HOW BILL SOLVED THE RUBIK'S CUBE
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@KUSTEVE Bravo STEVE! We’re all “Grazin In the Grass” on this one. “I can digit, you can digit, he can digit, she can digit, we can digit - oh let’s digit, can you digit baby !!” Clearly one of the very best posts of the summer - WTH Jethro, maybe the whole year …
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@KUSTEVE KJ is a stretch 4 with the back court pieces Self already has for 2018. Moore at PG, Garrett as the off ball guard, Vick at the 3, Cunliffe off the bench, plus whatever Self adds in recruiting. Dedric, and probably one of Preston or Doke comes back, but if not, KJ at the 4. With what we know for sure Self will have in 2018, there’s no reason why the conference streak shouldn’t reach at least 15 straight because there’s nobody that has that for sure coming back.
I would put a starting line up of Moore, Garrett, Vick, Lawson, Lawson against anybody in 2018-19 and feel great about it. With Cunliffe and Lightfoot off the bench, that’s a line up missing a back up PG and back up low post player from being a 2016-17 UNC caliber line up.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 Those are 3 really tough dudes we’re adding to the lineup.The experience they bring will be invaluable. Defensively, we should be really good.
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@jaybate-1.0 Because Adidas is not a factor in basketball recruiting.
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So: let’s have adidas sponsor the 2, 3, positions by selling the the rights to provide left shoes and Nike the 1, 4, and 5 positions by selling them the rights to our right shoe, and sell uniform rights to UA to provide us 6th and 7th men!!! Disaggregation for more efficient pricing is.crucial! Then we can re-aggregate into derivatives that can insured with fake GICs and bought by Black Rock with untraceable bailout Fed Notes that George Soros can then buy and use as underlying positions in currency hedging funds that can then be liquidated in increments to fund demonstrations and synthetic terror events that allow a new candidate to run and win on a promise of tax cuts and whatever the plebes might want to hear that election!!!
A KU Basketball Based GLOBAL MARKET STRUCTURE! And then KU biz graduate students could get grants to study and rationalize it!!
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If we lose again in the 2nd round, will you say Bill has solved the Rubik’s cube then???
The point is Bill will have solved the Rubik’s cube once he wins a national championship!!! There’s no other way to look at it. Big 12 streak is cute, but its no championship. We can sit here and say he’s solved the rubik’s cube and give him his dues only for the hawks to falter early in the NCAA tourney!!
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@jaybate-1.0 He wore the KU shoes, but millions and millions and millions will come from Under Armour.
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ https://note.taable.com/post/708/bleacherreport.com/articles/2717162-josh-jackson-under-armour-agree-to-endorsement-contract
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@elpoyo Newsflash - You may have missed this in the Flint hill poop
mountains of manhattan or the cave dwellings of misery but HCBS DID win a NC in 2008. Sorry 
life is so tough under those dirty ol’ rocks without sunlight.
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@elpoyo You are exactly right. Nothing can be deemed “solved” until he delivers the national championship. Period. We are now nearly 10 years past his first one. It’s time.
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@elpoyo I know it’s hard for a CNN reporter to grasp, but I was talking about next year’s team. Come back at the end of next year, and we’ll see if my positive vision wins, or your gutter sniping wins out.
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I sense a connection between you and @elpoyo…any chance he is your alter ego? A sycophant?
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@JayHawkFanToo There’s more than one alter on here for sure bro. Without a doubt.
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@HighEliteMajor We’re just in terrible shape, aren’t we?
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Earth to @elpoyo - Mario made the shot!
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JayHawkFanToo No, I just thinks it’s pathetic that every time the guy posts something, it’s always the same attacks. That’s a much greater reflection on those that think they’re cute attacking a reasonable point. Look at the garbage from @globaljaybird.
@KUSTEVE Of course, no one said we’re in bad shape. Problem talking titles and real achievement?
What do UNC, Duke, UK, UConn, Nova, Louisville have in common? Right. All have rings since we won ours. Except three of those have won two titles since we’ve won ours. Tourney is all luck though, right?
