2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc
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@BeddieKU23 Feels right to me unless we start getting bench production. I feel fairly confident we won’t win the league.
I’m fairly excited for next year, depending on who stays.
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@BShark who do you think will, Texas? I think we will be right in there.
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@Crimsonorblue22 Texas has a legitimate chance to go undefeated in league play but I’d guess they lose 1-2.
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My days of doubting Self winning the league are long gone. I don’t think we are in any position to win the league currently, but we’ll see how this month goes. League play is where Self always finds a way to get the upper hand.
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Texas has looked sharp, athletic at every position and outside shooting hasn’t hurt them, yet. They play Creighton & Illinois back to back. The game they beat Gonzaga stands out & if they play at that level it will be difficult to match them.
Convenient in the Big-12 schedule, KU travels to Texas for the last regular season game which could also have championship implications on the line.
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@Jethro said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
@benshawks08 said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
Really surprised to see Jank as our 4th best player. He’d been so strongly leading in the early games. It just goes to show how razor thin the margin between superstar and walk on really are. Injuries really put him in a tough spot the last few games and missing that 3 was just a critical error that could have long lasting implications for his future stock.
I’m thinking of starting a " don’t yank the Jank" fanclub.
Unfortunately, I’m afraid not yanking the Jank is what brought us here. I mean, I’m still a fan, but the numbers now show he is actually only the 4th best player on the team instead of a statistical superstar destined for the league. The numbers still don’t lie. With that said, based on the numbers I would still start him next game.
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@BeddieKU23 said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
My days of doubting Self winning the league are long gone. I don’t think we are in any position to win the league currently, but we’ll see how this month goes. League play is where Self always finds a way to get the upper hand.
While it is unrealistic to expect any of our current bigs to develop at the same speed or get to the same level as Embiid, with time and effort, most bigs get better at Kansas. I think freshman Doke is a good comparison for Udeh. He doesn’t have the same dominating presence on size alone, but his length and athleticism can be special if properly directed.
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I thought Udeh reminded me of young Dave the last 2 weeks. They are completely different players but the immaturity they show on the court is/was similar at this stage. Udeh likes to take himself out of every play by jumping for blocks he can’t make or misjudging offensive rebounds/putbacks which then has him out of position for basically everything. He needs a ton of practice working on screens as well.
I can’t lie I’ve been really disappointed with Ernest but I had some higher expectations coming in then I probably should have. He’s sped up and being asked to play before he’s ready so it’s not his fault per say. I knew he was raw coming in but had the right tools to mold. If we had an experienced post player like we are used to having he probably only sees mop up minutes so having him out there before he’s seasoned enough is what we are currently seeing. He just looks so wild out there and not in a good way. I know in due time he’ll be fine.
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KU’s freshmen bigs are raw. Very raw. I knew Udeh was raw. I thought Ejifor was a bit more polished, but he is more raw than I expected from his HS performances. We may get something from them in spurts, but I don’t expect much consistency from them.
One of the tough transitions for bigs from HS to college, especially P5, is that the guards are tons better than what they are used to seeing. You think you can block a shot because HS guards can’t hit that floater. Guys in college can, and they are good at baiting you out of position (or into a foul) by hesitating that split second, or lofting the ball just out of your reach. They will draw you up the lane, then hit the cutter behind you where most HS players can’t make that pass, or don’t have a teammate with the awareness to cut into that open area. That’s why a good freshman big is so startling, and why those types of players usually aren’t in college for very long.
I think both Ejifor and Udeh will be good eventually. I think they will both help KU win games this year. But there will also be moments where you want to throw the remote because they are so raw and will make mistakes. But they have to play. Self can’t give in to the temptation to just ride his perimeter guys. He needs Ejifor and Udeh because he will need their size. Clemence too, because he’s the only one of those three that has an offensive game other than “lob threat” right now.
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@benshawks08 said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
@Jethro said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
@benshawks08 said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
Really surprised to see Jank as our 4th best player. He’d been so strongly leading in the early games. It just goes to show how razor thin the margin between superstar and walk on really are. Injuries really put him in a tough spot the last few games and missing that 3 was just a critical error that could have long lasting implications for his future stock.
