Yes, this is the worst Kansas has ever been in football
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@stoptheflop I agree, Turner Gill is a great guy but not an FBS coach as well.
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I too think Turner Gill was a class act. Just not a HC of a power conference type school.
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I am sure none of you have ever been paid a single dollar to call a single play in a football game . I know for a fact that you have no idea of just how much work Beaty puts in and that is why you cant understand why the man was a little emotional after taking the chance on KU ( because i assure you it wasnt the other way around) and coming in and getting these guys to believe and buy in and keep working their a… off everyday and get knocked down and read all the bs from dumbass know it alls that act like they have ever ran a hundred yards for or put in any work for this program talk sh.t and still get up and do it again and keep pushing forward and do that for an entire season and off season and get beat all year not counting rhode island high school or whoever and come on the field and beat TEXAS … i am sure that was overwhelming you have no idea what is going on while idiots sit here and rip the program and act like they care with all their KU basketball gear and profile pics talk shit about the program and have the chance for potential recruits come looking on internet about KU football and see idiots making shit look worse than it is … Zenger didnt pull Beatys name out of a hat he put in work and found a good coach that would work hard and be able to weather this fairweathered football fanbase and see it through. It takes a lot of work to get to a point where your name would be thought of for first head coaching job anyone that has put in that much effort wouldnt come here and get knocked back down and look incompitent that was worth a shit if KU pulls that again with this coach and no coach with a good rep wants that job either not worth destroying everything they worked for. Beaty was offered 1.6 millon to be Texas OC when herman took over and could have taken that job and bailed on KU that was his chance to bail and he stayed for same money you have the right guy .
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@justsayn OK, you support Coach Beaty and KU football. Good. So do the rest of us who post here. I don’t doubt for one second that Coach Beaty puts in an extraordinary effort for our program. I like the guy. But, lack of wins is not acceptable. I probably paid too much attention to all the accolades and hyperbole for our team during the off season. I expected much more from the defense this year, especially the defensive line. How do you explain the drop off in the defense this year? Hey, welcome to the board and I hope you keep posting.
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@stoptheflop Sreiously? - - -Really? - -your reaching that far, talking about a Coach crying after an upset win - -any win at all period at a program that was and still close to ashes? -That’s a reach for sure. Soo we can go to the OTHER end of the spectrum, if a team or any member of a staff that win the Super Bowl or the NCAA in THE bowl happen to cry after winning - -or another player get’s hurt - -no crying right, there is no crying in football EVER right? – ummmm, ummmm, ummmm. ya you keep that train of thought I get beat up for some of my comments and I try to refrain - -I rally do, but when I see a comment such as this - -Come on give me a fricken break - that statement is beyond way over the left field fence holy crap. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@stoptheflop So what your trying to tell people is, that a winning coach Can’t be a guy wear his emotions on his sleeve? - -Not allowed to show his passion for the School - -Not allowed to show his emotions for his kids - how had they have worked their ass off. - Show his emotions for realizing that their work was paying off , his work was paying off? -ya – ummmm wow - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY. - -WHAT A WAY TO START MY WEEK SEEING THAT ROFLMMFAO
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@justsayn I’ve been following KU for sometime in all sports. I was at the central Michigan game. Kansas took plenty of risk hiring Beaty ( was a position coach, only one year of coordinatin) , if the pay is high enough a ton of coaches would come here. Also I like Beaty, he’s a great guy and I’m sure he does work hard but they’re no participation trophies in the real world especially college football. Just about every blog site has people calling for both his and Zengers firing. I also highly highly doubt he was offered to be an OC at Texas let alone at that pay. Beaty had no credentials to be a power 5 head coach let alone an OC. Any source to that? All my Texas fan buddies laughed and said your full of it (one of which has a booster for an uncle with inside info).
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Let’s pump the brakes here for a second. Since 2008, KU football has been led by Mangino, Gill, Weis, Bowen (interim) and now Beaty. That’s five different coaches, philosophies, staffs, etc. in less than 10 years. Let’s slow down and let the program have something resembling stability for a minute.
Is Beaty having the type of success we want him to have? No.
Is switching coaches and starting all over going to help? Probably not.
KU hit the eject button too early on Gill, then made matters worse by bringing in Weis, who set about trying to undo everything Gill had put into place. That meant that when Weis got canned, KU was starting over for the third time in less than five years. What’s more, Beaty took the job with less than 60 scholarship players on the roster. The D1 limit is 85. Beaty was working with less than three quarters of a full D1 roster in his first year!
If KU bails out on Beaty now, we start over again. We basically guarantee that we will see 1 or 2 win seasons in 2018 and 2019 once you account for the attrition that will once again occur when we change coaches.
