BYU Thread
-
One thing worth pointing out: is I have no doubt with Kev playing we would have easily beaten BYU. With Kev out we have no one willing to attack the basket through contact. He’s also another threat from three. His D is probably the best on the team, and that helps Juando on D. (Really need a couple good defensive guys working together to create turnovers) Kev also bitches to the refs a lot, which takes some of that burden away from Hunter, so there’s that too. LOL
-
@DanR To be fair, KJ attacks the basket through contact but defenses have such little respect for his shooting that they are generally set by the time he gets there leading to not too many foul calls in those situations. And then I do feel refs just kind of stop calling it ANY time KJ draws contact.
As for Hunter, I honestly believe if we had any kind of reliable big back up, Hunter might have seen significant bench minutes and endured the Self toughening box. But as is, he’s been allowed to play his game. There’s a reason he was productive and his team was still unremarkable at Michigan. (Parker is fine but not a game changer in any way, kind of a budget mitch and that’s saying something)
-
@benshawks08 said in BYU Thread:
@DanR To be fair, KJ attacks the basket through contact but defenses have such little respect for his shooting that they are generally set by the time he gets there leading to not too many foul calls in those situations. And then I do feel refs just kind of stop calling it ANY time KJ draws contact.
As for Hunter, I honestly believe if we had any kind of reliable big back up, Hunter might have seen significant bench minutes and endured the Self toughening box. But as is, he’s been allowed to play his game. There’s a reason he was productive and his team was still unremarkable at Michigan. (Parker is fine but not a game changer in any way, kind of a budget mitch and that’s saying something)
Exactly , and Hunter knows Bill has nobody else- -kind plays in, which also I really don’t care if he comes back or not next yr. If he does then ok, will have some better relief and maybe we see a better version, but as fa as this year not that impressed. About all I can say is – he is big, when your bigger then most , ya your gonna get points and rebounds. Also like was said when he was at Michigan-with Hunter—EH.
-
This team as it is constructed would be terrible without Hunter. It’s debatable about where it would be with Udeh and Zuby.
-
To be fair to Hunter… part of his “attitude” comes from getting banged on every play and rarely getting calls his way. It’s the price for having his size.
Instead, he should embrace the contact and learn to use his size better to position down low. It’s an automatic 2 when he can get low positioning and it’s always there if he is willing to fight for it.
Not sure what he is thinking about a career after KU. Shooting 3s is fool’s gold for him. No team wants to sacrifice his size and down low scoring to add another trey shooter subpar to other options.
His technical helped encourage BYU. No doubt about it.
Still… I’m awfully glad we have Hunter because without him this year we are a 500 team!
If I look at the BYU game and pick underperformers… I’d tag Hunter, but also KJ. KJ is another one of our guys who needs to better embrace contact and use it to his advantage. He has improved (dramatically) this year… but it’s still not where it needs to be because he is such a brut stud athlete. If he wants a shot at the NBA, he’ll have to design his own unique game style and it will be about being physical.
Outside of Juan’s 4 TOs… I didn’t have an issue with his game. He had a few nice aggressive scores in this game, too.
Furph let it all hangout and he was good, just not his best shooting night. Hard to criticize a player who hustles like Johnny!
BYU is an unorthodox team. It’s a team we needed to prepare uniquely for and I think it showed that we didn’t do that. It is very untypical for us to prepare a unique game plan for the opponent we play. It’s part of Self’s style to just stay running our type of game regardless who we play. I can’t recall another team we’ve played in years that brought this style of offense to AFH. Not even Princeton.
Nick didn’t shoot well… but he still played a physical, tough game and I give him cred in this one.
Elmarko shows signs but still needs a lot of work. He may have a tough time next year earning minutes if he doesn’t step it up a big notch.
-
@DanR said in BYU Thread:
One thing worth pointing out: is I have no doubt with Kev playing we would have easily beaten BYU. With Kev out we have no one willing to attack the basket through contact. He’s also another threat from three. His D is probably the best on the team, and that helps Juando on D. (Really need a couple good defensive guys working together to create turnovers) Kev also bitches to the refs a lot, which takes some of that burden away from Hunter, so there’s that too. LOL
Yep, Kevin is our only guard that hunts for himself really. I’m guessing KU adds at least three in the portal (we will have to see who all leaves of course) and I think there will be a priority on secondary ball handler and guys that can create a bit for themself. Otherwise next year’s roster really has a lot of the same issues. If they are going to roll out KJ at the 4 again (history indicates they will) then we really need additional handling and shooting from the other two starting spots pretty badly. Furphy coming back would help a lot but who knows at this point with him.
