WSU grudge
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So to the complete inapplicability of the analogy. Folks do this stuff all the time. So, why criticize someone for murder or other lawlessness if I go 79 in a 75? Pure foolishness. It’s the argument of the irrational moral equalizers.
Bill Self made the widely public proclamation on the his behalf, on behalf of our program, on behalf of our school – for the entire nation to hear – that was a lie. It’s easy to say he’s dishonest.
The fact that it was so public and made on behalf of our program increases its import to me. And leads to my viewpoint.
On the integrity part, I think that’s much different. I get what many of you have said relating it to other coaches, programs, and the sport. My view is/was based some unrealistic expectations perhaps. I acknowledge that.
But I do expect honesty – or at least not lying. Don’t lie. Just don’t say anything. Don’t lie. It’s a horrible message to all involved and certainly to the players that he’s trying to be a role model for.
Instead, perhaps this statement related to improper benefits: “I have always tried to operate our program the right way. As a program, we do not offer any improper benefits. None of my coaches, nor I, have offered or provided improper benefits. I can assure you of that. The Adidas involvement and the role of shoe companies in general, create a much different dynamic for all schools involved. Obviously we’re dealing with those issues related to our involvement. And I’m sure college basketball as a whole will address many of these issues. We want to operate our program in the right way.”
I’m still believing that “our program” and “coaches” don’t do it. But we know the shoecos do. This simple adjustment avoids blatantly lying.
But Bill Self chose to go a much different route. And that ain’t going 79 in a 75.
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This all rings hollow from a likely Trump supporter and known racist.
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@BShark What does one’s political leanings have to do with what that person expects from a basketball coach?
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@BigBad said in WSU grudge:
@BShark What does one’s political leanings have to do with what that person expects from a basketball coach?
If you condemn a basketball coach with this veracity, over one single “misleading” statement, wouldn’t you think that same person would expect the POTUS to also operate with honesty and integrity?
If honesty and integrity are SOOOOOO important to you as a person, than you shouldn’t morally be able to support someone who has lied or mislead the American public 15,000 times in three years.
Or is it actually not that important to your moral code? Is honesty only important sometimes? Is it an expectation or is it not? Why is one more worthy of condemning than the other?
“That’s politics” is a pretty lame excuse for someone who claims to have such upstanding morals and character. And it’s rather inconsistent. Dare I say, hypocritical… It is actually funny to think someone tries to pretend they have the moral conviction to be so upset about one lie and then is 100% lock to vote in a pathological liar into the most powerful position on Earth and they will sleep like a baby that same night.
There is no moral conviction here. It’s virtue signaling at it’s finest. This is like a Vegetarian who owns a slaughterhouse. A doctor who smokes. A quarterback who kneels for injustice but is endorsed by Nike. A Trump being pissed about a Biden getting a job through nepotism. An activist lawyer that’s also being indicted for extortion.
I don’t care which way you lean.
Just don’t pretend to care about honesty and integrity when it is so clear that you are willing to abandon your “values” the second it benefits you.
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@BigBad It sort of reminds me of a time back in the 80s when someone told me she was in Germany when the US bombed Libya in response to Libyan agents murdering the Army sergeant in Berlin. She talked about how ashamed she was to be an American when her German friends asked how we could do so a warlike thing.
I said it would be years before I was willing to listen to moral lessons in international relations from Germans.
The thing is, when someone gets all bent out of shape over one lie told by a coach but is willing to let literally hundreds go by his chosen leader, or waxes forever about the breakdown in family values in minority communities but actively advocates for a serial adulterer and accused sex offender to be the leader of the country, or expresses so much disgust over lack of respect in modern society while knowingly and admittedly trying to offend people with racial and sexual jokes, it really undermines the weight of their opinion.
It is fair to consider blatant hypocrisy when assessing an opinion.
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Well I was gonna answer, but there is little point after those two. I will just say still supporting Trump at this point requires a lot of cognitive dissonance, or at least I would hope so because the alternative is even worse.
