so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already
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@RockkChalkk said in so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already:
@DanR yeah, forcing people to give up the core fundamental for why this country was founded because of a cold that 99% of people recover from is such a brilliant idea. All those covid free dictatorships out there are such a shining beacon of hope for what we should aspire to be.
My 50-something year old mom is in rough shape with this “cold” and another friend (college baseball player, so not some diabetic boomer) has lost his taste and smell for months (and has lost a ton of weight because eating makes him nauseous) so with all due respect, this is a bad take. People really should take the necessary precarious, and if they choose not to and put others at risk, government should step in.
On the hoops side, I kind of like Slick Rick’s idea to delay everything to after the first of the year when hopefully a vaccine is available (for at least some part of the population) and we have the tournament in May after even more people can get inoculated. Might be our best shot at an uninterrupted season.
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It will be hard to get through the full season without at least a few hiccups. Not every school is positioned like KU to isolate their basketball teams in a single dorm. That means more exposure. You would also need to essentially “bubble” everyone (managers, coaches, training staff, etc.) that would otherwise come into contact with the team to avoid exposure. With cases going up so fast in so many places, chances of avoiding exposure for 15 different people is pretty tough if they are having contact with outside individuals.
Someone I know that works in the medical community told me that they are not expecting a vaccine to be available to first responders until early Spring at best, which means it probably won’t be available generally until mid to late summer at the earliest. The other thing we don’t know is how long immunity lasts post vaccine. Flu shots last 10-12 weeks. If this is at all similar, that means we need a shot roughly every two months to protect the population. That’s six doses a year. Multiply by the population (350M in U.S. alone) and that’s over 2B shots needed in a year.
Every plan I have seen is to distribute about 100M shots. If those go to first responders, that’s probably only a year’s worth of doses for that group. Suffice it to say, a vaccine is not coming to save us, or at least isn’t going to save us next Spring.
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I think Moderna will have theirs out sooner, and can be stored easier. If this is just the sniffles to anyone, no need to take the vaccine from others or take a bed from over crowded hospitals.
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@FarmerJayhawk praying for your mom!
it’s really bad here!
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I’m currently dealing with 7 friends who are positive for Covid. Only two had heavy symptoms. One had to be hospitalized but is now released.
It’s a mistake to view this as harmless because only 1 or 2% are fatal especially because of the level of contagiousness.
I carefully watch the positivity rate. That gives us an indication of how widespread the virus is and if we are doing enough testing. This rate is growing rapidly in most places throughout America. Meanwhile, hospital beds, personnel and supplies are running extremely low. If you just look at known confirmed test positives then add in a couple lag time weeks… we are headed for a disaster in ERs and ICUs.
Because we have fatigue and we did take earlier measures to setup field locations, we are now not moving to prepare for what is coming within the next 30 days. I hope I’m wrong, but I see a major catastrophe coming and I don’t expect any schools anywhere to remain open.
I don’t expect our season to happen. I’m not even sure we get started.
The vaccine potential looks promising, but not having an impact until spring or later, maybe end of next year.
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@Crimsonorblue22 said in so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already:
@FarmerJayhawk praying for your mom!
it’s really bad here!Thank you! It looks like a lot of the rural part of the state is really getting hammered. I heard Children’s Mercy took all of KU Med’s pediatric patients to free up beds for covid. Be safe out there, folks.
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@FarmerJayhawk hope your mom is OK. Scary.
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@approxinfinity thank you, sir. I talked to her over lunch and she’s in good spirits. More than anything she’s mad she can’t taste her coffee.
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@justanotherfan said in so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already:
It will be hard to get through the full season without at least a few hiccups. Not every school is positioned like KU to isolate their basketball teams in a single dorm. That means more exposure. You would also need to essentially “bubble” everyone (managers, coaches, training staff, etc.) that would otherwise come into contact with the team to avoid exposure. With cases going up so fast in so many places, chances of avoiding exposure for 15 different people is pretty tough if they are having contact with outside individuals.
Someone I know that works in the medical community told me that they are not expecting a vaccine to be available to first responders until early Spring at best, which means it probably won’t be available generally until mid to late summer at the earliest. The other thing we don’t know is how long immunity lasts post vaccine. Flu shots last 10-12 weeks. If this is at all similar, that means we need a shot roughly every two months to protect the population. That’s six doses a year. Multiply by the population (350M in U.S. alone) and that’s over 2B shots needed in a year.
