Trae Young
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Yes, but…if Devonte wants to make it to the NBA he would have to play PG and he needs to audition for that. We all feel he can do it but the NBA no longer takes as many risks as it once did because they have an additional supply of Euro player from which to choose. Devonte’s best chance is to have a Mason like season and then he can maybe become a lottery pick.
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Graham is averaging over 4 assists a game as the “other guard” with less turnovers then Frank. Without getting into detail it would seem that Devonte is doing just fine in proving himself for the next level.
I don’t necessarily believe GM’s are going to look at him and be scared to draft him because he hasn’t been the primary point guard at KU. It would certainly help his case to solidify a 1st round pick if he did come back and try and assume the lead point guard duties at KU. I don’t think anyone can question that would be a smart move, maybe even the smarter move. If he risks going pro, there is a good chance he’s a 2nd round pick unless he has more of those heroics like he did last night.
I think all of us KU fans selfishly want him to return for his senior year but in this day and age what we want and what we think is the best move for a kid is not what they may be thinking. We saw this last year as a perfect example. Graham is old for his class and may not think he has anything to prove after this season. It would be hard to argue for him coming back if this team were to win the championship. An early exit might make him hungry enough to return.
Anyways its a good discussion to have. Question. Do you think Self would be selling Frank Mason’s role so definititively to a recruit if he believed Graham was returning. I think Self would be honest with a recruit if he thought his role wouldn’t be as advertised.
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More importantly, how certain are we that Coach Self actually made that exact statement? There have been several recruits in the past that have made comments publicly about what coaches promised only to find out there were not true. Coach Self has always indicated that players have to earn playing time…just thinking aloud…
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And I agree we don’t know that exact statement that was said other then his family saying it to the reporter.
Of course he must earn his playing time as every top recruit must do here. I think that’s kind of a mute point when you can see Trae clearly has enough talent to start at KU and he’d probably start at almost any program in the country. We knew Jackson would start here as a freshman even though Svi was a proven returner and that was debated at length here. Jackson ended up proving he could be versatile enough to play both at the same time. Things usually have a way of working themselves out. Young might allow Self to go extremely small with 3 shooters/ball-handlers (Young, Graham, Newman) for hypothetical purposes.
In the case of Trae, I do think the Staff has told him what his role would be especially with confidence that Graham wouldn’t be here. I guess I won’t know if that is true until Thursday. The one constant thing with their interviews is the remarks of having a clear role, not having too much competition to jeopardize him being showcased… If KU does in fact get him it signals to me that the staff confidently sold him playing time.
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@JayHawkFanToo OK, gotcha bud, sorry for missing things, just kind of slow lol. - – -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@BeddieKU23 Very true, I KINDA got a little better feel after reading this article, was a very good piece, really broke things down. - - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@BeddieKU23 I have to agree with you soo, much. - -I think Coach Self telling Trae why is the decision so hard, you come to the University of Kansas you ARE going to be our starting point Guard. - -I like you , I feel the Coaching staff just like last year I believe they knew with Wayne, they Know this year with Devonte, I think they already know what Devonte is going to do. I fully believe this is one of the main reasons that Coach Self himself has told Trae that he would be the starting point guard - I just feel Coach already knows . - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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Well saw now that the last THREE CB picks for Trae has gone to KU, we got another prediction for him today, from some one by the name of Matt Agnoli - -the CB and ya believe me I know for what it’s worth but the CB now has us leading at 48% to 36 % - -But I’m trying to keep that in perspective as we all remember how the CB did us with AYTON it had us all along or pretty much at 100% - -but I will say, Gerry Meyer which is usually pretty accurate is still saying Trae will end up at KU, says it close but he just feels when it’s all said and done Trae at KU - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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If Trae signs with KU, we know DG is gone. Period.
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@KUSTEVE not necessarily. If Trae commits to KU, then it’s him, Malik, Vick and Garret. We are two guards short, so Devonte would still get all the playing time he wants next year and also be the man. If he was going to leave, he should have done it after his great season last year, IMO.
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Young had 44 points last night- his season average.
Lots of deep 3’s, one he shot from so far away he looked down to see where his feet where.
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Don’t forget Cunliffe.
IMO the likely-hood that Graham and Svi both return is 0%.
There’s many ways to look at this situation but if Young commits tomm we pretty much have our answer about Devonte.
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Did you see all the empty seats last night at the OU game? Why would he want to play there when he would be assured of 16,300 rabid fans every game? OU is a football school. KU is the mecca of college basketball. OU will be better next year as they have some good young players, but KU will be great year in and year out. He said he wants to win. Easy decision.
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@Big-Clyde52 Easy decision for you and me. But I didn’t average 44 a night in HS. If I did I’m sure I would think I could fill OU’s bb-arena as well as Heild.
