Oh how I hate Kansas State.
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@kjayhawks I bet a million dollars Juan was jamming on his AirPods right before the game. He completely was unprepared to play. 3 fouls in 4 minutes?
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@drgnslayr said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
@kjayhawks I bet a million dollars Juan was jamming on his AirPods right before the game. He completely was unprepared to play. 3 fouls in 4 minutes?
Ya idk 2 of his fouls we freshman level mistakes for 6th year guy so idk. Definitely would’ve helps to have on the floor more defensively I believe
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@drgnslayr I refer back to my last reply to you, and your right-- they don’t feel the need of any urgency
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Here is an idea for Self… no electronics on game day! Make them stay connected to the team and stay plugged in!
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We are going to end the Season with at least eight losses. we have still to play three game stretch of Texas Tech-- - Arizona-- - And Houston oh boy
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@Kcmatt7 I guess I’m just having doubts that this season is an outliner like you claim. Last year Bill Self had his only season at Kansas with 11 loses and a losing road record. This season is headed in the exact same direction with 7 losses and a 3-5 road record currently. I’m gonna highly doubt we win 3 of our next 4 on the road at this point. I guess it depends on how you want to look at it. With the 2018 season being vacated, we have made it out of the first weekend of the NCAAs a single time since then. One time that’s it, if you want to count 2018 still one time in 6 years isn’t good. That one time was by the hair of our chins tho the final result was good.
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Invest in Darryn Peterson and the kids next year. This group doesn’t have “it”.
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Kj -35 minutes and 5 boards
Flory - 16 minutes and 4 boards
Sucks being right when I was hoping I’d be wrong. Dolla Bill can’t elevate the true talent he has and it limits so many of his teams. Caught up with him these past 3 years……as he stuck with “his guys”
But hey let’s blame the assistants not the guy who the buck stops with
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D2, trex and lil dick - per Rinehart on Twitter
Dolla Bill - you weren’t wanted in the nba for a reason….
The last two seasons:
-Big 12 play: 17-14 -Road Record: 6-13 -Lost Wednesday in Big 12 Tourney -Big 12 Opener Streak:
-42 Year streak of not losing 3 straight in Manhattan:
-Lost to Mizzou
-Biggest blown lead in program history.
-8 double digit losses. (4 by 20+)Bad
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I didnt watch a minute of this one tbh. Kid stuff going on. Was it a train wreck? Are we hanging the L on Self?
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@approxinfinity pretty much, like we didn’t have a scouting report at all. We had zero energy and even less heart somehow. Juando got into foul trouble early as in 3 fouls in about 8 minutes of playing time in the first half. 2 of which were just plain stupidity. We left shooters wide open consistently and just didn’t care to attempt to play anything that resembled defense.
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Brutal.
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https://x.com/jayhawkslant/status/1888355128266363243?s=46
Once again I’m an asshole for saying it but even Bill agrees
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@approxinfinity I’ll add in this simply, Kansas state players seemed happy to be there and excited to take to shots. Kansas (primarily Juan and Shak) looked terrified to shoot.
Edit: we also tried 3 bigs again for a stretch in the second half…… it also as anyone with a brain could predict didn’t work and led to open 3s for them.
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I haven’t read a single comment. I just wanted to say that my wife and I had a great day of antiquing in Hutchinson and now we’re at a nice Mexican restaurant. I hope everyone had a good day.
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A lot of issues related to roster construction and navigating the portal - NIL world, but one thing is clear is that this team is the softest of the Self era - lacking both physical and mental toughness… KU used to win the vast majority of games that came down to crunch time. That certainly hasn’t been true the last couple of years…
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@nuleafjhawk you’re smarter than the rest of us
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@kjayhawks said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
@Kcmatt7 we are currently on our third in a row in terms of bad seasons. If this was an outliner I’d be fine with it. It’s becoming the new norm
We’re also seeing the effects of the NCAA investigation with this group in regards to recruiting. That severely hurt the recruiting and overall talent level on this team. While the investigation was active, KU was only able to bring in 2 recruits good enough to be drafted and only 1 transfer that was drafted so there’s been a major drop off in talent. Elmarko and Flory have the talent to change that, but neither will be NBA players next season.
When was the last time KU had a team with zero players drafted that season? 2009 I think. I do expect next season to be better as KU could have at least 3 players that could be NBA players in 2026, and all potentially 1st round picks with Peterson, Flory, and Elmarko.