Every plan I have seen is to distribute about 100M shots. If those go to first responders, that’s probably only a year’s worth of doses for that group. Suffice it to say, a vaccine is not coming to save us, or at least isn’t going to save us next Spring.
ya they wee talking about here in Shawnee Co that the 1st vaccine will go to our front line health workers, have heard ANY Vaccine is many months away
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Well HELL just since I got on this site like 15 minutes ago my daughter called and told us her ex son-in-law tested positive for the COVID. Which means my little 3 year old Grandson has been exposed and is going to have to quarintine - that’s just great - - keeping my fingers crossed, just means my daughter , her boyfriend , and all his kids also have been exposed
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Can’t taste or smell? Oh the humanity! The obvious answer is that government must step in and shut down all schools and stunt our kids’ growth, force people to lose their businesses/livelihoods/jobs by closing restaurants, businesses, etc. that they have worked their lives to build because some people temporarily can’t taste their coffee. I hope that comes off as insensitive to many of you because its meant to be a bit of a wake up call. This is a politically exaggerated virus and a lot of people have fallen into the trap. Of course there are very real concerns about people’s heath that need to be taken seriously (the elderly, high risk people) just like every year with the flu, and i genuinely hope anyone that is struggling with the virus fully recovers. However i just don’t think the rest of the world should be forced to grind to a halt over such a small percent of people that have serious issues.
Our family circle has had about a dozen people we know get C19, most had mild to no symptoms. Others said it was worse than a common cold but not as bad as the flu. Another actually had C19 and the flu at the same time and just said it was a little rough, a few days of bad headaches, but was back to work in a few weeks. On the other hand, i have a friend that owns a very popular daycare franchise, multiple locations, that has gone from very successful and thinking about early retirement to now be on the verge of bankruptcy. I’ve spoken to owners of many local businesses we love that say if round 2 of shutdowns was to hit our state (which it appears to be happening) that they definitely won’t survive.
Ironically, allergies force me to lose my taste and smell every year. I guess it never occurred to me to just stay inside my house, stop living my life, and hide until allergy season is over because of the horror of losing my taste and smell. No offense to anyone but if the worst thing you have is temporarily losing your taste and smell, you’re doing pretty good. Enjoy your life and don’t let minor setbacks stop you from doing it.
Its a good time to come back Jaybate so i can maybe get at least one upvote!
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There is no good solution.
Either you let thousands die and put more people out of work or you save thousands and hurt the quality of life of hundreds of thousands.
It is, however, disingenuous to say you only lose your taste and smell. But you knew that when you wrote this. Diminishing the disease to make it sound less than it is to justify your reasoning for choosing thousands dead instead of a short term economic hit. It is to make yourself feel better when you look in the mirror. But the “other side” is doing the same thing to justify putting people out of work. There is no clear and correct choice.
Nobody, and I mean nobody, wants to close businesses just to close businesses. The choice is basically saying if you could only save your child or your wife which one would you choose?
Below is an excerpt from the show “Blacklist” which was written before Covid, but I think of it all the time now.
Red: You know, many ancient cultures shares a common figure, a god or demon who brought disease to humanity. The Finns called her Loviatar, the Yoruba people knew her as Shapona. The Greeks of course immortalized Pandora. Odd that they’re always women. Have you ever heard of Mary Mallon? Liz: Should I have? Red: She was a cook for the New York elite in the late 19th Century. When an alarming number of high society swells came down with typhoid fever, a research scientist traced the outbreak to a woman with the rare ability to carry the disease without suffering its effects or exhibiting any outward symptoms. Earning her the name– Liz: Typhoid Mary. Red: Correct. You’re looking for an asymptomatic carrier of Luschen’s Disease. To find your suspect, you need to know when and where was the outbreak that she survived. And, hurry. There’s a reason the plague-bringers were the most feared among the ancient deities.
This just reminds me that diseases have to be taken seriously as they have literally wiped out entire civilizations. While we know covid isn’t going to do that, we do understand it will infect millions, put hospitals at capacity, and is lethal to a certain faction of society. Boris Johnson and Donald Trump literally had to go to the hospital because of this. What if Trump or Johnson had died? This virus was thiiiis close to causing a potential shift in world power. I’m sure DT and BJ went to the hospital just because they couldn’t smell or taste.
On the bright side, we are probably 200 days away from a mass produced vaccine. And we will have the agility to reduce the impact of the next pandemic due to major advances in RNA vaccine technology which is going to be proven to be both extremely effective, but also more agile and easier to scale than previous vaccine technology. While the storage and logistics challenges it presents right now are certainly an issue, RNA technology is going to be an arms race here over the next five years and we will see drastic improvements.
For what its worth, this is also an opportunity to find new interests and hobbies, if we are encouraging people to do things. I went from not knowing hardly anything about tools to now having completely renovated a 1950s house.