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@HighEliteMajor careful! Saying it’s all luck will get you in trouble! Lol
We can’t hang on to 08 forever, even though it was perhaps our best KU hoops memory. Sooner or later, Self will need to get the job done again. Can’t keep making excuses - at some point we need results.
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I don’t have a problem with @elpoyo posting his hate for KU. Yes he’s never made one positive comment about KU.
I just wish he would announce the real team/school he loves.
By all means come talk and play the game, but at least be fair and tell us real KU fans who you root for.
I don’t know about other KU fans but I have a hard time taking someone seriously when they claim they are KU fan, yet they never have anything positive to say.
Smells like a troll to me. In fact smells like a Missouri fan to me. Yet all I ask is tell me who you really root for, and then lets have the conversation or debate.
I think it’s fair enough.
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Come on @HighEliteMajor, we both know that @elpoyo comes to this board only occasionally and mostly to make outrageous statements and to get a reaction.
Now, you are a smart fellow…are you saying the the NCAA does not involve a fair amount of luck? If you say no, you are being disingenuous.
Also, how is it A coaches fault when he has a good game plan and the team picks the wrong time to have an off game? Take the last game of the season against Oregon, KU shot 5 of 25 or 20% from the 3 point, 4 of 10 or 40% in the first half and a putrid 1 of 15 or 6.67% in the second half. When is the last time the team shot so poorly from the 3?..and most of the misses were not even contested shots but wide open ones that the various players made routinely during the season…how is this Coach Self’s fault? I am sure that if Coach Self could have played he would have shot better than that.
I have always maintained that if from the Elite 8 forward the format is switched to 2 of 3 or 3 of 5 the end result would be quite different. KU probably does not win in 1988 but likely wins at least 2 or 3 more titles in other years, maybe even this past season.
By the way, one man’ garbage is another man’s treasure.
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@HighEliteMajor Glad you’re back once again joining in the pathetic fun. I’ll wager Elpoyo really missed your hiatus.Yee haw boys sic em
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@JayHawkFanToo it’s never the coach, yet his teams, which means different players same result, keep having their worst offensive performance of the year in the elite eight. 07, 08, 11, 16 and 17. We got fortunate in 08. You know why they played better in 2012 in the elite eight? They weren’t tight. When Bill doesn’t feel tight, his team isn’t tight. Those terrible performances keep happening for a reason. Maybe this year will be different…
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@JayHawkFanToo Flattery is always good
for soothing a bruised ego …
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@globaljaybird I didn’t say it was fun, just pathetic.
@JayHawkFanToo Every basketball game entails a “fair amount” of luck. So that really means nothing. I know we disagree on the “luck” factor in the NCAA tourney. A matter of degrees separate our perspectives. Folks that favor a coach’s perspective tend to be more in the “luck” camp. Those that tend to be more critical of coaches tend to be more in the “less luck” camp.
The tourney results speak for themselves and prove that great teams and programs win titles, with few exceptions. In the last 9 seasons, Duke, UNC, and UK account for 5 titles. And KU won the title the year before that, and Florida had gone back to back preceding KU, and UNC won in 2005, UConn 2004, etc. It’s a large amount of other stuff, beyond “luck.” When we win the next title, the narrative changes. If we win this season, suddenly we’ve won 2 titles in 11 seasons. It’s that sudden. But we have to win it. I defend @elpoyo because of the lack of civility of those who respond to him – meaning personal attacks.
We are national title deficient among blue bloods, and it is always a burr in the saddle. We went 20 years without one, now have gone another 10. I, like others, grow tired of the fawning over Big 12 titles. It’s not a substitute for the ultimate prize.
@DoubleDD Some people may be fans, but may only see the negative, or may only choose to comment when something irritates them. That doesn’t mean they are not a fan of the KU or the program. It may be annoying. Some folks think everything that can go wrong, will go wrong – and some are right (see the MU fan base). And all of the fatalists that get anxious at the start of every NCAA tourney, that somehow, someway, we’ll lose before our seed line, have only been wrong a few times since Bill Self took over (Self’s regular season success raising that tourney bar, of course).