I’m thinking of starting a " don’t yank the Jank" fanclub.
Unfortunately, I’m afraid not yanking the Jank is what brought us here. I mean, I’m still a fan, but the numbers now show he is actually only the 4th best player on the team instead of a statistical superstar destined for the league. The numbers still don’t lie. With that said, based on the numbers I would still start him next game.
I wouldn’t. They’d take the ball away from him and dunk in his face.
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Based on the numbers, my starters would be Wilson, Dick, Ejiofor, Jank, and Harris. I’d bring Rice in as the first wing off the bench with McCullar getting similar time as a 7th man and use Adams as the first big off the bench. Again, based on the numbers.
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Not Kenpom but stat related. A couple of things that sticking out in our conference: - -the most obvious - -we suck with our free throws, don’t understand that - - 62.3 - -DEAD LAST - 2nd in Conference in assists , kind of weird after had been hearing about our rebounding -we are 3rd in Conference the 3rd best rebounding team. - - 3rd best & 4th in blocks- -couple of area’s I didn’t think we would do that well at taking care of the ball- – negative other then our free throw % 7th in conference in Fg, — 5th in - -3pt shooting
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OK…trivia question. Who has more dunks this season? Juando or Jalen?
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@Jethro Well Jalen has 0 so I’d say Juan.
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@BShark said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
@Jethro Well Jalen has 0 so I’d say Juan.
Trick question- they’re both tied … with ZERO.
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O-fer this season. In the past, Juando has had a couple memorable dunks (OK, maybe just one). Wilson has no memorable dunks. Wilson’s legs are huge, like oaken logs, solid for horizontal movement or cabin construction, but like lead weights for leaping.
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On the other hand, Selden clanked more dunks off the rim than the two of them combined have made dunks
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@BShark said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
If KJ somehow becomes a threat to score we will be very dangerous.
If KJ had just a bit more polishing he would be outrageously lethal in the post… and also against footers.
What he lacks in size he makes up with strength, speed, and hustle.
Give him some post moves… head/body/ball fakes… knowledge how to use his body to go into the defenders and then create just enough scoring space…
He would foul out all but a few 5s and all 5s would be afraid to guard him.
And he would OWN the boards!
Yes… that lethal!
Hey KJ… you out there? Read the book about Chab (Charles Barkley)!
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My question: when is this team going to become even mildly prolific at lobs? Holy smoly, guys…
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Stats are tools and useful to some degree… but somewhere they lose value… kind of like driverless cars. So the car approaches an intersection with someone running a red light… there is a 70 yr old woman crossing with her groceries and a skateboarder boarding across… which does it decide to potentially kill?
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@drgnslayr Are you saying you don’t agree with my proposed starting line up using statistics only? Wow. That hurts.
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@drgnslayr said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
@BShark said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
If KJ somehow becomes a threat to score we will be very dangerous.
If KJ had just a bit more polishing he would be outrageously lethal in the post… and also against footers.
What he lacks in size he makes up with strength, speed, and hustle.
Give him some post moves… head/body/ball fakes… knowledge how to use his body to go into the defenders and then create just enough scoring space…
He would foul out all but a few 5s and all 5s would be afraid to guard him.
And he would OWN the boards!
Yes… that lethal!
Hey KJ… you out there? Read the book about Chab (Charles Barkley)!
I think a large part of us being better with KJ is simply the fact that he isn’t playing inside. If you are posting a guy up he better be good at it. This way we keep the paint open.
I think rebounding will always be an issue for him. He tries so that isn’t the issue.
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@BShark Exactly, effort isn’t the issue. But it might be about WHEN he tries. He goes after rebounds but is almost never in position to get a rebound. This could be a result of him playing outside of the pain on purpose to open up the lane for drives or just not doing his work early enough when the shot goes up or even earlier.
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@drgnslayr said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
My question: when is this team going to become even mildly prolific at lobs? Holy smoly, guys…
I think they should calm down on the lob until they practice it some more. Execution of that play has lacked because of chemistry etc. I don’t think our guards have done a good job of selling the lob and I don’t think our bigs have done a good job of catching and finishing either. It’s looked rough lately especially since teams know its coming
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@BeddieKU23 They looked good the first few games but since then the defense has been playing more to stop the lob than the actual guy with the ball. We’ve thrown them anyway.
