@KUSTEVE Especially remarkable give that UK alone has 6! in the top 25 and 2 more in the top 100.

@wrwlumpy Agree that is kind of a joke that Jo Jo isn’t on the list. I love the more recent guys, but seriously. Jo Jo was a 2-time All American (2nd team) and 3-time All Big 8. And, a higher scoring average. People focus on where players end up on the all-time KU scoring list, but players today play many more games. And, freshman couldn’t play once upon a time. Scoring average should be weighted more, not just total points over a career. Would also probably put Bridges and Stallworth ahead of a couple of the more recent guys. I think Stallworth average 25ppg his last year and was B8 POY.

@JayHawkFanToo While I hope he does stay, I would argue that his progression has been very modest - and, disappointing relative to expectations. Shooting from the perimeter was streaky at best and while he is capable of driving and scoring, he did it to infrequently. More problematically, he really didn’t contribute much elsewhere. Terrible rebounder for a wing of his size (same issue with Selden last year) and surprisingly few assists for someone who is a good passer and at least decent ball handler. He seemed to defer a lot; maybe that would change with another year, but perhaps not with more alphas on the way?

@mayjay Interesting, but I’m not sure that it is dispositive of much. Since Roy went to UNC and Bill arrived at KU, Roy has had 16 players go in the 1st round of the NBA draft (and 4 of those were inherited) - Bill has had 14 go in the 1st round.

And how many of the UNC 1st rounders have been NBA All-Stars? Exactly zero. How many have been real impact players - Ty Lawson? Maybe Brice Johnson will be. That’s it. While Jayhawks in the Self era haven’t lit up the NBA, Chalmers, the Morii, McLemore, Wiggins and Embid have had or will have better NBA careers than the UNC guys. And, I think our JJ will have more of an impact than their JJ.

So, while it might well be the case that Roy is able to get more depth of talent at UNC because of a bigger, closer recruiting base, it doesn’t appear that he is getting much more if any of the top-tier talent - which makes his 3 titles there all the more remarkable…

@HighEliteMajor Believe it has been a decade since UNC has had a OAD. The latest NC and two title games in a row - this one primarily with juniors and seniors who bought in to the system and came back to give it another shot - and probably marginal NBA talent on the roster, other than Jackson and maybe Bradley.

@drgnslayr Over the arc of history perhaps, but more recent history? Other than Anthony Davis, has there really been an impactful big, let alone 2, among the titleists over the past decade. Dieng and Harrell (the latter 6-7)? Luke friggin’ Hancock was actually the MOP for the FF. Bigs don’t play a big role in the NBA and seems that they haven’t in college in the recent past. Gonzaga is actually a bit of a throwback in that regard…

@BShark I’m not a fan of UNC by any means, but maybe the reason it deflects off Roy there is he has won 2 titles with them and has been to the last two title games - and without obvious OAD talent. Yes Pinson hasn’t produced to expectations, but none of their recruits were clear OADs - not sure any were top 10 coming in? I’m also struggling to understand why some of the the 10-30 range recruits seem to be staying at Carolina on a more consistent basis?

Every coach has his unique style, which means plusses and minuses, but one thing I’ve always liked about Roy (didn’t like that he didn’t get guys as committed on the defensive end) is that he plays a lot of guys. Luke Maye came up huge for them in 2 tournament games - Luke Maye, really?!

@BeddieKU23 Actually pretty remarkable that UNC will be in back-to-back NC games with so little NBA talent on the roster. Jackson will be a lottery pick, but you are right, I don’t think anyone else is has a realistic shot. Veteran team with no OADs. In fact, I think I read that UNC hasn’t had a OAD in a decade. Folks have debated ad naseum on the board the merits or lack thereof of going the OAD recruiting strategy, but if UNC does win tomorrow, that will be 2 straight titleists comprised of multi-year players and no OADs. Gonzaga has only one possible OAD and he comes off the bench.

@chriz said:

@Blown said:

2013 we blow a 12 point lead in 2 minutes to michigan

Did we really have a 12 point lead with 2 minutes left?

Up by 10 with just less than 3 minutes to go and up 8 with just less than 2 minutes to play…

@nuleafjhawk said:

@betterfireE and many people changed their minds after we beat Michigan St by 20 (which NOBODY does) and a very good Purdue team by 32. I refuse to buy into the fact that their guards were that much better than our. All year - from day one - even the east coast media owned up to the fact that KANSAS had the best backcourt in the country. But half of it didn’t show up Saturday.

Keep in mind this is not a personal attack on him - I love him, hope he stays next year - but for whatever reason he did not show up Saturday night and it cost us a trip to Phoenix.

I agree - and there seems to be some post-hoc rationalization re talent level and athleticism - that Oregon was superior on both fronts. Make no mistake about it - Oregon is a really good team and was a FF favorite at the beginning of the year - got dropped at least a seed because Boucher got hurt at the end of the year (the guy who was supposedly more of a rim protector than Bell).

But let’s be real - Oregon beat exactly no one of note during the non-conference schedule - they got spanked by Baylor and lost to Georgetown (?!). In conference they beat the lower tier teams and split with UCLA and Arizona.

In their first 3 tournament games, they beat Iona by 16 and squeaked by URI and Michigan - by 3 and 1 points, respectively. Their first 3 opponents all scored more points that we did - apparently they did not have quite the same issues with Oregon’s length and athleticism. Oregon’s DER was in the 20s, although dropped to 19 after the win against us, so they were solid, but not one of elite defensive teams - even with Boucher.

The thing that is sticking in my craw is that we clearly got taken out of our offense - the guys admitted that they struggled with the match-up zone. As a result, we scored the fewest points we have all season. Last year at the same time, Villanova took us out of our offense and we scored 59 points.

I’m not sure why in seemingly too many instances in the tournament over the years (I’m thinking VCU, Davidson (even though we won) and UCLA, among others) that our opponents seem to be successful in taking us out of our offense? Shouldn’t we be the team doing that to them?

Oregon is a really good team and shot the ball well and played well in a hostile environment, so hats off to them. But, I don’t accept that they were more talented across the line-up (although it may turn out that they have more successful NBA players; remains to be seen) and there is a reason we were favored by 6.5 points going in. Posts above show recap who’ve we lost to as a higher seed in the tournament (esp. in the Elite Eight) and I would argue that UCLA was probably the only team in all of those who actually had more talent on the floor.

What is most frustrating is a seeming pattern of very sub par performances on the offensive end during the tournament. Maybe it is just luck or one of those things…