This is a cycle that has to stop. I said when Beaty was hired that he needed to be given a minimum of four years, regardless of how things went just because any stability within the program has value right now. You can’t develop any players when they are constantly changing offseason programs, schemes, etc. We can’t ever start winning if we do not bring some stability. The constant churn and turmoil has undermined any progress we may have made over the past several years.
Look at the basketball program here. The only coaches to stay at KU less than 10 years were Naismith (nine), Harp (eight) and Brown (five). KU has played basketball for nearly 120 years, and has had 8 coaches in that time. The football team has had five in the last 10 years. One team is nationally known and respected. The other is constantly searching for its way. The lack of consistent direction has hindered any potential growth for the program.
KU football isn’t going to resurrect overnight. We aren’t in a situation like KSU was in the late 1980s and early 1990s where there is a vacuum of strong programs within the conference that allows a mediocre team to rise. This will take time because the Big 12 has legitimate depth right now.
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I understand where you are coming from and I feel exactly the same way when people second guess Coach Self.
Having said that, there is a huge difference. Coach Self wins at the best click of any coach, Coach Beaty…well, not so much. Hard to argue with Coach Self’s results, not so hard with Coach Beaty’s.
We all support Coach Beaty and I have to say that before the season, I was the most excited I have been for the programs since the Mangino best days. There were many returning players and eligible transfers and recruiting appeared to have been well above the usual haul at KU. However, after 3 games I see that the team has really not changed that much and has not performed to expectation.
Perhaps our expectations were too high and unrealistic but it would be nice to see some light at the end of the tunnel but I honestly can’s say I see any at this time. Perhaps the team will surprise and win a game or two but again, realistically, I just don’t see this happening.
I have maintained in the past that a coach has to be given a reasonable amount of time to turn the program around and a minimum of 4-5 years; however, there must be some demonstrated progress during this time and I am sorry to say but I just don’t see it at this time.
No doubt that Coach Beaty is a dedicated, high character individual but so are most coaches and without tangible results he is is just another one of the bunch.
My question to you is: If KU does not win any other games this season, what should KU do? I will answer my own question and say he should get one more year…what say you?
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@justanotherfan I agree, I’m not saying firing him today just saying IMO he’s failed to develop several players with 2 years worth of experience and will be fired in a few years.
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Looks like Beaty’s mom joined the forum. We’re movin’ on up.
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What we need is a big name coach who can bring in a couple 5 star QB’s, right? Oh, wait…
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Wait for what? Um KU isn’t a football school, yet the powers to be are trying. A lot of money is about to be donated to making KU Football better. So again wait for what?
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@BShark lmao you win the internet today buddy
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@DoubleDD Weis
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@stoptheflop Dick Vermeil says hi.
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stoptheflop said:
@kjayhawks When Coach Beaty cried after the Texas win, I doubted he had the right mindset to be a winning coach. Great person, yes. But, winning coach, no. What other D1 coach would you expect to show that much emotion after an upset win? Coach Snyder? Coach Mangino? There’s no crying in football, ever.
Dick Vermeil says hi.
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Seeing a good chunk of fire Beaty and Zenger comments all across the web here. I honestly feel like the next few weeks are huge for Zenger’s job and how much more time Beaty gets. We go on the road to face TCU the 4th ranked team in the land, then KSU and Baylor at home. If we get blown away bye a TCU it’s probably not a big deal but KSU will likely have a 3-4 record and Baylor likely will be 0-8. If we get hammered by 2 teams with a combined record of 3-12 at home it will be very tough to raise amy money for a program that bad and keep the current people in charge.
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…and KU will own the records for most consecutive road loses.
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@JayHawkFanToo We can just hold our head high and wear “Record Breaking!” on our tshirts.
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Apparently Coach Beaty is feeling the heat. His comments at the presser sound like those of some one seeing the writing on the wall.
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@JayHawkFanToo It should be getting hot, as I stated before the ISU game both teams returned within a guy or 2 of the same but the result the next year flipped from 31-24 to 45-0. Samething could be said for the TCU and KSU games both return similar numbers and the games were competitive a year ago, TCU beat us 24-23 and KSU 34-19 in a touchdown game late. I beat both are 30 plus point beatings again.
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I understand KU is 14 points worse than the Vegas line…worst in college football.
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I feel like the infomercial guy “but wait there’s more!!” Kansas is now tied for the longest road losing streak in NCAA history and let’s be honest they will own it here shortly and probably for a long time seems how it has been in place since before WW2. Kansas now has the worst offensive output this century (only 17 years but still pathetic) with a grand total of 21 yards. KU has been out scored 144 to 19 in the past 3 games including 2 shutouts. If Beaty can’t at least be competitive the next 2 weeks he has to go end of story.
