Big 12 Expansion
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@justanotherfan said in Big 12 Expansion:
@drgnslayr said in Big 12 Expansion:
Where will our kids be making their NIL? Maybe I’m off here… but won’t it be for selling carpet in Kansas City? Or BBQ? Won’t that be more localized $$$? Like… would Och be making money on his image in Michigan? I am thinking the big $$$ made from moving to the Big10 won’t be going to the athletes.
You’re right, they will be making money locally. But answer this - where can you make more money? Selling carpet in KC or selling carpet in Chicago? Advertising for a restaurant in Wichita or in Dallas? See where I’m going. The Big 12 footprint doesn’t have a lot of pull in the larger metro areas, so NIL $$$ will depress slightly. If you’re an athlete at UCLA or USC, you have all of LA at your fingertips. That will pay more than something in Lawrence. That’s the challenge.
@Texas-Hawk-10 if streaming is the future, again, will Jayhawk TV get as many subscribers as a network dedicated to Texas or USC or Cal? If not, the money just won’t be there because Kansas is a smaller state than a lot of these other places. That’s just the difficulty with the new deals out there.
That’s not how NIL works. Playing for a school in a bigger market doesn’t guarantee a bigger payday. In the case of somewhere like LA, that’s a pro sports town and it’s going to be players from the pro teams getting the type of endorsement deals your talking about. The way NIL money makes it way to programs is through the school’s boosters and the companies they own paying athletes to promote those businesses on social media.
As for streaming, no, JayhawkTV is not something that KU should market independently. If you go into ESPN+, you can find hours of content produced by JayhawkTV there like “Miles To Go” and other stuff like that. Old football and basketball games, olympic sports archives, behind the scenes stuff. That’s stuff that adds value to JayhawkTV and if KU were to move to the Big 10, all that content moves with KU to be added to the BTN archives giving them even more content they can add. Then, when the Big 10 goes looking for a new media rights deal, if someone like Amazon or AppleTV get involved, the B10 can show them how many hours of content they have to sell, including JayhawkTV content and help increase the value of that type of deal because a lot of those deals are based on how many hours of content are being offered.
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This may be a stupid question, I’ve asked a few, but do our many wealthy alumni that are scattered around the country contribute to NIL’s?
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@justanotherfan do you think our ncaa championship game viewership is a good judge of that or not? https://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/article/2022-04-05/2022-di-mens-basketball-championship-game-sets-single-game-viewing-records
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Fascinating posts… thank you! I can get behind growth in academics!
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The new Big Ten media deal will be MASSIVE. Like over $1 billion per year massive. Pretty soon the gap between the two premiere leagues and the rest of the crew will be $50m+ per school per year. Not to mention the Big 12, ACC, and PAC will get worse networks, less desirable time slots, and less coverage on ESPN, ABC, CBS, and FOX.
Our ticket to a better league for KU is when (I don’t think it’s an if statement) the conferences tell the NCAA to screw off and take the basketball tournament into their own hands. Any other network would love to have the tv rights to a new Power 5 Invitational or whatever they call it. And KU would be the biggest beneficiary. Why, you ask? It all comes down to how the NCAA distributes Tournament revenue.
The NCAA Tournament takes in over $1 billion per year. How much of that gets doled out to conferences? Well, about $170 million. Each school gets one “unit” for making the tournament and another for each win. The value of a unit this year was about $340k. So KU earned 7 units for the Big 12 to split up among the 10 schools. Which is a ripoff! We should be getting A LOT more. But between the Tournament not being sold at market value (the NCAA isn’t maximizing the value at all) and the NCAA taking by far the largest share of a too small pie, the conferences are getting jobbed.
What if the power leagues started their own, similar to the football playoff? I’m glad you asked! The CFP distributes $74m per conference to P5 leagues as part of the bowl system, plus academic bonuses. And an additional $6m per league for each playoff team. And an additional $4m just for making a bowl.
There is a vast well of untapped value KU has if the leagues tell the NCAA to screw off.
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@Crimsonorblue22 said in Big 12 Expansion:
@justanotherfan do you think our ncaa championship game viewership is a good judge of that or not? https://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/article/2022-04-05/2022-di-mens-basketball-championship-game-sets-single-game-viewing-records
I don’t. The NCAA championship game usually has good viewership. You had a great game with two high profile programs. That should have high viewership. This wasn’t Texas Tech-Virginia. This was KU-UNC. I don’t think that necessarily translates to NIL, but it does help the overall college basketball market.