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@RockkChalkk said in so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already:
Can’t taste or smell? Oh the humanity! The obvious answer is that government must step in and shut down all schools and stunt our kids’ growth, force people to lose their businesses/livelihoods/jobs by closing restaurants, businesses, etc. that they have worked their lives to build because some people temporarily can’t taste their coffee. I hope that comes off as insensitive to many of you because its meant to be a bit of a wake up call. This is a politically exaggerated virus and a lot of people have fallen into the trap. Of course there are very real concerns about people’s heath that need to be taken seriously (the elderly, high risk people) just like every year with the flu, and i genuinely hope anyone that is struggling with the virus fully recovers. However i just don’t think the rest of the world should be forced to grind to a halt over such a small percent of people that have serious issues.
Our family circle has had about a dozen people we know get C19, most had mild to no symptoms. Others said it was worse than a common cold but not as bad as the flu. Another actually had C19 and the flu at the same time and just said it was a little rough, a few days of bad headaches, but was back to work in a few weeks. On the other hand, i have a friend that owns a very popular daycare franchise, multiple locations, that has gone from very successful and thinking about early retirement to now be on the verge of bankruptcy. I’ve spoken to owners of many local businesses we love that say if round 2 of shutdowns was to hit our state (which it appears to be happening) that they definitely won’t survive.
Ironically, allergies force me to lose my taste and smell every year. I guess it never occurred to me to just stay inside my house, stop living my life, and hide until allergy season is over because of the horror of losing my taste and smell. No offense to anyone but if the worst thing you have is temporarily losing your taste and smell, you’re doing pretty good. Enjoy your life and don’t let minor setbacks stop you from doing it.
Its a good time to come back Jaybate so i can maybe get at least one upvote!
Yawn. Sorry. Didn’t wake up. Like the now well over 300,000 people who died from this “cold.”
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how would you like this ? - -Was on Good Morning America this Morning. A Lady out of El Paso Texas has lost 6 family members to the COVID. - Her Mother , Her farther , 2 Cousins & her Nephew. - - - She said it’s pure hell to live through when they come out and say how sorry that her Farther had passed away from the COVID - - then less then an hour later they come back out and say your Mother has passed away from the COVID - - -same dam day.
Then we have People who wanna just brush this off as a nuisance a incovience - that’s just sad.
Like the nurse said until people want to start to follow guidelines then it’s only getting worse, - - she says it’s now a matter where it has come down to an issue of respect
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@RockkChalkk you are right that there is a debate to be had about whether destroying the economy and the livelihood of many is worth the lives lost to stay open. But by falsely representing the mortality of the disease while belittling it, you are framing the debate in a way that is ugly. If you ease up a little on trying to frame the argument for lock down as being people who don’t want to lose their sense of taste, I think the conversation will be more fruitful. You have to recognize that your opposition comes from a place they think is valid if you want to change their mind.
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Lock downs saves lives and numbers of infections. When lockdowns happen, some people say, see, why are we locking down, not that many people are getting sick or dying. They’re like the person taking medication for whatever ailment it is, let’s say high blood pressure. The meds keeps it lower, person says, see, I don’t need these meds so I’ll stop taking them. Weeks later person suffers heart attack. It’s really the same.
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Good morning Bucketeers, thanks for not beating me up too bad. I’ve been following this site for a loooong time and its part of my daily ritual to check in and read about our beloved Jayhawks. Even though the responses have been mostly civil i really don’t enjoy having any disagreements with posters on here that have become some of my favorites to read each day.
At the end of the day, this whole C-19 debate comes down to each individual’s perspective and whats most important to their family. Mine is from a middle ageish person with young kids and a family circle focused in the medical field. While i could continue the back and forth about why coronaviruses are a classification of viruses considered one of the causes of the common cold, its not worth going down this hole. I hold a lot of people on this site in high regard and don’t want my perspective on the issue to be taken as though I am diminishing the significance of the pandemic.
There is always a second side of the coin. Lockdowns save lives (C19; flu; fewer car accidents) but also destroy lives (Jobs; Businesses Lost; Stunted Education, Divorces; Drugs). America being the land of the free has always let you choose what side of the coin you want to be on until recently. NFL and MLB let the players decide, several decided to opt out and keep themselves away from greater exposure potential. That was their choice and nobody should fault them for it. But now government decides for you which can be a slippery slope. You may like what side the government chose for you this time but you might not like it the next time. Once we relinquish our decision making power its tough to get it back. I mean, haven’t we all seen what happened with Skynet in The Terminator?
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@RockkChalkk said in so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already:
Good morning Bucketeers, thanks for not beating me up too bad. I’ve been following this site for a loooong time and its part of my daily ritual to check in and read about our beloved Jayhawks. Even though the responses have been mostly civil i really don’t enjoy having any disagreements with posters on here that have become some of my favorites to read each day.
