@rcjhdraft 100%

Really tough for it to end. Even tougher for it to end this way.

His impact on the program is undeniable.

There will have to be some historic commemoration at some point.

Following Self is daunting.

Next coach will look at the Self's winning percentage, B12 titles, Tournament Titles and wonder: "If that wasn't good enough, how will I keep this job?"

Whoever it is will probably need to do what Jon Scheyer has done in his first four seasons-- 3 ACC tournament titles, multiple sweet 16 appearances and a National Title game appearance.

Yikes.

I've heard through a connection in Chapel Hill that TJ Otzelberger is/was first on the list.

On the character front alone, Golden is a red flag. Chris Beard is probably a bright orange flag.

I sure hope we allow character to be a filter.

LOL - Job swap for Hubert Davis and Bill Self for a year.

But seriously, does anyone else find it interesting that for all the respect that Self gets for being an elite coaching mind, there doesn't seem to be much of a coaching tree to climb and pick fruit. I don't know if that's a misconception or if the former players are too young, many still in their player career, or product of the kinds of players he tended to recruit.

It just feels different from Larry Brown and even Roy Williams. And very different from Phog Allen and Coach K.

The coaching tree is probably the #1 consideration when Duke and UNC go looking for a successor. But with KU, if we wanted to follow that path, it seems pretty barren.

@approxinfinity said in Money next year:

@nuleafjhawk seriously we should find some obscure sports that make no money and those who play it do it for the love and we should invest an unhealthy amount of our speculating on it. KU Baseball and volleyball are my nominations, but I could be convinced to go weirder and more obscure.

Obscure/Club:
KU Rowing has some recent success. Would be attention-getting among the east-coast elite. Ultimate (just throwing that out there.)

Not Obscure:
Baseball, Softball not so obscure, but would be interesting to see if money is all it takes to eat away at the SEC dominance... That said, you're competing with the deep pockets.

or maybe Soccer?

Also don't sleep on Flag Football. That might be a fascinating place to invest given the clear issues with CTE and injuries... It will only get worse as guys get bigger and bulkier. There will be some who value their brains but still love the strategy and competition of Football. Flag is also great for men and women. You can also use the same facilities that have been built for football (get a bit more value out of that investment.)

Bennett is a good guy and has had a strong Australian recruiting connection over the years. He's clearly looking for more resources. He's 63, so this may be his last stop. Real loss for the WCC which needed programs to compete with Gonzaga. But Gonzaga's leaving for the reborn Pac12, so it's going to be very hard for schools in the WCC to get an at-large bid going forward.

Will be interesting to see what Sendek at Santa Clara does...

I think it's a bad year to be looking for a coach. I also look a Pitino (dinosaur?) who left the NCAA for several years under some dark clouds that were embarrassing and was able to revise his game outside of the spotlight (oversees, then to Iona). Izzo hasn't won a championship since 2000, but has great character and is admired.

Personally, I think Self is admired and needs to be give more time to adjust. It's very different and difficult to do it under the microscope of a legendary program like KU.

That said, none of the objective points above are invalid at all. It's worrisome and uncomfortable right now. Learning often feels that way... and we are all collectively on for the ride.

When I put on my tinfoil hat and get cynical (or is it pragmatic?), I convince myself that it's all about the B1G and the SEC, with east coast and Duke bias sprinkled in for ratings. That's where the money is. The engine is running and well-fueled (football) and good luck stopping or slowing it.

SWEET 16 since conference realignment:
2025: DUKE + 7 SEC and 4 B1G =12
2026: DUKE + 2 Big East teams. 6 B1G teams. 4 SEC teams = 13.

Big12, allegedly the best conference all year gets 3 teams to the s16. Now maybe they all get to the Final Four, but right now, it doesn't look good.

This team was a top 8 team on paper and in my heart at the start of the season (and at various times in the season).

But from January to present, looking objectively, they ware mostly between top 16-25. Going into the tourney, my head said that the round of 32 was the threshold for the team. If we get to S16, there should be no disappointment... But losing at the round of 32 was completely possible. And the way we lost — on a shot at the buzzer — kind of shows how close we were. Like, #17. That sucks, but that's where we landed.

It's kind of fitting when you look back on the record -- losing to West Virginia, losing at home to Cincinnati when it really mattered... Yet beating Iowa State, Houston and Arizona.. Not to mention Tennessee who is in the S16. So, we could win or we could lose...

