed at Svi. How many times did Svi have a chance to cut the lead, and just didn’t deliver? I found myself wanting to see a lot more Sam last night, and less Svi and Vick. Oh well. The world didn’t end last night. This is going to be a challenging year for us.
I don’t necessarily disagree, Svi went mad cold in the 2nd half but I’ve come to expect it from him. He’s always been this way, can’t expect him to change now. Svi missed shots he should make, unfortunately everyone did the same. I thought Svi had some really good defense at points, jumping passing lanes, forcing a TO when we pressed. We know his limitations and Tech certainly exposed them as well.
Vick however was a total no show last night, Self even called him out. Not just the box score, it was the total lack of energy and aggressiveness. If he scores 17 last night the game is different (not necessarily a win), instead he let a few misses ruin his entire game. I was so disappointed in him last night. He had opportunities to drive to the hoop but he doesn’t follow through. Not acceptable effort from him. But that’s for coach to decide. Just voicing what I saw
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DCHawker said:
@drgnslayr This has become a recurrent theme - and, unfortunately, perhaps the identity of this team. TTU has scored more than 85 only twice this season, against mighty FAU and Savannah St! Even in the TX win, we gave up 85 to them and they have trouble scoring against anyone (only game they scored more was against Northwestern State). Gave up 95 to ASU on at AFU.
No resistance against penetration and no blocking out. Gave up 18 ORBs. TTU missed 38 shots from the floor plus a few missed FTs. Doke garnered just 4 of those missed shots. Fully healthy or not, that isn’t acceptable. Whether driving into the paint or positioning for rebounds, it seems like our guys are allergic to contact.
Don’t know if that will or can change with the current line-up - perhaps de Sousa or Preston will at least be willing to mix it up, even if they don’t really know what they are doing on the floor…
Points off turnovers killed us last night as well. I know ESPN threw up the stat early in the 2nd half, Tech had 17pts off our turnovers and I know the final tally was more. Both losses prior to last night KU had given up a ton of points off turnovers. Some of them last night were just shake your head moments, fundamental errors that you would not expect upperclassmen to be making.
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26 points off of turnovers was the dagger, imo. If we limit turnovers to 10, that cuts that number in half and probably gives us another 6-8 points. That’s a 19 point swing.
Sure the D was bad. Sure we were streaky. Sure we rebound poorly. Those are all the same thing we have been dealing with all season. But turning the ball over as many times as we did, and the way we turned them over, was what was knew. And that is why we lost that game.
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Bright side was we saw some guys attack the basket and see some success. I think that was huge.
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@Kcmatt7 DG handing the ball to their guy at the top of the key was the key image I will take from this game. It looked someone being handed the ball in a pickup game so they could get a mercy basket.
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@mayjay just at the worst points in the game too. We’d be down 6 and one score away from the Fieldhouse going crazy and then we would hand them the ball and let them get a layup to push it back to 8. Happened 3 or 4 times just like that.
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This game was never in question. - -Well up until the tip it was. - -Then never in question , KU got dominated in every phase of the game , from tip to final buzzer. Texas Tech was a man playing against a child.
It was all about who wanted it more , this defense or lack there of cause we played no defense - - who wanted the 50/50 balls more , we can’t use the excuse that we were outsized terribly cause we weren’t - it was just basic basketball fundamentals 101 - -basic box out. Even with the players available to us at this point thee is no reason/excuse we give up what 18 offensive rebounds? - -How many times did we see a player shoot the ball and end up getting his own rebound or TT getting it back.
Our guards I mean Devonte - -come on how many turnovers did he end up with? - -simply driving the ball down court and losing control , guards making terrible passes. also agree this team is so dammm soft.
I know I’m gonna hear the excuse well if we had Preston or if we had De Sousa ya and? - - could of probably would of made SOME difference on rebounding but one big sure the hell isn’t going to make up for the glaring defensive issues this team has a overall team, that ONE big can’t defend all five players from the opposing team.
A lot of these things just come from lack of heart - -want to. Think maybe these guys need to get a copy of Jarrod Haase book floor burns and read it let it sink in. Just so many weakness’s on this team.
I feel to an extent kind of like what some other said I was like why and the hell doesn’t he at least try to play Sam a little more I understand he might have some weakness somewhere in his game I don’t know haven’t had the chance to see enough of him playing to tell for sure but if he does that makes him different from the rest of the team how? - - -Malik needs to find a spot on the bench and stay there he is absolutely non beneficial at this point - -offensively - -defensively - -nothing.