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We have to remember KJ hasn’t spent a lot of time playing or practicing exclusively as the 5 so I do think some of his issues are still comfort and game reps. Rebounding is not a strength of his and its weird because we never have to question effort but you do wonder what additional effort it will take to get him to be more effective
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Yup film has hurt them recently. I think it comes from teams not respecting our guards to finish at the rim. Harris is getting a paint touch and he’s probably looking to dish it. Bobby hasn’t been a scorer at all and really likes to look for that lob when he gets to the middle of the paint area. Yesufu is the guy I think a defense would respect to shoot it and is someone that would have an easier time baiting the big to hedge a step more to set it up. I just think they need practice to figure it out
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@BeddieKU23 Offensive rebounding is more of an effort stat and he is fine there. Dave was a better offensive rebounder as well but he wasn’t abysmal defensively.
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For sure KJ is pretty good at those 50/50 balls on offense.
I think Dave’s size especially in the latter parts of his Jr & Sr seasons became a factor with him rebounding better. He got smarter and through game reps he learned positioning.
KJ doesn’t have that luxury (size) & he’s playing out of position first and foremost. Game reps and experience though should sharpen him a bit with boarding
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Being undersized helps on the offensive boards, but hurts on the defensive glass.
On defensive rebounds, you have to get physical with your man and box him out. Trouble is, if you are significantly undersized (and at 6-7, KJ is very undersized for a 5), it can be hard to hold that position because you have to move that guy out, otherwise you don’t have an advantage when the ball comes off the rim.
On offensive rebounds, though, being undersized doesn’t necessarily hurt you because you can get off box outs with your quickness and hit gaps to knife in for rebounds before guys can make contact with you. Having big guys always helps on the glass, but it helps more on defense because if you get superior position, you have an advantage.
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@BeddieKU23 said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
I think they should calm down on the lob until they practice it some more. Execution of that play has lacked because of chemistry etc. I don’t think our guards have done a good job of selling the lob and I don’t think our bigs have done a good job of catching and finishing either. It’s looked rough lately especially since teams know its coming
It’s just a great indicator of how far we are away from playing good team offense. Timing, spacing, connecting… these guys need practice time… but down the road… wow, what potential!
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KJ is out of position for most rebounds because we use him on ball screens. And then he should slash better to the boards on the shot and understand where rebounds are going to go. The great rebounders see the shot and have a very good idea of where it will go.
He should take advantage of his build. Being short, but built strong, can help him because his center of gravity is low. Wish he had a bigger butt, though. Stick it out there and create spacing! lol
I’m celebrating the game tonight by watching it on my new 85" tv! No more squinting on a 75"er! lol
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@drgnslayr said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
@BeddieKU23 said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
I think they should calm down on the lob until they practice it some more. Execution of that play has lacked because of chemistry etc. I don’t think our guards have done a good job of selling the lob and I don’t think our bigs have done a good job of catching and finishing either. It’s looked rough lately especially since teams know its coming
It’s just a great indicator of how far we are away from playing good team offense. Timing, spacing, connecting… these guys need practice time… but down the road… wow, what potential!
We saw some improved lob play last night. I also think Seton Hall did a poor job defensively against that. We’ll get teams as we’ve seen already that won’t fall for it but it was nice to see improvement there
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Updated post Seton Hall Shellacking
PER’s
Udeh the biggest riser after his 10pt performance. Adams also saw a nice bump. After averaging 11.25 on the PER his first two seasons, Harris at 17.9 really lets you know how much his game has improved this season. Harris is first in the Big-12 in Assists, Steals, Steals per game.
Points
Jalen Wilson needs 51 points to join the 1,000 pt scoring club. He’ll get there in the next 2-3 games. Zach still with a goose egg on the season.
Kenpom
Nice jump after a solid win.
Torvik, Sagarin, Massey, Bracket Matrix.
Added Torvik, KU also jumped up after last night’s win.
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The next time I watch one of our 3 pt shots come up short while the shooter stays outside the arc, I am probably going to hurt myself hitting the tv.
