Elmarko
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@BeddieKU23 said in Elmarko:
He’s playing a different role because the role they could really use him at (backup PG, secondary ballhandler) he cannot do currently. He cannot run the offense or simple plays for this team.
They say he’s really good in practice but in games it hasn’t translated. He is young to the game due so maybe he has a big leap in him coming. We need something to stay and develop.
This is another reason I’m for it. We need to start having player retention again. We can’t keep shuffling guys in and out.
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There’s a reason why Elmarko was tabbed as a potential OAD and lottery pick entering the season.
People want a play making PG who can get his own shots, Elmarko can be that player.
It also baffles me to see people complain about not having players to cheer for because they don’t stick around and develop. Now that someone is potentially changing their minds about returning and developing more here at KU, those same people don’t want him back. It can’t be both ways because how many of the most beloved Jayhawks are beloved because they stuck here through adversity?
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I think there’s going to be some criticism/hesitation from fans because with Harris coming back we need shooting and playmaking. I’m not sure anyone wants to watch another year where the backcourt can’t shoot or create their own like we are seeing this year. Just my 2 cents
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Elmarko should definitely come back. Learning for another year then stepping into the starting role later would be awesome for both sides
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@FarmerJayhawk said in Elmarko:
Elmarko should definitely come back. Learning for another year then stepping into the starting role later would be awesome for both sides
Guessing you’ve heard about all this as well since it’s been buzzing around for days (I really vetted it out before posting here). KJ’s dad (KJ and his dad love KU) has been a big part of this. Heard he has been talking to Elmarko’s mom about things.
I’m still a believer in the physical tools but he is raw and needs someone to teach him basketball skills. That can be tricky, some guys never get there. Philon is the opposite, he knows how to play very well. I think the idea of the Elmarko (JR)/Philon (SO) is pretty enticing.
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@BeddieKU23 said in Elmarko:
I think there’s going to be some criticism/hesitation from fans because with Harris coming back we need shooting and playmaking. I’m not sure anyone wants to watch another year where the backcourt can’t shoot or create their own like we are seeing this year. Just my 2 cents
We need a proven stud guard no matter what happens with Elmarko.
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I’d be thrilled is Elmarko comes back. You can tell he has all the tools to be a dominant player, but for some reason he’s just not aggressive enough. Usually Freshmen screw up by trying to do too much, but Elmarko barely tried to do anything. Was flat out weird to me.
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@FarmerJayhawk said in Elmarko:
Elmarko should definitely come back. Learning for another year then stepping into the starting role later would be awesome for both sides
Guessing you’ve heard about all this as well since it’s been buzzing around for days (I really vetted it out before posting here). KJ’s dad (KJ and his dad love KU) has been a big part of this. Heard he has been talking to Elmarko’s mom about things.
I’m still a believer in the physical tools but he is raw and needs someone to teach him basketball skills. That can be tricky, some guys never get there. Philon is the opposite, he knows how to play very well. I think the idea of the Elmarko (JR)/Philon (SO) is pretty enticing.
Gotta hope KJ’s dad and Self keep the other teams and people in his camp away.
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@FarmerJayhawk said in Elmarko:
Elmarko should definitely come back. Learning for another year then stepping into the starting role later would be awesome for both sides
Guessing you’ve heard about all this as well since it’s been buzzing around for days (I really vetted it out before posting here). KJ’s dad (KJ and his dad love KU) has been a big part of this. Heard he has been talking to Elmarko’s mom about things.
I’m still a believer in the physical tools but he is raw and needs someone to teach him basketball skills. That can be tricky, some guys never get there. Philon is the opposite, he knows how to play very well. I think the idea of the Elmarko (JR)/Philon (SO) is pretty enticing.
Chalked it up to teenagers being typically indecisive lol. But it does make a lot of sense given the portal chatter has shifted more to the wings. Not to say they won’t go after a guard but building a more skilled and versatile lineup seems to be the play
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@Texas-Hawk-10 i hear you, but im struggling with this limbo we find ourselves in, where we may or may not be able to retain freshman players to the point that they are of value to us. I want what is best for both our program and for the player. I just am not convinced that it is best for either for Elmarko to stay with Juan coming back. Could he really not go run the show somewhere else and be better for it?