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I wouldn’t put the PAC into the same category as the Big12 or even ACC. I think the PAC has a unique demographic advantage that is very desirable-- the entire west coast.
My opinion: The 3 conferences with the best positioning for the foreseeable future are SEC, B10 and PAC.
These are the 3 Kings.
All 3 are headed toward a natural state of equilibrium that is 16 schools. The SEC is already there with the addition of Texas and OU. The B10 and PAC both have 14 schools, so they could add 2 schools each.
In this ecosystem, there is room for one more super-conference. (Four super-conferences provides 64 teams for a natural playoff bracket for all major sports. It covers the timezones for the networks and it avoids saturation.)
That fourth conference is to be determined… but the B12 and the ACC do not have the mass/gravity to hold together while in such close orbit. They will pull apart at some point and there will be reformation to a new conference of 16 schools that will join the 3 kings.
An inevitable game of musical chairs is coming. Any schools not already comfortably sitting in one of the 3 kings, would be vying for those 16 spots – including the remaining schools from the ACC, the Big12 the AAC and the Big East… not to mention a few from the Big West will try to make a case.
Avoiding this game of musical chairs is another reason (on top of all the points previously made) why it is important to secure a spot in one of the 3 kings… (and SEC and PAC are non-starters, so it has to be B10).
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Well, there goes KU’s shot at joining the B10…
Dwindling options. Join the PAC 12 or the B12 add two of the best remaining - CO rejoin and maybe AZ? Not sure they would have any interest…
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@DCHawker said in Big 12 Expansion:
Well, there goes KU’s shot at joining the B10…
Dwindling options. Join the PAC 12 or the B12 add two of the best remaining - CO rejoin and maybe AZ? Not sure they would have any interest…
ya does look that way if those two joined that would put the Big 10 at the 16 team , although I’ve never thought we were really in that serious contention. Not worried KU will figure this out
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The moving isn’t close to done
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This is interesting and surprising because usually the Big 10 has been interested in schools that share a border with current Big 10 members.
With the Big 12 hiring their new commissioner, I’m hoping he’ll look at further expanding the Big 12 by raiding the PAC12 and going after Arizona, Arizona St., Colorado, and Utah if UCLA and USC do bolt for the Big 10.
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@FarmerJayhawk said in Big 12 Expansion:
The moving isn’t close to done
How much more moving are you thinking? 20 teams? 24 teams?
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A bit concerning and discouraging as KU fan who thought the Big10 was the best resting place when the music stopped.
There are interesting opportunities for the B12 - Not only plucking some fruit from the Pac12 as was mentioned, but also from the SEC which might have a couple of schools rethinking their allegiances… And possibly ACC (which has been very quiet lately.)
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@KirkIsMyHinrich said in Big 12 Expansion:
@FarmerJayhawk said in Big 12 Expansion:
The moving isn’t close to done
How much more moving are you thinking? 20 teams? 24 teams?
24 https://twitter.com/genetics56/status/1542623835761033219?s=21&t=kS1iTgLGpPca_kJ7eJsZcA
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Hang onto your butts https://twitter.com/rossdellenger/status/1542654210306674688?s=21&t=-aAGNmgYxa1sic2rGR5wTA
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The news just said at 6 they’ve been accepted.
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@FarmerJayhawk said in Big 12 Expansion:
Hang onto your butts https://twitter.com/rossdellenger/status/1542654210306674688?s=21&t=-aAGNmgYxa1sic2rGR5wTA
Out of curiosity, would you rather UNC join the SEC or the B10? And how do you feel about not being in a conference with Duke?
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Media outlets in the Northwest are already reacting to the USC & UCLA departures, mostly with alarm.
Schools like Oregon and Washington (fiscally stable up to now) have a decision, according to one headline I just read: “Leave Pac-12 Or Be Content In A Declining Conference.” Already some rumors have the two schools off to another league, possibly the Big 10.
One issue for any conference taking them in: the fate of the rival programs at Oregon State and Washington State, which don’t have near the resources of their in-state counterparts.
(It makes one wonder how many KU fans would trade the K-State rivalry for a berth in a better conference.)