If the game goes to OT, I like our chances, but it didn't.

Again, number 17, in a game where number 16 is still playing, and the season is over for #17.

I think Roy called it "olé" defense. That last play certainly was that.

But seriously, with 5 min left if you had said "Would you like to be tied with 5 seconds left and St John's has the ball?" I would have said YES 1000% YES.

Despite not sleeping well, I'm more sanguine (or at least neutral) about all of this. The ball bounces your way sometimes and bounces the other team's way sometimes.

I recall those FF years and the 2 championship runs and there was always a place where you can find moment in the game where you can say-- if that call goes the other way or the ball didn't drop at that moment... Self's legacy looks markedly different. We have never had a team that was so dominant that we didn't need a little luck to get to the FF or NC.

Also, we've been a juggernaut: In the tournament EVERY year and a historic run of B12 championships.

The consistent success made it seem like we should have even more success in the tourney. Easy to forget how difficult and rare it is to get a National Championship. (...I will be grateful, not spoiled...)

Only nine schools have won the title since 2004.

UConn (2004, 2011, 2014, 2023, 2024)
Florida (2006, 2007, 2025)
North Carolina (2005, 2009, 2017)
Kansas (2008, 2022)
Villanova (2016, 2018)
Duke (2010, 2015)
Kentucky (2012)
Louisville (2013)*
Baylor (2021)
Virginia (2019)

We all want more, but there are schools that have had a lot of success in the last 20+ years not on that list (Purdue, Gonzaga...)

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On the PAY FOR PLAY topic, I'll just say that it was necessary and appropriate to pay players. It was also predictable that it would be bumpy, especially with the NCAA's track record of poorly establishing governance that drives the right behavior and also poor track record of consistent oversight and enforcement.

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Final point: Performance & Payment.

As a fan, focused on the 40 minutes that we watch on TV, it's hard to remember that player performance goes beyond what we see on court — beyond the stats.

We already know that there are aspects to the game that are beyond analytics, despite trying to count EVERYTHING.

But performance includes many things that we don't see and cannot be captured by analytics. These contributions to a program and to a team should still go into compensation consideration.

For instance, did the player show up to all the workouts? All the practices? Were they engaged in community services with the team and good stewards of the university? Did they do something stupid to damage the program's reputation? Were they disruptive or disrespectful?

When they do all the 'invisible' things right, we tend to ignore them as though they didn't count. But, those expectations are certainly there. And these 'employees' are mostly between the age of 18-23.

I'm disappointed by the loss but I am trying to keep things in perspective.

It was a good group of guys and a good coach. Coach probably did a phenomenal job this year in unique and tough circumstances with DP's situation/injuries.

It was a bad way to lose but the comeback (which shouldn't have been necessary) was still pretty heroic.

Adam Lefkoe (Syracuse) on TNT taking a bit too much glee in KU's loss and giving a lot of shade to KU.. making stuff up about DP

Ugly game.

Heroic effort to tie the game. Truly. We should pause on that and give credit where credit is due.

Then, a Crimson & Blue gift-wrapped win for St.John's to undermine the heroic comeback. Wow.

Why on Earth Self swapped Rosario for ElMarko I can only speculate... Rosario's contributions in the comeback were undeniable.

It was a bizarre ending for a bizarre year. I'm sorry that Council and Tre weren't able to have more post-season success. I will miss them both.

Flory is really good, but should be interesting to see if he gets any bites.

DP was an interesting experiment.

@approxinfinity said in Kansas vs St Johns:

@bskeet i dont recall Pitino struggling to play 4 out or struggling with recruitment etc. Bill Self is a bball genius no doubt but I think he struggles more with transitions.

Also known as stubborn on those oldies but goodies...?

I don't understand why Kohl hasn't had more opportunities. He has passed the eye test to me. Maybe something else... Or maybe just a seniority thing. Historically, Coach tends to reward the guys who have put in the time and built up a bank account full of effort.

So, all that may be true, but both of these coaches are from the same Jurassic Era... So this should be less about how the game has changed and more about the players simply playing together as a unit. Old school.

Tre is sooo due for a 3. His cold streak right now is frigid. He's so much better than how he's played.

Lucky to be down 8

Will DP have a 30/30 day (points and minutes)? Will it be a balanced scoring day or a superman day? Or, (shudders) neither?