VICK GONE for Good this time???
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It’s a family issue
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I didn’t call it. I wouldn’t call it, because I didn’t think Bill was stonecold enough to kick his to the curb. I definitely believed it was the best thing for the team’s success. Someone else did call it though. @kjayhawks ?
I don’t know if he’s gone gone. But I’m guessing Bill told him where he might expect to be in the rotation after that loss, and Vick didn’t want pollen allergies enflamed by an overdose of pine. Maybe a leave does him some good. I might hold onto a small hope that he can find balance again after a leave, as opposed to trying to play through being a knucklehead.
If it is truly a family issue, I A. feel bad for being so mad at a 20-something kid who is dealing with crap and B. have maybe even more than a small hope that he can come back focused.
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Edited my post to reflect yours
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https://twitter.com/GaryBedore/status/1093683178227859457
Comment from LALA @BeddieKU23
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BShark said:
https://twitter.com/GaryBedore/status/1093683178227859457
Comment from LALA @BeddieKU23
Yeah that does sound like LaLa laying some smoke down to protect Lagerald. In this case, it seems like a wise move.
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I thought self said it doesn’t look like Marcus could play sat
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What a dumpster fire
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A couple of weeks?
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This season is just a nightmare you can’t wake up from.
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@BShark If Vick is going to continue the “bad” ways…no. But the whole scenario of his actions and now suspension…yes I does. Should have responded to your comment about replacing Vick with Chuck. Although…maybe if Charlie gets a shot to play more off the ball he can show that shooting prowess that we’ve only seen brief glimpses of.
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Crimsonorblue22 said:
I thought self said it doesn’t look like Marcus could play sat
It is likely he will be out for Saturday game
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@JAYHAWKFAN214 If it truly is a family issue…I feel bad for the kid.
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Well, I called this unfortunately. I think that may have diminished any hope of a B12 title or run in March. The distractions for this team seem to grow almost daily. Lets not harp on Vick until we know more. He could’ve had a death in the family or something along those lines.
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Hawk8086 said:
@BShark If Vick is going to continue the “bad” ways…no. But the whole scenario of his actions and now suspension…yes I does. Should have responded to your comment about replacing Vick with Chuck. Although…maybe if Charlie gets a shot to play more off the ball he can show that shooting prowess that we’ve only seen brief glimpses of.
In their current states, Moore is a better basketball player than Charlie right now. The KSU loss was about 70% on Vick 30% on Grimes in my book. Tempted to go higher on Vick too, he missed simple defensive assignments and his head just wasn’t in the game at all. He is simply not a good player when his head isn’t right.
Charlie Moore made more of an effort defensively and was more effective than Vick against KSU. That says it all.
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Self needs to do some serious reflection after this season. It all finally caught up to him in one giant shit storm. You just can’t take risky kids with character issues. And those that have them when they get here need to get gone immediately.
Time to start a new recruiting approach and at least give the program a facelift. This was the straw that broke the camels back for me. I always thought he basically had everything under control. This season is proof that he has just been putting bandaids on the leak. Recruit high character kids, and the results will be the results. I can live with that.
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If it’s a legit personal issue, then hopefully Vick gets through whatever that issue is.
If it’s a typical Bill Self kicking a kid off the team without throwing the kid under the bus type deal, then hopefully Vick’s influence on this team will disappear and KU can finish the year strong and make a decent showing in the tournament.
I hate that KU needs so much help down the stretch, but we definitely need Baylor to win on Saturday along with TCU disrupting Hilton Magic.
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I just keep laughing at myself for thinking this team would be a legit NC contender at the beginning of the season. Half the team was like “hold my beer” lol.
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The non-suiting up players squad keeps getting better.
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So, seriously, time to start thinking about pulling Elliot’s redshirt?
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So do we have tryouts for football players??
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Hawk8086 said:
@BShark If Vick is going to continue the “bad” ways…no. But the whole scenario of his actions and now suspension…yes I does. Should have responded to your comment about replacing Vick with Chuck. Although…maybe if Charlie gets a shot to play more off the ball he can show that shooting prowess that we’ve only seen brief glimpses of.
good thought!
