NCAA Corruption Investigation - Kansas Identified?
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Sean Miller says he expects to be vindicated? OK.
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Ayton will play
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BeddieKU23 said:
Ayton will play
Joke
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Taking a McDonald All American top prospects does not strike me as having an air of desperation. I am sure glad KU did not take Ayton considering what is being reported.
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How about this scenario. Agent goes to his boss and says…I just met with Mrs. Jackson and gave her $2,600 in cash, of course there is no record of our meeting or the payment because the NCAA frowns on that so, here is my expense report and the master spreadsheet has been updated. All the while Mrs. Jackson has been at home, never met the agent and has no idea who he is. Has the spreadsheet not been made public none is the wiser. Maybe what has been uncovered is a gigantic agency in-house scam
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@JayHawkFanToo because Ayton is playing today and Billy is in Bosnia? Lol.
Agree to disagree because I believe you don’t know much of the subject you’re trying to speak on.
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@JayHawkFanToo That was my exact thought. Dawkins is a slime. I wouldn’t put it past him to pad his expense account. Make up some names to hide the money you’re skimming.
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Consider the source.
Always!
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@KUSTEVE Thats my deal, at this point ether this paper is completely BS or a ton of schools are lying.
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Good old Tucky fans
https://kentucky.forums.rivals.com/threads/bigger-name-coach-on-tape.259092/
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@BShark So…it never occurred to them it might be their very own?
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@Hawk8086 Of course not.
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@Hawk8086 Cal is clean. He already has two vacated final fours and would never do anything to risk that again.
It’s like girls continually getting back with their ex that cheats on them. “He’s changed! He won’t do it again, he promised.”
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Not sure what to make of the Miles Bridges situation. How does an internal review and then eligibility clearance by the NCAA happen overnight on a weekend when the office is closed. Idk why but that just smells terrible.
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@cragarhawk I sure don’t want their tourney appearance last year vacated. BIFM vs Bridges deserves to stay in history!
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KU could have just as easily played Preston, but didn’t.
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BShark said:
KU could have just as easily played Preston, but didn’t.
Scruples. I like it.
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Every coach in the Country with an available scholarship…or without one, would have taken Preston in a NewYork minute; he is playing in Eastern Europe because of potential violations, which are yet to be determined, and not because lack of talent. As I posted, there were zero red flags on Preston other than academic. When Arizona has to vacate all the wins when Ayton played, it will look like a blessing in disguise.
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So I’m watching Sparty play my Badgers today and of course Bridges is out there. He gets 10 points, 8 boards, and I’m trying to figure out why he is playing. I asked the same thing with Ayton last night.
So of course I start thinking of our own team. We had a young man we kept out and ultimately the NCAA doesn’t clear to play. Assuming they had found something it was the right decision of course. But I’m thinking why are these schools playing these dudes? Are they figuring they’re already caught so they might as well enjoy the ride since it’s all going to fall apart when the other shoe drops and puts them on probation?
I’m proud of KU for doing things the right way, even if there is some dirt on us through this latest crap. I’m pretty upset though watching those guys play. Not sure if Duke’s cheater was kept out or any of the others who are active players. But they shouldn’t. It seems like such a no brainer. Why are these guys still playing basketball?
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@wissox so from what I understand it’s the FBI that wiretapped him and released the findings. The NCAA has no actual proof that Ayton or Bridges received the money. The decision to sit Miller was made by the school administration and not the NCAA. If this all came to light last year i do wonder however if Self would have sat Josh. Would like to hear everyone’s take on that.
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@SkinnyKansasDude I understand your point but the FBI 's word holds no weight with the NCAA? This is the FBI, they probably laugh at the NCAA’s investigations. T
100,000$ and the guy plays. I don’t care if it’s the kid selling happy meals saying he heard it. That’s a wad of cash and I can’t believe that he’s playing. Of course maybe they know their goose is cooked so they’ll play him as a sort of ‘why the heck not, we’ve got nothing to lose’.
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Texas sidelined Eric Davis Jr.
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Hmm, well from reading on some other sites. Talk is more news possibly coming before Thursday. - Talk is Michigan State & Texas is on deck.
Lot of talk that another big name - - - bigger then Miller was caught on wiretap conversation - and quite possibly Izzo.
