Jeff Long = New AD
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Texas Hawk 10 said:
@FarmerJayhawk Beaty will get longer than CMU this year. The schedule sets up for 6 games a bye then 6 more to end the year. 6 games is what Beaty has this year.
Also, Brady Hoke will not be a factor the KU job if Jeff Long wants to win over the donors. Brady Hoke got worse each year at Michigan. When he took the DC job at Oregon, Oregon was the second worst defense in the country (both ppg and ypg) and went 4-8 in 2016. Last year as the DLine coach at Tennessee, the Vols went 0-8 in the SEC and had the 5th worst run defense in the country.
Nothing Brady Hoke has done since 2012 says he deserves a D1 head coach job, even at Kansas.
I don’t like Hoke either. Just passing it along. Hoke and Long go waaaaaayyy back. Played HS football together if memory serves. Long was QB and Hoke was his center.
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HighEliteMajor said:
Please let us be a spring board; please let us be a spring board; please let us be a spring board.
Ah, if we could just be a springboard in the tradition of Miami, Ohio: HOF coaches Sid Gillman, Woody Hayes, Ara Paraseghian, Bo Schembechler all cut their chops there.
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@justanotherfan KU would really be great if debate was a revenue producer…
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Bielema. Easy pick. He would get KU to a bowl game, and we’d have our once in 20 years run of good teams. Then he’ll go somewhere else, and we’ll start again. If KU hires him, maybe him and Klingsbury can slug it out. Bielema would be perfect, imo. He has recruited Texas, and his midwest contacts from back in the day at Wisky would play a lot better than trying to convince midwesterners to go to Bugtussle. I mean, at this point, are there any other Rose Bowl coaches available to risk career suicide by taking on the biggest challenge since football was invented? I personally feel he is a goomer, so the interviews would be quite a drag, but if he can resurrect the program, I’d be willing to pay the price.
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@KUSTEVE Bielema also ticked off some Texas hs coaches talking of how the spread doesn’t work and you need a fullback but he also spanked the daylights outta KSU and Snyder in the liberty bowl a few years back. I think he’s a better coach than anyone we have had in my lifetime not named Mangino or Mason.
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@HighEliteMajor could Bill Self hold him in the palm of his hand and choose to crush him?
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@Texas-Hawk-10 I don’t know…ESPN can’t even judge talent between Big10 and other conferences except their nose is so far up the rear of the SEC.
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@Bwag and Trae young, still
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@kjayhawks I would venture there are a pretty large number of coaches in Texas that agree with him, although he sounded like a jerk when he said it. I’ll give him this: he competed in the toughest conference in football. That’s simply a murderer’s row of conference games. To take the Hogs to 3 straight bowl games playing the likes of Bammer, Auburn, LSU, A & M, and Miss St every year is pretty amazing. And the job he did at Wisky was incredible. He isn’t Petrino, but he doesn’t have the character issues, either.
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@KUSTEVE I agree, it would just be interesting to a guy that got the AD fired from his last gig come in to his new gig. I have no doubt he’s a better than what we have had since MM was here.
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If we have no doubt he’s better, would we be better firing Beatty now and just hiring him?
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@KUSTEVE Getting to a bowl game in the SEC is easier than in the B12. The SEC only plays 8 conference games so scheduling 4 cupcakes in nonconference, Texas Tech and Rutgers were two of P5 nonconference opponents so not that difficult of a task to get to 4-0 in nonconference which means an SEC needs to go 2-6 in league play to reach a bowl game. That’s a 25% winning percentage in league play and Arkansas has had a really bad Missouri as their locked in cross division game for the past several years.
Compare that to a B12 schedule that only has 3 nonconference games which means B12 teams have to win 33% of their league games to get to bowl eligibility with a perfect nonconference record.
Even in the SEC West, getting to a bowl game is easier than it is in the B12 because of how their schedule works.
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The SEC does only schedule 8 conference games, but that is because some of their conference teams have an in-state rivalry game with another major conference school each season.
South Carolina and Clemson play every year.
So do Florida and Florida State.
Same for Georgia and Georgia Tech.
Kentucky and Louisville.
Those games take place during the SEC “rivalry week” at the end of November, when the Iron Bowl, Egg Bowl, Battle for the Boot, etc. traditionally take place.
For those schools, it’s like having 9 conference games every year.
Those games are written in stone for those schools. They don’t want a 9th conference game on top of that because it would be like having 10 conference games.