The other issue, and I’ve mentioned this in the past is Dejuan isn’t a great leader and that’s his biggest weakness to me. I think you’re the one mentioning listening to music in headphones before games. That’s not an issue to me because for many players, that’s how they block out the outside world to get focused on the game ahead. Everyone is different in that regard about helps them lock in before a game.
The issue with Dejuan’s leadership to me is that he appears to be a very soft spoken and shy person that doesn’t enjoy the spotlight. I don’t recall him ever getting loud and yelling to fire his teammates up and I think that’s why we see this team come out so flat most of the time. Basically, this group lacks a vocal leader that can light a fire under everyone because Self can’t do that every game and stay effective with his speeches. This would’ve been the perfect role for Hunter as we all know he had a edge to him that was perfect for that role of vocal leader, but he chose to not embrace that role for whatever reason this year.
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@SlimShaddy54 said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
Now before anyone says anything I guess were not the only fans who probably pretty upset on the year.— Gonzaga sure not typical Gonzaga year- —Oh Hurley U Conn for sure not a typical U Conn year- -doesn’t make it any better , cause I could give a rats ass just sayin
This is more of a typical UConn year than the previous 2 under Hurley.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 I wish we had a well rounded player that was a leader. Is Peterson a leader? Who will be the floor leader next year?
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@approxinfinity said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
@Texas-Hawk-10 I wish we had a well rounded player that was a leader. Is Peterson a leader? Who will be the floor leader next year?
To me, it would ideally be Elmarko since he would be in his 3rd season and expected to run point next season.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 Valid points on the initial investigation hurting recruiting but after winning the title in 2022 and being able to pay players with NIL, I don’t think it Is valid at this point. To me we went to hard after the portal guys and other than Zeke none of them have produced. Shak, Diggy, Rylen and AJ haven’t panned out IMO I’d rather spent some money on a highschooler or picked differently in the portal.
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@DCHawker Also, looking at from another angle, teams beating KU left and right by making lots and lots of 3s (40%). Team is lacking 3pt defense. Coach has a lot to do with the losses, too. 50% FT is not acceptable… BS has to exhaust 2.5 bigs to score 40 but guards? Aren’t they supposed to score off of dribble and drive? 3pts? getting into FT lane? Thanks to Juando who thinks he doesn’t have to score, their guards contribute 2x than ours in scoring.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 with the portal we are way past this. Teams these past two years have been rebuilt overnight
Not sure how you can even take this stance
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@kjayhawks Huh playing 4 on 1 doesn’t work when your pg refuses to shoot 3’s and be an offensive threat oh and he can’t beat his man off the dribble?
Whatever will we do without thou next year???
Three bigs - man dolla bill really is struggling to coach elite players and elevate them. Tang smoking him 3 straight seasons and our road record, big 12 finishes and tourney appearances plus ncaa finishes are all clearly showing something
All I remember after 2022 with wright and k retiring is oh Self is going to take us to new heights.
Heart deal happened and it was level up and “won’t happen again”……he’s literally taken us to new lows these last two years instead
Complete and utter flop showing he ain’t the goat right now and it ain’t even close. His talent evaluation is atrocious and even when he does see the guys play he doesn’t pull the right strings to have them play their best.
When other players played better for other teams that says ATON about Self and his “system/coaching”
The best coaches get the most out of all their players
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@nuleafjhawk Oh thanks for ignoring my brilliant opening to the game thread. I think you might be part of the reason that you enjoyed your day today!
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@Texas-Hawk-10 I’ve seen you write that before about the effects of the investigation, but I’m wondering. Basically the guys who won a championship were recruited after we started to feel the heat from the NCAA. So in the midst of an investigation Self constructed a championship team. Or am I wrong?
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I will say this gently and out of kindness for all. Buzz killers or negative persons who seek to dampen the mood, enjoyment and pleasure of others can cast a pall over all of this. I have always looked forward to our daily discourse but now it’s depressing.
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@wissox to me the investigation is why took chances on several guys like Ochai who was ranked in the 300s before we offer, Braun wasn’t highly rated before we signed him. Now I have zero idea how it effect the guys we signed in the portal
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@Zabudda Feel free to state some positives about this team to lighten things up around here
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@wissox said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
@Texas-Hawk-10 I’ve seen you write that before about the effects of the investigation, but I’m wondering. Basically the guys who won a championship were recruited after we started to feel the heat from the NCAA. So in the midst of an investigation Self constructed a championship team. Or am I wrong?
