KU's Next BBall coach - a game!
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@approxinfinity I was waiting for the Zags to Zig. But they never Zigged or Zagged. They didn’t have the talent of many other teams either.
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Self received his masters from KU so technically, he is an alum which would make him a legacy hire.
@KUSTEVE Legacy hires are not necessarily a bad thing. Since you bring up Missouri basketball and keep using them as the poster child of failed legacy hires, Norm Stewart played for Missouri and he was a prettt good coach.
Jim Boeheim and Roy Williams are also legacy hires, those two are pretty good coaches, wouldn’t you agree?
Just like hiring any other coach, a legacy coach isn’t guaranteed to be successful or a failure because of their ties to a school, but it does help them know the culture of the program and help with donors and marketing the program to recruits.
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I still think Haase is currently in tge best path to be Self’s successor.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 Because the sole reason any coach should be hired is can they coach, not where they graduated from. We’re way beyond that stage. I used the English example because that was clearly a case where legacy appears to be the only reason he was hired. Roy could coach no matter where he went to school at; same with Bill. And they weren’t hired at their present positions because they were alumni. Yet, when anyone discusses Bill leaving, the only criteria seems to be whether they played here. You can keep correcting me on this issue, and I will continue to rail away about it. If/when we lose Bill, I want the best to replace him, period. No asterisks, no " we’re saving this job for Danny "…none of that. If Danny is the best coach in America when Bill moves on, then I’m all for him. If he’s not, then I don’t want him as coach. It’s not that I don’t love Danny…I do. But this program is beyond Danny or Jerrod at this point by a long margin …this program commands the very elite- the very best. To settle for anything less would simply be a travesty.
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I think you are taking the legacy concept too literally. I don’t believe I or any other poster has indicated that the position should be reserved for an alumn; however, being one should not necessarily disqualify him either and if two candidates are very similar then the legacy aspect can be used as a tie breaker.
The Missouri example is not a good one because when Kim Anderson was hired he was indeed considered an up and coming coach and no “name” coach would touch the MU program and a clean cut coach was needed to remove the stench left by Frank Haith and in a way, he did accomplish that. I don’t believe being an alumn was the primary reason for MU to hire him but more of a strong reason why Anderson agreed to apply for and take the job. Had daddy Porter not have been from Columbia and with ties to MU, Martin does not take the job that included an Assistant Coach and the #1 player and potentially other highly ranked players. In 3 years Martin will be gone and MU goes back to being a bottom feeder in the SEC.
If Coach Self decides to retire tomorrow, no question that Few would be a candidate; in 5-10 years? Who knows. Just curious, who would you consider to replace Coach Self, now? in 5-10 years?
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@JayHawkFanToo I think I’m taking the legacy issue just right, tyvm. My choice right now would be Brad Stevens.
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@KUSTEVE North Carolina wanted Roy Williams specifically because of his ties to North Carolina. Bill Self was KU’s top choice to replace Roy Williams because of his previous ties to KU.
Yes, they were successful elsewhere, but those previous ties to UNC and KU are the primary reason Roy is at UNC and Self is at KU today.
Sounds like they were legacy hires to me.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 I’m glad you brought Roy’s legacy hiring because it jogs my memory: do you remember who Roy replaced at UNC? That’s right…the legacy hire a.k.a. Matt Doherty. Oh my goodness, what a great hire that was. I think you are begging the question a bit with the “Self was a KU guy” before he was actually a KU guy. He served as an assistant for 1 year- I think he was a Larry Brown guy before he was a KU guy, because he spent the next 7 years coaching at his alma mater. A connection to KU? Absolutely. A KU legacy hire? No way. I’ll give you an A for effort, though …lol.
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@KUSTEVE I think that KU fans are obsessed with Legacy hires because of Roy… “If we hire one of our own they will never leave!”
I personally think Haase will be too old though by the time Self retires. We hired Self at the ripe age of 41 and he finished his first season at age 42. Haase is already 43. Serious candidates will be guys that are currently in their mid 30’s most likely. Because KU doesn’t hire coaches that last just 10 years. We try to hire guys for 15-20+ years. This is supposed to be a coaches last stop.
By that logic, Aaron Miles would be the most likely Legacy hire. I think they are setting up FGCU to be Miles first HC Job. Dooley is going to get a better job one of these years and leave the program to Miles. And at that point, it is up to Aaron to become a top tier head coach.
Personally, I like Matt Lottich from Valpo as a guy to keep an eye on. He learned under the Drews (gross , I know) but did tie for 1st in the conference in his first season. He is also from Chicago, which is our best Pipeline for players. And, being in Indiana he knows how to recruit the Midwest. He played at Stanford, so I’m assuming he is no dummy. And, it sounds weird, but he has the look of a guy that can recruit. He’s a handsome fella… But anyways, just a guy to keep tabs on. The last two Drew’s to coach at Valpo have done pretty well…
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I don’t think I know where to start on this one.
First… I will be blown away in shock and sadness if we lose Bill within less than 10 years.