The trickle down effect from Kevin not playing is massive. Jamari got completely lost multiple times on defense.
Speaking of bitching at the refs, that tech from the BYU coach turned the game, the next 7 calls were on KU iirc.
-
BYU was basically KU but with guys who can actually put the ball in the basket from deep. They pass it just like us, had almost identical assists per game as us. How they ran offense sharing the ball should have looked familiar. KU had a scouting report on this team for months and then poorly executed whatever changes they made to guard them from 3. BYU knew KU would revert to their ways when the shot clock got low or was stuck in close out situations. I thought we did an OK job in the first half forcing them into rushed or low % looks but that 2nd half was bad defense. Self is vulnerable against these teams until he adjusts his scheme which I don’t see happening
-
Except they ran at least double the on and off ball screens we run. Their offense was crazy active and it paid off. We fought hard on defense but it’s hard to make it through a 30-second shot clock when teams run stuff throughout the clock.
We were totally gassed the second half. Made it hard to run offense when our guys were so winded. They had more endurance than we did. Perhaps because they only had one player who put up 30+ minutes while our starting 5 were 30+!
-
We had their 2 primary ball handlers in severe foul trouble and they were left to put their leading scorer who comes off the bench on the ball and he picked us apart so badly they could bring Hall back in and he smelt blood. I still think we did a very poor job of disrupting what they wanted to do. The ball went wherever they pleased. They got the shots they wanted so often the shots they made were not a surprise once they had momentum. They stepped up on our home floor and we didn’t match it enough. Really disappointing to see.
But we don’t lose this game if the offense shows up. The free throw misses were reminiscent of how we lost to Cuse in the Championship game.
-
Absolutely correct! If our offense showed up we won easily. But a big reason why our offense didn’t show was because we were winded. They usually ran their shot clock down to almost zero, and we had to fight through screens that entire time. How much energy did we have left when going to our end to score?
You are right that we didn’t disrupt their offense enough… it was everything we could do just to keep close to their guys. The one way we could have disrupted their flow would be to anticipate screens coming and have either of our defenders step into the screen paths to disrupt it.
We really needed Kevin in this game. Then we have two defenders (Kevin and Juan) capable of disrupting offense.
Oh shizzzz… the Cuse game! How could I forget?! A new term was coined from this game… “Hacka Hunter!”
-
One thing is for sure… I guarantee… KU fans in AFH will remember BYU. And so will our teams. I’ll be surprised if they ever win again in AFH!
I remember when UT throttled us in AFH after TRob’s mom died. Remember this?
https://jj.kusports.com/news/2011/jan/23/texas-snaps-streak-jayhawks-cope-loss-thomas-robin/
Since this game every Jayhawk fan wishes everything but death to UT when they come to Lawrence!
-
@dylans I’m with @drgnslayr if we don’t have Hunter we aren’t making the NCAA tournament Zuby and Udeh both have looked terrible in the games I’ve watched. There averages combined x2 are still less than Hunters averages to date. I would be happy if one stayed instead of getting Parker.
-
@BeddieKU23 I compared it to the cuse game during the game.
-
I don’t think BYU wanted to foul Hunter as much as they did but it seemed to me it shifted to a coaching decision once he missed some and they were getting in his head. Also reminds me of when Kruger “Hack a Doke’d” KU @ OU a few years back, KU lost due to that strategy that night. Hunter shoots it better statistically but he’s missed plenty when we’ve needed him to focus and step up and Tuesday was no different. He’s been in an awful shooting slump since December.
-
Hunter in conf play- 57% FT, 17% from 3, 51% FG. Yikes
-
@BeddieKU23 said in BYU Thread:
Hunter in conf play- 57% FT, 17% from 3, 51% FG. Yikes
Yikes is right, he has just got to tighten the nutts and play like a man - -dam use that height & bulk to HIS ADVANTAGE makes these guys defend him. - -He needs to be like Choclate thunder use to be.–Remember him ? - when he went up to flush the ball he took it up and he said he dared others to challenge him, he said because the jam/flush time was HIS TIME and dared anyone to try and reject him - love that approach, Hunter needs that kind of mentality. Like if you wanna try and stop me then - -you better bring your lunch cause I’m coming and taking names. instead of some fluff boy. Get that mean streak in ya
-
@kjayhawks I think you are mistaken, I have never said Hunter is anything but good for this team.
-
I don’t buy the tired legs theories out there. These are young men in their primes. They only play two games per week! Come on. If this is really an issue with this team then they need a better strength and conditioning program.
