KU # 1 in pre seasons rankings for upcoming yr. Justified?



  • Just read an article talking about KU being # 1 for the upcoming year. You think this is a justified ranking? - -To me it doesn’t bother me much either way. - -I’m not sure exactly what all they basing this on - -are they basing this on the possible assumption that Doke comes back? - - are they basing this on the train of Thought De souse will be Eligible? - -or both of these things?

    To me I IF these guys don’t return , I’m not so sure we are a justified # 1. - I mean true we are going to be good - - -very good - - - very good I mean we still have Dedric which will contend for Big 12 player of the year - We Have McCormack -We have KJ - - We still have Mitch for quality backup then there is Marcus - – and then what I feel is loaded in the backcourt with depth – one of those is Grimes whom I feel will be or is an absolute stud. We have Devon which I feel some STILL under estimate - I think this kid is going to prove himself even more to some here - he loves to attack the rim and is really quick - - Then you ad in the other on the roster Charlie – -and Cunliffe will probably see a little more time - were gonna be deep - just not sure without Doke and or DeSousa if we are a # 1 team in the ln the land at this point.

    Actually who cares? at this point it’s just bragging rights , actually all through the season is pretty much for fans to thump their chests talk smack , it’s the END of the season when we really should want that # 1 ranking obtain that AFTER the National title game other then that ehhhh. - - As I have mentioned before if you were to ask the players - -the Coaches - -what is the number 1 goal for a team and Coaches of a season - -what would make their season complete. - Being ranked # 1 throughout the season OR being THAT National # 1 TEAM after the title game. - You ask any team - any Coach what their goal is? - -Win the Title - -not so much being ranked # 1 during the year - -if they were to say that -some would say ya? - well you go ahead - you take your # 1 ranking through the season - -us? - -we will take the hardware.

    But it makes for good conversation - Like I said if we are # 1 it’s cool - -if not - -it’s fine too - I know this we will for sure be top 5 I’m good with that. anyways these people have given us the # 1 preseason ranking : ESPN.com - – -CBS Sports- - - USA Today - - -Sporting News - - - Sports Illustrated - - -& NBC Sports - -like I said I wonder what they are basing their thoughts on?



  • Just doke back and I think it is fine. There will be growing pains though with only one returning guard.



  • BShark said:

    Just doke back and I think it is fine. There will be growing pains though with only one returning guard.

    ya gonna be young in the back court - going to be interesting, with WV getting Konate back - -we sure need Doke back



  • I think it shows a huge amount of respect for KU. To lose 4, potentially all 5, starters and still be considered for the #1 ranking is a huge show of respect for the transfers KU has, for the recruits Self has brought in, and for Self himself.



  • @Texas-Hawk-10 Well Doke now has what 4 days to make a decision? - -He has till the 30th right?



  • No we are not close to the #1 team currently. It’s nice to see us being talked about highly after losing at least 4 starters. Let’s us know just how good Dedric really is



  • @BeddieKU23

    Who would you say is the pre-season #1 team? Duke and UK will have talented but very inexperienced teams, UNC lost key players and it will take time to see how the replacements work and Villanova is still a question mark depending on who returns.

    KU is losing 4 starters but is replacing them with 3 5-star equivalent experienced transfers, 3 McDonald’s All-Americans and a couple of others with good potential in addition to quality returning players, Doke (???), Silvio, Mitch, Garret and Cunliffe, that are ready to start contributing. Looks like a very solid lineup that anyone would have in the conversation for top team.





  • @BShark

    Grimes’ outside shot looks like it has improved even more. The stroke has gotten even more consistent. If Dotson can provide a little bit of shooting, KU shouldn’t have an issue spacing the floor.



  • @justanotherfan As long as Garrett can drag his number up to about 32% I think KU should be fine.



  • @BShark

    I understand Garret has been working hard on his outside shooting and I would not be surprised to see him shoot on the mid to upper 30s which would be a nice bonus.



  • @JayHawkFanToo Mid to upper 30s? Starting the weekend early?



  • Yeah I don’t think he can get much higher than 33% next year. Something like 34-35 would be best case scenario.



  • @jayballer73

    No.

    It has no > 39% 3pt shooters.

    Hypothesis: This ranking might enable bet balancing and distract from the small group of NIKE-EST teams pre-selected for the winner of the Carney to emerge from with some anomalous mix of MUA; I.e., 9-10 OADs, or 6 > 39% 3pt shooters, etc.



  • HighEliteMajor said:

    @JayHawkFanToo Mid to upper 30s? Starting the weekend early?