The only person who has direct knowledge of a shot’s likely distance is the shooter. Follow your short shot, get the rebound.
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@mayjay said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
The next time I watch one of our 3 pt shots come up short while the shooter stays outside the arc, I am probably going to hurt myself hitting the tv.
The only person who has direct knowledge of a shot’s likely distance is the shooter. Follow your short shot, get the rebound.
I’d guess coaching and game plan come into play here. Self has likely drilled into their heads that certain positions/players have to or be ready to leak back to stop any breaks.
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Two positive notes on 3 pt shooting so far.
Jalen Wilson is well on his way to a career year shooting from 3. Currently at 35.7% on 20 makes, he had 40 makes as a freshman & 30 makes as a Sophomore. We are 9 games into the season and he’s already halfway to his career best. He’s improved his shot a lot. I also think he’s capable of shooting 75%+ from the line, currently at 73%. Jalen’s already been to the FT line 56 times & is on pace for over 200 attempts on the season which would double his career best.
McCullar sitting at 37% from 3 on the season (10/27). As a career 30% shooter from 3 before coming to KU this is huge. His shot looked great last night from the right corner. Also trending to set career best marks on makes and %. Positive stuff for Kevin.
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After last yr, I am really pleasantly surprised with JW! I think Och was a great influence on him.
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@mayjay said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
The next time I watch one of our 3 pt shots come up short while the shooter stays outside the arc, I am probably going to hurt myself hitting the tv.
The only person who has direct knowledge of a shot’s likely distance is the shooter. Follow your short shot, get the rebound.
Guaranteed that’s deliberate on Self’s part as part of his team philosophy for this season. No team, unless they’re just absolutely clueless, which this group isn’t, is that bad without it being intentional strategy to get back on defense.
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Self usually has a number he sends back, depending on who they play.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 I would buy that explanation if the shooters were breaking the other way. They have just been stanfing there until the ball clanks. Often they get tovthe other end after the ball. Thus…grrrrr.
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Updated post Methzu beatdown!! Everyone likes us again. Thanks Methy!
Points
Jalen continues his torrid pace. He is 6th in D1 in scoring at 22.1ppg, 32nd in rebounds per game at 9.4 per. Top 3 player in the Country and its not debatable anymore. He has a great shot at 1,000 points Saturday against Indiana. Harris is tied for 8th nationally in assists per game. Gradey Dick is 6th nationally in freshman scoring per game. Kevin has a legit shot at 1,000 point club this season with his recent play.
PER
JANK’s 3 put him back on top where he belongs. Kevin is rising quickly to really good status.
KENPOM
We good?
OTHERS
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I wonder if Jank got extra points for the range of the three he hit? That thing was DEEP!! It was clearly a message that he’s still ready for the league.
Based on these stats I’d consider benching Harris and starting Jank in his place next game.
Little surprised KJ didn’t get more of a bump.
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Ken Pom is not to be trusted.
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What’s the o/u for Jalen’s first dunk?
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@wissox said in 2022-23 stats-PER, Kenpom etc:
Ken Pom is not to be trusted.
You certainly can’t predict results from his list. I’m always baffled where he comes up with strength of schedule. He has us 44th, and has Purdue 25th. We have played Dook, Wisconsin and Tennessee. Purdue has played Dook, Gonzaga, and Marquette. So, throw out Dook since we both beat them, and you have Tenn (6th) vs. Gonzaga (15th), and we have Wisky (22nd), vs. Marquette (unranked). They’ve also played a 2-9 FSU team. And they’re 19 spots ahead of us.
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@Jethro Yes, the SOS thing is baffling. It really doesn’t like teams that play defense is my observation. Wisconsin plays D but doesn’t exactly play UNLV Tarkball. So currently they sit 35th, while they have a 3-1 record against teams ahead of them, with the 1 loss of course being the OT defeat to us. Obviously then Wake Forest says well we beat Wiscy and they’re up there ahead of us so what gives? It’s why, I think, there needs to be some human element, as there is of course. I hate Iowa as much as any college out there and KP loves them. Iowa hasn’t visited the Sweet 16 since last century, heck, last millenium. Yet KP will keep them up there.
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Should be a fun update.