At the end of the day, this whole C-19 debate comes down to each individual’s perspective and whats most important to their family. Mine is from a middle ageish person with young kids and a family circle focused in the medical field. While i could continue the back and forth about why coronaviruses are a classification of viruses considered one of the causes of the common cold, its not worth going down this hole. I hold a lot of people on this site in high regard and don’t want my perspective on the issue to be taken as though I am diminishing the significance of the pandemic.
There is always a second side of the coin. Lockdowns save lives (C19; flu; fewer car accidents) but also destroy lives (Jobs; Businesses Lost; Stunted Education, Divorces; Drugs). America being the land of the free has always let you choose what side of the coin you want to be on until recently. NFL and MLB let the players decide, several decided to opt out and keep themselves away from greater exposure potential. That was their choice and nobody should fault them for it. But now government decides for you which can be a slippery slope. You may like what side the government chose for you this time but you might not like it the next time. Once we relinquish our decision making power its tough to get it back. I mean, haven’t we all seen what happened with Skynet in The Terminator?
Great post! It’s funny that your perspective is as a middle aged person with young kids and relatives in the medical field. Thats where I’m coming from as well! And while our perspectives differ I think we are probably feeling a lot of the same things. I sent my youngest back to daycare last week and he promptly got me sick bringing a crusty nose home from daycare. Sending him back was a relief that he was getting the attention he needs (it’s a nice day care with lots of outside time and attention) and dread that I was putting the whole family at much greater risk. And I realize that I’m lucky to even have this choice, as hard as it may seem. With infections back on the rise we are going to pull him back out. For just a couple weeks he got a chance to experience normal.
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As for the compromise of personal choice during a pandemic, I think we can agree that that many countries are dealing with a second surge. One conclusion I draw is that since we value our freedoms as individuals in a capitalist country, we need leaders that act with a conscience and are willing to work together with the country’s best interest at heart. If you look at the countries in the EU, they’ve been actively looking at what works for their neighbors and they have pretty uniformly adopted lockdowns to combat the new surge. As far as I see it, we have a choice. Either lock down again or let the virus rage out of control well before a vaccine is available. Unfortunately when your people aren’t equipped with adequate ppe and also believe it’s a personal choice whether they want to use it or not, there aren’t any good choices, but there is a least bad option.
While liberals typically find themselves on the side of explaining more complicated solutions to more complicated problems, here they find themselves aligned with a “simple” problem and a simple solution (lock down and don’t die) and simple usually has an easier time capturing the hearts and minds. However, I do think there is merit to all of the problems you enumerate that come from the lockdown. They are just much harder to quantify than a higher death toll.
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just posted that this is getting beyond bad. They have brought in Mobile Morgue here in Topeka at the local hospital - -not good
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I thought this was a good look at how deadly COVID-19 really is with some good comparisons. Helps give some perspective to what 250,000 deaths really means.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/18/health/covid-19-deaths-us-250k-trnd/index.html
Some might look at this and say, “See, heart disease and cancer kill more per year than coronavirus but we don’t shut down the economy for that…” but heart disease and cancer aren’t contagious.
And @RockkChalkk I’m not trying to be rude but this “At the end of the day, this whole C-19 debate comes down to each individual’s perspective and whats most important to their family.” comes off to me as selfish. This whole thing continues to spread because individuals are making decisions based on what is best for them rather than what is best for everyone. As a healthy, white, fully employed, fairly healthy 35(??) year old, my risk of death or even serious complications if I get the virus are fairly low. I could take risks knowing my well being would not be greatly affected by even a few weeks of some significant illness. The problem is because of how insanely contagious this virus is, those risks I might feel comfortable taking knowing my situation can have deadly impacts on people I don’t even know. There are examples over and over and over again of family gatherings, weddings, funerals, parties, etc, leading to hundreds of cases and deaths of people who never even attended the event.
I’m incredibly lucky to work at a school where 90% of the students have elected to attend remotely. I have between 0-4 kids in my in person classes every day. Even in this nearly IDEAL scenario for controlling the spread of the virus, the level of anxiety and vigilance I have to maintain is exhausting.
A kid needs help? All my training and experience says, go kneel next to them and figure out what they need. Problems with your computer? Let me show you which buttons to push to get to where you need to go.
Instead I have to keep my distance and explain from afar. Doesn’t seem like a big deal but try cooking an omelet from six feet away from the stove without touching the pan.
And those are the easy ones.
But if I don’t keep that vigilance, if I take risks I can be pretty sure won’t kill me, I could pass the virus to my student who lives with grandma who has diabetes but has to come to school in person because the internet at their house can’t handle he and his 3 siblings on a zoom call at the same time.
I’ve honestly come around since starting school that schools do need to be open as long as the spread at schools can be prevented (not sure how you do that when positivity rate starts skyrocketing like it is now). There are kids who need a school building to learn in, a teacher to interact with, and a safe place to get the support they need. But in order to do that we need to prioritize keeping schools open by shutting down non-essential business, operating remotely and utilizing curbside as much as possible, and WEARING A DAMN MASK, KEEPING DISTANCE, AND WASHING HANDS REGULARLY!