A lot of the blame for the LA schools leaving can be put on the last Pac-12 commissioner, who negotiated a terrible TV contract that put a lot of kickoff times way too late for viewers in the Eastern and Central time zones. I’m sure the Big 10 won’t have them play home games at 7:30 Pacific.
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@KirkIsMyHinrich said in Big 12 Expansion:
@FarmerJayhawk said in Big 12 Expansion:
Hang onto your butts https://twitter.com/rossdellenger/status/1542654210306674688?s=21&t=-aAGNmgYxa1sic2rGR5wTA
Out of curiosity, would you rather UNC join the SEC or the B10? And how do you feel about not being in a conference with Duke?
That’s tough. Culturally UNC is a much better fit in the SEC, but the SEC doesn’t have the Olympic sports or academics UNC really values. So I’d say Big Ten. Duke can rot in hell
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@nwhawkfan said in Big 12 Expansion:
Media outlets in the Northwest are already reacting to the USC & UCLA departures, mostly with alarm.
Schools like Oregon and Washington (fiscally stable up to now) have a decision, according to one headline I just read: “Leave Pac-12 Or Be Content In A Declining Conference.” Already some rumors have the two schools off to another league, possibly the Big 10.
One issue for any conference taking them in: the fate of the rival programs at Oregon State and Washington State, which don’t have near the resources of their in-state counterparts.
(It makes one wonder how many KU fans would trade the K-State rivalry for a berth in a better conference.)
A lot of the blame for the LA schools leaving can be put on the last Pac-12 commissioner, who negotiated a terrible TV contract that put a lot of kickoff times way too late for viewers in the Eastern and Central time zones. I’m sure the Big 10 won’t have them play home games at 7:30 Pacific.
Answering about KU leaving the K/ state rivalry - -I think they would in a heart beat, bottom line is teams/schools have to look out for themselves , rivalries or not, and really for KU/K State there hasn’t been that rialary lately in the two sports - - K/State dominating Football - - KU dominating Basketball. The other school need to win once in a while for it to really be a rivalry . The thing is and I have no clue on this totally know nothing but evey time this is brought up all I hear is how Govt here in Kansas would not allow KU to leave K/State behind I don’t know
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@Texas-Hawk-10 said in Big 12 Expansion:
This is interesting and surprising because usually the Big 10 has been interested in schools that share a border with current Big 10 members.
With the Big 12 hiring their new commissioner, I’m hoping he’ll look at further expanding the Big 12 by raiding the PAC12 and going after Arizona, Arizona St., Colorado, and Utah if UCLA and USC do bolt for the Big 10.
Ya we must do something and would say I think fairly quickly. - -Like your thoughts would like possibly having Arizona & Arizona State possibly joining . - -What about trying to get some teams from ACC if not PACC 12 ? - -This whole deal with the BIG 10 accepting UCLA & USC has kind of blown geographics right out of the water. - Would be some travel problems/distance for sure but looking like now all bets are off and Dog eat Dog
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I think with this move by USC & UCLA moving to the BIG 10 - your gonna see a lot of movement now. - -I think this thing has just erupted. Hoping for the best & I think now KU stays put expand the Big 12 and see where it goes. Good teams from other conferences going to be looking to make moves and make moves soon I think
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Not sure if ANY TRUTH at all to this but got from TOS. statement from Bowlsbuy - -The Big 12 officially announcing extending offers to Arizona , Arizona State , Washington , & Oregon to joining 24-25 academic year. - -Could be some trioll.
One thing we DO KNOW this is going to be something else hold on wild ride in the future
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I don’t know guys , I mean call me blind , call me thick , call me slow , call me stupid BUT with this latest development , I just think even more now that KU will be staying put. - -One - -with USC & UCLA joining the BIg 10 I just think there is even a less chance of KU just for Basketball.- - With what has even been mentioned here Football is the money maker in College sports and even though I love my KU - - we all know KU brings NOTHING in that aspect I just don’t think even more now that our Basketball is enough to attract the offer. USC traditional good football teams - & good enough especially UCLA can hold their own in Basketball
I just feel even more strongly now and like an article I red tonight the Big 12 which found it’self in Death throes 11 months ago NOW all of a sudden find their Selves in an advantageous position as beneficiary with this movement in the Pac 12. I think the possibilities like a different article said - -we could see the Big 12 and the remainder of the Pac 12 form a merger - -OR the big 12 may just try and add Arizona - - Arizona State - - Oregon - - Utah - -* Washington I just think KU will stay put and ride it out
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I would favor something like what happened with the Big 12 1.0. The Southwest Conference and Big 8 folded and formed the Big 12.