For the schools that don’t have that instate game, they typically schedule another major conference opponent instead.
A&M is playing Clemson this year. Bama has Louisville. Auburn has Washington. Ole Miss plays Texas Tech. Mississippi State plays K-State. LSU plays Miami. Mizzou plays Purdue. Tennessee gets West Virginia. Vandy gets Notre Dame.
The only school that doesn’t have another major conference opponent this season is Arkansas. Saying its easier in the SEC is not true, unless you were to take the Bill Snyder approach to scheduling every year (something that is frowned on in the SEC because so many schools schedule a power conference opponent).
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@justanotherfan The OOC game that only 3 of the SEC teams play in November (UGA/GTech, UF/FSU, and SC/Clem) is not why the SEC stayed at 8 conference games. They stayed because of the cross divisional rivalry games of Alabama/Tennessee and Auburn/Georgia because Alabama is like Texas in that they control the politics of the SEC and they didn’t want a 9th conference game.
The quality nonconference match ups outside of the 3 teams above is very new and because of the CFP and trying to impress voters. Prior to that, it wasn’t uncommon for the mid pack and bad teams to schedule an FCS team in late October/early November (most still do that), and some combination of 3 Sun Belt/MAC/C-USA to get a 4-0 nonconference record so they only needed to get to two SEC wins and get a bowl berth.
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You are correct that Bama led the charge of not wanting the 9th conference game. But the politics of the SEC is somewhat different than the Big 12 in that a handful of schools wield power rather than just two (because so many of the SEC schools make tons of money). The major power brokers in the SEC are Alabama, LSU, Florida, Georgia and Kentucky. Because of that, if three of those schools are vocal about something, it’s going their way. Bama, Florida and Georgia were vocal about not having a 9th conference game.
That’s why the conference title game was initially held in Birmingham (Alabama’s request), then moved to Atlanta (Georgia’s request, with Florida and Kentucky support). That’s why the basketball tournament is typically in Atlanta (UK preference, with Georgia support).
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I’m interested to see how this hire goes with our basketball interests. I would assume Jeff Long will be in charge of finding the next Basketball Head Coach when Bill Self hangs it up. Hopefully its not anytime soon but when the day comes I hope he’s the type of AD we can respect and appreciate.
He’s got his hands full with the football mess that’s for sure. Fire the one in charge now, take your lumps and make the right hire
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BeddieKU23 said:
I’m interested to see how this hire goes with our basketball interests. I would assume Jeff Long will be in charge of finding the next Basketball Head Coach when Bill Self hangs it up. Hopefully its not anytime soon but when the day comes I hope he’s the type of AD we can respect and appreciate when that time comes.
He’s got his hands full with the football mess that’s for sure. Fire the one in charge now, take your lumps and make the right hire
I bet Bill is involved with finding the next coach when he does step down.
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BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
I’m interested to see how this hire goes with our basketball interests. I would assume Jeff Long will be in charge of finding the next Basketball Head Coach when Bill Self hangs it up. Hopefully its not anytime soon but when the day comes I hope he’s the type of AD we can respect and appreciate when that time comes.
He’s got his hands full with the football mess that’s for sure. Fire the one in charge now, take your lumps and make the right hire
I bet Bill is involved with finding the next coach when he does step down.
I hope so, granted its a mutual decision when he steps away. If he leaves for the NBA or something unexpected then JL will have to shoulder a lot of the ground work and responsibility.
I’m certainly not trying to think ahead. I was voicing what would be the biggest job for the AD in the future. Short term- give the football team a living pulse. Long term continue to keep KU basketball at the elite of the elite level
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@Texas-Hawk-10 His last year, Arkansas played 9 teams that went to bowls out of 12 games. The worst team in conference was Miss, who was 6-6.So, every team on their side of the conference went to a bowl game except Ark. Their East division games were against a 9-4 USC team, and a Mizzourah team that went to a bowl. Murderer’s row.
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So here is the bottom line - - -pain and simple no bullshit. - -Jeff Long IS the Athletic Director now at KU. - -We have people that are ok with the hire we have others that thinks it sucks. - -Doesn’t matter he is our Ad - -he WILL name our next Coach - -you like him that’s cool - -you having kittens thinking it’s a terrible hire - -Sorry it is what it is , but he is the AD so you might as well get behind him , cause not going to do you any good to do otherwise.
