How a 16 defeats a 1



  • Play starters until they are gased

    Play without your one match up advantage

    Have your shooting guard go 2-10 from 3

    Terrible 3pt closeout at game point from a 3 year player

    Unnecessary technicals from your head coach

    Run into the all time big east leader in winning percentages coach

    Airball a lob pass

    Get ZERO production from your bench.



  • Do not fret, my friend. We ain’t losin’ next weekend.



  • @HighEliteMajor this team has what it takes to end the season with a win, but it’s a razors edge.



  • @Blown Yes, a very sharp one. It’s never easy.



  • @Blown Bench? - - What Bench? - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY



  • I still love our chances. This game is a wake up call that it’s all over if and when another loss comes. Let’s get some rest, get some time to scout the 3 teams on our side of the round of 32 bracket and into the thick of the real tournament. Still can’t wait for Sunday!!



  • @Blown You forgot sit a 2nd team all american and possible #1 draft pick.



  • @wissox that’s point #2. and JJ did that to himself



  • It’s very simple to me,the one seed plays no defense whatsoever, has guys benched for stupidity, doesn’t rebound and has too many turnovers.



  • @Blown Missed that one! I think my point is with Josh playing I don’t think all this handwringing is happening.



  • TCU is significantly better than any 16 seed KU will face. Whatever league KU’s 16 seed comes out of, TCU is good enough to go undefeated in that league.



  • @HighEliteMajor said:

    Do not fret, my friend. We ain’t losin’ next weekend.

    I hope so but I would wait to see who the 8/9 is before declaring this objectively. If it’s a true 8/9 seed then I like KU’s chances, if it’s a vastly underseeded midmajor I think it’s just about a coin flip.



  • @Texas-Hawk-10 said:

    TCU is significantly better than any 16 seed KU will face. Whatever league KU’s 16 seed comes out of, TCU is good enough to go undefeated in that league.

    Very much agree with this. The 16 seed could be worse than any team KU has faced all year given the nature of conference tournaments.



  • Josh and Frank are too hungry to go out in the 2nd round. This is the best lineup we’ve had in a LONG time.



  • @BShark said:

    @Texas-Hawk-10 said:

    TCU is significantly better than any 16 seed KU will face. Whatever league KU’s 16 seed comes out of, TCU is good enough to go undefeated in that league.

    Very much agree with this. The 16 seed could be worse than any team KU has faced all year given the nature of conference tournaments.

    Yes, TCU is much better than the 16 seeds - at least this year - but not better than most of the 8-9s. Gotta step it up…



  • @DCHawker They were playing without Jackson today and Self has never cared much about winning the B12 tournament. There’s a reason why is winning % in this tournament is anything worth bragging about.



  • @chriz said:

    Josh and Frank are too hungry to go out in the 2nd round. This is the best lineup we’ve had in a LONG time.

    Best lineup? In terms of scoring ability, it is one of the best Self has had. But, it also is the worst defensively during the Self - at least as measured by defensive efficiency metrics - and, it’s not really close. One of the worst in shooting percentage defense, rebound margin and, if with being a high scoring team, middle of the pack in scoring margin.



  • @chriz said:

    Josh and Frank are too hungry to go out in the 2nd round. This is the best lineup we’ve had in a LONG time.

    This is a fun topic. I would say without a doubt this team is better than the previous two editions. It gets murky with the 13-14 team. That team had a lot of potential, they also piled up a lot of losses and it could be said never realized it. The Embiid mystery adds intrigue but give me this year’s squad at the end of the day. 100% better than EJ the PG’s squad moving on. So then we get to TRob and the miracles. The tournament results are definitely there. The tournament results are there, but they just as easily could have lost to Purdue. They didn’t so that’s great but you could argue for the current team. Ok yeah 2011 is way better top to bottom the fun ends there.

    So arguably the best since 2011. Let’s hope for a better tournament result. :100:



  • @Texas-Hawk-10 said:

    @DCHawker They were playing without Jackson today and Self has never cared much about winning the B12 tournament. There’s a reason why is winning % in this tournament is anything worth bragging about.

    Self definitely didn’t seem to broken up about this game during or after.



  • @DCHawker do you think part of our poor D is based on our very, very short bench?



  • @Texas-Hawk-10 said:

    @DCHawker They were playing without Jackson today and Self has never cared much about winning the B12 tournament. There’s a reason why is winning % in this tournament is anything worth bragging about.

    Maybe Self doesn’t put a lot of stock in winning the B12 tournament, but he seemed pretty animated today. The technical seemed intended to get the team fired up, esp. as it was an easy goal tend call and he really lit into the players during TCU’s early second half run. Just didn’t seem to me like he didn’t care.



  • @BShark He’s always much more relaxed and mellow during conference tournaments and houmds the refs much less than. If Self doesn’t value the Big 12 tournament, why should we?



  • @Crimsonorblue22 said:

    @DCHawker do you think part of our poor D is based on our very, very short bench?

    Strikes me at an excuse or rationalization. Sure, with a short bench - and really no shorter than a lot of teams - it means we can’t pressure the whole game and need to manage foul trouble. But a short bench doesn’t explain the blow-bys, the poor blocking out, not closing out on 3 point shooters, and poor transition defense.



  • @Blown

    How exactly is TCU a 16? It finished 7th in the top ranked conference, with 13-2 non-con record and just about all of its conference loses to top 10/25 teams.

    If the true top 68 teams were selected TCU would be dancing but all the auto qualifiers from the small conferences, many way outside the top 100, take spots from more deserving teams.

    Perhaps for balance…and a change you could list some of the things the team did well.



  • Re: Balance- howsabout i keep playing the part of yin and you play yang? Deal? Deal.