The core of the title team was all before the notice of allegations against KU was received in the fall of 2019 except for transfer players.
Lightfoot was a 2016 recruit, McCormack and Agbaji were both 2018, Braun, Wilson, and Harris were all 2019 players.
The timeline was KU received the notice from the NCAA in September of 2019 and in July of 2020, KU and the NCAA agreed to send the case to the IARP. With the case going to the IARP, KU gave up their right to appeal the verdict against them.
That means that the 2021 class was the first one where Self truly had the potential of a post season ban and suspension hanging over his head in recruiting, but the 2020 class was also a very weak class so I think it could even be argued that the NCAA started hurting KU’s recruiting in that 2020 class.
Nobody from the 2020 class even made it to year 2 at Kansas. Bryce Thompson was the highlight of that class and Tyon Grant-Foster was a top JuCo player, but the other two was always long term prospects.
2021 was another extremely weak HS class overall with Zach Clemence being the highest rated player in that group (12 spots ahead of KJ).
2022 was a better class with Dick in it, but still no top 20 recruits in that class either. This was also the first class to benefit from NIL, but it was in its infancy and not fully monetize yet.
The 2023 class was the first group with NIL involved from the get go and there is a noticeable bump in talent brought in with Elmarko and Furphy being considered OAD prospects and Hunter and Arterio Morris as top level transfers.
Summer of 2023 is also when KU gets off with a slap on the wrist in the NCAA case as it was finally resolved almost 5 years after it began. KU had already gotten involved with their target recruits for the 2024 class at that point so that was this was last recruiting cycle with the NCAA case influencing recruiting of HS kids.
The 2025 is the first class post NCAA resolution for KU to go through the full cycle without the NCAA cloud hanging over their heads. What’s going to hurt the 2025 rankings is Tiller reclassifying and enrolling early, but should help long term development for him.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 Wow thanks, do you just have all this in your mind? I didn’t ask my question that long ago and you produced an article!
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@kjayhawks said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
@Texas-Hawk-10 Valid points on the initial investigation hurting recruiting but after winning the title in 2022 and being able to pay players with NIL, I don’t think it Is valid at this point. To me we went to hard after the portal guys and other than Zeke none of them have produced. Shak, Diggy, Rylen and AJ haven’t panned out IMO I’d rather spent some money on a highschooler or picked differently in the portal.
It wasn’t until the summer of 2023 that the NCAA case was resolved. Hunter was the only high dollar NIL transfer during that time and we all know he came to KU because KU was the highest bidder for him. Transfers that cared about winning more were likely still leery of the NCAA hammer coming down on KU so this past transfer class was the first without the NCAA investigation influencing potential transfers and the 2025 class is the first high school class without the investigation influencing it.
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@wissox said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
@Texas-Hawk-10 Wow thanks, do you just have all this in your mind? I didn’t ask my question that long ago and you produced an article!
I know some of the dates, but had to check 247 to double check who all was in which class. Not really any deep research.
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Watching dudes fly by AJ Storr today was a joy. I heard this guy was an athlete!
That of course left Hunter to blissfully watch the ball float in the air and forget to play defense of any kind. What an embarrassment of effort today.
Zeke really makes my head spin at times. For one, he simply could not get a decent shot off today. The sheep lovers made sure of that. Shouldn’t that mean somebody else (Hunter) should be open??? OH, and Zeke is NOT a point guard.
Miserable feeling losing to that team. aaargh.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
@kjayhawks said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
@Texas-Hawk-10 Valid points on the initial investigation hurting recruiting but after winning the title in 2022 and being able to pay players with NIL, I don’t think it Is valid at this point. To me we went to hard after the portal guys and other than Zeke none of them have produced. Shak, Diggy, Rylen and AJ haven’t panned out IMO I’d rather spent some money on a highschooler or picked differently in the portal.
It wasn’t until the summer of 2023 that the NCAA case was resolved. Hunter was the only high dollar NIL transfer during that time and we all know he came to KU because KU was the highest bidder for him. Transfers that cared about winning more were likely still leery of the NCAA hammer coming down on KU so this past transfer class was the first without the NCAA investigation influencing potential transfers and the 2025 class is the first high school class without the investigation influencing it.