It really comes down to some simple questions.
Schools or bars? Schools or gyms? Schools or large gatherings bringing together multiple households?
We CAN keep schools safe, but we need everyone’s help and not just if it’s what’s best for your family.
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@benshawks08 that’s where the European countries that are locked down stand as well. They are prioritizing keeping schools open over businesses.
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@approxinfinity Yeah, and here it is really my school community more than any policy keeping people safe. Anyone who wanted to could come back to school right now. I have no idea how I would handle a full class of 30 students. Another school in our district had to shut down for a week after evidence of spread in the school. It is wholly NOT surprising considering from July-October, a group of parents from that school were at all the school board meetings arguing against remote learning, mask mandates at school, and any other restrictions on their “freedom.”
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Just curious . Here in Shawnee Co they have just put in force new health orders. All restaurants and bars have to close at 9:00 - ALL sports have been cancelled other then School , not sure what other one’s there would be other then School . Restaurants must run at 50 %
Reduced gatherings public or private - limiting to no more then 10 People , so like the one Comissoner said he didn’t want to punish people on private gatherings like for Thanksgiving.
So here is my question probably pretty crazy question BUT with this new order - - how in the hell are they planning on enforcing private gatherings such as Thanksgiving? - what are they going to do go door to door to EVERY HOUSE in the County and ask - - HEY how many people do you have in here? I don’t see any way in hell they going to be able to enforce this - - -pretty much the same if they decide a curfew or mask man date - how you going to enforce these things. - -You can’t stop every car to see if they have their mask - -crazy. - not saying I disagree just saying how you gonna enforce ?
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@jayballer67 basically people narcing on each other.
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@jayballer67 They also can’t monitor every highway to make sure people aren’t speeding. Than can notice when folks are recklessly endangering others say if one house has 15 cars in front of it or a person is reported by a business owner as refusing to wear a mask. As with any law, in my opinion, the goal should not be to catch and punish but to prevent, educate and redirect. Most people don’t get a ticket every time they get pulled over. Most noise complaints don’t end in arrests. But it is nice for say a police officer or health official to be able to say, “sorry sir, that is the law” and for that to be true.
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Here in Vermont the governor banned inter house gatherings among other things. Restaurants etc closed down by 10pm. Vt has consistently been last in case totals since early summer but has seen a dramatic rise of late which has forced people in charge into tough decisions.
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@FarmerJayhawk said in so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already:
@jayballer67 basically people narcing on each other.
ya your right about that but still I mean even if they do that - - what happens ? - -how or would they have to face some kind of penality or what ? - -I mean it’s really going to be hard to enforce and follow up
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@jayballer67 yeah, it would be a fine. Similar to a noise complaint type deal.
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@FarmerJayhawk said in so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already:
@jayballer67 yeah, it would be a fine. Similar to a noise complaint type deal.
Boy my friend just read from my local WIBW site here in Topeka , not sure where exactly your at but hee in Shawnee Co which is right next to Douglas Co and Lawrence here are the latest numbers that just came out today for the COVID - -if THIS doesn’t make you realize just how bad things have gotten - - I don’t know what will.
They have a health scorecard - well Shawnee Co just maxed out. The highest score you can have is a 24. Shawnee Co is at 24. they said the highest level possible for the COVID our weekly case incidence of over 1,ooo new cases - - a 17.5 positive test rate and a 95 % hospital occupancy rate - the cases rose from 783 to an uncontrolled 1,027 for the week of Nov 8-14
The pct of New Cases with no known source of infection from 17.7 % to an uncontrolled 92 %… Hosp occupancy rate went from 82.2 % to an uncontrolled 95 % - - -cases per week have increased 31 % from last week any positivity% over 10 % indicates heavy uncontrolled community transmisson. - - - Kansas is now the 5th most infectious State in the Nation
Do we REALLY think we will have a Basketball Season?
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@benshawks08 if acting in the best interests of my family over the interests of someone three degrees removed from me makes me selfish, call me selfish all day long i don’t care. My family wears our masks, takes germ spreading seriously, and try our best not to get ourselves or anyone else sick. They are my priority and always will be no matter what names people want to call me.
The ironic thing about this all is you are using your perspective as a teacher to diminish other people’s views and don’t even realize it. Its the same thing you called me selfish for. As a teacher, you are measuring the importance of school vs a bar or school vs a gym and saying school is unquestionably more important to “everyone.” Tell that to the families of the owners of the bar and gym that government has mandated must close their doors because their business isn’t important. Sorry sir, this business you worked your a$$ off to build, that provides income to feed and shelter your family, must close for an indeterminate amount of time because someone who comes here could possibly pickup the virus and then spread it to someone else who spreads it to someone else who spreads it to someone else that dies from it.