    Low 30s would be 30-33, mid 30s would be 34-36 and upper 30s would be 37-39, right? so the mid point would be 36-37 add a +/- 1 and we are at 35% to 38% which I thinks is very achievable. We should review these numbers around the end of the year and see if how they shape up. I will guess that whichever one of us is correct will certainly bring it up. :smile:



  • JayHawkFanToo said:

    @BShark

    I understand Garret has been working hard on his outside shooting and I would not be surprised to see him shoot on the mid to upper 30s which would be a nice bonus.

    was listening to the podcast off the shiver and I think they said that his AAu guy or not for sure who put was having Garrett shooting 1000 jumpers a day and talking about how much repetition that would make for from now till the start of practices ought to make improvement



  • From what I’ve seen on Grimes, he’s easily one of the best crossover dribble-capable players to come out of high school in ages! What that means for us is he’s a guy that can create offense regardless of the situation. Bring on that nasty Nova defense! Let Grimes rip it apart and either finish at the rim or stack his assist totals!

    Everything is pointing for us to collect a lot of points from within the trey line. So we better learn how to defend the trey better!



  • There are a lot of unknowns going into next season. Our coaching staff has done a good job getting guys to improve their 3 point shooting. Mason improved from a .327 to a .429 between freshman and sophomore year. Selden improved from a .328 to a .365 that same summer. Svi went from a .288 to a .402 between his 1st and 2nd year. One of our incoming freshmen could also have a great 3 point shooting year? Grahams freshman year he shot a .425 from 3 point land. Jackson shot .378 his freshman year too. Who is to say that Grimes and Dotson can not be similar to Graham and Jackson? If Garrett is putting up 1000 shots a day his numbers will improve. From everything I have read most of our bigs can stretch the floor out to the 3pt line too. I am optimistic that our squad will be deadly at all 5 positions. From what I have heard from the guys everyone is improving and there has been no drop off in talent just an increase in depth so this team is primed and ready for another final 4 trip. I also heard that they could go with 4 small guys and a big but it would be unfair given the talent and depth in the frontcourt so don’t expect to see it unless another team is running similar offense.



  • @Statmachine think of the fouls we have to give!



  • Statmachine said:

    There are a lot of unknowns going into next season. Our coaching staff has done a good job getting guys to improve their 3 point shooting. Mason improved from a .327 to a .429 between freshman and sophomore year. Selden improved from a .328 to a .365 that same summer. Svi went from a .288 to a .402 between his 1st and 2nd year. One of our incoming freshmen could also have a great 3 point shooting year? Grahams freshman year he shot a .425 from 3 point land. Jackson shot .378 his freshman year too. Who is to say that Grimes and Dotson can not be similar to Graham and Jackson? If Garrett is putting up 1000 shots a day his numbers will improve. From everything I have read most of our bigs can stretch the floor out to the 3pt line too. I am optimistic that our squad will be deadly at all 5 positions. From what I have heard from the guys everyone is improving and there has been no drop off in talent just an increase in depth so this team is primed and ready for another final 4 trip. I also heard that they could go with 4 small guys and a big but it would be unfair given the talent and depth in the frontcourt so don’t expect to see it unless another team is running similar offense.

    Agree this staff does a great job with kids and improving their shot.

    As for bigs stretching the floor Mitch and Dedric are guys you don’t mind shooting threes. McCormack from what I have heard has a decent midrange game but not out to the 3 line yet. Similar for SDS IF he plays. Doke of course is inside only.



  • @BShark Depends on which Dedric is shooting those 3’s. Freshman year Dedric was solid for a big man at 35%, it if he’s shooting it like he did his sophomore year at 27%, that’s going to cost KU games and I don’t want him venturing out there at all.



  • @Texas-Hawk-10 I trust that hopefully Self has tightened up his shot selection. Big part of it imo. Don’t want him taking many guarded threes, but I have no issue with open looks.



  • @Texas-Hawk-10 neither will his team mates



  • Dedric can shoot. He will get some better shots than he did at Memphis as a sophomore largely because he will have other guys (Doke inside, Grimes and Dotson on the perimeter) that will be drawing a lot of defensive attention. That will help him get better looks, so his percentage will probably land closer to the 35% he had as a freshman.

    KU will have a lot of guys able to shoot in the mid 30’s, which will make for an okay shooting team, especially since Doke will keep that 2pt % high, and Dotson and Dedric will be able to help guys get easy shots inside the arc as well.



  • Kentucky got one of those eligible now grad transfers from Stanford. He’s an all Pac12 performer. ESPN now has Kentucky in their 1st spot in their early top 25.



  • If Vick joins KU we will leapfrog UK again.



  • Statmachine said:

    If Vick joins KU we will leapfrog UK again.

    I disagree. I think he could make KU worse.