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@JayHawkFanToo If the Elite 8 losses are bad luck, explain why KU has had their lowest scoring game in that round in 5 of those 7 games. That’s not bad luck, that’s a trend.
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I’m curious. It was said when HCBS is tight his teams play tight. Is there a source we can go to that will tell us his level of tightness prior to a game so that we may prepare ourselves by lowering our level of expectation thereby reducing our anxiety level? Perhaps an unknown location on the KU Athletics website that receives data packets from a unit attached to his sphincter. I know my heart would appreciate such info.
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It’s more just watching, especially how they shoot on the offensive end. You can tell the team is pressing in certain games, trying to make plays out of nothing. Against Purdue, KU was drilling shots, laughing and smiling, having a great time just playing ball. Against Oregon, they looked like they were locked in a phone booth with a tiger. That’s visible in their play.
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Whether he choked the first two Elite 8 flameouts is debatable. But after that the monkey has been on his back, EVERYONE feels the pressure.
Next year, he needs to come out and run about 10 set plays in a row. Nothing that the other team could have scouted that entire week. Throw off the other coach and team and then lets get into our normal flow. Or even come out in a zone or something.
Either way, the psychology behind it is interesting. We are expected to win that game. So instead of being excited like most elite 8 teams, we come out scared. We have pressure most other teams don’t. But, it comes with the Blue Blood territory.
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I actually think he needs less structure in the Elite Eight. Let the guys go play ball. Self seems to want to control every aspect of the outcome in big games, rather than letting the talent on his team decide the outcome. If you say to guys, hey, I trust you - go play our game, they can relax and play ball. If you tighten up, they do too because they are trying to avoid mistakes.
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Better competition? You can look at any data and come up with all kinds of trend and coincidences, most of which don’t mean a thing.
Have you ever read the list of similarities between Lincoln and Kennedy? At first sight it seems hard to believe that there could be so many coincidences but when you look at it in more detail it is really not that big of a deal and a number of coincidences can be found for any two people and it has even been debunked by Snopes.
Likewise, you can take any number of stats and arrange them to fit any desired outcome. Remember what Will Rogers said…there are lies, damn lies and statistics.
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@HighEliteMajor the problem is when the only measure used is a national title, then you miss the genius of bringing in experienced players in order to prevent a full rebuild year. Now, if I had posed the initial question of : “will the 3 transfers lead us to the national title”??? then I would understand el putrid’s stupidity, and blatant attack ( for the 10,000th time) on our program. Here is the definition of what el putrid did:
In Internet slang, a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows discord on the Internet by starting arguments or upsetting people, by posting inflammatory,[1] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[2] or of otherwise disrupting normal, on-topic discussion,[3] often for the troll’s amusement.
See how the entire gist of the thread went from complimenting Coach Self on his transfers, to running down Coach Self for not winning more national titles?
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@justanotherfan I thought he did that this last year. And our guards minus Frank all got tight. DG passed up several open 3s he took all season long.
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@KUSTEVE No one said the “only measure” – it is, however, the “ultimate” prize. You can see the difference, right? One can appreciate and enjoy what we have done, but be extremely dissatisfied by our lagging behind the other blue bloods on national titles.
But now you criticize @elpoyo because, in your opinion, he didn’t respond either directly to your topic or in the manner you preferred (suggesting “stupidity”)? You said Self solved something. @elpoyo said until we win a title, we can’t say anything is solved. He’s right.
I’ve posted enough threads that change or morph into something not intended. It happens. It’s discussion. But the NC issue seems a reasonable tangent here.
@brooksmd It is legendary that Bill Self appears tight in tourney games. Much comment on that. Vs. Oregon, I recall both Newell and Tait posting on twitter that Self seemed relaxed. I buy that that. He seemed more relaxed all season to me. I guess my take is that there was nothing vs. Oregon that I saw that might create tightness. Other times, when he was ranting and flopping, and all that stuff we’ve seen, maybe more so.