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The thing is I believe KU is still paying for Gill, and Weis even though both have been excorted off the property. If KU gets rid of Beaty that would mean KU would be paying for 4 HC’s? I don’t know somebody would have to research that one. However I believe it’s time to part ways with Zenger.
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@kjayhawks Minus 25 yards rushing. I can sure see why we tried to pass 20 times and rushed 31. Gotta keep diggin’ that hole.
I watched several 3rd-down-and-long plays where we tried passes in the backfield that resulted in losses or incompletions, and a few others where on 3rd and 10 (or 15) the pass was no further than 5 yards over the line of scrimmage. And Bender didn’t even get the ball all the way to those guys a couple of times. All those plays were in the same area of the field–behind or near the line of scrimmage, where we were stymied all day. Maybe trying a whole series of patterns that are 15 or 20 yards deep would open something up?
But then again, the o-line was getting swsmped by three guys, so maybe deep receivers never could get open.
Our biggest gain on a pass play was 14 yds on pass interference. Bender’s second pass was complete for 13. But our third longest “successful” pass play was 11 yds–again, pass interference. So TCU’s secondary made longer plays for our passing game than we did.
I feel bad for all those guys. I believe the coaches need more imagination to right the ship. Not trick plays, but plays that, if successful, get the team fired up, like a few deep passes. 31 rushes for minus 25 will not excite anyone except the other team.
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DoubleDD said:
… If KU gets rid of Beaty that would mean KU would be paying for 4 HC’s?..
Maybe not–we might not get anyone willing to tank their career, so we might still only be paying 3.
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@mayjay Deep routes weren’t going to happen. Defense live in KU’s backfield all night. Even Usain Bolt wouldn’t have had time to get open last night.
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Yep, oline is terrible and that’s where it starts. Get a better line and you can do MUCH more.
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I suffered through 3 of the worst seasons in baseball history with my Astros while they implemented their rebuilding plan.
This was never going to be a 3 year rebuild for Beaty. I’ve seen people ask why were programs like UCF which went 0-12 the same year KU did a couple of years ago and is currently 6-0 and why can’t KU duplicate that.
There’s several reasons for that. First would be that UCF won the Fiesta Bowl just 2 years prior to their 0-12 season so Scott Frost inherited a much better situation with very recent success and players that were apart of the Fiesta Bowl team.
Number two is the level of competition UCF plays. The AAC is not the Big 12. It’s much easier to rebound from a down year in a league like the AAC than the Big 12.
Number three is UCF is in Orlando. Their recruiting base is much better than KU’s. They are competing with USF for the second tier prospects in Florida that the Big 3 don’t want.
KU has none of those advantages. Another comparison I’ve seen is David Cutcliffe at Duke. Duke was patient with Cutcliffe and actually let him build that program. It took Cutcliffe until year 5 to finally break through and reach a bowl game. He actually regressed in years 3 and 4 at Duke like Beaty is now and we see what the reaction has been to that regression. The difference is Duke allowed Cutcliffe to execute his plan and once all of the players in that program were Cutcliffe guys, Duke then made 4 straight bowl games before breaking that streak last season.
I don’t know if Beaty will ever succeed at Kansas or not, but I know a 5 year turnaround plan is never going to be executed in 3 years. I also know that KU has traditionally cycled through coaches every 3-4 years for the better part of the past 70 years since WWII. I know that continuing that cycle of only giving a coach 3-4 years to finish a 5 year is never going to build anything sustainable at Kansas either. Every good coach that has come through Kansas post WWII has gone on to vetter programs except for Mangino was looking after the OB, but nobody wanted him at that time.
I would say that if we want any hope of success after a long period of futility like Duke, we need to allow Beaty his 5 years and realize there will be road bumps just like Cutcliffe had road bumps in years 3 and 4 that if those were duplicated at KU, wouldn’t have gotten him a 5th year to see if the plan would payoff or not.
Yes, our OLine is garbage right now. It takes time build an OLine. 3 years is not enough time. It literally takes 4-5 year’s because thise kids legitimately need 4-5 years in the weight room and there is no legal substitute for that time. The normal starting OLine are comprised primarily of 2nd and 3rd year players. They are not physically ready yet, but there are no other options out there for KU so we are seeing those growing pains right now. When injuries get tossed into the mix and players who are even less physically ready to play are forced to play, we see what we’ve seen offensively the past 2 weeks.
I don’t know if Beaty will ever get KU turned around or not, but I know that continuing to do the same thing we’ve seen for the past 70 years will yield the same results we’ve seen for the past 70 years which is one of, if not the worst major conference football team in the country.
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It gets worse friends, we just had another recruit bail. I believe 4 so far this year. Beaty says we are close to caught up on scholarships but we may actually lose ground in that department.
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@kjayhawks QB Clayton Tune is one I thought KU would struggle to hang on to even when he committed.
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Only commit from Texas bailed out following the TCU debacle.