I’ll be honest, I do not give a flying monkey’s arse about BYU, University of Florida - Orlando (Online), or “baby vomit over spaghetti” Cincinnati. I don’t like those cities for road trips and they don’t add much to the competitiveness of the league in terms of economic value.
I also don’t really care about Wazzu or Oregon State. Pullman is more or less in Idaho and Corvallis allegedly is a real city, but I haven’t confirmed that.
So, let’s take the best of the rest and build a legit power league. Stanford, Cal, Colorado, Utah, and the Arizonas are a good start out west. KU, ISU, Tech, OSU, Houston, and maybe another Texas school works. If you can get UW and Oregon that’s even better. All the sudden you have a really good league.
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Doesn’t CA have a prohibition against their state supported schools (UC system) playing schools where politics conflict? I think Kansas, Oklahoma, maybe Nebraska conflict. I dunno about other Big 10 schools.
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@Gorilla72 said in Big 12 Expansion:
Doesn’t CA have a prohibition against their state supported schools (UC system) playing schools where politics conflict? I think Kansas, Oklahoma, maybe Nebraska conflict. I dunno about other Big 10 schools.
State funds can’t be used to travel to those states. Which doesn’t really matter for athletics since they can just say it’s donor money.
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“ The travel ban, which took effect in January, originally included Kansas, Mississippi, North Carolina and Tennessee. The Attorney General … announced he had added Alabama, Kentucky, South Dakota and Texas because of recently enacted laws in those states.” Apparently it includes university staff members. I’m not certain it can be gotten around so easily due to the amount of state funding involved. I’ll be interested to see if it comes into play…
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Coaches and team personnel are almost always independent contractors. If this was a real issue UCLA would be in trouble. I believe Iowa and Ohio are on the list
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@FarmerJayhawk said in Big 12 Expansion:
I would favor something like what happened with the Big 12 1.0. The Southwest Conference and Big 8 folded and formed the Big 12.
I’ll be honest, I do not give a flying monkey’s arse about BYU, University of Florida - Orlando (Online), or “baby vomit over spaghetti” Cincinnati. I don’t like those cities for road trips and they don’t add much to the competitiveness of the league in terms of economic value.
I also don’t really care about Wazzu or Oregon State. Pullman is more or less in Idaho and Corvallis allegedly is a real city, but I haven’t confirmed that.
So, let’s take the best of the rest and build a legit power league. Stanford, Cal, Colorado, Utah, and the Arizonas are a good start out west. KU, ISU, Tech, OSU, Houston, and maybe another Texas school works. If you can get UW and Oregon that’s even better. All the sudden you have a really good league.
Baby v**** over spaghetti. That is the grossest restaurant on earth. When I lived in Florida, there was a Skyline right next to my office. I tried it once, and it was horrible. A year later, I got talked into it again, and it was even worse.
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I think chances are that the Big 1 and the Pac 12 merge when it’s all said and done , & I think we are going to see this put into action fairly quickly
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@Jethro said in Big 12 Expansion:
@FarmerJayhawk said in Big 12 Expansion:
I would favor something like what happened with the Big 12 1.0. The Southwest Conference and Big 8 folded and formed the Big 12.
I’ll be honest, I do not give a flying monkey’s arse about BYU, University of Florida - Orlando (Online), or “baby vomit over spaghetti” Cincinnati. I don’t like those cities for road trips and they don’t add much to the competitiveness of the league in terms of economic value.
I also don’t really care about Wazzu or Oregon State. Pullman is more or less in Idaho and Corvallis allegedly is a real city, but I haven’t confirmed that.
So, let’s take the best of the rest and build a legit power league. Stanford, Cal, Colorado, Utah, and the Arizonas are a good start out west. KU, ISU, Tech, OSU, Houston, and maybe another Texas school works. If you can get UW and Oregon that’s even better. All the sudden you have a really good league.
Baby v**** over spaghetti. That is the grossest restaurant on earth. When I lived in Florida, there was a Skyline right next to my office. I tried it once, and it was horrible. A year later, I got talked into it again, and it was even worse.