Most of the time, though, as @justanotherfan referenced, a team reflects the coach much of the time. I do think that feeling prepared, have answers to the opposition (which we didn’t have vs. Nova), can help there. Jay Wright had a plan; we adjusted; Wright countered. And it ended there. That might tighten up a player a big – when they’re jumping our hand-offs, preventing normal entry passes, etc.
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@JayHawkFanToo Bill Self has coached in 4 Final Four games, that’s supposed to be even better competition than the Elite 8, yet KU hasn’t had the scoring issues in those rounds they’ve had in the Elite 8.
You can try and justify it however you want, but it doesn’t change the reality that when KU reaches the Elite 8 (50% of the time under Self), the odds say KU is going have their worst scoring game of the season that night.
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@KUSTEVE All it takes to start a pissing match is one d@%k… or who knows what else it may prefer? Anyway, that’s the kinda stuff they expect on the old site - El poyo trollo has a track record that belongs anywhere else, not here. And he even has a buddy or two doesn’t he? Absence doesn’t always make the heart grow fonder …
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the off-season is too long. is that the gist of the this so far?
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@BeddieKU23 Svi plays in like two weeks. At least that will give us something…
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@Kcmatt7 I think he’s played in some exhibition games, saw some box scores somewhere.
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@Crimsonorblue22 He has played in 4 or 5. A couple more to go, then the tournament. Then he plays for KU in Italy. After that, in late August and early September, he plays for the Ukrainian team in a FIBA Euro tournament taking place in Israel and I think another country.
Svi is definitely going to come back with some major experience this fall. Hope it proves helpful!
(This is all discussed in a Gary Bedore article in that newspaper you have, I believe, sworn never to read… thus, I have not included a link.)
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@HighEliteMajor against oregon, from the tip, our guys did not have the same energy and intensity as oregon. It was painfully obvious. Twice now a zone or matchup zone has contributed to our elite eight loss - you know, the thing bill doesn’t believe in. It would be nice to see him use something to that effect.
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@JayHawkFanToo Great post!
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If not for a BS foul called on Graham against Villanova and 2 pick fouls on Jackson against Oregon, we could just as easily be back to back National Champions. Losing sucks and it always will. However, we win more than we lose. These setbacks will make winning our next one all the more sweeter.
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@brooksmd Perhaps one of our famed & supremely qualified alter ego buckets coaches would politely & galantly probe a probiscous near that scphinter to take one for the team & rescue a few at risk from such peril? Anyone come to mind?
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@globaljaybird The head, and attached probiscus, which comes to mind most quickly for nomination to undertake such a probe is, I am afraid, previously engaged in a deep self-examination of a similar nature.
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@mayjay @Crimsonorblue22 Are there any box scores to those exhibition games?
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@Kcmatt7 I didn’t see any, not sure if Gary wrote the article? I know he only scored 4 in one game.
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You can try and justify it however you want, but it doesn’t change the reality that when KU reaches the Elite 8 (50% of the time under Self), the odds say KU is going have their worst scoring game of the season that night.
I don’t think so. I can count at least 5 games last season when KU scored less points. I have not checked other years but I am sure the result will be similar. Hyperbole will not make your case stronger.
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@Kcmatt7 No box scores. He has been in 4 games vs France, scoring 13, 4, 22, and 4 (if memory serves correctly). On Sunday he scored 25 with 7 rebs vs Turkey. This weekend starts a 3 game exhib tourney in Italy. His shooting has seemed to be in the 25 to 35% range.
The info on the 1st 4 games is from Bedore’s article about Svi’s reaction to the draft. The rest is from an add-on to an article by Bedore about Jeff Graves starting a women’s minor league bb team in KC.
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As long as it does not involve politics (they have a deep liberal bias), Snopes is not that bad. But why listen to me…or Snopes, do your own research and reach your own conclusions; at least I provide some links to support my statements, what do you provide other than hot air?
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JayHawkFanToo said:
You can try and justify it however you want, but it doesn’t change the reality that when KU reaches the Elite 8 (50% of the time under Self), the odds say KU is going have their worst scoring game of the season that night.
