Silence of the flock
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I didn’t mention the Hunter Mickelson, Sam Cunliffe, Dwight Coleby, Mario Little’s of the world. Transfers are hit and miss as you noted. I think Remy and Yesufu were great additions from the portal and will prove to be the exceptions. Remy with 4 years proven in the Pac-12, torched KU once. Yesufu was so fun to watch in the NCAA tournament and torched USC, a team that made us look like a bunch of 8th graders. He’s got some Moxy to him that I’m excited to see how it all fits here.
Agree on Dedric. He was statistically really good but for me underwhelmed in many areas I thought he’d excel at here. That was a weird squad. The injury to Doke & the drama with Vick ruined a lot of it.
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@Marco said in Silence of the flock:
@BShark what happened to Newman, is he playing overseas?
Yeah, he has really bounced around. Seems like he will have a long career but not at any one place.
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@BeddieKU23 said in Silence of the flock:
I didn’t mention the Hunter Mickelson, Sam Cunliffe, Dwight Coleby, Mario Little’s of the world. Transfers are hit and miss as you noted. I think Remy and Yesufu were great additions from the portal and will prove to be the exceptions. Remy with 4 years proven in the Pac-12, torched KU once. Yesufu was so fun to watch in the NCAA tournament and torched USC, a team that made us look like a bunch of 8th graders. He’s got some Moxy to him that I’m excited to see how it all fits here.
Agree on Dedric. He was statistically really good but for me underwhelmed in many areas I thought he’d excel at here. That was a weird squad. The injury to Doke & the drama with Vick ruined a lot of it.
With the rules change I think things are going to be a lot different going forward. We are basically going to see the lower levels of college hoops turn into feeders for the big boys. We already saw that this offseason with the likes of Kansas, Kentucky, Michigan State, Michigan etc take in players from low leagues that are expected to have very real roles and/or start.
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I think most of our transfers have a solid track record behind them already. Quite a bit different than other transfers from our past. Not sure about Martin because of his play being in D2, but I like what I see in game footage. Obviously, Remy is on another level. That shows why he already is recognized so highly in the Big 12.
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Remy and Coleman-Lands are probably the safest bets as far as expectations go among the transfers because they’re both coming from other P5 schools and have enough of a track record that we can pretty much pencil in their expectations. Remy is a legit B12 POY and I’ll even say he’s got a shot at NPOY if he duplicates his ASU numbers here and KU remains top 5 for most of the season. JCL will be a solid role player that gets good minutes.
Yesufu is much more of a wild card because he is stepping up a level in competition. We know how good he can be against good teams, the question with Yesufu will be consistency.
Cam is the biggest question mark among the transfers in this class because of how big of a step up he’s taking in level of competition.
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https://twitter.com/mctait/status/1449102559977816071
Remy saying the right things at least. More on Tait’s timeline.
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@BShark agree. How long before the smaller schools in unison all try to get the new transfer rules squashed? Because without question, they have basically become farm teams.
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If we stay healthy it is hard not to see us being a very dominant team this year. Question will be consistency. How will we do after we drop a couple? Good signs in preseason practices. Guys seem to be focused and working hard. Also… I am not sniffing out a troublemaker in our new crop of players.
Maybe only distraction is URP? Please someone tell me these jackarses wouldn’t punish this team during the season!
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@drgnslayr The real question is ALWAYS how will a team deal with adversity. Someone will get hurt, we may lose some games we weren’t supposed to, distractions happen. Seems like this year we could have the talent. If that shapes up to be true then it’s just about gelling and taking on each challenge as it comes.
I still worry about Dave as a legit leader and reliable advantage each game. I just don’t see how his mobility increases to the point where he is definitely better than most of the guys he goes up against.
I’m also concerned, as others mentioned, about the transfers fitting in to Self’s system. It traditionally taken time for most to adjust and freedom and creativity are not always at the top of the list of skills rewarded with playing time and trust from the head coach.
