KU vs TCU game chat
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Jay Wright liked the call.
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The neutral fans just want to see Kansas lose. I doubt they’d be nearly as irate if a TCU player had caught an elbow from Hunter, and TCU had gone on to win the game. In fact, just based on some of the comments I read about Hunter and KU, I’m betting a lot of people would be saying it was a good call, and calling Hunter a dirty player. But I won’t be losing any sleep over it.
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@wissox that a breaking news story lol
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@KirkIsMyHinrich We are Kansas we only win because of the refs
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@kjayhawks What are the odds we would get so many calls? Self should play the lottery!
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@kjayhawks in football too. Ask UNLV.
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@nuleafjhawk Cincy and Phil fans still griping today in The WPost about the NFL fixing it last year for the Chiefs.
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Different question. Who were the 3 TCU male fans the TV kept showing? Big guys. Apparently they had seats in an upper corner.
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One was the dad of the kid who shot the last shot. He played ball somewhere. Kid was Jameer Henson jr. I think. Copied and pasted Son of Jameer and Imani Nelson… Has younger sisters Jamia, Jayden and Jayce… Father, Jameer, starred at Saint Joseph’s University from 2000-04 before enjoying a 14-year NBA career, and is currently an Assistant GM with the Delaware Blue Coats.
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Were going to be hearing quite a bit about that call for some time , I hate that things like that just take away from a really exciting game. 26 lead changes , can’t remember how many ties. National media all over the call , Self said he thought it was clear -you have people like Jeff Goodman , -The guy Childress- --can’t remember his first name , played college ball and another guy that have the field of 68 - -saying KU should not of Won that game it was a flop by Dickinson , how KU got help from the refs, - others saying that even a former ref said that it was a bad call, should of been a play on.
Even Micheal Swain our KU beat reporter said Hunter sold it, that it should of been a play on , but with Hunter laying on the floor for the time sold the call., Swin if this would of been a game on the road and Hunter swung the elbow it would of been a play on. - -It might not of been as a bad of look if it was at a different point of the game, but coming at the time it did and causing a dour point swing, resulting in a two point win, not a good look at all. -Did Hunter flop? - I think maybe to a certain degree thing is judt gives fuel to people- - -media and just adds more to the fire about how KU get’s al kinds of help from whoever it takes when playing at the phog
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If we don’t get some home cooking in Allen at times then what’s the point of a home court advantage. We see it happen to us all the time on the road so I will not lose sleep here.
The rule is clear and it was called. What sold it was Hunter, as Self said in the post game.
No different then Miller selling that foul on KJ or guys calling for the ball that goes out of bounds to be their ball when they know it’s not. You influence the play however you can and Hunter did what he had to do to change the play so credit to him. Udeh being the guy that fouled is fitting because we know his antics and foul tendencies.
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Wasn’t even mentioned in either the ESPN site game recap or Kyle Boone’s CBS article.
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TCU is a good team, perhaps even a lot better then they are getting credit for in the rankings. They are top 25 in at least 7 team statistics including 8th in steals per game. Some of the turnovers were from TCU being a really good team at forcing turnovers with their traps and doubles.
They are just like KU but with more firepower from the perimeter at times. Nelson that comes off the bench is clearly a starter level guy and they are top 5 in experience in all of D-1.
Dixon has played KU tough the past 3-4 years and elevated to compete against us. He thumped us in Allen last year and the road games have always been difficult. I expected this game to be tough and it pushed us to the brink at home.
I like that this game kind of sets us up for the next couple games, unknown road game at UCF who will be looking for a bounce back after getting dismantled at K-ST and then a big one again next weekend with Oklahoma. They needed this kind of game to knock some rust off after only 5 games in the past month.
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@Gorilla72 said in KU vs TCU game chat:
Different question. Who were the 3 TCU male fans the TV kept showing? Big guys. Apparently they had seats in an upper corner.
It was the father of one of the TCU guards. I’m guessing it was Tennyson since he was having a career day. But it could have been a different guard. ESPN showed the guard on the court then his father with admittedly not great seats.
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We need a bit more production from bench, starters cannot play 35+ games in this brutal league.
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Elmarko needs to step up, if shots are not falling, he needs to become a lockdown defender.
Without watching replay, his D looked soft yesterday.