  • @Blown

    I was suggesting balance so you can get a semblance of credibility but if you don’t want to do it that is your choice; it really does not make an iota of difference to me.



  • @JayHawkFanToo I’ve been posting for nearly decade with many of these same people, and was one of the first to come over to buckets. If you think I’m not a balanced poster, you have serious comprehension or memory issues. I am positive when I choose to be. I challenge the status quo when I chose to. I vent when I chose to. and I don’t live with my crimson and blue glasses on at all times.



  • @DCHawker said:

    But a short bench doesn’t explain the blow-bys, the poor blocking out, not closing out on 3 point shooters, and poor transition defense.

    FWIW, precisely what do you think does explain these things? And do you think they happen to KU more than other teams?



  • @BShark like Marsha



  • @chriz nah, the lineup last year was championship caliber. I’d say they’re even.



  • @mayjay I know that bad games happen,m but these concerns will be significant next week. Should they have figured a lot of this out before tournament time. How are these basics are going to be utilized in just a week.



  • @Blown

    Please, do show me the balance in your original post. Every single stament is negative, not one positive thing the team did.



  • @chriz but it’s thin.



  • @JayHawkFanToo

    The premise of the original post and thread was to demonstrate how a simple series of unfortunate events that it takes for a team, which walks a thin line between greatness and average, can result in us coming up on the wrong side of the outcome.

    For balance, see my next comment, 2 posts down, where I said this team is good enough to win the national championship. Is that not complimentary?



  • @DCHawker there’s wanta win, and feel like havta win.

    Today was wanta win, but over it and move on. Use what material presented itself for coaching the next round.

    Like Self: “You know Josh, we don’t lose that game if you hadn’t screwed up. You owe the team in next weekend’s tournament”

    JJ: “okay coach. We’re not going home next weekend!”

    Coach: “Team, that’s how easily our season can be over if you don’t play freakin’ defense”



  • @Blown You forgot one more thing: Have a team that has taken a week off play a team that wins a play-in game and is feeling the momentum.



  • @bskeet gotta feel w/us, the rest is more beneficial. The osu game was pretty up and down too. I’m pretty bummed but trying to find the bright side. Recovery



  • On the upside-- If the B12 is as good as we think, it’s possible KU could meet 1 or 2 in the tournament. Perhaps it’s a blessing to not have to play ISU, WVU, or Baylor a fourth time…



  • @Blown

    Just the painful facts, Jack!

    PHOF the painful way.



  • @mayjay said:

    @DCHawker said:

    But a short bench doesn’t explain the blow-bys, the poor blocking out, not closing out on 3 point shooters, and poor transition defense.

    FWIW, precisely what do you think does explain these things? And do you think they happen to KU more than other teams?

    I think they happen more with this team than other Self coached KU teams - this is statistically the worst team Self has had during his tenure at KU. By no means are we statistically one of the worst teams defensively in the country - other top teams aren’t particularly strong defensively, e.g., UCLA and Duke. But, there clearly are much better defensive teams out there, e.g., Louisville and UVA (although they can be offensively challenged).

    As to the why, IMO the primary issue, although not the only one, is a lack of lateral quickness at some key spots. Svi, Bragg and LL, particularly. This impacts not only guarding on the perimeter, but also in the post defense. When combined with limited rim protection from a length and athleticism standpoint, we give up way too many easy baskets at the rim. And, other than LL, we don’t do a very good job of boxing out, which is why we also give up too many ORs and easy put-backs.

    What has particularly vexing has been our poor transition defense that past several games - we’ve given up a lot of lay-ups after we’ve made buckets on the other guys have gotten the defensive rebound. We have plenty of team speed - that is an issue of hustle and awareness.

    Some of it is correctable but some isn’t. I don’t think we are or can be an elite defensive team. But, we don’t have to be - we just need to be better defensively than we have been and Self clearly knows it - which he characterizes as “tightening up a few thing.”

    Personally, I would like to see us mix it up a little during the tournament given that we are simply not a typical Self man-to-man team - throw in a few possessions of zone and apply some pressure in key situations. Not only would that keep the other team off balance, and mask some of our deficiencies, but I think it also helps our guys with focus and intensity - esp. when we apply pressure or trap.



  • @Blown

    I’m not going to point a finger at Bill and say he intentionally lost this game. That would probably be considered a crime. I know it would if it was tied it to any kind of gambling scheme. But Bill clearly is in March Madness mode. Many of us have slammed him in previous years for not targeting his team to March until it was too late.

    If you have this game on DVR, please go back and look at it again.

    When we went up by double digit numbers in the first half, our offense was as smooth as it has been all year. It looked effortless. Eventually, our play helped motivate TCU to step up and play at a higher level. After that, we didn’t make that next step. That is a step we have usually made throughout this year. But it was clear this game had no meaning for our guys because it didn’t have meaning for Bill except to use it and try out a few things.

    While reviewing tape, look at Bill’s T. Most Ts on coaches happens over a little time frame where the coach builds up anger and continually adds to his venting. In this case, Bill just had a controlled “explosion” and then he was fine. He was testing the waters. He wanted to know how his guys would respond to him getting T’d. Brilliant move.

    Also… notice Bill’s expressions towards the end of the game. He just didn’t look like he cared.

    We only have 7 top tier players. That is enough to win it all. But if we lost just one player… not gonna happen.

    I hope our guys are having light workouts with lots of coaching this weekend. This is a small window of time to actually work on team development. We don’t get many windows like this in a season. We are usually just focused on our next opponent.

    I believe we will find our first tournament opponent on Sunday evening. So Monday, we get right after scouting and prep for Game 1.


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