Totally agree that a systematic use of a press is a pipe dream. A trapping press just isn’t how self sees basketball working. What I do see is guards picking up there man nearly full court but especially 3/4 court. Harris in particular is a proven ball hawk and can at least cause some stress on opposing guards as they simply try to bring the ball up the court. If Harris can find a partner in creating havoc it could be a fun year. It’s really too bad he and Garrett couldn’t muster enough offensive threats to play A LOT together to build that kind of chemistry. Remember, Mario couldn’t have made all those steals and been in all those passing lanes without russ rob adding pressure. In this same subject, Dave’s defense needs to take a step forward (which it started to last year) so that the guards can have some freedom to gamble knowing if they miss it’s not an auto bucket.
Basically I still see this season going as Dave goes and that makes me nervous. Hopeful, but nervous.
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@benshawks08 how many minutes do you see Cam Martin getting?
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He will certainly get minutes and was a highly coveted talent. But tbh I just haven’t watched enough of him to know whether he is truly a Self style guard. Just looking at stats, the 1 foul per game is something that stood out to be as a possible issue as that could indicate a lack of physicality on the defensive end but again, not an expert on Martin so I’m in wait and see mode on him. Hasn’t he been hurt this off season?
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@benshawks08 My bad, I was talking about Cam. I’ve amended my post.
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@Marco yeah going to be honest that he’s a big unknown for me. I would imagine he will get some minutes early to see how it goes but I’d imagine he has a pretty short leash. Self has adjusted to playing small over the last few years and has seemed willing to put more guards on the floor if that’s where the talent is.
Obviously Dave isn’t playing 40 minutes a game so someone has to get some of those minutes but I’m not plugged in enough on the new guys to really guess who that’d be.
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@Marco said in Silence of the flock:
@benshawks08 My bad, I was talking about Cam. I’ve amended my post.
I’d forgotten we had 2 Martins…
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Can’t wait! I am a fan no matter what. I’ve stayed abreast of developments in transfers and think we can go 8 deep for sure…maybe 10??? We’ll see if Coach has loosened up on his tried and true fashion we have labored through in years past. Excited to see how he forms the team! Happy Homecoming!!
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Great post and I agree.
I’m probably more optimistic because we have so much experience on this team and I feel certain Remy is going to step up big time to run the show. We have most of our key players back and then surrounded them with mostly experienced players.
I think Dave’s role will change quite a bit. We won’t be counting on him as much this year… mostly because we have a legit PG who will be a playmaker. Remy should help all our guys’ games. I think Harris will be considerably improved, too… and he has shown us sparks of being a playmaker.
Cam offers us a nice change up from Dave. Maybe we have a game where Dave is off or being controlled on his limited offensive game. Cam can come in and stretch the floor. He should be easy to use on the perimeter with pick and pops. Dave is more pick and roll and then had to finish near the rim. And though Cam’s defense is in question… but to some degree, so is Dave’s.
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@benshawks08 bro, I forget sometimes too. I think that Cam is going to play about 10 or 11 mpg. He can shoot from deep, and factor in that Coach bigtime recruited Clemence who at 6’10 can also shoot. I’m thinking that Bill is going to start mixing things up some from here on.
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Pre-season Kenpom just dropped, KU checking in at #3. Obviously doesn’t mean too much, but nice to see.
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Seems a little high on B10 teams.
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@KirkIsMyHinrich they are definitely high on something, and I’m not so sure that it’s just B1G teams…
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Hopefully Dave can play about 25-27 minutes a game and more in big games. Keeping out of foul trouble was an issue for him later in the season. I definitely see this as one of the bigger things to watch because of how much of a drop off there’s likely to be to the next guy. Maybe Cam surprises us making the jump to D-1.
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Just from Late night, I thought Big Dave looked a lil more jumpier, more athletic. Anxious to see if that’s true. Dunking seemed easier.
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Maybe it was the hair but he did look a little more sleek in build. Got up nice on a few dunks . Guy has transformed his body and probably is about as maxed out athletically as he’ll be here. If he can play 25-27 minutes a night we’ll know that he made big strides in his last year
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Dave has worked hard the whole time he has been at Kansas… including through the summer… really working on his conditioning. I expect him to be a little faster and that will help his footwork some.
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Did you all see the video of big Dave making the full court shot? It was actually impressive because it didn’t look entirely lucky.
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Well remember, he didn’t miss a single 3 pt shot last year!
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https://www.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/university-of-kansas/article255177727.html
I feel like this could be the key issue all season. This is a good explanation of the selfs way va freedom to play dilemma.