I feel very confident the next Coach he hires will do just fine. - -Personally I wouldn’t mind Miles for a period - - I know he isn’t the long resolve answer but hoping he could be like 4-5 years and possibly groom Tony Hull for the following Coach I think Hull might just have a very promising future would love to have him down the road - – feel it’s really pointless to continue to debate back and forth - - back and forth whether he was a good hire - -whether he made horrible football Coaching hires or not now - - - -we need to just get behind the hiring of this AD - and his choices at this point. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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At most schools does the hiring fall solely on the AD? Or is there a committee? I remember Self saying he hoped someone w/KU ties got his job. I don’t think he wants to hand it over to anyone. It’s his baby! He seemed awfully proud during the summer league games, and he’s getting so much praise from everybody, more than any other coach! Coaching and personality.
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@Crimsonorblue22 Yes…but…
Yes, the “responsibility” falls on the AD…he is in charge of the athletic department…BUT, most AD’s seek some kind of counsel on the hire (though not “required” to do so) be it forming a committee, hiring a consultant(s), getting recommendations from the “leaving” coach (assuming he was successful, such as Self) and maybe even “running” his choice by certain people (Chancellor, BMDs, etc.) before an announcement. So, ultimately the AD does the hire, but being a little like a politician…“consulting” with people and trying to get as big a “buy-in” from them as he can on his final choice (something I don’t think Zenger did).
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@ICThawk after the miserable fails I can’t imagine KU giving any AD a green light on hiring w/out some guidance! I also can’t imagine letting them sign big contracts w/out an ok.
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@Crimsonorblue22 then why hire an AD?..and who makes the “ultimate decision” then, the “committee”/“guider”? (and who chooses the “committee” and who is on the “committee”). Then who is responsible if it doesn’t “work out”…are we going to fire the members of the “committee” and keep the AD since it wasn’t “his” hire, it was the committees? Realistically though, most ADs have at least an informal committee for input, but that is the ADs choice, not someone telling him what he can and can not do. If you “hamstring” your AD, that seems to say you don’t have confidence in your AD to make a good decision so you should not have hired that person as AD in the first place.
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@ICThawk I was thinking about the contract Zenger signed w/fritzel. Scary. Thx for your input.
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@Crimsonorblue22 Agree with you wholeheartedly about that contract…though it seems to have been an “oversight” by the Athletic Corporation Board of Directors…who obviously in hindsight placed too much trust in Zenger who showed, at best, bad judgment, compounded by the Board abdicating its responsibility (as provided in its By-Laws). Setting general policy IS the job of the Athletic Board…carrying out that policy responsibly is the job of the AD. Just like a Board of Directors in a corporation, the AD being the President of the corporation. The Board sets general parameters but the “nitty-gritty” of carrying out those policies (the details like hiring/firing personnel) are left to the discretion of the President. But, the President still remains ultimately responsible to the Board and if they so choose, the Board may terminate him if they do not believe he is responsibly carrying out their policies. Because it was Zenger’s responsibility (coaches, contracts, administration) he was terminated, and properly so, even if regrettably later rather than sooner (in my opinion)…
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I’ve got an idea. There’s a coach who will be successful at KU. His name is Mark Mangino.
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wissox said:
I’ve got an idea. There’s a coach who will be successful at KU. His name is Mark Mangino.
Did you see his recent twitter rampage?
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The search for a high profile position be that an administrator or coach will invariably involve hiring a head hunter firm to select candidates and make sure they are properly vetted before they are considered.
I cannot imagine any major school AD making a hire at this level in isolation. Typically he will hire a search firm with input of the AdHoc search committee, who normally would not have many of the restrictions a school HR office would and can contact candidates off the record, something public officials might not be allowed to do. Once the list of candidates is available, he might add more and then the information would be shared with the search committee who would narrow the list and, while the AD might have the ultimate choice…subject to approval by the school president, the selected individual will most like be the consensus candidate.
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BShark said:
wissox said:
I’ve got an idea. There’s a coach who will be successful at KU. His name is Mark Mangino.
Did you see his recent twitter rampage?