Is Jamari in Self’s doghouse, got yanked out quickly.
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Jameer Nelson, former NBA player and St Joe’s legend. His son Jr plays for TCU
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The minutes played by our starters yesterday just can’t be sustained over the rest of the season: Juan, 39 min.; Kevin, 38; KJ, 37; and Hunter, 35. And 24 wasted minutes by Elmarko, 0 pts. 0/4 shooting, 2 rbs and 2 assists. I understand the starters were needed yesterday against an inspired TCU team. Now that KU plays two games a week, we’ll see how the playing time gets divided. Nick at the point yesterday was a complete surprise to me, even though it was only a minute. Parker could take some of KJ’s minutes; I really think KU would benefit by giving him more minutes than the 5 he played yesterday.
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@AsadZ said in KU vs TCU game chat:
Elmarko needs to step up, if shots are not falling, he needs to become a lockdown defender.
Without watching replay, his D looked soft yesterday.
Is Jamari in Self’s doghouse, got yanked out quickly.
He got yanked out quickly because just had n sooner came into the game and I believe he was the one who made silly turnover with I think Double Dribble. Couldn’t of picked a worse time to screw up that was one of the stretchs where Bill was trying to find that fifth guy, Furphy came in got yanked then Mcdowell came in and got yanked, Bill was not in a good mood during that stretch. They mentioned it either on the TV broadcast or Radio broadcast at that time
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@stoptheflop said in KU vs TCU game chat:
The minutes played by our starters yesterday just can’t be sustained over the rest of the season: Juan, 39 min.; Kevin, 38; KJ, 37; and Hunter, 35. And 24 wasted minutes by Elmarko, 0 pts. 0/4 shooting, 2 rbs and 2 assists. I understand the starters were needed yesterday against an inspired TCU team. Now that KU plays two games a week, we’ll see how the playing time gets divided. Nick at the point yesterday was a complete surprise to me, even though it was only a minute. Parker could take some of KJ’s minutes; I really think KU would benefit by giving him more minutes than the 5 he played yesterday.
I agree, they have just got to find/get some kind of minutes/production out of this bench , because of the physicality of this league we just can’t continue to have the starters having to play those type of minutes. There is no way they won’t wear down over the stretch of the Season. By the time the tourney rolls around they will be so exhausted.
Also they have just got to gt more scoring production out of other players - -Kevin , Hunter , & KJ had to do this all by themselves in the first half - -other then Johnny’s ONE point . In the 2nd half others finally was able to get some contribution. - -Juan has just got to score or look to score more, - he has proven he can do it. Coach has said multiple times Juan is a reluctant shooter. I think maybe to a point other He teams realize a lot of times when he drives baseline of course he isn’t going to try and score - - going to try and kick it out, and I think part of the problem for his recent rise in turnover, stupid forced passes. He is capable - -someone has to step up. Three guys isn’t going to get you to the promised land the deeper you go in the tourney we need others to produce more
@stoptheflop said in KU vs TCU game chat:
The minutes played by our starters yesterday just can’t be sustained over the rest of the season: Juan, 39 min.; Kevin, 38; KJ, 37; and Hunter, 35. And 24 wasted minutes by Elmarko, 0 pts. 0/4 shooting, 2 rbs and 2 assists. I understand the starters were needed yesterday against an inspired TCU team. Now that KU plays two games a week, we’ll see how the playing time gets divided. Nick at the point yesterday was a complete surprise to me, even though it was only a minute. Parker could take some of KJ’s minutes; I really think KU would benefit by giving him more minutes than the 5 he played yesterday.
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@stoptheflop I had to check the box score to see if Jackson recorded a stat besides a TO.
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I’m wondering if Furphy is close to taking the 5th starting spot? Nick even.
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@Crimsonorblue22 Nick looked good yesterday, had a couple of steals and was much better defensively. I’m kinda shocked that Jackson has a leash of 6 miles while the other youngsters have one that’s 6 inches. If he has a game like yesterday again, I’d start Timberlake or Furphy
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If they counted how many times he gave up a basket he’d lead the team. Really poor defensive game from him yesterday and you could tell he was not having his best day. Nerves for conference opener. Hopefully he settles. We are just seeing the up and down for sure
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Guess Fran lost his mind on X with the call. It’s odd to me why espn has him call our games. He is obviously super jealous of Self and can’t stand us. Can you imagine SEC football talking trash on Saban for 3/4s of the telecast.