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Why not I’m sure he can average 8 and 7 too
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approxinfinity said:
Hawk8086 said:
@BShark If Vick is going to continue the “bad” ways…no. But the whole scenario of his actions and now suspension…yes I does. Should have responded to your comment about replacing Vick with Chuck. Although…maybe if Charlie gets a shot to play more off the ball he can show that shooting prowess that we’ve only seen brief glimpses of.
good thought!
To further this line of thinking, maybe you can pull Dotson off of ball too. Grimes at point, Dotson and Chuck off ball.
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Kcmatt7 said:
Self needs to do some serious reflection after this season. It all finally caught up to him in one giant shit storm. You just can’t take risky kids with character issues. And those that have them when they get here need to get gone immediately.
Time to start a new recruiting approach and at least give the program a facelift. This was the straw that broke the camels back for me. I always thought he basically had everything under control. This season is proof that he has just been putting bandaids on the leak. Recruit high character kids, and the results will be the results. I can live with that.
I agree with you, but I think last year’s class was a HUGE step in the right direction.
This is certainly an interesting topic so let’s look at the roster
Dotson - Zero issues here. Good talent, great character.
Grimes - Everyone missed here, but I think he can be productive and part of the core of a winning team if he sticks it out. Doesn’t seem like a bad kid just FR struggles.
McCormack - By all accounts high character. Needs the game to slow down for him, just not ready yet. A typical #75-100 type recruit that got bumped up in a weak class.
Agbaji - Excellent character, fast learner. Good basketball player all around.
Garrett - Excellent character with one fatal flaw in his game which tbf is a big one.
Lightfoot - High character bench player.
Udoka - Great kid and effective player but injury prone.
Silvio - Honestly, great kid with a shitty handler. I would say it’s best to avoid “handlers” when possible. Obviously, Self was desperate at the time Silvio was acquired.
Moore - Forced transfer take after recruiting misses. Too short and just not a good fit for Self.
Dedric - Talented but definitely questionable character.
KJ - Had to take him to get Dedric…
Vick - Late take after recruiting misses. Then Self wanted to boot him but felt he couldn’t. Had he known how good Agbaji would be…
So, imo 7 great takes, 1otherwise good take with terrible timing and 4 meh takes. Thoughts?
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Kcmatt7 said:
So, seriously, time to start thinking about pulling Elliot’s redshirt?
Pretty sure it’s academic so no.
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Well it’s over for sure now guys, - -you thought we struggled before - - look the hell out. - -Really our only 3 pt threat - -now don’t come to me talking about an cancer. - - I realize that - -all I’m saying we are SO SCREWED. - -hope we realize we end up being a really low seed realistically were probably looking at a 8-9 seed - -as we are gonna really struggle finishing this season out - we looking at probably 4 more league losses for sure.
K- State at home - - -Texas Tech at Tech - -Maybe Baylor - - - - -Geez this season has been a diaster. - -We went from a very serious title contender to a very average team - – Doke OUT - - - Desousa - -NOPE – Garrett – OUT - – -now Vick Gone - -we went from a very deep talented team -depth at every position to very shallow NO DEPTH
We are in serious jeopardy - - of breaking our streak of consecutive weeks in the top 25 which we have the Nation’s longest -SOB what a screwed up season
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BShark said:
Vick was far and away the worst player in the KSU game. I didn’t think this would happen but I think it’s a good move.
IT’S CHUCK TIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIME.
Are you FRICKEN NUTS ? – have you just totally lost your mind ?
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“We need him here for a couple weeks,” La La Vick told The Star. “I need him. There’s a lot going on. It’ll work out.” Only statement from Lala or Vick himself
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Weird
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Well this should force the end of the 4 guard lineup experiment.
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@BeddieKU23 It wasn’t working anyway
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jayballer73 said:
BShark said:
Vick was far and away the worst player in the KSU game. I didn’t think this would happen but I think it’s a good move.
IT’S CHUCK TIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIME.
Are you FRICKEN NUTS ? – have you just totally lost your mind ?
Are you aware how bad Vick was against KSU? That loss was almost on him exclusively. When Vick was not playing, KU was whipping KSU in those stretches.
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BeddieKU23 said:
Well this should force the end of the 4 guard lineup experiment.
You’d think so with 4 guards, 3 bigs and…w/e position KJ is.
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So, ladies and gents. This is the team we would have had all year if Vick, Doke and Silvio had all been picked up by the league. Except we’d have at least 5 more losses.