Good to see this board has people with the strictly correct take regarding Skyline. Carry on then.
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@jayballer67 said in Big 12 Expansion:
I think chances are that the Big 1 and the Pac 12 merge when it’s all said and done , & I think we are going to see this put into action fairly quickly
The B1G isn’t ready to move on Oregon and Washington. Waiting on Notre Dame. The Big 12 should be pulling every string to get the top of the PAC.
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If Oregon joined the B12, the flagship institutions for Nike and Adidas would be head to head every season. (assuming KU stays in the B12, which is as big of an assumption at this point as Oregon leaving the Pac12)
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@FarmerJayhawk said in Big 12 Expansion:
@jayballer67 said in Big 12 Expansion:
I think chances are that the Big 1 and the Pac 12 merge when it’s all said and done , & I think we are going to see this put into action fairly quickly
The B1G isn’t ready to move on Oregon and Washington. Waiting on Notre Dame. The Big 12 should be pulling every string to get the top of the PAC.
couldn’t agree with you more Famer - - I think they need to jump and jump now. - -The chances of us in the Big 10 are getting less and less. - - I dove into the message boards of the pac 12 schools and they all seem to think they need to join the big 12 - Arizona , Arizona State , Utah , & Colorado. - sur not the perfect scenario but we can’t sit still and do nothing
I red a statement from CBS Sports that quoted one Big 12 Member saying they had no interest at this time to add any Pac 12 members - - that would be a HUGE mistake. - -Either merge and take all remaining members or take those 4 schools. The Big 12can not afford to just sit and do nothing
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@FarmerJayhawk so no way we get invited?
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So it looks like this is going to turn into one big time cluster. - - Read where the Big 10 has told Oregon & Stanford they standing pat and not looking to expand any further at this point.
Pac 12 looking to expand ,if this happens - -does KU become one of the expansions joining the Pac 12 ? - I will repeat the people in charge need to get after this with all fours - -whether its the Pac 12 joining the Big 1 or Visa Versa - -things have got to move. -I think probably best if the two just merge
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@Crimsonorblue22 said in Big 12 Expansion:
@FarmerJayhawk so no way we get invited?
There’s definitely a way. If the B1G goes to 20+, we’re a strong candidate.
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So I wonder what happens to these other Conferences ? - -The Big East - - Will the ACC survive
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https://www.heartlandcollegesports.com/2022/06/30/big-ten-conference-done-with-expansion-for-now/
Not sure how reliable, but sounds like Big 10 is done for now with expansion. If that is the case, the Big 12 needs act and go after Arizona, ASU, Colorado, Utah, Cal, Stanford, Oregon, and Washington and beat the Big 10 and SEC to 20 teams.
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No wonder people say the ACC grant of rights is ironclad. There’s no mechanism in the deal for getting out of it! https://cdn.theathletic.com/app/uploads/2022/07/01185531/ACC-Grant-of-Rights-1.pdf
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@jayballer67 said in Big 12 Expansion:
So it looks like this is going to turn into one big time cluster. - - Read where the Big 10 has told Oregon & Stanford they standing pat and not looking to expand any further at this point.
Pac 12 looking to expand ,if this happens - -does KU become one of the expansions joining the Pac 12 ? - I will repeat the people in charge need to get after this with all fours - -whether its the Pac 12 joining the Big 1 or Visa Versa - -things have got to move. -I think probably best if the two just merge
The Pac 12 would be a death knell for us- the black hole of college sports. I sure hope we don’t merge. If anything, I could see Pac12 losing most of their members after all this shakes out. I think the B12 will swoop in.
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@Jethro said in Big 12 Expansion:
@jayballer67 said in Big 12 Expansion:
So it looks like this is going to turn into one big time cluster. - - Read where the Big 10 has told Oregon & Stanford they standing pat and not looking to expand any further at this point.
Pac 12 looking to expand ,if this happens - -does KU become one of the expansions joining the Pac 12 ? - I will repeat the people in charge need to get after this with all fours - -whether its the Pac 12 joining the Big 1 or Visa Versa - -things have got to move. -I think probably best if the two just merge
The Pac 12 would be a death knell for us- the black hole of college sports. I sure hope we don’t merge. If anything, I could see Pac12 losing most of their members after all this shakes out. I think the B12 will swoop in.