I’m afraid a lot of what I would consider while choosing a school for these young men, isn’t what they look at. An advantage to my job is I step back from the work at hand and offer a different view. It’s easy to see the best/most logical solution given the limited # of facts we have about this situation and our distance from it. Put in the middle of the turmoil with all the facts (or at least a different set of facts), I have no clue how I’d respond.
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@dylans I’ve heard he’s waiting til seasons about over so he doesn’t have to hear so much crap from ou fans while still playing hs ball.
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@Crimsonorblue22 I assume you mean HS since OUs season has been over for a while now…
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@dylans yes!
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How much playing time is available in the backcourt depends on if we play 4 out next year or not.
If we play the traditional (and Self preferred) two bigs, three perimeter players, there are significant minutes for up to four guys, with one guy getting mop up minutes. If we play four out like we have this year, there are minutes for up to five guys, with one guy getting mop up minutes.
Next year inside we have Azuibuke, Preston, Bragg, Lightfoot and Coleby. On the perimeter we have Garrett, Vick, and Newman for sure. If Svi stays (likely), that’s four guys right there. If Graham stays, that’s five. KU is also still in the hunt for three other perimeter players - Trevon Duval, Kevin Knox and MJ Walker. And don’t forget, Preston can play either the 3 or the 4, and should get minutes at the 3 at least sometimes.
Right now, Garrett could be the odd man if we play a more traditional set (assuming Svi and Graham stay). If Graham or Svi goes, we would need another perimeter guy, but again, we are in the hunt for several of those guys.
And let’s not forget that Sam Cunliffe will be eligible in January.
Simply put, I think Young goes to Oklahoma because the Kansas backcourt is exceptionally crowded whether Graham stays or goes, and will be even more crowded if he stays.
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Predictions for OU rolling in.
Zagoria predicting OU as well.
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@BShark can’t get it at work
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Interesting take from the other side. So much of what they are relying on is the home factor from that article.
I wouldn’t claim much of anything from that article to be a fact and its worded in such a way to really play up a lot of this stuff as facts. Basically regurgitating the USA today article with some side notes to make it feel like his own.
Yes Trae being a hometown Norman kid has been around the OU program for years. Yes Kruger has recruited him for a while, slightly longer than KU has.
We have his mother on record saying she liked the Kansas staff better overall as well as distance not being a factor in seeing him play. What mother wouldn’t play up the “stay home” card, they ALL do. Doesn’t mean she wasn’t aware that KU was close enough to still see him play.
It will be interesting if Trae took his fathers comments about taking relationships out of the equation and making it a business decision. In the end though its his own to make.
Zagoria doesn’t know anything about mid-west recruiting…
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@BeddieKU23 said:
Don’t forget Cunliffe.
IMO the likely-hood that Graham and Svi both return is 0%.
There’s many ways to look at this situation but if Young commits tomm we pretty much have our answer about Devonte.
Which shows you the state of college basketball and the draft pipe dreams. Svi is NO WHERE NEAR athletic enough to play in the NBA. He isnt a consistent shooter and he struggles to defend. He should be a 4 year player.
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Yes our backcourt may be crowded next year, but OU is also pretty full. Anderson, James, McGusty, Odomes, Quinn, Shepherd, Strong-Moore will all be there. I am sure Trae is not afraid of any competition. His desire to win is pretty strong. I would think that would point him towards KU. At last I hope we will be more successful than OU in the years ahead.
And yes, he would be able to attract many more fans to their games, being a home town hero. But what fun is that if you are on a .500 winning team? I wonder how J. Allen is feeling now that he could have been a Jayhawk? And wow could we really use him. Free throws a problem with him also, but still.
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@BShark I like TY much less after that article. If he thinks he is a OAD, I’m not sold on him. I’d rather get Keene or another grad transfer that could come in and run the offense. At least that way we can focus on 2018 players and guarantee them a spot. Instead of a “wait and see what Trae does” approach.
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@Big-Clyde52 Allen is a borderline lottery pick. So I think he is feeling pretty good about his decision in the long run. Sure this year sucked, but he got to play 30 minutes a game and play through his mistakes. We could have definitely used him and his shot blocking abilities. But to think he could have gone higher in the draft by coming here isn’t realistic.
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@Kcmatt7 Agree totally with everything you said. It just looks to me like he is not having any fun. The expressions on his face are revealing. Or maybe that is just his demeanor.
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@Big-Clyde52 Everything I saw last year watching his recruitment, that’s just his demeanor. Just expressionless and kind of boring.
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@BigBad said:
Which shows you the state of college basketball and the draft pipe dreams. Svi is NO WHERE NEAR athletic enough to play in the NBA. He isnt a consistent shooter and he struggles to defend. He should be a 4 year player.