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@approxinfinity said in Elmarko:
@Texas-Hawk-10 i hear you, but im struggling with this limbo we find ourselves in, where we may or may not be able to retain freshman players to the point that they are of value to us. I want what is best for both our program and for the player. I just am not convinced that it is best for either for Elmarko to stay with Juan coming back. Could he really not go run the show somewhere else and be better for it?
Do you know what a common complaint with modern AAU basketball is? It’s a lack of practice time and player development. Many top level AAU programs focus on playing as many games as possible while not practicing very frequently which leads to a lack of skill development.
Sitting behind someone and learning from them can frequently be for more beneficial than being thrown to the wolves. Sitting a year behind Alex Smith and learning is frequently cited as a major contributing factor to Pat Mahomes success.
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@FarmerJayhawk said in Elmarko:
@FarmerJayhawk said in Elmarko:
Elmarko should definitely come back. Learning for another year then stepping into the starting role later would be awesome for both sides
Guessing you’ve heard about all this as well since it’s been buzzing around for days (I really vetted it out before posting here). KJ’s dad (KJ and his dad love KU) has been a big part of this. Heard he has been talking to Elmarko’s mom about things.
I’m still a believer in the physical tools but he is raw and needs someone to teach him basketball skills. That can be tricky, some guys never get there. Philon is the opposite, he knows how to play very well. I think the idea of the Elmarko (JR)/Philon (SO) is pretty enticing.
Chalked it up to teenagers being typically indecisive lol. But it does make a lot of sense given the portal chatter has shifted more to the wings. Not to say they won’t go after a guard but building a more skilled and versatile lineup seems to be the play
I think we need a STUD guard. Doesn’t make sense to get another developmental type if Elmarko is staying.
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If we are pretty sure Elmarko staying means for 2 more seasons when next year is a development year, then i’m all for it.
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@BeddieKU23 said in Elmarko:
I think there’s going to be some criticism/hesitation from fans because with Harris coming back we need shooting and playmaking. I’m not sure anyone wants to watch another year where the backcourt can’t shoot or create their own like we are seeing this year. Just my 2 cents
This is what drives me nuts. This is just one of many posts pointing out how much Juan’s non-scoring play style limits this team. He needs to make a massive change to his game or get out of the way so the team isn’t held back.
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@RockkChalkk If Dejuan starts hunting for shots this team will get real bad, real fast. Furphy, McCullar, KJ, Hunter - none can adequately handle the ball and none are good slashers/drivers. Elmarko and Harris are it for decent ball handlers. What I’d like to see isn’t Harris shooting more, but varying the pace more. Constantly walking the ball up the court is not good, push it even if all you do is pull it back out and wait for Hunter to get set. While Harris can’t carry a team he’s proven to be good enough to be a piece of a championship team like BJ Armstrong was for the Bulls. Bill just needs to do a better job recruiting around him - need a combo guard at the 2 (similiar to Arterio) or an 4 that isn’t an 5 and this season would look much different.
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@dylans This is why we desperately need more handling for next season. A small minute reduction but other guys being able to handle some would let Juan rest more so he could go faster here and there. As it is this season with him being our only real handler he has to pace himself.
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Can anyone guess KUs two McDonalds All-Americans on this year’s team? (No cheating!) Big clue - Crazy they have no depth with two Burger boys not starting!
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Can anyone guess KUs two McDonalds All-Americans on this year’s team? (No cheating!) Big clue - Crazy they have no depth with two Burger boys not starting!
Elmarko is the easy one, I assume the second is the bozo kicked off the team.
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Hunter?
Edit: nope
Actually, I don’t see 2 but I might be missing something, being old and all…
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@RockkChalkk said in Elmarko:
@BeddieKU23 said in Elmarko:
I think there’s going to be some criticism/hesitation from fans because with Harris coming back we need shooting and playmaking. I’m not sure anyone wants to watch another year where the backcourt can’t shoot or create their own like we are seeing this year. Just my 2 cents
This is what drives me nuts. This is just one of many posts pointing out how much Juan’s non-scoring play style limits this team. He needs to make a massive change to his game or get out of the way so the team isn’t held back.