Mangino would never work here again. - All the little golden boys with their little golden - don’t hurt me - don’t talk mean to me attitudes and their upper crust greater then thou parents would never allow that/ GOD forbid Mangino put hands on anyone - - I mean this is football for GOD’S Sakes - we sure the hell won’t allow any physical contact on our babies - they might get hurt - -might get their feelings hurt. - All I know is when these Golden boys make the cut at the NFL - better nobody touch these boys cause UMMMMMMM Mommie and Daddy be MAD – lmao - -get the F - - - out of here with that shit -It’s football , you think Mangino talk bad/nasty to these guys – you think his quote unquote demeanor his attitude - his approach - -his Coaching style was hard on these golden babies? - -that is such a fricken joke - -what they gonna do when someone slams them to the turf - -takes that career ending possibly cheap shot - -you think Mangino had a nasty mouth - you think he was physical? - - well get ready lil bitches cause if you wanna play NFL football - -HA - -what Mangino did - his character ain’t shit to what you will see boys - -Where is mommie and daddy then? - I wouldn’t want Mark back here not fair to him he doesn’t deserve this.
All people wanted to do was give him shit about his weight , talk smack on him. - - Tell me what the hell did his weight have to do with his Coaching ability? - He was one of the few Coach’s that we have had that could win some games - -didn’t or wouldn’t put up with the players show boating - trying to show up opposing players/teams - -Sure I would of loved to see him drop weight for his own personal health - -but we had people not even thinking about the Coaching side all they wanted to do is talk about make fun of laugh about his weight - - -SCREW THAT. - people like that are just plain and simple SAD - -pitiful lives. - Mangino deserves better glad he is not here for his sake - -one of the few times we had a decent Coach and golden boys and don’t touch me hit me talk mean to me and they golden little bitch as parents ran him out - - II’M DONE THANKS
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Honest question for Mangino supporters
If a KU recruit behaved the way that Mangino did:
- yelling at an officiating crew while a spectator at a sporting event
- public, profanity laced tirades
- allegations that he mistreated those around him
would you want KU to continue recruiting that student athlete? If not, why is that acceptable behavior from a coach?
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A recruit is not a coach. A recruit is just a recruit. He’s a player. He’s a cog in the system. He’s earned nothing. He’s accomplished nothing. Equating a player and coach is senseless.
I don’t know. Why can the CEO of a company yell and stomp around like an idiot? Why can a star athlete act like a fool and get away with it? Because he’s EARNED it. He’s gotten to that point in his life where he has enough leverage to do what he wants to do. When folks have leverage, when they’re a wanted commodity, they can get away with more.
But guys like that don’t build equity. When they lose, those that are offended quickly turn. It’s the risk of being a jerk. Such as happened in the Mangino witch hunt, where myth exceeded reality.
But there is a hierarchy in this world, and in society, which is EARNED by success. Not given. Troubling to some, I’m sure.
The reality with coaches is winning is the answer. When Tom Coughlin loses, he’s too much of micro manager, he’s too much of drill sergeant, he’s a jerk, players hate him; when he wins, well, he has great attention to detail, he demands excellence, players look to him as a demanding leader. Same with the “players’ coach.”
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@BShark No, I don’t do twitter.
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@jayballer73 The one issue that I remember reading about was that MM said some things that crossed the line as far as race goes. If the comments were what I remember…they are not acceptable in today’s world. I hope I am remembering correctly when I make this statement.
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@Hawk8086 yeah, that definitely happened. Mangino can coach football but he’s not really a good dude. He also totally lost the team in 2008-09.
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justanotherfan said:
Honest question for Mangino supporters
If a KU recruit behaved the way that Mangino did:
- yelling at an officiating crew while a spectator at a sporting event
- public, profanity laced tirades
- allegations that he mistreated those around him
would you want KU to continue recruiting that student athlete? If not, why is that acceptable behavior from a coach?
here is the question to you. - -how many pro Coach’s yell at officials at their sporting event? Ypu think these guys aren’t going to be around Coach’s that yell have tantrums/ tirades during games ? if these kids /parents think this isn’t going to happen then they need to keep their kids sheltered - -it’s life -it happens every day. - when these kids get to pro if they are that fortunate the way Magino acted is going to seem like being on a kindergarden level compared to some of these pro Coach’s. What? - mama and dadd - If these guys and or parents are so thin skinned to this type of enviroment then I truly feel sorry for them -it’s going to happen you can take that to the bank going to yank the kid off the NFL roster because the coach curses throws tirades during games? -If your Naïve enough to think Coach’s don’t use profanity - then your living under a rock - you don’t think NFL Coach’s don’t get physical? - mercy what world you live it? - -Football it’s self is a physical game very physical - -so if your so concerned about a Coach being physical with your kid - then they don’t need to be in football period. - -Hell yes I would want them to keep recruiting him- of course then again my boy hasn’t been pampered, had that golden spoon all his life either - these things happen Believe that to keep recruiting them
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@jayballer73 I don’t think he even remotely is talking about that. Mangino went after officials at his sons high school fb game.