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@BShark said in WSU grudge:
Self is a cheater for those that are still stuck in Pleasantville.
Oh well hell you wanna get technical every frickin school there is - cheats. -If the NCAA really wanted too they could nail EVERY FRICKEN SINGLE SCHOOL for some minor tedious Bullshit rule. - It’s the NCAA for GOD’S sake - tha is just another reason the NCAA life expectancy is coming toa close quickly. - -These schools gonna break away from these idiots -hide and watch.
The NCAA has had a wood for KU for years cause we stood up to these idiots - - fight for what we thought was right with appeals and suck for kids instead of just bending over and grabbing the ankles and saying - - -YES PLEASE. i’m so sick and tired of the NCAA’S bullshit and far from alone on how people feel. - Their time is limited - -you think not ? - - -Watch
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@BeddieKU23 said in WSU grudge:
@drgnslayr said in WSU grudge:
It should be a defensive battle! Wouldn’t surprise me to see a game in the 50s.
#1 and #2 defenses according to Kenpom.
Will Self try and play 2 bigs to match WVU? Have to win the rebounding war, we already know we are not winning the whistle tonight
KU’s Kenpom rating is slowly continuing to move upwards. Just passed 2019 Duke. Would have been ranked #2 in 2018, 2017, and 2016. #5 in 2015. #1 in 2014, #3 in 2013.
It’ll be interesting to see where they finish if they win out the rest of the regular season.
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@Kcmatt7 said in WSU grudge:
@BigBad said in WSU grudge:
@BShark What does one’s political leanings have to do with what that person expects from a basketball coach?
If you condemn a basketball coach with this veracity, over one single “misleading” statement, wouldn’t you think that same person would expect the POTUS to also operate with honesty and integrity?
If honesty and integrity are SOOOOOO important to you as a person, than you shouldn’t morally be able to support someone who has lied or mislead the American public 15,000 times in three years.
Again I asked why a political opinion matters the same as an opinion on a basketball coach.
You’re condemning hypocrisy while participating in the same thing just the opposite. You’re condemning a “lying president” but poo-pooing a lying basketball coach.
I’ll give you this…Politics and college basketball are pretty damn similar, they both reek of corruption! I don’t believe anyone who participates in either is clean.
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@drgnslayr said in WSU grudge:
It should be a defensive battle! Wouldn’t surprise me to see a game in the 50s.
you wasn’t far off my friend. ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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For those who remember their school days in debate… “truth” is defined as an absolute. Absolute is only applicable to mathematics.
We are all “liars.” We all have told “untruths” in our lives because, basically, every statement we make lacks absolute truth. Language isn’t built to accommodate absolute anything.
I’m making this extreme point because our tone is what counts here. Yes… Self, like all of us, has used language. Language doesn’t deal with absolute truths. Therefore, Self has communicated “untruths.” Do we take this to the extent of calling him a liar? This is about tone and how aggressively we want to label Self in the negative.
I’m on board for agreeing that college basketball is loaded with all kinds of untruth… exaggerations, misinformation, compromise, etc etc etc. Self is a part of the D1 system. He has chosen basketball coaching as his career. Did he do it because he desired to jump into a profession swimming in untruth? I don’t think so. I think he loves basketball. He loves coaching basketball. And he loves guiding young people in the game of basketball and the game of life. That is the “tone” I apply to this thread.
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Back to the speeding analogy, and a little injection of levity in this suddenly politically charged sports thread…
Regardless of actual speed, why is it that on the highway everybody going slower than me is a dumbass and everybody going faster than me is a crazy mthrfckr?
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@drgnslayr Oh sure. Bring logic and sense to the conversation. Thanks a lot.
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@StLJhawk LOL - Truth!
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@BigBad said in WSU grudge:
@Kcmatt7 said in WSU grudge:
@BigBad said in WSU grudge:
@BShark What does one’s political leanings have to do with what that person expects from a basketball coach?
If you condemn a basketball coach with this veracity, over one single “misleading” statement, wouldn’t you think that same person would expect the POTUS to also operate with honesty and integrity?