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@benshawks08 I am definitely looking forward to seeing how this team shakes out. Coach likes to be in control, and it has served both him and we the fans well. Interesting that he specifically names Remy while bringing up Mason in context. He’s basically saying, “don’t overthink it, if you can make the shot take it, if not pass the ball.”
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Great read from Jesse. Also shows how Self is in a constant learning situation himself.
I suspect we will start the year with last year’s guys starting, minus Marcus plus a mix of Remy and DaJuan.
What an advantage we have is we can run all returning players in proper positions and slowly give minutes out by how well the new guys perform.
Also liked how Self discusses adding more players to the regular minutes list. After further discussion it sounds like he is just talking about adding 1 more guy… to have a rotation as many as 10.
Sounds like we need to redshirt more than one. If we don’t, we probably lose at least a couple guys to the portal. That isn’t necessarily a bad thing. The times have changed… so players move from team-to-team more but that also gives coaches a chance to replace players easily.
A big key to future success is learning how to educate players faster into your system. This will absolutely be paramount moving on into the future.
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@drgnslayr said in Silence of the flock:
Great read from Jesse. Also shows how Self is in a constant learning situation himself.
I suspect we will start the year with last year’s guys starting, minus Marcus plus a mix of Remy and DaJuan.
What an advantage we have is we can run all returning players in proper positions and slowly give minutes out by how well the new guys perform.
Also liked how Self discusses adding more players to the regular minutes list. After further discussion it sounds like he is just talking about adding 1 more guy… to have a rotation as many as 10.
Sounds like we need to redshirt more than one. If we don’t, we probably lose at least a couple guys to the portal. That isn’t necessarily a bad thing. The times have changed… so players move from team-to-team more but that also gives coaches a chance to replace players easily.
A big key to future success is learning how to educate players faster into your system. This will absolutely be paramount moving on into the future.
Cuffe and Adam’s are the two guys who should redshirt. Cuffed has lost out on a lot of games because of the Covid situation, not his fault, and he has several players in front of him on the depth chart currently so him redshirting seems like the safest bet. KJ Adams also has several players in front of him on the depth chart and his ranking suggests he also needs time to develop and work on his body so he would make a lot of sense to redshirt. The other 12 guys all have a reasonable path to minutes.
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Sounds logical to me.
Question… with this transfer portal… seems obvious players may be lost easier.
Also seems easier to snag decent, experienced talent.
Isn’t just turning smaller schools into talent farms?
Maybe we redshirt two. Take a hard look at where they are later in the year. If they don’t look like minutes players Self advises them to transfer. Meanwhile… he brings in a new batch!
Am I seeing this wrong?
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@drgnslayr said in Silence of the flock:
Sounds logical to me.
Question… with this transfer portal… seems obvious players may be lost easier.
Also seems easier to snag decent, experienced talent.
Isn’t just turning smaller schools into talent farms?
Maybe we redshirt two. Take a hard look at where they are later in the year. If they don’t look like minutes players Self advises them to transfer. Meanwhile… he brings in a new batch!
Am I seeing this wrong?
I’m just going to say it… While we have more than benefited from the new transfer rule, the smaller schools are being put at a serious disadvantage. I don’t think the rule will last for long.
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@drgnslayr said in Silence of the flock:
Sounds logical to me.
Question… with this transfer portal… seems obvious players may be lost easier.
Also seems easier to snag decent, experienced talent.
Isn’t just turning smaller schools into talent farms?
Maybe we redshirt two. Take a hard look at where they are later in the year. If they don’t look like minutes players Self advises them to transfer. Meanwhile… he brings in a new batch!
Am I seeing this wrong?
I don’t think it changes Self’s approach very much in regards to players already on his roster. Maybe Kyle Cuffe transfers out because it could be awhile before he sees big minutes with Harris, Yesufu, and Pettiford all capable PG’s already here and none looking like early exit candidates. That combined with how little he’s played recently could hinder his development and he ends up at a lower level. Maybe Adams or Clemence, but I would say those two would be more likely after year two based on the class KU has coming next year if either Adams or Clemence fails to crack the rotation in 2022-23. 2022-23 is looking like it could be be very young team at the 4 and 5 spots.
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That is part of why I thought they would maybe go transfer to get a big. It will be very interesting to see who wins those starting jobs for sure.