It goes beyond gyms and bars but you chose those examples to make your argument appear to be a simple choice. The small mom and pop retail stores that could be three generations of life savings put into the business are told they aren’t essential and must close until government says so. But their main competition - Target across the street is considered essential and can remain open. I could go buy a tennis racket at Dick’s Sporting Goods but can’t get a haircut. Apparently its considered acceptable risk if someone gets the virus from a Target store and spreads it to others but not if they get it from a gym and it spreads to others.
Its a tough situation and there isn’t a good answer that works well for everyone. Hopefully this vaccine is ready soon and things can get back to normal. This virus already stole a championship from our Hawks, hopefully it doesn’t take more games away from us. I mean, seeing them beat up on Kentucky sounds pretty essential to me!
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@RockkChalkk said in so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already:
@benshawks08 if acting in the best interests of my family over the interests of someone three degrees removed from me makes me selfish, call me selfish all day long i don’t care. My family wears our masks, takes germ spreading seriously, and try our best not to get ourselves or anyone else sick. They are my priority and always will be no matter what names people want to call me.
The ironic thing about this all is you are using your perspective as a teacher to diminish other people’s views and don’t even realize it. Its the same thing you called me selfish for. As a teacher, you are measuring the importance of school vs a bar or school vs a gym and saying school is unquestionably more important to “everyone.” Tell that to the families of the owners of the bar and gym that government has mandated must close their doors because their business isn’t important. Sorry sir, this business you worked your a$$ off to build, that provides income to feed and shelter your family, must close for an indeterminate amount of time because someone who comes here could possibly pickup the virus and then spread it to someone else who spreads it to someone else who spreads it to someone else that dies from it.
It goes beyond gyms and bars but you chose those examples to make your argument appear to be a simple choice. The small mom and pop retail stores that could be three generations of life savings put into the business are told they aren’t essential and must close until government says so. But their main competition - Target across the street is considered essential and can remain open. I could go buy a tennis racket at Dick’s Sporting Goods but can’t get a haircut. Apparently its considered acceptable risk if someone gets the virus from a Target store and spreads it to others but not if they get it from a gym and it spreads to others.
Its a tough situation and there isn’t a good answer that works well for everyone. Hopefully this vaccine is ready soon and things can get back to normal. This virus already stole a championship from our Hawks, hopefully it doesn’t take more games away from us. I mean, seeing them beat up on Kentucky sounds pretty essential to me!
And there’s why this thing isn’t going away. If you don’t care about people 3 degrees removed from you, than you don’t care about people in general and that may be fine for you but to me it’s the biggest problem in our culture today. To think that people 3 degrees removed have no bearing on your life, well-being and livelihood is just ignorant.
I’m not saying school is more important than bars because I’m a teacher. If you don’t think education is more important that being able to drink at a certain location rather than home than we obviously have vastly different views on what matters. I picked bars and gyms because they are proven places where the virus has spread. Grocery stores have to stay open because people need food and supplies. Restaurants can operate to-go and curbside. Not ideal for the business owners for sure but life is more important than profit. Target sells essential goods. Gyms do not. Bars do not. If a mom and pop store sells essential goods than they should stay open too.
There need to be services and support for those struggling financially amid a shut down but just letting things go as they are now is just unacceptable. Over 2000 people died from COVID yesterday in the U.S. I guess that’s fine for you as long as you didn’t know any of them.
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I think about the reaction to a deadly virus with shutdown as a market force. Those businesses relying entirely on indoor in person experiences have found themselves suddenly at the mercy of a market force that is crushing their business. It doesn’t mean that the market force needs to change, i.e. not shut down, it means that the businesses need to adapt if possible. I don’t think it just means trying to weather the problem. It means being creative. Are the gyms offering their members trainer led video sessions, that sort of thing. This is like a meteor hitting the earth and kicking off an ice age. A time for evolution. And yes that’s not fair, and the rich get richer for sure.
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@jayballer67 said
So here is my question probably pretty crazy question BUT with this new order - - how in the hell are they planning on enforcing private gatherings such as Thanksgiving?
I don’t think anyone will try to enforce the 10-person limit around the Thanksgiving table, but it does help give people a reason to call off the big family gathering if they are on the fence about it. As of last week, my mother-in-law was still trying to decide whether to have all 40 of us crammed into her house. She’s 81 years old and has some heart probs (AFib). Half the kids/grandkids told her it was a bad idea, and the other half thought it would be worth the risk. She finally gave in and cancelled when they issued the health order/recommendation. Half the kids can bitch about government overreach instead of blaming the other kids.