If honesty and integrity are SOOOOOO important to you as a person, than you shouldn’t morally be able to support someone who has lied or mislead the American public 15,000 times in three years.
Again I asked why a political opinion matters the same as an opinion on a basketball coach.
You’re condemning hypocrisy while participating in the same thing just the opposite. You’re condemning a “lying president” but poo-pooing a lying basketball coach.
I’ll give you this…Politics and college basketball are pretty damn similar, they both reek of corruption! I don’t believe anyone who participates in either is clean.
I’m condemning someone feeling so righteous they are acting as if they are Jesus while throwing the first stone.
I’m very well aware that my expectations on honesty and integrity are fluid and dependent on certain conditions.
The difference is I’m not lecturing people on here about their values. I don’t sit on a high horse. I just don’t appreciate someone thinking they have moral convictions so much greater than others here when that’s so obviously not true.
And fwiw, I’d rather be the hypocrite who expects the leader of the free world to have more honesty and integrity than than a basketball coach for my favorite hobby than vice versa…
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WSU is crying again, this time about mean ole KSU.
https://www.kansas.com/sports/college/wichita-state/article240416271.html
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@BShark said in WSU grudge:
WSU is crying again, this time about mean ole KSU.
https://www.kansas.com/sports/college/wichita-state/article240416271.html
Dam why the hell don’t they just give it a rest man.
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@jayballer73 What else you going to do when you have a crappy team in a crappy town? (sorry to my Wichita Jayhawks out there…)
They have to whine about something.
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@nuleafjhawk said in WSU grudge:
@jayballer73 What else you going to do when you have a crappy team in a crappy town? (sorry to my Wichita Jayhawks out there…)
They have to whine about something.
I actually love the City of Wichita. - -Lived there and on the out skirts for like 20 years. Then is there bitching even though it is K- State, they talk about how K-State was wanting to play them when WSU was in a rebuilding year , but now they wanna biotch when K-State obviously is in some rebuilding
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@jayballer73 I don’t like Wichita. When I’m there it feels like I’m just driving in a big strip mall.
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It’s the chain restaurant capital of the US.
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@nuleafjhawk crappy town?? Well I guess that’s your opinion bud
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@HawkChamp said in WSU grudge:
@nuleafjhawk crappy town?? Well I guess that’s your opinion bud
I loved Wichita, easy to get around in, and lots to do - -if you can’t find anything to do in Wichita - - - then your just not looking. - -Lived there and the surrounding area in between 13-14 years. te ONLY reason I left was after my divorce moved back here to be closer to other family. - -I don’t have any problem with it.
The only one thing that wasn’t to good was even though I didn’t have any encounters but one thing was you don’t mess with Law enforcement there. - Lots of accounts of Police brutality kind of some shaddy things going on. - Not gospel cause I never had encounter but plenty of accusations.
Wichita has it’s good points - - has it’s bad , just like any other city in the USA.
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@HawkChamp I guess you didn’t read the part where i already apologized. It was just to emphasize how much i disliked WSU. Didn’t mean anything by it.
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@nuleafjhawk Any town that would allow Nola Fulston to be in charge of law should be burned to the ground.
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@bskeet if you need a list of some fine dining spots, let me know. My son and his wife are wined and dined every thurs by dental reps. Also @drgnslayr could probably tell you some good places. I’ve been to some good, off the beaten path authentic Mexican places.
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@nuleafjhawk the edit function is your friend in this case
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@dylans ease up there chief. Some of us live there and love it. Don’t understand the vile hatred some of you have for Wichita.
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@HawkChamp and hutch!
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@HawkChamp That was edited. It’s fiercely personal and I’d fight anyone who wants to.