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@Crimsonorblue22 High School game College game - - Pro game - - it happens
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Wow. The other day someone was posting about the fighting here and then they come unglued over @justanotherfan 's good question.
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As @Crimsonorblue22 said, I wasn’t referencing Mangino yelling while coaching a KU game. He was at his son’s HS football game and went after the high school officiating crew. KU punished him internally for that, so I can’t honestly say what happened to him as a result. How would you feel if you read that a KU recruit was screaming at officials at their cousin’s junior high football game from the sidelines, to the point where they had to be restrained?
I specifically said spectator to make it clear that it wasn’t while coaching.
The public, profanity laced tirades also did not happen while coaching. These happened off the field as well - once to a parking attendant, once to another person in Lawrence and at least one other time on campus. Again, how would you feel if a report surfaced that a KU recruit had been seen screaming and cursing at a parking attendant?
Mangino’s management habits are well known. Again, how would you feel if you found out that a KU recruit was known to be a jerk to the people around him?
And that’s just the stuff we know about that happened off the field.
These are specific to things that happened OFF THE FIELD. These incidents are pretty well known around the KU program, and were a large reason why, despite his on field success, Mangino had very few supporters among the athletic department, administration and big donors. Mangino is probably the most successful coach in the history of KU football, but when he was pushed out, there wasn’t anyone in power trying to save him. That’s telling.
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@wissox YA WOW - -now you see how it really looks huh? lmao - -I AM NOT pointing at anyone specific on here with this - -let me tell you more slowly I am not in a debate with anyone specific here but thanks for trying to stir the pot - -your comment is greatly appreciated. - This is such a broad topic/conversation - you see wissox this is conversation heated about the person - - - -I appreciate what they are sayin. - Just so happens I have a very strong opinion about this - but not pissed at anyone here they have their opinions and make very valid points - -thanks again. ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@justanotherfan Thanks for your input - - appreciated.
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Oh my gosh, the idea of a football coach being a “jerk.” I mean, what is the world coming too? It the pussification of America. Thank you to a portion of America. Bunch of pansies. Victim mentality. Snowflakes. Good thing they don’t see Marine corp training.
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@HighEliteMajor are you ok w/a parent going off on refs at a high school game?
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@Crimsonorblue22 Truthfully, it depends. Generally, I’m fine with barking or a comment here and there. “Going off” … that would be for a major, major deal in my opinion. To the general point, I don’t support Mangino when he went off on an official at at HS game. As the KU coach, he should have considered time, place, and his position. But that doesn’t color my opinion that his ouster was nothing more than a witch hunt. I have mentioned this before, but I spoke directly to a former KU player who was close with the program, at the time of his firing, who used that exact term. Lots of info that he had.
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@HighEliteMajor - - That’s the bottom line - they could use any reason you want - no one really knows for sure but the administration & officals. - -But ya bottom line that’s all it mounted to WITCH HUNT
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Perkins wanted Mangino gone and got it done. But it’s pretty telling that Mangino isn’t a head coach somewhere else.
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You said, “If your Naïve enough to think Coach’s don’t use profanity - then your living under a rock - you don’t think NFL Coach’s don’t get physical? - mercy what world you live it?”
That’s stirring the pot sir. It’s just ironic to me since your post from a few days ago.
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wissox said:
You said, “If your Naïve enough to think Coach’s don’t use profanity - then your living under a rock - you don’t think NFL Coach’s don’t get physical? - mercy what world you live it?”
That’s stirring the pot sir. It’s just ironic to me since your post from a few days ago.
Again thanks for your input. -Are you here just to argue with yourself? - see I’m not doing it. - You’ve made your point , I have no problem with that but I’m not going to keep going back and forth I move along , it’s pointless to just keep going back and forth to see who has the last word. Your point has been made I appreciate it and time to move to a new subject. - -Have a great day. - -oh one side note though – - - -please don’t call me sir - -that’s so formal. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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wissox said:
You said, “If your Naïve enough to think Coach’s don’t use profanity - then your living under a rock - you don’t think NFL Coach’s don’t get physical? - mercy what world you live it?”
That’s stirring the pot sir. It’s just ironic to me since your post from a few days ago.
I’ll fix it so it’s not so offensive to the teacher in ya! @wissox
If you’re naive enough to think coaches don’t use profanity, then you are living under a rock! You don’t think NFL coaches get physical?!? Mercy, what world are you living in?