-
@RockkChalkk said in BYU Thread:
I don’t buy the tired legs theories out there. These are young men in their primes. They only play two games per week! Come on. If this is really an issue with this team then they need a better strength and conditioning program.
EXACTLY - - - -thank you.
-
Hm. Every player on the court is going close to 100% theoretically and our roster is shorter. The margin of difference between fatigue and non fatigue may be small for a person in their prime but the consequences can still be significant in a high level game.
-
We shouldn’t have been winded, we just had 7 days off and another 3 to the BYU game. Something is really off with this group this year from a conditioning standpoint. BYU played 9 guys and only 1 hit 30 minutes and that was because of foul trouble. All 5 KU starters hit 30+ minutes again. It seemed like Self committed to playing the bench more with substitutions the last 2 games but it’s still an issue with guys playing too many minutes. I know Kev is 30+ minutes missing but man we just seem to have issues that are usually not a talking point (like conditioning). I can’t recall a season where its been this visible
-
BYU Bench minutes- 84- 29 points. Played 9.
KU Bench minutes- 37- 9 points. Played 8.
Pope might have outcoached Self here. Fouling Hunter, using his bench heavy. Sounds like BYU plays a lot of guys, Self doesn’t generally. Perhaps it’s something that needs to change in the future. The game is ever changing and it doesn’t seem like guys are holding up playing 33+ minutes a night.
-
I hear what you are saying. Perhaps it’s just with some of our guys on this team. Every player is unique on conditioning, even when going through a conditioning program.
Earlier this year I questioned Furph’s ability to go for 30+ minutes. I think his conditioning has actually strengthened as the season comes to a close. He has a bit of a high school player’s body… but he’s definitely improved (including improving his defense against the drive). I’m expecting him to be a completely different player (stronger) by next fall, if he comes back!
If he builds his body this off-season he’s pretty much a shoe-in high lottery pick next year, regardless of the talent in the draft.
-
I went back and watched some highlights earlier of the 2012 season because it popped up on X. It’s almost sad how unathletic we are compared to that team. They are pushing the ball and every player is catching lobs just fun stuff to watch. Man I hope now that the investigation is over we can get back to getting athletes.
-
@kjayhawks KJ, Furphy, and Nick are all above average athletically in my opinion. Have we seen many Furphy lobs though? He’s had plenty of jams in transition but has he gone back door for the classic Kansas lob?
-
Maybe Baylor will play zone so we can get back to lobs.
-
@benshawks08 I bet they do, maybe not as much w/Kevin playing.
-
Do you think coach talks to Hunter about his bad behavior on the court?
-
@benshawks08 I think only KJ and Furphy are elite athletes. Yes we have several above average this is D1 basketball. But overall top to bottom this team is one of Selfs worst IMO. Only team that comes close is the 2019 team to me.
-
@RockkChalkk I’ve been preaching this since Hudy left and I just mentioned watching the 2012 team, that teams bench was even shorter than this teams yet we are just too tired to play. I’m really starting to question this deal with LMH health.
-
@RockkChalkk THANK YOU. I’ve been saying that for years. 17-22 or so year olds cannot get that tired. I used to play ALL DAY in Houston’s Herman Park and go back for more on Sunday when I was young. The only way they could be tired like that is if they believe the BS about being tired.
-
@kjayhawks based on what? In football we’ve had very good player durability and conditioning. Or is all the other sports where we’ve had issues if you can name them?
I think it’s more mental than anything. Bill’s system is pretty demanding and being that mentally geared up that long has to be tough.
-
@FarmerJayhawk I pretty much have only seen the negative effects in Basketball.
-
@FarmerJayhawk said in BYU Thread:
@kjayhawks based on what? In football we’ve had very good player durability and conditioning. Or is all the other sports where we’ve had issues if you can name them?
I think it’s more mental than anything. Bill’s system is pretty demanding and being that mentally geared up that long has to be tough.
Man, can’t think of one high profile football player dealing with a lingering injury and consistently wondering if they’ll play or not. Lol. Jk. I know there’s a lot more than one player on the team.
-
@nuleafjhawk Yep back in playing days I got up early to run 3 miles a day, got to school an hour early as soon as the the women’s coach would let me shoot and had my last hour off to shoot before practice. At this point to me it’s as simple as this team’s conditioning is pure garbage or they are a bunch a softies as Self would say.
-
I don’t miss Hudy. She added too much bulk and the players lost explosion. The current players are the issue, not the trainers.