Svi is 9th in the conference in 3 point %. He’s 4th in terms of makes to attempts so I would say he’s pretty darn consistent this year. Also making 48% of his 2’s.
Now I agree his defense needs work, a lot of it but at 19 with 3 years in College he’s a good draft and stash option in Europe for a team that might want to see him further develop against pro’s. The fact that he’s originally from oversea’s adds to the intrigue with him. And he does have great size for a perimeter position.
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Everything I read about Allen was that he was a shy kid that didn’t want the attention that recruiting brought. He was mostly silent throughout that whole process. Kid can play, @Kcmatt7 is right, even though Texas isn’t good he’s being showcased and allowed to do what he wants. He’s clearly their best player and his stock is as high as it will be because of where he is.
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the latest from Matt…
Alright - it begins now.
Trae Young will announce tomorrow at noon. It’s OU or KU and people are wildly guessing like crazy now. KU has the lead in Crystal Ball right now so we shall see if it sticks over the next 24 hours.
I’ve heard both from multiple people. Nothing that would make me switch my Crystal Ball pick though. I have KU picked right now.
So Oklahoma media have KU - a lot have OU.
As of last night all coaches left in the race have NOT been notified of the decision. NOT!!! I expect that will happen before his announcement though.
Either way - Trae is a great kid that has worked his arse off to get to where he is.
More to come…
and feel free to post anything you guys find on the interwebs.
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Another thing to remember is that while some of these kids enjoy or at least can handle the spotlight aspect of recruiting, there are a lot of kids that are shy and really don’t enjoy the other side of the recruiting (i.e. interviews, questions from strangers, etc.). Basketball is their safe space, they have no issue playing on the court, but don’t really want to deal with too many strangers off the floor.
I’ve seen and known several kids like that over the years. They tend, like Allen did, to stay closer to home where they already have a good support system of people they can trust around them. Some of these kids are just naturally introverted and, were it not for their incredible athletic skills, they would likely just fade into the background.
Sometimes they get labeled as the “dumb jock” because they don’t talk much during interviews, but they are not necessarily unintelligent, they just don’t like speaking in public. Heck, I was a pretty articulate kid when I was in high school, but I didn’t like talking to strangers if I hadn’t prepared something to say.
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@justanotherfan Larry Bird!
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FYI KU isn’t recruiting Kevin Knox.
Duval has already said his interest in KU will be over if Young picks KU…
MJ Walker, well it seems like we got our foot in the door with him. Staying home seems like the popular thought with him. So far has only visited Florida St so the longer that plays out, the better chance they have.
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@justanotherfan said:
Simply put, I think Young goes to Oklahoma because the Kansas backcourt is exceptionally crowded whether Graham stays or goes, and will be even more crowded if he stays.
But your not talking about the position which Young plays-PG. Newman was brought into be what he is, a scorer and ball handler. Mason is gone, we need a point guard.
Why would there be so much emphasis from coach on getting another PG if he didn’t need one?
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Saw Allen looking at the score board after the game and I was wondering what he was thinking. Being an elite athlete, quiet or not, sucks to lose, over and over…
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He probably didn’t think they would struggle so much.
Most of their struggles are coaching related. I know they lack a point guard and their leading scorer was suspended mid-season but they have been competitive in games. Andrew Jones is an NBA player as well. Shaka is failing with talent
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@justanotherfan said:
Another thing to remember is that while some of these kids enjoy or at least can handle the spotlight aspect of recruiting, there are a lot of kids that are shy and really don’t enjoy the other side of the recruiting (i.e. interviews, questions from strangers, etc.). Basketball is their safe space, they have no issue playing on the court, but don’t really want to deal with too many strangers off the floor.
I’ve seen and known several kids like that over the years. They tend, like Allen did, to stay closer to home where they already have a good support system of people they can trust around them. Some of these kids are just naturally introverted and, were it not for their incredible athletic skills, they would likely just fade into the background.
I think Allen is a natural introvert. He played at a small high school, basically neglected being recruited like a top kid and wanted to stay close to home. He’ll make money at the next level, will be interesting to see if his character holds him back from being more than a big that gets a paycheck.
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If you can get a Young or Duval, you do it because those are elite level players. You don’t have to get those guys, but if they want to come, you take them because you don’t turn down elite skill players.
I agree with you on Allen being an introvert. I don’t think he will be a star in the NBA because of that, but I do think he can succeed because he will be a perfect off the bench guy. Because he’s quiet, he won’t cause a stir in the lockerroom, but he has more than enough talent to help a team out. I could see him carving out a 12-15 year career as a backup big that scores near double figures, but never jumps to the elite level.
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I thought that Newman came to KU to become a PG since he is not tall enough to play SG in the NBA. I would be interested to know if someone knows what position he has been playing during practice as it would shed some light on where he will be playing next season.
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Quote from when he signed.