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Currently eligible and healthy from the 2015 and 2016 recruiting classes: Mitch Lightfoot.
To your earlier point @Kcmatt7
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BShark said:
My guess is Vick is done at KU.
Ya think? – common sense would tell you that - -9 regular season games to go. - -I would be willing to bet he said screw this- - -which is just total immaturity on his part- -what a dumpster fire this is
Anyone wanting to guess what our regular season record ends up? - - Anyone want to wager their house about us getting out of the 1st round in the NCAA ?
This has been brought up in another thread here - -who thinks Bill might have lost this team? - - - Grimes - - - Vick -cancer’s ?
This just adds to the possibility that YES this very well just might be Coach Self’s last year with all that has happened this year - -on top of the possibility of more penalities that might be coming from the NCAA - - ban from post season? - -Stripped of Victories ? - - -Vacating the final 4 ? - -The FBI Trial ? - -the Connection with Coach and the Spurs - - - -Pops looking at retiring soon ? - - -Rumor has been said that Self had said that the Spurs would be the ONE team he would be interested in. – Get that list with names ready boys.
This year could be the year Coach says F - - - this - -he Gonna say – Cindy - - let’s loadem up - -holy crap what a cluster F - - - don’t laugh - -it could easily happen
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Self might go, but it won’t be to the NBA…
See also: Bob Stoops
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BeddieKU23 said:
No Vick to get more Charlie. Not sure we won on that
Exactly - - thank you - - and NO that is NOT a win for sure - - -this has been a crap year for Sports for sure - - Football sucked - - -Again - - - Basketball is going down the tubes - -QUICK - - Volleyball was sad - -Baseball psssssst - -do we have badminton here ? lmao
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nuleafjhawk said:
We’re the laughingstock of the Big 12. It’s going to be so funny when we win number 15 in a few weeks.
psssst HEY can you give me some of the shit you been smokin ? - -that must be some REALLY good shit roflmao. - In all seriousness you might wanna put the pipe down and slowly back away -come on Get real
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BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
No Vick to get more Charlie. Not sure we won on that
So, the healthy and eligible roster right now
Dotson, Grimes, Agbaji, Moore, Lawson, Lawson, Mitch, McCormack
We are foul trouble away from TEAHAN TIME.
Dam was good double now for sure we pulled the Re Shirt -just think about that lol
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BeddieKU23 said:
BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
No Vick to get more Charlie. Not sure we won on that
So, the healthy and eligible roster right now
Dotson, Grimes, Agbaji, Moore, Lawson, Lawson, Mitch, McCormack
We are foul trouble away from TEAHAN TIME.
I wish I was surprised but the last few years have numbed away being pissed off about not having enough players or depth. It’s a circus
I didn’t get to see the Circus this year when it came to town – I’ll have to check it out Saturday lol
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BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
No Vick to get more Charlie. Not sure we won on that
So, the healthy and eligible roster right now
Dotson, Grimes, Agbaji, Moore, Lawson, Lawson, Mitch, McCormack
We are foul trouble away from TEAHAN TIME.
I wish I was surprised but the last few years have numbed away being pissed off about not having enough players or depth. It’s a circus
Well to be fair it’s hard to account for two injuries. Even in this crap scenario if Garrett and Doke were just healthy there would be more than enough depth.
So for now, Self pretty much has to play all 8 guys. We will get to see if Dave and KJ can adapt.
In the mean time…I heard KU is recruiting this player…
My Kingdom - - My Kingdom - we can always say we got him from a Nike School lol
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@jayballer73 We will see how this all shakes out. I still think Self should have stuck to his guns and had Vick take the last train out of town last summer. But he missed on Romeo and Cremo so he couldn’t resist taking Vick back. I strongly believe Vick has been a bad influence on the young players. We will find out A LOT over the next 5 games. Just this board rat’s opinion.
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BShark said:
jayballer73 said:
BShark said:
Vick was far and away the worst player in the KSU game. I didn’t think this would happen but I think it’s a good move.
IT’S CHUCK TIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIME.
Are you FRICKEN NUTS ? – have you just totally lost your mind ?