  • @BShark

    Worst case he does not play much or he is dismissed so there is little downside but he could also go on to have a good or even great season and contribute heavily. Considerably more potential upside than downside.



  • @JayHawkFanToo Worst case is that he upsets matters in the locker room, becomes a distraction, has an incident – all in the bubble of reasonable possibilities even if Self/Vick reach some agreement. That might be @BShark point in part. That said, I think if an agreement is reached, it is a lesser possibility. It’s literally Vick begging to come back.

    To your point, though, on the court we might see a guy who sees that he has a second chance and becomes a star. Some were thinking that heading into last season … the “star” part. He does have that talent. So I would agree that there is considerable upside here on the court. And we need three point shooting.

    If Self declines, we thus know there is a very good reason.



  • @HighEliteMajor

    Agreed. I posted before that if Vick comes back he will be on a very short leash and with zero tolerance. Since his announcement about testing the NBA he has gotten a harsh lesson on reality and the real world and he probably knows that one more year at KU is the best opportunity for him not only basketball wise but hopefully earning a degree to fall back on. Hopefully he makes the best of it



  • In my opinion, he knew he was never going to be picked up this year. More to the story…



  • @BShark I think it could be a sh** or get off the pot experience. I see him best case as the 4 or 5 guard. With the way that Marcus Garrett’s jump shot looked in the games over the past few weeks, I don’t want to shut the door as much as I did a few weeks back. I think Vick would be on a different playing field if he does come back- instead of being gifted with minutes like he was last year, it would be a dogfight for every minute he gets. Maybe coming back could give him the humility to be a better team player. Maybe not.



  • If Vick wants to be a pro, he needs to go the G-League route because that will prepare him for the NBA better than another year in Lawrence. His NBA role (3 and D wing) is going to be somewhat different than the role he might play at KU. If his goal is to play pro ball, he needs to get used to being a role playing 3 and D wing, likely off the bench. He needs to be immersed in the video room with understanding the details of schemes and plays. He has to learn to diagnose actions based on only one key.

    He’s not going to get that at KU because the schemes and plays aren’t going to be complex enough. The designs aren’t going to include the misdirection he will see at the pro level.

    If he wants another shot at a national title, he should come back, because his skillset could push this particular team over the top.

    It’s a question of what he wants to do.



  • It was said he needed to help earn money for his family🤷‍♀️



  • Crimsonorblue22 said:

    It was said he needed to help earn money for his family🤷‍♀️

    He has a kid that his mom currently pays for.

    BTW fair points everyone. I just think KU has a ton of options already and he could muddy the waters. Also coming back but not starting could cause issues.



  • All Knucklehead Team for KU Under Self: G Tharpe G Vick G Greene F Bragg F Preston. Off the bench, second teamers based on level of issues, G Taylor G Adams, G Morningstar, F Ma. Morris, F Jackson.



  • HighEliteMajor said:

    All Knucklehead Team for KU Under Self: G Tharpe G Vick G Greene F Bragg F Preston. Off the bench, second teamers based on level of issues, G Taylor G Adams, G Morningstar, F Ma. Morris, F Jackson.

    Adams is a first teamer hahaha. This could honestly be its own thread…



  • @HighEliteMajor lolol so good.



  • @HighEliteMajor It’s interesting because the other day I had similar thoughts and was going to create a thread like it. Since I was in a negative mood at the time I also thought who might make our most disappointing team. Some of those names might crossover to the all knucklehead team, but some were just disappointing. Brannen Greene makes both lists, but Cheick makes just the disappointing list in my view.



  • @HighEliteMajor

    Alexander/mom should warrant at least an honorable mention. :smile:



  • Has anyone mentioned that Self getting experience playing more guys with a deeper roster for u18 might translate to playing 10 guys for Kansas this year? Anyone have a link to see total stats for the u18? Curious what the usage/minutes looked like.





  • @JayHawkFanToo thanks man.





  • The 12th man off the bench on the U18 team got 9.8 minutes per game. Self did a great job of getting all 12 guys minutes of playing time.



  • A little different situation. All the players in the USA U18 team are extremely good and top players and could be starters, they were together for a short time and they all had an expectation of playing time; no role players present. At KU, some players know they are either role players or long term projects and playing time expectations are lower.

    Having said that, I believe Coach Self did a fantastic job getting the U18 players to play as a team, sharing time and keeping egos in check.



  • @JayHawkFanToo I wouldn’t be surprised seeing a rotation that deep, based upon talent, if Self is open minded to it. Mitch, McCormack, and Agbaji are probably our 10/11/12 guys.



  • @approxinfinity

    I would be surprised if Agjabi does not red shirt; he has indicated he is open to it.



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