Yeah we are in an interesting spot here. We can gain a minutes reduction in Juan by having a backup PG that is trusted to run the offense. That’s what Elmarko cannot currently do. Perhaps they think he’s just an offseason away from that being the case but right now it’s not possible. It’s a gamble given what we’ve seen all year from him but if we believe in kids developing (especially one’s so highly rated) from Year 1 to Year 2 then it could work out. They also have Philon coming in as another ballhandling possibility. I’m still hoping we get an experienced guard from the portal that’s the total package, can run the offense in a pinch, create his own shot and be dependable doing so.
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@BShark didn’t know Udeh was one.
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I’m hearing that it’s impossible to give top effort with these minutes as a 20 year old… tell that to these point/combo guards - Sherron, Tyshawn, Frank Mason, Devonte Graham (38!), Devon Dotson
I love Harris, but I’m not sure why he can’t go all out 10-15% of the offensive plays to keep the other team on its heals a little more. If he can not, a more ideal situation would be similar minutes to 2007-8 Mario and RussRob played 30 each and flat got with it on both sides of the ball. —-if Elmarko could just give 10 lousy minutes of relief to Harris he should be able to get closer to peak efficiency. If Elmarko could manage 25-30 the stress of being the only ball handler would be off Harris’ shoulders. But we’ve seen that Elmarko is a work in progress and players are exceptionally impatient in this era.
We absolutely need Elmarko to play better going forward (this year and next if he’s here) to take pressure off of Harris.
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@dylans Thank you. The protection of d2 by the staff is what makes the roster construction baffling but explains why the dumb decisions are made because of horrible scouting of one of their own.
Next year won’t be any better with him at the point no matter who you surround him with.
Yet again the guaranteed minutes at pg turn guys away but sure “bill makes u earn minutes” that’s a load of bs. Bills soft
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This post is deleted!
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Obviously exit meetings haven’t happened but new article is up with EJ saying he’s staying. Hope he’s true to that statement
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What’s this about Elmarko staying?
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Obviously exit meetings haven’t happened but new article is up with EJ saying he’s staying. Hope he’s true to that statement
We have mom in our corner at least, but I don’t think it’s as decided as that article implies. Shreyas had a similar article with Bobby last year.
I really hope Elmarko stays though.
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@BShark I was thinking the same thing, Bobby could’ve helped this team
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@kjayhawks hell, Joe yesefu could have helped this team.
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Anybody share a link for the Elmarko story?
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Bump.
PREDICTION: Shreyas article will be looking rather bad.
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Heard earlier it was more likely than not he’d be back but teenagers are notoriously consistent with their decision making
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@FarmerJayhawk said in Elmarko:
Heard earlier it was more likely than not he’d be back but teenagers are notoriously consistent with their decision making
It’s going to be a bumpy road. This was a very recent shift and I felt confident enough to call it a prediction but obviously things can change. AGAIN. lol
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@BShark I honestly think he becomes a solid player in a few seasons. I feel like we have struggled to get guys to buy in long term. TGF is a prime example IMO. I’d like to see us keep a nucleus of players and pick up a few guys that are shooters and/or can go get a bucket. A guy today that can go get a tough bucket to stop a run.
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@FarmerJayhawk said in Elmarko:
Heard earlier it was more likely than not he’d be back but teenagers are notoriously consistent with their decision making
It’s going to be a bumpy road. This was a very recent shift and I felt confident enough to call it a prediction but obviously things can change. AGAIN. lol
If the coaching staff was banking on Elmarko to replace mccullar over a transfer then this is for the better
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@rcjhdraft agree
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Im good with Elmarko returning but hes not going to replace Kevins shooting, at least not next year, imo.
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I think we need to recruit as if Elmarko is the backup PG primarily and find a starting 2. Elmarko can work his ass off and take more time from Dajuan at PG. If he develops a reliable 3 he can earn more minutes at 1 and 2.
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Marko just goes solo, it’s a no from me.
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@approxinfinity Philon gonna be better I think.
Elmarko turns it over, dribbles and falls down and can’t score outside 10 feet. I’m good moving on
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@Crimsonorblue22 said in Elmarko:
Marko just goes solo, it’s a no from me.
Crimson! I’ve never heard such harsh words from you!