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@kjayhawks said in KU vs TCU game chat:
@Crimsonorblue22 Nick looked good yesterday, had a couple of steals and was much better defensively. I’m kinda shocked that Jackson has a leash of 6 miles while the other youngsters have one that’s 6 inches. If he has a game like yesterday again, I’d start Timberlake or Furphy
The problem is that we desperately need Elmarko to start and improve. He’s the only athletic small we have to help guard opposing smalls. We all love us some Furphy, but he’s not that guy. Timberlake hasn’t proven to be that guy either. McCullar is great on D, but smaller quicker guys are tough to stick with.
So unless we are playing a bigger, slower team, I can’t see how Furphy starts.
And we know how Self feels about defending…
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@rockchalkjayhawk I don’t disagree with that assessment at all. I feel like Kevin disappeared for much of the second half yesterday. I trust Self and he’s at practice everyday assessing these guys. But I do think our season hinges on these younger/bench guys developing into serviceable players at this level. I think Wednesday is a huge game because it’s probably the weakest team left on our schedule. A good chance to rest starters as we prepare to play 2 games a week from here on out and some experience for Mari, Furphy and Elmarko.
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Glad we are all on the same page that we need production from at least 5 guys, and a few good minutes from our bench.
First… let’s remember this is our conference season opener… so it is new to all our newbie players. I wasn’t expecting much from the Furphy, Timberlake, Jackson combo for this reason alone, plus add in TCU’s ability to play us tough on our own court. TCU came in with energy, were well-prepared and had us properly scouted. Their attitudes were right on and I still can’t believe we won this game.
Comparing these 3 in this one game I’d say Jackson was at the bottom. You could see his confidence was lacking and that not only hurts his play but also puts a damper on the rest of the team. Timberlake was up and down. Loved it when he was up! Furphy is young but I feel like he keeps his composure well. Furphy gives us another real rebounder. The biggest problem with all 3 players is their defense just isn’t there. All teams are going to take it right to all 3. Furphy had 4 quick fouls because they took the ball to him. For this season, Jackson probably has the most defensive potential because of his athleticism… but he makes so many mental and newbie mistakes.
Self is going to have to engineer a defensive strategy to help prevent getting chewed up at that spot. It isn’t enough to put these guys on the worst offensive players because they get nailed in switches and offer little weakside help.
While I’m being critical… I think the best way for us to help cover this weakness is to turn up our defense all the way around. I realize our guys play a lot of minutes, but our overall defensive intensity was low. It was our conference home-opener and we faced a team that thrashed us last year in AFH. We did not disrupt their offensive flow at all. And which team scored off their defense? Our fast break defense was lacking.
I’d rather see our starting 5 turn it up to 100% intensity and sub them out more regularly. Parker has been a nice surprise on defense. Jamari has been okay. I just think our low-intensity games are going to cost us big eventually and it also sets us up for bad habits.
Positives… Hunter and KJ! Wow! It wasn’t one of Kevin’s best games but he never stops hustling. Juan finally turned it up a little bit late. He needs to shoot the ball more.
We dodged a big bullet… let’s all be thankful for that! The Udeh smack deserved the call. Can’t believe what I heard from whats-his-name (the old ref) saying it was incidental play-through contact. BS. Udeh’s arm went back while his play was moving forward. There was no reason for that motion. It was out of control and could have caused a lasting injury. I’m not going to claim it was intentional… I can’t get in his head. Flagrant fouls don’t relate to intention (and why they aren’t called “intentional fouls”). By all definitions, this was a foul. His arm went out of control and it reminded me how rough his skills were when in Lawrence.
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@drgnslayr ya it looked intentional and like an easy call live and at the game. Watching replays today, I don’t see the cause for an uproar. It was avoidable contact to the head or neck. Literally written that way in the rule book.
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Do you possibly think, Self has no idea what Fran says on the air? The reason I say that is cause fran acts like they’re best friends, like coach has him at his camps, practices, etc. He sucks up so bad!
fran also said that Hunter traveled on the winning layup when he clearly used a power dribble. He thought it was funny to add that after he said he agreed w/cbs expert, who clearly wasn’t up on new rule.