Which means Self took a big swing and a miss, Self was thinking about building this team towards the end of last year, which I thought was a good thing but it turned out quite the opposite.
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Anyone else just looking forward to next season at this point? Baring a Danny and Miracles type of run next month we are just pissing in the wind at this point.
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Speaking of Tiller, does anyone know whether Tiller practices with team already? I don’t see any improvement watching the bigs play. I’m afraid BS is preparing Tiller for next season, instead. LOL… High-low v22.0.
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@jay4ever said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
Speaking of Tiller, does anyone know whether Tiller practices with team already? I don’t see any improvement watching the bigs play. I’m afraid BS is preparing Tiller for next season, instead. LOL… High-low v22.0.
From a few weeks ago:
KU coach Bill Self said on Monday on his “Hawk Talk” radio show that Tiller has only been working in individual drills so far, but he’s just a few days away now from getting checked out by physicians and having a chance to become a full member of KU’s scout team.
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I would expect minimal impact from Tiller year 1. Kid has missed a lot of time
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@kjayhawks said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
Anyone else just looking forward to next season at this point? Baring a Danny and Miracles type of run next month we are just pissing in the wind at this point.
This I agree with. I’m looking forward to a new look at PG next season. I do think Juan has always been a liability. I don’t really think a Bill Self team can win a Natty without someone dynamic at PG. The 2022 run Remy really got us out of the 1st round, and then obviously the Natty game he saved us.
Mason. Graham. Dotson. Collins. Tyshawn. All of the best Bill Self teams had a PG putting up like 15ppg and at the end of the game were the type of guy who could just take his man off the dribble and get a bucket.
That is what we need from that spot with this coach. It is part of why I’m not worried about the future. When Juan is gone we can get back to looking for a PG that can really fill up the bucket.
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@Kcmatt7 said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
@kjayhawks said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
Anyone else just looking forward to next season at this point? Baring a Danny and Miracles type of run next month we are just pissing in the wind at this point.
This I agree with. I’m looking forward to a new look at PG next season. I do think Juan has always been a liability. I don’t really think a Bill Self team can win a Natty without someone dynamic at PG. The 2022 run Remy really got us out of the 1st round, and then obviously the Natty game he saved us.
Mason. Graham. Dotson. Collins. Tyshawn. All of the best Bill Self teams had a PG putting up like 15ppg and at the end of the game were the type of guy who could just take his man off the dribble and get a bucket.
That is what we need from that spot with this coach. It is part of why I’m not worried about the future. When Juan is gone we can get back to looking for a PG that can really fill up the bucket.
At the end of the day, none of those PG’s won a title as the starting PG at KU though. Sherron was a back up to Robinson. The formula for winning a title at PG for Self seems to be a pass first, defensive oriented starter with a scorer coming off the bench.
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Found some pretty interesting conversation off the KU podcast yesterday after this debacle. Side show ( could be wrong ) is the name , and before some say here that these guys are idiots and know nothing, maybe you need to listen to them before you bsrk to loud they are just as if not more knowledgeable about some of thus as you are. They are pretty pissed but brought up some really valid points. They are and these are just some :
They fully believe Bill doesn’t have this team , This team has no chemistry, this team has no leadership They were saying that when this tok place that anybody in h Basketball industry that knows anything knew that the AJ Storr transfer was not going to work That this with Storr was a complete failure from Coach Self on down
Last two years Bill has completely whiffed in the porta Aj Storr is a total COMPLETE WHIFF , – Griffen is a Complete whiff- – -Timberlake is a complete whiff.
They were sayig about people who were trying Hell Storr a lot of times is like some raging bull in a China Closet, charging the basket and throwing up some wild ass jock shot that hits the bottom side of the back board to defend Storr & Griffen – -example of their play they were 5-17 from the field do you REALLY think we need to see more minutes of these guys so they can go another 2-3 of 19 from the filed? They have been given chances Hell how many times have we seen Griffen come down the floor bumbling tumblin stumblin having a hard enough time standing up on his feet,
The guys were talking about there is so much dis-content on this team, how the Coach’s don’t have them ready to play , talking about how these kids don’t like one another , no chemistry.