Hell if the big 12 swoops in as you say and most of members no difference then the leagues merging -big 12/pac 12 - - pac 12/big 12 either way these two will form in the ed in some way
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@FarmerJayhawk said in Big 12 Expansion:
No wonder people say the ACC grant of rights is ironclad. There’s no mechanism in the deal for getting out of it! https://cdn.theathletic.com/app/uploads/2022/07/01185531/ACC-Grant-of-Rights-1.pdf
I don’t imagine the conference lawyers wanted to make it easy to make a “lateral” move for schools from one P5 league to another. The Big 12 probably has similar language in their deals which is why OU amd Texas haven’t been able to work on an earlier move to the SEC than when the B12 Grant of Rights expires.
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https://www.heartlandcollegesports.com/2022/07/01/pac-12-big-12-college-football-realignment-news/
If accurate, WTF!?!? I guess the behavior makes sense considering Bowlsby is still in charge for a few more weeks and he’s never been proactive when poaching teams when that’s been anopinion, he’s always been reactive when making moves. It’d be nice if his farewell to the Big 12 was to change it up, swing for the fences and invite Arizona, ASU, Cal, Colorado, Oregon, Stanford, Utah, and Washington to the Big 12 and see who’s interested. Especially considering the Big 12 does have their next TV deal coming up a year after the B10. Going for those 8 schools is probably the only way to realistically increase the current yearly payout to schools.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 said in Big 12 Expansion:
https://www.heartlandcollegesports.com/2022/07/01/pac-12-big-12-college-football-realignment-news/
If accurate, WTF!?!? I guess the behavior makes sense considering Bowlsby is still in charge for a few more weeks and he’s never been proactive when poaching teams when that’s been anopinion, he’s always been reactive when making moves. It’d be nice if his farewell to the Big 12 was to change it up, swing for the fences and invite Arizona, ASU, Cal, Colorado, Oregon, Stanford, Utah, and Washington to the Big 12 and see who’s interested. Especially considering the Big 12 does have their next TV deal coming up a year after the B10. Going for those 8 schools is probably the only way to realistically increase the current yearly payout to schools.
If the Big 12 jacks around and does nothing and wets all over themselves with this - - then the league deserves whatever they get. This bullshit of just sitting when the teams are there to expand - -now days you better get it done. - -The Big 12 can not afford to just sit around on their thumbs with this
@Texas-Hawk-10 said in Big 12 Expansion:
@FarmerJayhawk said in Big 12 Expansion:
No wonder people say the ACC grant of rights is ironclad. There’s no mechanism in the deal for getting out of it! https://cdn.theathletic.com/app/uploads/2022/07/01185531/ACC-Grant-of-Rights-1.pdf
I don’t imagine the conference lawyers wanted to make it easy to make a “lateral” move for schools from one P5 league to another. The Big 12 probably has similar language in their deals which is why OU amd Texas haven’t been able to work on an earlier move to the SEC than when the B12 Grant of Rights expires.
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maybe I’m a lone wolf , maybe im stressing to much but I’ve been reding Arizona , Arizona State , Utah boards and seems consensoul that these teams need to be added to the Big 12. WHY is the higher ups of the Big 12 being so blind. They need to move, the Big 12 sits silent then they WILL BE silent at the wrong time. - -They have to get these teams added to stay relevant in the sporting world. To sit and be silent makes no sense what so ever The Big 12 needs to move and move now.
Either we merge with the pac 12 or we take these teams to form our own solid conference - not just sit and be a complete idiot
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There’s a meeting Tuesday between the Big 12 and the Arizonas, Utah, and Colorado. This could get done quickly
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@FarmerJayhawk said in Big 12 Expansion:
There’s a meeting Tuesday between the Big 12 and the Arizonas, Utah, and Colorado. This could get done quickly
Dang Farmer thats good news hopefully. Thanks for the insight. The Big 12 just can’t afford to sit still and do nothing, I’m hoping this is some SERIOUS TALKS. - -I think if we could get together with the Arizona Schools and add the other two it would at least put us on more stable ground. No wouldn’t be some mega conference but we would at least put us on more stable ground…
Your a breath of fresh air on this Sunday Evening Farmer, may not be the ideal situation but we have to DO SOMETHING. - -Like I posted earlier, off the Arizona boards most their fans figure it’s pretty much a given they come to the Big 12. If indeed this got done would move us to a 16 team conference