I don’t think so. I can count at least 5 games last season when KU scored less points. I have not checked other years but I am sure the result will be similar. Hyperbole will not make your case stronger.
It’s not hyperbole, KU’s lowest single game point total has come in the Elite 8 five times under Bill Self. KU is 1-4 in those games with Davidson in 2008 being the only win. The 5 times KU has put up a season low in points in the Elite 8 are 2007, 2008, 2011, 2016, and 2017. You can dispute it all you want and claim hyperbole all you want. You can claim to @jaybate-1-0 that you use facts all you want, but when you claim you can name 5 games KU scored fewer than the 60 points they did against Oregon, you better be able to back it up which I know you can’t because the schedule doesn’t lie, and doesn’t support your claim in any way, shape, or form.
Here’s the link to KU’s schedules in those 7 years. Prove me wrong, prove it’s hyperbole and not reality that Bill Self and KU have not had their lowest single game point total 5 times in 7 Elite 8 appearances. I’ll post the link to KU’s schedule all 7 of the seasons KU went to the Elite 8 or deeper and you can look for yourself to see if it’s hyperbole or reality.
2016-17 schedule: http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/team/schedule/_/id/2305/kansas-jayhawks
Show me where KU scored less than the 60 they put up against Oregon?
2015-16 schedule: http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/team/schedule/_/id/2305/year/2016
Show me where KU put less than the 59 they put up against Villanova?
2011-12 schedule: http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/team/schedule/_/id/2305/year/2012
This is one of the two Elite 8 appearances KU did not have their lowest scoring game of the year, that happened in the Sweet 16 against NC State.
2010-11 schedule: http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/team/schedule/_/id/2305/year/2011
Show me where KU scored less than the 61 they did against VCU?
2007-08 schedule: http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/team/schedule/_/id/2305/year/2008
KU also only scored 59 against USC so the E8 game against Davidson is tied for the lowest that year, but still the lowest.
Show me where KU scored less than the 59 they put up against Davidson and USC?
2006-07 schedule: http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/team/schedule/_/id/2305/year/2007
Show me where KU scored less than the 55 they put up against UCLA?
2003-04 schedule: http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/team/schedule/_/id/2305/year/2004
The only other year besides 2012 where KU did not have a season low in the Elite 8. KU’s lowest scoring game that year was against Nebraska in Lincoln.
There’s all 7 of KU’s Elite 8 or better seasons under Self. I’ve given you the point total KU scored in each of the 5 Elite 8 games KU had their lowest scoring game of the season and I even told you which game was KU’s lowest in the 2 years it wasn’t the E8.
I’ll even give you KU’s worst scoring game in the other 7 seasons in which KU didn’t reach the Elite 8.
2014-15: Kentucky (Neutral court) - 40 points
2013-14: San Diego St. and Stanford (Round of 32) - 57 points
2012-13: @TCU - 55 points
2009-10: Memphis (Neutral court) - 57 points
2008-09: UMass (Sprint Center) and @Missouri - 60 points
2005-06: Arizona (Neutral court) - 49 points
2004-05: Nebraska - 59 points
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@Texas-Hawk-10 I really like this post. It is backed up with a lot of facts about KU’s struggles in the Elite 8. Very interesting (and a bit scary).
One of the things that I do find interesting is how well our guys have played in the Final 4 and Finals. To me Bill Self coached teams have looked extremely tight (and occasionally choked) in Elite 8 games but have looked anything but that in the Final 4 and in the actual Final. The thrashing of UNC was the opposite of looking tight. The great comeback win over Ohio St. was all guts. The epic win against Memphis was one of the all time displays of late game confidence in the history of the tournament. Even our “almost” comeback against a far superior Kentucky in 2012 was a display of grit and determination that was not remotely derailed by being nervous.
So, what is it? Is it that the Final 4 is simply the measure of a successful season and that everything after that is gravy? I certainly don’t know the answer but I do know that Bill Self teams (like all great teams) have days that they look tight and choke and they have days where they play college basketball at the highest level and achieve greatness.