Are you aware how bad Vick was against KSU? That loss was almost on him exclusively. When Vick was not playing, KU was whipping KSU in those stretches.
nope NOT at all - - Charlie has been a night mare ALL YEAR - -soon as his little feet hits the floor it turns into turnover city trying to drive through like one on three - -chucks up some kind of a bullshit wing and prayer - - just Ugly - - real ugly - -oh I’m sure he will play , have no option - don’t really think it is gonna matter who we try playing now - - it’s kind of funny that I actually find myself looking towards KU spring football - -and their upcoming season BUT I am dam. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@BShark Can you prove you thought Self should have stuck to his guns when Vick came back? Easy to say now? I know a lot of us were pretty pleased when he came back. He had a pretty strong season last year. If you can prove it I’ll leave you alone
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@wissox I went digging. I found arguments with jb about his position. I won’t link any of that silliness…
Then there is this where I was pretty clear about not wanting Vick back: https://kubuckets.com/topic/7578/heres-your-mystery-recruit-legerald-vick-lol/29
I was slightly off on KJ…well kinda… I don’t think KJ has been terrible, he just doesn’t get minutes.
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BShark said:
@jayballer73 We will see how this all shakes out. I still think Self should have stuck to his guns and had Vick take the last train out of town last summer. But he missed on Romeo and Cremo so he couldn’t resist taking Vick back. I strongly believe Vick has been a bad influence on the young players. We will find out A LOT over the next 5 games. Just this board rat’s opinion.
I agree with the bad influence part. This team definitely took on the identity of a leader and that leader just happened to be Vick. This team definitely has had his personality for most of the season so now I’m curious to see who steps up or if this team takes on someone else’s personality.
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And the train continues to derail… Interesting about Vick. Pure speculation, but I wonder if he went off his meds and mom wants him to come home to get him back on track. Who knows, maybe it really is a family emergency. He is a head case, but we could use his shooting. Then again, when he was on the bench the other day, we did have a good run. He’s no leader, but maybe the problem is we have no other leaders to keep him in line.
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P.S.: LOVE the mustache mystery man! Hi-larious.
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I think I am glad I was able to deal with all the great traumas in my life–my failures, my decades of depression, my disappointments, and my inability to meet the expectations of others–out of the public eye. With that perspective, a few impressions:
I look at Grimes, and it is obvious he is clueless about how to be that fluid 1st rounder, and how to fix things when the game is going too fast. I see a guy who would have benefitted from expecting to develop more gradually, but modern cbb doesn’t allow that anymore.
I look at Dedrick, who has put up AA stats this year despite inconsistent passing to him and with no help in the post where he has been forced to play as the only big, and I see people questioning his effort? or his character? And I think, wow, has he ever complained? Is his stoic expression more important to people than his single-handedly keeping us as competitive as we have been?
I look at Mitch and wish he had been allowed to play the small forward position, and I marvel at his ability to stay enthusiastic. Despite having to come in as a 1.5 ppg undersized player expected to turn it around in the middle when everyone is floundering.
I look at Charlie Moore, and the only flaw I see is that he tries too hard, goes too fast, and tries to change every game with boneheaded “hero” shot selection. His passes would have led to twice as many assists but for the team’s crappy shooting.
And Vick. I look at Vick, and like everyone I wonder what is going on. If it is a mental issue, it is largely beyond both his control and his own understanding. If it is emotional distraction from outside, I can only hope he can learn to deal with it–maybe getting out of the glare will help. I see someone whose face alternates reflecting either a wild fierceness or a bizarre disconnect to the game around him. I see someone whose talent belies the ropes holding him back. And I wonder how heavy it may be for him, knowing at times he is the savior of the team and at other times the anchor dragging the team down.
Finally, I see fans dealing with seeing a team of lofty expectations appearing to dismantle as we watch. Disappointment, anger, cynicism, hopelessness and helplessness all combining to just sap the joy out of us.
I know 2 things, going way back to my very first post a couple or three years ago: those kids are out there trying so freaking hard, and they are vastly more crushed than we are when they lose. So, I am going to do what I can to remind myself that there is always a lot of fun watching KU, and that I can be both disappointed and appreciative for the team, and that if this year is a bust I guess reality had to come sometime. Almost a decade and a half of championship ball (conference AND an NC) is something no other fanbase has ever had. I refuse to let the possibility of it ending get in the way of my unbridled pride in the kids who have made it possible. I hope I never join KU’s enemies by thinking of ANY KU team as losers.