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@dylans hmmm I’m sorry for your anger issues on the city as a whole. Hopefully it gets better for you
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@HawkChamp Thank you, I’m familiar with the “edit” function. Also with the “Discard” function, as I have used both prolifically trying to respond to you and keep things civil. As far as “vile hatred” goes, you and I have a vastly different idea of what that means. I didn’t say one time that I hated Wichita. It ain’t my favorite place. That doesn’t stop me from going there. In fact, we spent a fair amount of time and money in your fair city this past Saturday. My wife was shopping at Dillard’s (while I was watching the KU game on my phone) and then we spent more money at the At Home Store, or whatever it’s called.
After we shopped in Wichita for a good part of the morning and early afternoon, we headed south. When we came back in the evening, we were going through Wichita on 135 and when we came upon the "canal’ that runs through town we both about threw up from the smell. One of the reasons I don’t like Wichita.
BTW - I live in Salina. Feel free to say whatever you want about it. I probably won’t disagree.
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@nuleafjhawk I’m glad you know about it!!
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@nuleafjhawk said in WSU grudge:
@HawkChamp I guess you didn’t read the part where i already apologized. It was just to emphasize how much i disliked WSU. Didn’t mean anything by it.
ya even though I really liked the City of Wichita for sure doesn’t mean I have a love fest for Marsha and the gang. - - I remember Eddie and the group - However did kind of like the motto " MTXE " - - Mental Toughness Extra Effort. - -Couldn’t stand his son Randy cocky little shit. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@HawkChamp said in WSU grudge:
@dylans ease up there chief. Some of us live there and love it. Don’t understand the vile hatred some of you have for Wichita.
It’s Ok, I love Wichita the city it’self - -but I’m sure there is a town /city that everyone has a dis taste for - -for one reason or another. - -Like me there is no way I’d ever in Bigger Cities NY - - LA - - Dallas - refuse to live in those rat race - -another case where everyone is entitled to their own opinions/taste. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@HawkChamp LOL. OK, I throw in the towel.
I just have a problem with word vomit. Sometimes words just come out of my mouth with no input from my brain. I honestly don’t mean to be rude, I guess it’s just how I’m wired.
Take me with a grain or two of salt please.
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@nuleafjhawk said in WSU grudge:
@HawkChamp Thank you, I’m familiar with the “edit” function. Also with the “Discard” function, as I have used both prolifically trying to respond to you and keep things civil. As far as “vile hatred” goes, you and I have a vastly different idea of what that means. I didn’t say one time that I hated Wichita. It ain’t my favorite place. That doesn’t stop me from going there. In fact, we spent a fair amount of time and money in your fair city this past Saturday. My wife was shopping at Dillard’s (while I was watching the KU game on my phone) and then we spent more money at the At Home Store, or whatever it’s called.
After we shopped in Wichita for a good part of the morning and early afternoon, we headed south. When we came back in the evening, we were going through Wichita on 135 and when we came upon the "canal’ that runs through town we both about threw up from the smell. One of the reasons I don’t like Wichita.
BTW - I live in Salina. Feel free to say whatever you want about it. I probably won’t disagree.
Ah the good old canal route. Can’t say I miss that. My old baseball coach would give me a ride home from practice or games on occasion and always took that route and made us keep the windows down. He enjoyed making me and his son scream about that awful smell!
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Any time anyone feels like insulting somewhere, just feel free to substitute “South Carolina.”
It is wonderfully cathartic, and no one on the board is likely to take it personally – certainly not me!
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@mayjay lol
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It’s all personal preference to what city you like or dislike and also what part of the city you have been associated with. @Crimsonorblue22 lives in Hutchinson and likes it and thats good for her. I wouldn’t want someone stuck were they aren’t happy. I’ve several bad experiences in hutch, like finding drug syringes in a park and one of my best friends was held at gun for walking in on a drug deal at gas station bathroom there. I work with two guys that were born and raised there that claim it’s a crap hole. But I’d bet if you live in the right neighborhood, it’s not bad. Me personally I avoid it and have only been 1 or 2 times in the past 8 years or so. @nuleafjhawk I actually was born in Salina and lived there for several years as a kid. I don’t have a high opinion of the place if I’m honest. But its because I lived in the crappy side of town. Where Broadway and 9th come together was my neighborhood, a couple of the houses I lived in are boarded up now. I will always remember walking home in 5th grade and seeing the cops kick the door in on drug bust in the house beside us. The cop chewed my rear end for 15 minutes before I could tell him I lived right there and was just trying to get home. Wichita is a good town if you live in a good area, I had friends that went to WSU and that campus is in a bad part of town. They got their cars broken into several times and there was guns ringing most nights according to them. I personally prefer small town America where I probably know 90% people that live in my town and the crime rate is almost non existent. That being said there are some bad small towns that are nothing but a bunch of rednecks and meth heads. We are are entitled to our opinions and we could argue all day.