Imagine what Bill is yet to accomplish at Kansas but is aligning the stars to happen between now and his departure? I am hopeful we can score at least 2 National Championships between now and then. But I also put equal desire to keep our conference streak alive.
I do believe people are starting to realize what a big deal that conference streak is. It has given us a definite spot in the top 4 elite teams, without question.
Why would Bill leave a situation where he is just now actually starting to reap the benefits? His HOFr status will just start to kick in now, giving him one more of the pieces he needed all along.
If Bill can win a couple of NCs and explode Wooden’s conference streak by like a decade… and keep our NCAA berth streak alive… and his overall winning dominance… who will be seen as a better coach in college basketball? Coach K and Roy are in their sunset years. And when it is all said and done, isn’t it possible Bill could be viewed as the all-time greatest coach in college basketball? I realize that sounds like pie in the sky… but put it all together and if the pieces fall in place. His dominance will be well-recognized and he will have plenty to show even more than the greats that are up there now.
That is what Bill has on the line at Kansas. And for him to leave… what on God’s earth could he gain by leaving? Just to become another “Larry Brown?” Nothing against the great Larry Brown, but the real achievements happen at one school. Wooden/UCLA, K/Duke, Roy/UNC, Knight/Indiana… No one adds much value into Roy’s work at KU, or Knight’s work at TT.
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@KUSTEVE When you claim a position on an issue and only mention the failures to justify your stance, I will call you out every single time because of the flawed nature of the argument.
No program is above a legacy hire.
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The truth of it is that KU’s next coach may not be coaching at this moment. Bill Self turns 55 in December, so he could reasonably coach 10 or even 15 more years. Let’s split the difference and call it 12 more years with Self.
Bill Self, as @Kcmatt7 points out, was 41 when he was hired at KU. Roy Williams was 38 when he took the KU job. Larry Brown was 43 when he took the KU job. Ted Owens was just 36.
That’s KU’s last four coaches and none were over the age of 43 when they took the job. If Bill Self coaches at KU for another dozen or so years, that means KU’s next coach is likely in his early 30’s or even mid to late 20’s. If that’s the case, chances are we don’t actually know who will be KU’s next coach because they probably aren’t even a coach yet.
Aaron Miles will be 46 in 12 years. Haase will be in his 50s. Same with Vaughn and Hoiberg. Donovan, Few and others will be in their 60s by then. Simply put, unless Self retires sooner than most anyone expects, every single person mentioned so far on this board is already too old to be the next KU coach. We would be better off betting on someone like Russell Robinson (turned 31 in January) or someone younger than that like Niko Roberts (Norm’s son), Travis Releford, or Kevin Young.
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Lets just go double legacy and hire Tyler Self as the next coach in 20 yrs when Bill retires with his 10th NC.
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It has to be a UNC assistant without head coaching experience, willing to split the AirJordan/Nike conveyor 50/50 by recruiting west of the Mississippi, and he has to institute easy classes. He also has to promise to stay 15 years, then take the UNC job.
That’s not too much to ask, is it?
Otherwise I don’t care.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 Call me out? After I called you out over you twisting around Bill’s history? That was your ego talking. You haven’t convinced me or persuaded me of anything, and I will continue to “call you out” when you make dubious claims. For some reason you seem to think it is a real bad idea to be cautious who we turn the reins of the best college bb program in America. I happen to want the very best coach for our team, regardless of whether they have former connections to the program or not. If you want to “call me out” over that, by all means, knock yourself out.
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Hey… you never know!
At least Tyler can go directly towards a coaching career now and not mess with trying to still play the game himself.
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Tyler is in grad school and I wonder if he becomes a grad. assistant until he finishes his degree and then moves on. Sounds like the logical path.
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Predicting the next KU head coach is tougher than trying to predict when enough regime change will be enough.
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I’d say BIFM is the man.
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@Hawk69 he’d be great to have on staff!
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I think Jacque Vaughn will get a long look and might be the pick.
I hope we don’t find out for a long time.
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Oh, and if I need to pick someone who will be under 50 in 10 years, I would focus on Tarik Black, Connor Teahan, Cole Aldrich, Frank Mason.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 What coach did Haase play for? Where did Haase do his assistant coaching? He’s another UNC liability and doubt he has much of an obligation to KU. I think his UNC legacy is stronger than his KU time. Love him as a player, but as a coach? I think I’ll pass. But what coach in his position passes on a blueblood program and your alma mater? Maybe it’s a little different. Maybe Haase could do what Roy failed to do…bring at least 1 NC to KU.
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@truehawk93 I be willing to bet a big amount Roy would be long gone bye the time Haase ended up here and with it most of his ties to UNC. I think I’ll worry about the subject more when it comes to light friends.
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Teahan has been out of basketball since he left KU; he works as a stock broker in KC and has not shown any interest in coaching.
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@truehawk93 Based on Haase’s comments when Stanford came into town last season, I think Haase still bleeds Crimson and Blue and would take the KU job in a heartbeat if he’s ever offered the job, even if he’s coaching at UNC at the time.
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@JayHawkFanToo Yep. Seems like a long shot… but never know. He has the right attributes on paper…