They were saying people hollering about Flory’s minutes saying do you REALLY think that if Flory got more minutes yesterday we would of WON this game ?- NO , NO we wouldn’t - Flory like has been mentioned he ( Bshark ) said Flory was just bad yesterday, he wouldn’t of won this game for us yesterday, Doesn’t matter No line up combo is gonna make this team any better-- -we just good to face it , this team is just not good. – Avers age team , very Average
We should of won this game yesterday , but we got dog stomped by a 12-11 team. a team more hungry then these guys. Talking about we need to re-evaluate our NINE Assistants - needs to be a change
I think some people are taking some things to for granted with Diggy & Flory coming back,-- I 100 % feel Diggy is done and won’t be back, and Flory ? – Flory ?- -with the way things have played out this Season, his minuttes not there - chemisty ?- -dont be surprised , is he ready ?-- Hell no but don’t be surprised if he doesn’t come back
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Bro Sheron played more minutes than Russ and was a HUGE team player by not basically demanding he start.
Russ only played 20 minutes the Natty game including OT!
DG led a very short rotation to a FF. Tyshawn lead an even shorter bench to a Natty runner up. Dotson didn’t get his chance to do it.
You are blatantly wrong.
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@Kcmatt7 said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
Bro Sheron played more minutes than Russ and was a HUGE team player by not basically demanding he start.
Russ only played 20 minutes the Natty game including OT!
DG led a very short rotation to a FF. Tyshawn lead an even shorter bench to a Natty runner up. Dotson didn’t get his chance to do it.
You are blatantly wrong.
Like semantics, sure they didn’t win a Natty (except Sherron). But they were all clearly Bill’s best teams here. Argue with a wall if you disagree.
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And like yea, ok, sure, we ALL feel like the shortcoming from the Frank Mason teams was Frank. The NPOY… And not that his starting C was Landen Fucking Lucas both those EE runs.
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@Kcmatt7 said in Oh how I hate Kansas State.:
Bro Sheron played more minutes than Russ and was a HUGE team player by not basically demanding he start.
Russ only played 20 minutes the Natty game including OT!
DG led a very short rotation to a FF. Tyshawn lead an even shorter bench to a Natty runner up. Dotson didn’t get his chance to do it.
You are blatantly wrong.
Who were the starting PG’s that hung banners for Self? Non scoring PG’s with a scoring PG coming off the bench. You can claim whatever you want, but at the end of the day, none of those other teams won national title. Also, remind me what 17ppg scorer Perry Ellis did in the 2016 Villanova game?
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@SlimShaddy54 I doubt Diggy has what it takes to be a solid PG aka BIFM - I’m fine if he’s gone. Moore has bigger balls than anybody in the team. Flory or any kind of slim athletic power fwd/center players out of HS, should not join KU when BS is still at the throne. He doesn’t have the right formula to use them. Period. That’s very unfortunate. These days, players like that will be recruited by NBA and will thrive for years. Guys like HD, Lawson, Ellis, Landen, will never survive in NBA. Flory seems to be smarter, better defensively, has more upsides than Udeh. We’ll miss FB, sadly. I’m excited Peterson joined next season. The Brazillian dude has shown potentials, but will present challenges to BS & his staff again and again. Will he force those slim athletic centers to play high-low? We know this won’t work. We won natty with David because Remy was just a natural. BS has yet to show his worth as an HOF with unlimited term, IMHO.
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@jay4ever Check out my thread about help being on the way— deals with Darryn, MY GOD that kid is a beast and absolute 100 % real. As far a Flory I think there is at least a 50/50 now him trying NBA next year, probably not, but god chance he hits portal, think frustrating for him not playing as much right now.- -Read in another article saying looks like he has stepped back and on cruise control since KJ being back- - and ya Diggy have no doubt he is - GONE his minutes would be so scarce next year, because El Marko going to run the point and when he is not-- Darryn will slide over to run. - -There had ben a lot of talk Darryn wanted to play point at one time, so no surprise if he doesn’t slide over when El Marko is out.
Yet with the expanding roster to 15 right next year ? – I guess never say neve , but he would be option number three
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You are such a literal person you can’t even evaluate things beyond the stat sheet.
Who finished both NC games at PG? National Championship on the line, who is in the game? Russ? Nope. Juan? Nope.
Remy played the final 9 minutes. Sherron played the final 15. Mario’s miracle, was Sherron or Russ in??? But hang the banner Russ! He did it! Juan won that Natty!
If you could add Remy Martin to this team and you’d have to drop Juan for the rest of the season you telling me you wouldn’t?
If you could add Russ or Sherron to this years team in place of Juan, who are you adding?