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I was thinking, if KU beats #1 Gonzaga next thursday, we might move up to #1 in the polls.
Then, if the season gets cancelled the following week, we’d end up #1 two years in a row!
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@DanR I like where your head is at!
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Hey all, I never know whether to weigh in on non-bball topics because…politics on the internet (sigh) But it feels good to talk about it so here goes. The latest & biggest-to-date study out of Denmark, a couple days ago, concluded what many of us already know: wearing a mask will not keep you from getting covid, and may/may not keep you from spreading it.
Personally, I got the vid while taking safety precautions from someone else who was doing the same. My assumption is that we’ll all be exposed eventually because the virus is in no hurry. It will wait. Statistically, the chances of dying from covid are 1/5000, with the great majority of those deaths folks 80 and older with comorbidities. To me, it makes sense to protect the senior citizens (those who want to be protected) while the rest of us take basic precautions and go on with our lives. Senior citizens deserve to choose whether they want to isolate and keep their families at bay. So do kids re: school. Kids 14 and under are impervious to this thing (under 100 deaths nationally). Shutting down schools “for the kids” is insane and won’t stop the virus anyway.
My small business was hit hard in the first round of lockdowns, so of course I have a vested interest. Round 2 may be the end, since I don’t have the luxury of staying home and drawing a paycheck. Asking—let’s be real, compelling—millions of small business owners to take a hit on behalf of those who can work remotely is crazy.
“If everyone masks up for a few weeks”…the virus will still be here. It’s not leaving.
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@ajvan said in so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already:
“If everyone masks up for a few weeks”…the virus will still be here. It’s not leaving.
Agree with this. The issue is that it seems some hospitals are being overwhelmed again in larger population areas.
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@ajvan That studies had all kinds of problems and was only published so that folks didn’t think it was being buried. Only 46% of the group who were supposed to always wear masks reported actually doing that…
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@BShark said in so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already:
@ajvan said in so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already:
“If everyone masks up for a few weeks”…the virus will still be here. It’s not leaving.
Agree with this. The issue is that it seems some hospitals are being overwhelmed again in larger population areas.
Here in Topeka they are in discussions of where to house Patients because of over flow/ Early talks of the Stor Mont Vail event Center - - the old Expo Center.
Just heard Dr Faucci said the Vaccine would be available in April. - -Lots of sickeness and positive cases and Deaths by April
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@DanR What would we be ranked if we lost to them and they cancelled the season?
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@approxinfinity those countries one and all are much smaller than we are and a hell of alot less populated.
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@Marco the total population of the EU is 447,706,209.
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The influx of the elderly into hospitals seems to indicate that we’re not doing a great job protecting our senior citizens. This isn’t a new problem and dates way back to when the virus first arrived and was allowed to run rampant in nursing homes.
Or, conversely, it indicates that they are sick of the preventive measures and prefer to take risks in order to see people they care about (like most of my neighbors and my own parents).
One thing it doesn’t do is make is a compelling case for shutting down schools, the economy, etc.
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@ajvan said in so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already:
The influx of the elderly into hospitals seems to indicate that we’re not doing a great job protecting our senior citizens. This isn’t a new problem and dates way back to when the virus first arrived and was allowed to run rampant in nursing homes.
Or, conversely, it indicates that they are sick of the preventive measures and prefer to take risks in order to see people they care about (like most of my neighbors and my own parents).
One thing it doesn’t do is make is a compelling case for shutting down schools, the economy, etc.
Would have to agree with this
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https://twitter.com/aslavitt/status/1330178507582939136?s=21
I’d love to live in a country where 1 persons life made for a compelling argument. I’d settle for a place where 1000s of live could do it. Instead we are in a place where 100s of thousands of lives just aren’t that compelling.
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Something positive to think about.
https://twitter.com/celeste_pewter/status/1330301996201631751?s=21
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My perspective on this seems to flow directly with my politics. I’m an independent, basically despise both major parties. I’ve never seen this virus as anything political. I have friends on both sides, and I vowed early on to not lose any of them over this issue. Still have them all. I have strong opinions in some areas, but I do my best to stay respectful at all times and try to see other sides of this.
I’m well-educated in the sciences and had years experience as a lab tech in one of the largest hospitals in Kansas when I was young and thinking medicine would be my life. I dealt with infectious disease daily and still give thanks to being well protected with PPE. I feel strongly that masks are very effective at slowing this virus down, especially N95 or better. I wear N95 today, try to keep social distancing (but not perfect) and don’t do the large gatherings. I’ve made it this far, but feel fortunate because my kids are my biggest source of risk, and their lives have created the need for three quarantines so far. I am the medical administrator of my 87 yr old father. I can not completely separate myself from his presence. He is high risk. Covid isn’t a game with me. Not a hoax. Not some bragging point for a political side. It’s a threat within my family and I respect it as a threat.