Bottom line is - -this conference championship run is over/finished. This team does no have the drive or desire to carry it on, at this point West Virginia for sure better - - -Texas Tech proved they are better - - Oklahoma better - -& not sure but TCU might even be better. The rest of the big 12 is licking their chops, this is what they have been waiting for. There is not a team that is afraid of playing us now you can take it to the bank. Even in Allen field house – -" THE PHOG HAS LIFTED "
Name me ONE - - -ONE player that played positive last night - - ONE. - -they all looked like a group of guys you picked up for some street ball at the YMCA, it’s gonna be a long conference season if they don’t get their act together. As far as the NCAA tourney? – psssssssssssssssssssssst please - -right now at this point your looking at possible a 7 seed maybe. - -Another streak that is in serious jeopardy? - if things keep going? - -that super super long streak of being ranked in the top 25 will be GONE QUITE quite possibly if we should pull a repeat Saturday it would be GONE. All this means is now we have to go steal a win on the road somewhere , as to where it might not be expected - - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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DG played 40 minutes. It’s absolutely ridiculous Malik can’t help at the point for 10 minutes, especially with Cunliffe in the mix.
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Kcmatt7 said:
26 points off of turnovers was the dagger, imo. If we limit turnovers to 10, that cuts that number in half and probably gives us another 6-8 points. That’s a 19 point swing.
Sure the D was bad. Sure we were streaky. Sure we rebound poorly. Those are all the same thing we have been dealing with all season. But turning the ball over as many times as we did, and the way we turned them over, was what was knew. And that is why we lost that game.
All sounds good as to why and they were contributors other then one small little item which was - - -getting our ass KICKED all night long on the boards. - -There is NO excuse , none what so ever for that to happen with us when we are playing a team comparable in size. If anyone tries to justify us getting beat like a drum off offensive rebounds then that person has no clue to what the hell they are talking about period. - Again more then anything this game simply game down to a team with more heart desire then the other it was a really sad night total.
We were streaky? - -I agree we were streaky - - Streaky bad - well actually more consistently bad then streaky bad - BUT when were we streaky good? - I must of stepped out of the room when the streaky good was happening and it must of been a pretty small streak.
Every game we have played this year and resulting in a loss has come from a team that is going to get in your face, really get in your shorts aggressive defense. - -our surposed strength the 3 pt shot in these games goes right out the window like others have said here this team is charmin soft. - -Some want to try and blame Doke, for sure real maybe/probably should of had more rebounds for sure - but our guards? - our perimeter players SUCK they can’t stop a runny nose that’s not Doke fault, and with him having to fight through back issues at least he has a some what even if you want to try and say a feeble excuse it is one - -what are the others going to say about their defense?
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mayjay said:
@Kcmatt7 DG handing the ball to their guy at the top of the key was the key image I will take from this game. It looked someone being handed the ball in a pickup game so they could get a mercy basket.
this was an occurance multiple times - not all Devonte by any means but just sloppy sloppy ball by all. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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Jayballer54 said:
this was an occurance multiple times - not all Devonte by any means but just sloppy sloppy ball by all. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
He is playing out of position and too many minutes. He’s a 2 guard that can handle the point in spells like the previous two seasons. Nothing we can do at this point. Malik should be better.
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Right now the old Conference Championship streak is looking like a pretty damn lofty goal.
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The Preston ordeal was in KU Compliance hands for a very, very long time before being sent to the NCAA. If KU Compliance takes 8 weeks, I don’t think we should expect the NCAA to turn it around in less than 2-3 weeks.
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Svi is the king of the bonehead play, I lose count of the number of times he makes them. Sure he makes some nice shots but I really wonder if he actually gives up an equal number, if not more, points on the defensive side and with turnovers. The two charges, the drive to the hoop he fumbles out of bounds, the inbounds pass directly to the TT player who quickly passes to a teammate for a three. So frustrating, especially from a senior. Its nuts.
Did you guys hear that stat that Kansas has the fewest number of made free throws in the ENTIRE NATION?!?! Good lord! Simply amazing.
I think KU has the talent to win but at this point in time the biggest question is their effort. They are getting killed on defense and rebounding and a large part of both of those parts of the game comes from effort. From a fan’s point of view it looks like they don’t have that killer instinct to refuse to be beaten by their guy.
Its going to be a long year if these players don’t find a way to light a fire under their asses.
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If Preston ends up playing and playing really well, and we go on to lose the Big 12 he will be sadly blamed.
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Frank Mason fallout? He was the heart driver for the team for so long as well as such a strong leader that it seems none of the other guys have any experience taking charge. Rudderless ship. The team doesn’t take pride in defense. Doesn’t drive the ball. Doesn’t look good unless shots are falling. It’s time for a player/players to man up and take accountability for the team. Bill can’t make them want it, they have to do it.
-Mason -Jackson -Lucas +Udoka +Newman = net negative big time. The Kansas math doesn’t work right now.
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BigBad said:
DG played 40 minutes. It’s absolutely ridiculous Malik can’t help at the point for 10 minutes, especially with Cunliffe in the mix.