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@DoubleDD Don’t fret - we can still get worse.
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@nuleafjhawk Hey! Where have you been? We missed you for the whole charity game controversy!
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Thanks @mayjay - I’ve been around, just super, super busy lately. I am Sooooooooo ready for basketball - i was on the road Sunday and listened to the game on the radio. I must have looked like a drunk monkey driving, because i was INTO the game! As bad as I hate to admit it, MU has some really good players this year - i was a teeeeeeeeensy bit concerned before the game. But dang - i think we’re going to be a special team this year. I think the basketball team may be as good as the football team is bad. Sorry - i try to be optimistic, but they force me to be the opposite of that.
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@nuleafjhawk Actually, and unfortunately, thinking the fb is “bad” is probably the optimistic view. Most people think in much more extreme terms in the awfulness spectrum…
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A touchdown underdog at Memorial Stadium to winless Baylor is another slap in the face of Coach Beaty, AD Zenger and all KU football supporters. I’ll be watching the outcome of this game with great interest. A loss here must result in a coaching change, right? If we stay with Coach Beaty, what is going to get so much better next year that we might win 2 games?
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@stoptheflop They should all be fired with a loss Saturday no question. I’m still pissed they blew last week with poor coaching for the special teams for the 3rd week in a row. Although my sources close to the program are telling Beaty will be around til his contract expires. I’m not sure how a 3rd coach could lose at home to teams 3-12 combined record and stay. Beaty himself said they expected to go to a bowl this year. I predicted 4 wins and a slight chance to go bowling. I honestly can hardly talk about it, it’s me makes so mad the lack of knowledge our coaches have.
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I’m 59 years old and very sporadically over the many years, KU football has provided me with some great joy, but I’m at the point now where, if it were up to me - I’d scrap the whole damn program. Save the $300 million for basketball, hurricane relief, grants, scholarships, free cotton candy for all Lawrence natives - anything but football. Give it up. It’s an embarrassment to the University, to KU fans, to the State of Kansas and to the Universe. Please stop the madness now.
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@nuleafjhawk The money would also be needed to replace all the Big 12 logos and flags with whatever small conference we end up in…
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@mayjay Yeah, I know. But i’m frustrated.
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@nuleafjhawk Free cotton candy!!!
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Most of the younger posters probably don’t remember the 1987 game between KU and KSU and aptly labeled the “Toilet Bowl” because KU had one win and KSU was winless and the game ended in a tie. The upcoming game against Baylor is looking like a repeat of the “Toilet Bowl.”
Here is a description of that game…
1987: The Toilet Bowl
The lone tie during the Governor’s Cup era took place on November 7, 1987, in Manhattan, and is the most infamous game in the history of the series. Termed “The Toilet Bowl” and “The Futility Bowl” by national commentators, the game featured 1–7 KU and 0–8 K-State. The contest lived down to expectations and resulted in a 17–17 tie, which was secured when Kansas blocked a field goal at the end of the game.[7][8] Following the tie, both teams lost their last two games of the season. KU coach Bob Valesente was fired following the season. His counterpart Stan Parrish kept his job, but did not make it past 1988 after the Wildcats posted an 0–11 campaign to extend a winless streak to 28 games. Parrish’s dismissal led to the hiring of Bill Snyder, who would shift the direction of the series in favor of the Wildcats.
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@nuleafjhawk Football still generates twice the money basketball does for the athletic department. KU football may suck, but it’s still funding the rest of the athletic department’s non revenue sports.
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I keep telling people that and they just don’t believe it, they think basketball generates the majority of income.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 Wait - I upvoted your post, but HOW does football generate more money? KU doesn’t give away basketball tickets or concessions and the 16,300 people that show up for EVERY home game stay and spend money. Ninety percent of the 10,000 that show up for football leave at or waaaaaaaaaaaaay before halftime. I’m not a math scholar, but i don’t get it.
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@nuleafjhawk But if they charge the football players for admission to the stadium, too, that would represent what, a 5% increase in attendance?
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@nuleafjhawk It’s not money based upon merit. It’s based upon being a football team in the Big12 and the money that is (thankfully) evenly distributed even though KU hasn’t carried it’s weight in years. Ridiculous, but true. Also making the $ divide worse is the NCAA keeps most of the money from the NCAA tournament.
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@nuleafjhawk The TV deal for football is massive and dwarfs the basketball deal. Football still has more people in the stadium those than basketball so ticket revenue is comparable because of the lower prices tickets. It also doesn’t matter if someone leaves after the 1st play or stays the whole game, they still had to pay the same amount to enter the stadium.
Mainly it’s the TV deal that generates a massive amount of money for KU each year, $30+ million based on what the Big 12 said about revenues last year. Basketball doesn’t come anywhere near that.