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@BShark said in Silence of the flock:
That is part of why I thought they would maybe go transfer to get a big. It will be very interesting to see who wins those starting jobs for sure.
I’d love to see Clemence and Udeh being the starters at the 4 and 5 spots respectively next season if both Wilson and McCormack are gone which seems pretty likely at this point.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 me too. No one is really talking about Clemence though, why? Udeh and Clemence as our bigs, I’d take that all day everyday. Point would be Yesufu(?), Dick a more athletic version of Svi and Zuby factoring in too … That’s not even mentioning the others, Pettiford etc.
But anyway, I digress, can’t wait for this season to start.
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So we have URP still looming…
Why do we seem to be in a rhythm of recruiting better talent recently? Or am I just seeing this through more optimistic eyes?!
From everything I read… it makes me wonder if Self becoming a HOF is now paying off big dividends.
I know we haven’t landed that very top shelf elite recruit… but I see that as a plus and I think, deep down, Self does, too. It seems like recruiting in those players shows desperation. Filling in starting role gaps with freshmen seems desperate to me.
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@Marco said in Silence of the flock:
@Texas-Hawk-10 me too. No one is really talking about Clemence though, why? Udeh and Clemence as our bigs, I’d take that all day everyday. Point would be Yesufu(?), Dick a more athletic version of Svi and Zuby factoring in too … That’s not even mentioning the others, Pettiford etc.
But anyway, I digress, can’t wait for this season to start.
I think Harris would actually handle the majority of the PG duties with Yesufu mostly playing the 2 in 2022-23. The good thing about how Self is building is that a lot of players expected to be on the roster in 2022-23 can play multiple positions. Yesufu and Pettiford can both play the 1 and 2 spots, Braun can play the 2-4 spots, MJ Rice if he makes it here can play the 2/3, Zuby and KJ can play the 3/4, Clemence can play the 4/5 spots. To me, Harris, Cuffe, Dick, and Udeh are the only players who are basically one position players.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 You see Dick as a one position player?
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@Marco With his size and stroke Dick seems like a good fit at the 3. If you see Self putting Dick in at multiple positions, I think it will be bad news.
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Size and stroke
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@approxinfinity said in Silence of the flock:
@Marco With his size and stroke Dick seems like a good fit at the 3. If you see Self putting Dick in at multiple positions, I think it will be bad news.
There is so much phrasing here my God
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@BShark you’ve been to to many Dicks!
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@Crimsonorblue22 said in Silence of the flock:
@BShark you’ve been to to many Dicks!
OH MY GOD PHRASING
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Yeah redshirting is no longer something coaches have leverage over a player to stick around and develop with the one-time transfer rule the way it is. Before a redshirt kind of locked them in because if they transferred after a redshirt year they still had another sit-out year in most cases wherever they went. Now redshirting doesn’t really bind a player to KU. No idea how you massage a situation like that anymore.
Hopefully the 4 freshman have patience because after this year every one of them has a chance at PT in 22. KU is going to be extremely inexperienced and young the way the roster is shaping up. Braun, Yesufu & Harris the only locks to come back that will be in the rotation. Perhaps KU can make Jalen stick another year but we’re hearing the opposite. If the freshman return & all 4 incoming recruits make it to campus Self has 2 open spots to fill in the spring (assuming Wilson goes pro). Can imagine he’ll be hitting the portal for an experienced wing & big to balance out all that youth.
This year is kind of a catch 22 situation. The roster is so deep none of the freshman may play outside mop up minutes. But next year those same kids will be in the starting lineup/rotation with very little experience which isn’t ideal either. Usually those freshman have a better chance at PT their first year which accelerates the development curve for them. I see 22/23 as a real transition/rebuild year.
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Dicksportinggoods?
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At least the backcourt should be solid enough in 22. Harris/Yesufu/Pettiford/Cuffe in the 1-2 spots with Braun/Dick/Rice/Adams for the wing/forward spots. I wouldn’t be surprised if Self was on the hunt for a high scoring guard transfer in the spring.
The real intrigue will be in the post. Clemence/Adams/Udeh/Ejiofer. Again I can see Self looking for a veteran to help these young guys along.
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I really like the look of the back court and don’t think they need an immediate impact transfer there tbh.