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Any kind of hit or blow to head can cause a head injury which is why they call these! With these head injuries they protect kids better than they use too, which is the right thing. We’ve had kids in our high school they have had more than 1 concussion in BB. Scary! So my point besides protecting them is they could miss a few games at the very least.
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Udeh did apologize
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Coach said our offense lead to their offense, meaning our TO’s lead to 3 on 2’s and 2 on 1’s. Hard to guard those. Somebody said they knew a lot of our sets, anticipated our passes well.
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Wasn’t it last game or 1 before marko had his best game? They abused him yesterday! Athletic team. @kjayhawks how was the crowd when Udeh was introduced? I heard mixed.
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@rockchalkjayhawk said in KU vs TCU game chat:
@kjayhawks said in KU vs TCU game chat:
@Crimsonorblue22 Nick looked good yesterday, had a couple of steals and was much better defensively. I’m kinda shocked that Jackson has a leash of 6 miles while the other youngsters have one that’s 6 inches. If he has a game like yesterday again, I’d start Timberlake or Furphy
The problem is that we desperately need Elmarko to start and improve. He’s the only athletic small we have to help guard opposing smalls. We all love us some Furphy, but he’s not that guy. Timberlake hasn’t proven to be that guy either. McCullar is great on D, but smaller quicker guys are tough to stick with.
So unless we are playing a bigger, slower team, I can’t see how Furphy starts.
And we know how Self feels about defending…
Agree that Furphy can’t start, but would like to see him get 20 minutes a game at both the 3 and 4 for Kev and KJ…He has high Bball IQ, which can’t really be taught, and he rebounds more aggressively than anyone else on the team…
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@Crimsonorblue22 I read that he was cheered during introductions but booed during game
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@Crimsonorblue22 there were more cheers than boos for Udeh for sure.
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@DCHawker I’m all for more PT for Furphy!
I thought he was even aggressive with a rebound or two. Love it.
I was a bit sad that Self hooked Jamari after one nervous double dribble. Can’t grow accustomed to the game speed and intensity from the bench
And more Parker is a great idea. Give a few guys some rest. I honestly don’t get how stubborn Self can be at times. But, our scoring ability dips considerably without the 7 footer on the floor.
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@rockchalkjayhawk that’s my deal with not letting anyone get a chance to play thru a mistake outside of Elmarko. 2 of Furphys fouls were garbage imo.
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@AsadZ during the elbow? I’m sure he didn’t do it on purpose, that’s part of his erratic play.
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Even in the first half
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This game will be much easier to evaluate at the end of the season.
My personal opinion: Hindsight will show that our turnovers are as much a credit to TCU’s defense as to our sloppy play. Good defenses cause TOs. And TCU is well coached, so they have an edge on anticipating actions and lanes.
I think this will look like a good win in March.
Also, this was a 50-50 game throughout and we won. Neither team got or gave up a big lead. Winning that kind of game is always good!
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@bskeet TCU will finish in the top 5 of this conference. They are long and will give teams a fit defensively.
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Great post, agree on all. Biggest lead was 6 (KU) for either team. TCU is top 10 in the nation in steals. The way KU is generating offense this year is heavily influenced through passing (a reason assists are so high) with a lot less ISO ball so it’s something KU will have to navigate and continue to improve on. There were certainly some careless mistakes made but a good chunk of turnovers came off good TCU defense. It is an area of concern though as Harris & is averaging a career worst 2.7 turnovers per game & his coach has been on him about that and other things more than a few times already this season. Some out of character mistakes from him at times this year. Hopefully it’s something they get behind them and doesn’t keep popping up.
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I’m happy that Kevin is shooting and making his free throws with 78 made at a very nice 83.9% rate. This is 50 more makes than Hunter or KJ. Since Kevin came back to raise his draft stock, I guess, one thing the NBA tracks and values is percentage of finishes at the rim and it seems to me Kevin has an opportunity to get more “and ones” than he is getting now. No one is tougher than Kevin and he sacrifices himself every game but if he would complete say for comparisons sake two more at the rim makes and hit the free throw that adds two more points and would up his conference leading scoring average to 22.1 and get him even closer to first team AA status.