Newman said Self and his staff sold him on the opportunity to be a playmaker in the backcourt.
“They just said they want me to get back to the player I was,” Newman said. “I told the staff that I don’t need to play the point. They just want me to handle the ball, make plays and make the team better. That’s what they sold me on.”
Another
Noted Self: “In our opinion, Malik was a top-five player coming out of high school. He’s a combo guard that has good size, can really shoot the ball and stretch it. There are things he needs to get better at, but the year off will allow him to address things that the NBA people wanted to see more of out of him.”
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I would think the NBA wants to see him play PG, he just does not have the build to play SG in the NBA…in college ? Yes, in the NBA? No.
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He’ll get the chance to have the ball in his hand if a NBA career is what he wants. We have seen Mason/Graham/Jackson this year handling the ball. Newman is not a natural passer, he has been a score first guard his entire career.
Are we just looking for reasons to say Young won’t be coming here because this player or that player needs to run point? Wouldn’t KU be out of the running if the point position wasn’t available to him?
The same pitch was given to Duval, who has relayed to the media that KU was looking for a point guard to come in and play right away.
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Not at all. I believe that Young would be a better PG than Newman, but if Newman wants to play in the League it will likely be as PG. Remember Mario? he was turnover machine when he played PG as a freshman and Jeff Hawkins and Russ Rob played PG, He played some PG but at KU he was primarily a SG and dropped to the second round in the draft, after a great Junior year and a National Championship where he was the hero, but had to learn to be a PG to play in the League.
Hopefully tomorrow around this time, things will become clearer.
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I do agree that if Malik Newman wants to play in the NBA its most likely at PG even though that isn’t his natural position. He just happens to be a tweener in size for the average SG. He doesn’t have elite athleticism or wingspan so much like Trae Young he has to perfect other area’s of his game. Newman wouldn’t even be at KU today if he had the right measurable’s for the NBA. He can score and shoot the 3 so those are things that fit in perfectly in the new-age KU offense.
Hopefully what the staff wants from Malik and what Malik wants from himself can coexist. Usually Self does great with getting both of those factors to mesh well. We know Devonte is a great teammate but maybe their is a part of him that wishes he had Frank’s role? I would hope that if Young signs with KU, that Malik is perfectly okay with another guard joining and possibly taking the role that Mason is leaving behind. Or vice versa, Young will be okay with playing off the ball with his elite shooting ability. I think the way Self has been showcasing his guards of late makes who’s 1A and 1B a non issue.
Yes I hope tomorrow gives us some clarity on the situation.
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I have a younger brother who is a senior at OU and he just texted me and said he has heard from some Oklahoma HS coaches that Young will pick OU. Not sure how reliable the people he has heard from are… Everything I’ve read and heard I still think Trae will pick KU. Rock Chalk!
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FYI Ryan on 247 just CB’d Young to KU based on intel he got… He is a career pessimistic person on recruits and was the first to give us the intel on Marcus Garrett from this cycle.
FWIW, I’m thinking Kansas based on the little bit of intel I got today. Enough that I changed my CB pick back to Kansas. I know you guys don’t like the CB though.
So both people connected to this situation from KU says its KU…
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@BeddieKU23 I don’t know WHAT to think anymore, It’s just all over the place - - KU - - OU – OU - -KU , ya know.? I would love to have Trae, but have come to the realization you know what? - - If we get him - -we get him, I’m just ready for this to be done. If we don’t, we will still be just fine when it is all said and done. - -I have complete confidence in Coach. If he doesn’t come, I think we can patchwork through well enough till the following year, I think we will land a nice PG for sure the next year.
Again I would love to land Trae, - -HOWEVER I’ve bounced back and forth on my thinking on this, and I think in the end run I just have to say I think he is going to OU. - -That’s my last pick, hope I’m wrong, part of me still says I feel I might be wrong, but then on the other side of the fence, my guy just says now OU - he is crazy if he does, but that’s my prejudice of being KU, I think in the end MaMa wins out, She really wants him to stay home - - -She would settle if she had too but in her heart she wants him at OU - -so be it- -play in half full lifeless arena’s -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@dylans IF he is an alpha, then he shouldnt be afraid to make whichever choice he has in mind. Just speaking in general terms, right?
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I know we now have the last FIVE CB picks for Trae, but we all know that’s the CB. I mean that makes it look better for us, cause usually when we are this late in the commitment , usually these guys have picked up something or heard something - -the ol where there is smoke there is fire, but I made a final predict Trae to OU so gonna man up and stay with it - -not jumping the fence again. GOD I hope I’m wrong. the CB now shows KU 56% OU 36%
The last 5 CB picks: - - -Ryan Noel, Chris Bunn, Matt Agnoli, Josh Stirn, forgot the fifth one, also Jerry Meyer says Trae to KU - -we shall see - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