Then talk about Texas and Bamba. - talking about how the story from his brother back sometime ago reveiling as to what he said was that he had took money for Bamba’s recruitment to Texas, then family was saying he was just jealous. - Talk being said not so laughable now is it? - - Bamba? - - Money? - -Texas? - I’m not really sold solid on this stuff - but guess we will see if anything develops this week with these two schools - just passing what I read but I’m not say 100% for sure. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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San Diego St also sidelined Malik Pope.
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wissox said:
@SkinnyKansasDude I understand your point but the FBI 's word holds no weight with the NCAA? This is the FBI, they probably laugh at the NCAA’s investigations. T
100,000$ and the guy plays. I don’t care if it’s the kid selling happy meals saying he heard it. That’s a wad of cash and I can’t believe that he’s playing. Of course maybe they know their goose is cooked so they’ll play him as a sort of ‘why the heck not, we’ve got nothing to lose’.
I was baffled as well that Ayton played. If the Arizona administration held Miller out I’m not sure why Ayton wasn’t a pre-cautionary scratch as well. Other programs would have likely held him out, I have a good feeling Self would have or KU compliance would have to investigate the validity in the report.
In my opinion Arizona lost all of my respect allowing him to play. Maybe some don’t share that view. Maybe we should wait to see whether Ayton received the money before placing blame on him as well. There is however some good information out there that Ayton told Self he was committing to KU and then days later commits to Arizona out of the blue. And now we have a FBI wiretap explaining an alledged deal to pay Ayton or his family to influence him to play for Arizona.
Michigan St played Bridges, Kentucky played Knox, Alabama played Sexton, Duke played Carter. All of them allegedly had dinner with Dawkins. Sexton was the only one suspended by Alabama in the beginning of the season for being named in the initial FBI report. I’m surprised the other 3 were “cleared” by their programs so quickly. We shouldn’t have been surprised given these are star players and they had games to play/win the next day
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BeddieKU23 said:
San Diego St also sidelined Malik Pope.
Weird.
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BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
San Diego St also sidelined Malik Pope.
Weird.
Seemed like Texas & SD St were caught flat-footed with them being included and wanted to look into it is my guess.
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This is all just setting the table for the NBA to set up its own development system outside the NCAA. This report may be the push that moves the NCAA back to amateur status (i.e., no players with pro aspirations) while the NBA moves to a more European model (i.e. each team having a developmental system).
If that happens, D1 basketball will change. It won’t cease to exist, but it will certainly change. Kids with pro aspirations will start working their way through the pro development system as early as 12 or 13, going to school during the day, then training at the pro development facility at night. That’s why you see guys from Europe coming over having already played three or four years within a pro system - they start that as soon as they are ready from a talent perspective, often 17 or 18. Had a guy like Svi stayed in Europe, he likely would be finishing his second or third year as a pro in a lower European league right now. That is coming to the U.S.
That type of system will allow Big Shoe to sponsor these development centers (along with the NBA and GLeague). It will also mean that top HS players probably won’t go to their local high school, or even a private school or prep school - they will go to the development center probably as early as 13 or 14.
Now obviously, this is years down the road - currently, there are six or seven NBA teams pondering opening training centers. It’s in the planning stages, which means its probably still three years from happening in the earliest stages. But with this issue popping up now, it may speed up the process just a bit. It’s still going to take 8-10 years to get anything like this off the ground, but that’s where things are headed.
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@justanotherfan I just have a hard time seeing the NBA giving up a free developmental league.
It isn’t like baseball where an NAIA guy can make the pros. So you don’t have to cast a wide net.
Not to mention, there basically are NBA academies leading up to college. Almost all of these top 100 guys play for a prep school where they eat and breath basketball.
The dollars and cents just aren’t there from what I can see. The more simple, cheaper fix is just getting rid of the OAD rule.
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Having guys stay in the NCAA longer doesn’t serve a purpose for the NBA. Most college programs don’t run NBA systems, so it doesn’t help the NBA to have a guy play in that type of system for several years.
That’s one of the issues the NFL is facing now - colleges run college schemes, while the NFL runs a completely different type of playbook offensively and defensively. That means that success in college could be the result of the system, not a player’s overall talent, or a player’s skillset just may not translate from college to the pros. That’s at every position in football from the line to the skill guys.