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Its interesting that elite hs talent guards can be so incongruous with the teams actual needs, Grimes before this. Beyond recruiting for a position, mentality seems incongruous as @Crimsonorblue22 said. As if “go get me the best talent” wasnt a specific enough directive.
Re: @Texas-Hawk-10 ’s statement about AAU leaving players incomplete, would like to recruit more internationals, I think, if paying them isnt a pain in the ass.
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The talent evaluators all knew Elmarko wasn’t a finished product coming out (think a raw big with oodles of potential but not the consistency). His growth in the last 2 years of HS, athleticism and growing playmaking skills got him ranked where he was because of what they thought he’d become at KU.
Elmarko has only been playing basketball 5/6 years so he’s behind.
After a year here, he’s further behind then anyone could imagine. Been hit or miss with top ranked guards lately I’d say. Dotson came prepared to handle it.
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@BeddieKU23 right. But its the mental side of things we need to do better at. Dotson was a 3 sport athlete, Embiid grew up playing soccer. All the internationals are growing immensely by coming here and seeing life in an entirely different society. Maybe there is a lack of robustness of mind, groundedness, when you are a single (? Is he?) sport athlete produced by the AAU puppy mill.
Im struggling to articulate, help me pick at this thread if it strikes a chord?
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Also i wonder if other sports might teach you to be more of a team player?
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@approxinfinity said in Elmarko:
@BeddieKU23 right. But its the mental side of things we need to do better at. Dotson was a 3 sport athlete, Embiid grew up playing soccer. All the internationals are growing immensely by coming here and seeing life in an entirely different society. Maybe there is a lack of robustness of mind, groundedness, when you are a single (? Is he?) sport athlete produced by the AAU puppy mill.
Im struggling to articulate, help me pick at this thread if it strikes a chord?
If Elmarko is included in your thoughts here, don’t forget that he was a growing Lacrosse star.
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Scouts and coaches will always tell you it’s good for your kids to do other sports.
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There was talk that Elmarko was a better practice player then in games. It was evident from most of his play this year he was not ready for this level, mentally. Who knows if they expected him to start or play a large role before the season but as we know the Morris situation forced their hand. In any case the highly ranked and highly touted player coming in did not live up to expectations. Most of us expected to see some version of why he was highly ranked and we saw far and few evidence to back it up. His rise from unranked prospect to top tier might have been a mis-eval but there was a lot of positives said about him from evaluators to coaches so how did everyone miss the boat?
I hate to use absolutes with freshman because an offseason to reflect and start over in this program has led to far more players improving then not but I have my doubts like many on him. It’s not just the mental mistakes on both sides, it’s the lack of skill that worries me most. Did anyone ever feel comfortable with him dribbling the ball or having to make a pass? It was cringe.
After a full season he could not be trusted to run simple plays at lead guard or defend opposing guards from getting anything they wanted. Self could not depend on him to do anything Juan does, leaving him no choice but to play him at ‘SG’ which we saw didn’t work either. When you don’t have the skills to play either backcourt position what do you do?
I’m guessing the coaches know more about his mental approach and ability to play at this level but I do think it’s a hard question they must ask.
Perhaps all of this is just segwaying into the bigger issue about development at the HS and prep level due to the challenges covid presented among other development issues. AAU ball is a joke, kids are reclassifying at record pace every year, there are lots of players who transfer multiple times in High School now, another recent phenomenon. That lost year for so many set the sport back more then we can measure. The lost year changed so much of how things were done.
On the other side it also left grown men in the game when before it was rare to see guys over 22 still playing. Now you got 5th and 6th year guys still hooping with 18 year olds creating this big gap in physical and mental development. I think that’s negatively shaped our opinions of younger players because nobody is winning right now with a young roster. “Stay Old” is the new model coaches are following. It’s hard to have patience now when everything is being catered to the now
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No more lacrosse players. No more softies like Kevin. Need life long hoopers. DOGS.
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No more lacrosse players. No more softies like Kevin. Need life long hoopers. DOGS.
EXACTLY - - - spot on 100 % - - No more Lacrosse- - -Volleyball , what the hell eve, Basketball - -Basketball , – Basketball players only - -Basketball is what your getting your free ride on so – SHOW ME your BASKETBALL SKILLS . - Not Lacrosse , Volleyball , Badminton- -no we nee top Dog Alpha Basketball players