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@mayjay Lol - your graciousness is much appreciated.
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I’ve been in some of the worst parts of town in Wichita, KC and other places in Kansas. In no way does it compare to the worst parts of towns in just about any American city. That may not be the way to grade a place, unless you live in those neighborhoods. I’ve lived in many places and I feel good about living in Kansas again! I grew up here and life moves slower… great for raising kids. There is culture here, too, though you may have to search it out more, but it is here. People are friendly… maybe too friendly. I can’t go to the grocery store without spending an hour or so chatting with people, sometimes strangers.
I lived in Europe for two decades and made many great friends. Many of those friends still come over to Kansas to visit. Some come every year. They love it over here!
Sometimes it is hard to appreciate something until you have it taken away. I know I am thankful I don’t have to waste much time in traffic jams. It was common for me to suddenly get stuck in a 2 hour jam in Europe because of an accident. That happened constantly. And it can take an hour to find out where to park and when you do you might spend $100 a day to park it. Uncommon to have a garage on your home. Drive right up to the front door of a store? Ha… unlikely.
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@mayjay I’ve never been to South Carolina, my preconceived notion is that it’s a neat place. My daughter lives a little north of there - in Wilmington, NC. and loves it.
I wonder if Ol Roy is starting to think that Chapel Hill is kind of a dump? Or maybe Chapel Hill is starting to think that about him!
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This should not have been an afterthought, but I wanted to tell you that I appreciate you calling me out and defending your city in a manner that didn’t include cussing and yelling and name calling. I’ll be the first to admit that I say stupid things sometimes. Tell me so. Say - hey nuleaf - that was stupid. ( I’m kind of talking to other posters here, because that’s basically what you did)…I can deal with that. I appreciate you handling a dispute, or difference of opinion like an adult.
There’s no sarcasm font here. Thank you.
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@kjayhawks Yes, Broadway and 9th is probably not the premium real estate destination in town, unless you want to walk to the mall very quickly. As you and others have pointed out, there are really good and really bad neighborhoods in most towns.
Unless you live in Port Arthur, Tx - then it’s all bad. (Lord, please don’t let anyone here live in Port Arthur…)
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@nuleafjhawk said in WSU grudge:
@mayjay I’ve never been to South Carolina, my preconceived notion is that it’s a neat place. My daughter lives a little north of there - in Wilmington, NC. and loves it.
I wonder if Ol Roy is starting to think that Chapel Hill is kind of a dump? Or maybe Chapel Hill is starting to think that about him!
Idk about Roy but Chapel Hill is fantastic. Cost of living is brutal but it’s a really cool town. Picture Lawrence but the population of Manhattan.
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Hey I live in Port Arthur!
Ha, just teasing. I did live in Houston for a few years and passed through it on the way to New Orleans now and then. Yea, unless you like marshy oily flat and stinky (largest oil refinery in the US there), it makes Wichita look like Honolulu.
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@StLJhawk Man, you gave me a start there. I’m just glad I didn’t say St Louis…
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Ha! No, you totally called it on Port A. And while I enjoyed STL for over two decades, East St. Louis might give Port Arthur a run for its money.
But not even in the Lou anymore either. Last February, we moved to an hour outside LA. For a lifelong Midwesterner who hates winter, loves big water, big culture and oh yes, mountains, I’m kind of in heaven here. And the best part is I work from home so don’t have to fight the nasty nasty traffic!