The NBA is moving more and more to positionless basketball, while most college teams are still in a traditional two interior player system. Because of that, from a development standpoint, you really don’t want a guy working in a system that is so much different than what he will be asked to do at the pro level, as that may stunt his professional development.
Right now, major sports networks pay tons of money to broadcast college basketball. If the talent pool shifts away from college, that money could shift as well. The money will follow the talent.
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@justanotherfan I’m not saying that they should make players go to college for longer. I’m saying they need to take them right out of HS like they used to. That is the cheaper fix. That is the process that created more HOF players than the current system.
I’m not arguing with you that college doesn’t prep players as well as another system might. But, I do not believe that the benefit of changing the system outweighs the cost in the eyes of the owners.
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@justanotherfan I really hope what you’re saying doesn’t happen. I, like so many here, and on similar fan sites across the land, love our college teams and would hate to see it watered down to it only existing for the kids who don’t go pro.
In that scenario, what happens to Frank Mason? He probably wouldn’t have made it into the NBA minor leagues (my term) right out of HS. Does he then get branded a college player therefore not good enough? Maybe, hard to say really.
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Frank was an exceptional HS player, so he probably would have gotten into the development pipeline, albeit likely later on (as a sophomore or junior rather than at 13 or 14). The kids that don’t develop in that system would still go on to college (there would likely be an avenue for them to pursue collegiate education later on).
Sports is a big business. It’s only a matter of time before the business part changes the developmental stages, too.
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Kcmatt7 said:
@justanotherfan I just have a hard time seeing the NBA giving up a free developmental league.
FREE? They have limited expose to the college guys so the bust factor is higher, which costs a ton. When you have all access(all practices, scrimmages, games) to prospects the bust factor lowers significantly. A dev league is WAY better for the NBA.
The one place it does hurt the NBA is marketability. When a kid is well known in college it helps NBA fans familiarity with the player.
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…but,…the NBA already has a development League, it is called the G League.
The NBA had several big time busts when players could go directly from HS to the NBA so it changed the rules so prospects now have to go to college for one year where they are observed by teams’ scouts…for free. A sweet deal for the NBA, a sweet deal for prospects and a lousy deal for colleges if you ask me.
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@BigBad Free. And they instituted the OAD rule so that the bust potential was lower. Guys like Cliff would have made millions.
And, as you said, the exposure from colleges is a HUGE selling point for the NBA.
Top that off with the cost to run a developmental league. How much do you pay a 12 year old? How much do you pay a late blooming 16 year old? Blooming 18 year old? Who decides what kids go to what team? Are you putting them up in multimillion dollar condos? Are you feeding them? Paying world-class trainers hundreds of thousands to train them? Building hundred-million dollar complexes for them? Putting them in front of a crowd to develop their marketability?
There have been dozens of attempted leagues to steal away top recruits and pay them. None of them have worked because what colleges offer is still better. And Owners aren’t going to spend a fortune to compete with that when, right now, it is free.
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None of them has ever worked because the big players (NBA, ShoeCos, etc) never backed any of them.
The GLeague is backed by the NBA and Gatorade. Add a pipeline backed by Nike and Adidas and you have a whole new system.
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@justanotherfan and they never would because they have too much money invested in college athletics.
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For all of you that thought I had lost my mind when I said I thought the Stubby Miller investigation seemed like BS…well …here you go:
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@KUSTEVE Yep, it wasn’t very well vetted apparently. Crazy.
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@BShark I don’t think the FBI was actually involved in this hit job. I think this was a rogue ESPN writer who inexplicably decided to tilt the AZ/ Oregon game in the Dux favor by creating as much havoc as possible. And it worked. Oregon and their sh** sandwich eating coach won. Still makes me wonder if the writer was good buddies with the boys at Nike.
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@KUSTEVE Maybe it was KU to prevent JRE visiting.
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I see lawyers in the near future, lots and lots of lawyers…
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Interesting read.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/secret-cash-isnt-an-ncaa-scandal-amateurism-is-1519665889
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@BeddieKU23 No one bets on music or art. That’s why no one cares if they get paid. It’s all about betting. Same as the injury report, it has nothing to do with fairness of play, it’s all about betting.