It’s ridiculous that our staff thought he would be an option to play the point. He’s the farthest thing from a point guard. We certainly haven’t invested in letting Garrett run point either. Graham can’t play 40 minutes but we have no other options. We knew this coming in
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Kcmatt7 said:
@mayjay just at the worst points in the game too. We’d be down 6 and one score away from the Fieldhouse going crazy and then we would hand them the ball and let them get a layup to push it back to 8. Happened 3 or 4 times just like that.
Yes…that was maddening. We kept shooting ourselves in the foot. Point off turnovers and lack of rebounding did us in. Even with Vick and Svi cold…we didn’t really shoot worse than they did. They just got more attempts…and made a few more FTs.
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1983-84 season was the last time Kansas lost 2 home games by double digits, Tech was Selfs largest margin of defeat in AFH. Roy Williams was 201-17 in the fieldhouse, does Self get to 17 losses this year (currently 12)? I think it easily could happen, I could see us not winning more than 3 more games and going to the NIT. Every other B12 team has guards that are more athletic than ours. I will continue to support this team but I don’t expect much of anything out of them.
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So, you think KU is going to finish 4-14 in the Conference? I am not sure you will find anyone that agrees with you; I certainly do not. I am thinking 12-6 or 11-7 are more realistic numbers. If Preston and De Sousa start playing soon, the record will probably closer to 13-5 or even 14-4.
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@JayHawkFanToo if this team stays as it currently is I will grow udders and get milked before they go .500 in this league. Maybe if Billy and Silvio are cleared maybe we compete with a decent team.
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@kjayhawks This team, as composed, not going .500 in league? Not winning more than three more games? Seriously. You truly are on another planet. It’s an easy comment to make because it’s really likely we won’t move forward for entire season “as it currently is.” So we’ll never know, so that’s you’re out. But when has coach Self ever been .500 or below in anything? I think you posted before really contemplating what you have said. I’m trying not to be harsh here, but this might be one of the truly reactionary, outrageous, and baseless comments made around here in a long, long time. Feel free to retract and we’ll forget this ever happened.
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@HighEliteMajor “I’m trying not to be harsh here, but this might be one of the truly reactionary, outrageous, and baseless comments made around here in a long, long time.”
I don’t disagree with you here, but, just kind of wondering what your comment would have been if you hadn’t softened it up so much?
All kidding, no malice!
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Haha just stirring the pot to see reactions
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I spoke with Zenger a couple of months ago… just before our first game. I asked him what he thought of this team. He told me, “WE are excited! Devonte is an original. A unique player.” He gave me a bit of an odd expression. I think “WE” meant himself and Bill.
That short moment with Zenger has puzzled me all this time. I’ve been the guy who always felt like Devonte was capable of being everything Trae Young is showing the world now… but better. Experienced. I still think that. I remember when he stepped up in Norman against Buddy.
I still think Devonte has just one more thing to conquer; himself. He needs to find a way to stay focused during games… with the right kind of focus. It really is a mystery watching him play. He still is a streaky player. Hot and cold shooting… hot and cold in a leadership role.
Everyone loves Devonte. Players, fans, students. He’s extremely personable. He has that “people person” charm that can really help a team leader lead. I’ve come to not understand this part of what I am seeing, anymore than understanding Devonte’s streaky game.
I really thought he was going to bring us a refreshing look different from Frank. And we have seen some of that. But many of the leadership aspects I expected from him are still missing. I expected he would be the most vocal/animated leader we have ever had in the Self era. I felt like Zenger’s coded message to me was about Devonte being a great leader for this team.
This one area is the area that will turn this team around. Devonte is the key. For example… where was Vick in this last game? That should have been asked with 15 minutes left in the first half. And the one asking should have been Devonte. “Hey man… we need YOU! Come on!”
Someone needs to step up and rally our troops. Someone needs to bring them together when they aren’t playing like a team. Getting a couple more post players wasn’t the answer for this loss. Anyone believing that Silvio and Billy will be our big remedy will be in for a shock.
Our biggest weakness isn’t our post depth. Our biggest weakness is the ineffectiveness of our guard play. We can make any opposition’s offense look like Golden State! We aren’t controlling pace… nothing. You could see this last loss within the first 2 minutes of play.
Maybe our guys are handcuffed by their own thoughts… more… FEARS about losing the streak! Look back at that Texas game. The only reason we won was because we couldn’t miss from trey. To shoot that well from trey an eek out a victory should have been a sign. I feel bad for Self. He must feel stumped on how to get these guys motivated. Maybe the problem isn’t motivation. Maybe the problem is just an execution problem. From my experience, defensive softness is an attitude problem. You can’t just make players hungry. I think our guys feel like they are stuffed with steak and shrimp.
We need chemistry. We need synergy. We need life. We need optimism. We need hustle. We need team play. We need leadership.
I’m not giving up on these guys. At any moment in this season the light bulb might come on. And if it does… we are going to go on a streak!