We can argue all we want until we are blue in the face, but I only have to state one word to defend my side… Taiwan! Google “Taiwan Covid” and you will receive an education on the right way to handle this virus and how our country failed miserably. I know Trump and his administration could have done better… but I don’t think any administration would have been able to do what we needed to do, which is what Taiwan did. Their secret weapon was having Chen Chien-jen (an Epidemiologist) as their VP. Their people are not so focused on independent liberties.
To date, Taiwan has suffered only 7 deaths with a population of 25 million. They had their first case around the same time as us, while receiving a higher traffic of Chinese mainland visitors. They’ve never shutdown their economy. Didn’t need to. Life goes on for them while we fight among ourselves.
My point is… science wins when we believe in it and play by the rules. Our only hope for getting our lives back is to back science. Our economy will not recover just by keeping it open. Most of the public does not have confidence to get out there and live like they once did. I know I don’t, and I can’t. I have too much at stake to risk people in my own family and also have no desire to spread it to others.
We have only begun to deal with this virus… many who have contracted Covid have developed chronic issues that may continue for the rest of their lives. Turns out Covid may actually be a vascular disease. All your organs are at risk for long term damage. That damage may show up now, or down the road. You can bet Covid is going to cost us financially for the rest of our lives. We are not even having those conversations yet. Google “long haulers” for a taste of chronic issues.
I am a business owner and I have been heavily impacted financially because of Covid. I totally agree that we need to do whatever we can to keep people from financial collapse. This is where the gov should be of more assistance. I’m not a socialist and have never taken a single free cent from our gov, and haven’t with this either. I don’t want free money. But I see it is necessary to help people at this time. Actually, it fits in my beliefs as a fiscal conservative to rescue people at this time as an investment in our long term stability.
Sometimes being a nation of individualists doesn’t pay off. Sometimes we need to come together with a single purpose. We once were a country that did that… but we aren’t any longer. Consider this virus the warning shot of something much more deadly ahead and we will again not listen to science and all do our own thing.
During WWII, my grandfather took my mother to Los Angeles so he could work for Lockheed Burbank. Because of the threat of Japanese bombings the city was on a blackout. You couldn’t even light a candle. The community came together. Renegades who didn’t follow orders (not many) were flogged. This is the America I like to remember… but it is gone. And if it isn’t this virus with it’s death rate of 1-2% but potential to kill 2+ million Americans, it will be the next one. Perhaps H1N5. We won’t have time to play games with that virus.
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@drgnslayr said in so looks like Covid starting to cause problems with basketball already:
My perspective on this seems to flow directly with my politics. I’m an independent, basically despise both major parties. I’ve never seen this virus as anything political. I have friends on both sides, and I vowed early on to not lose any of them over this issue. Still have them all. I have strong opinions in some areas, but I do my best to stay respectful at all times and try to see other sides of this.
I’m well-educated in the sciences and had years experience as a lab tech in one of the largest hospitals in Kansas when I was young and thinking medicine would be my life. I dealt with infectious disease daily and still give thanks to being well protected with PPE. I feel strongly that masks are very effective at slowing this virus down, especially N95 or better. I wear N95 today, try to keep social distancing (but not perfect) and don’t do the large gatherings. I’ve made it this far, but feel fortunate because my kids are my biggest source of risk, and their lives have created the need for three quarantines so far. I am the medical administrator of my 87 yr old father. I can not completely separate myself from his presence. He is high risk. Covid isn’t a game with me. Not a hoax. Not some bragging point for a political side. It’s a threat within my family and I respect it as a threat.
We can argue all we want until we are blue in the face, but I only have to state one word to defend my side… Taiwan! Google “Taiwan Covid” and you will receive an education on the right way to handle this virus and how our country failed miserably. I know Trump and his administration could have done better… but I don’t think any administration would have been able to do what we needed to do, which is what Taiwan did. Their secret weapon was having Chen Chien-jen (an Epidemiologist) as their VP. Their people are not so focused on independent liberties.
To date, Taiwan has suffered only 7 deaths with a population of 25 million. They had their first case around the same time as us, while receiving a higher traffic of Chinese mainland visitors. They’ve never shutdown their economy. Didn’t need to. Life goes on for them while we fight among ourselves.
My point is… science wins when we believe in it and play by the rules. Our only hope for getting our lives back is to back science. Our economy will not recover just by keeping it open. Most of the public does not have confidence to get out there and live like they once did. I know I don’t, and I can’t. I have too much at stake to risk people in my own family and also have no desire to spread it to others.
We have only begun to deal with this virus… many who have contracted Covid have developed chronic issues that may continue for the rest of their lives. Turns out Covid may actually be a vascular disease. All your organs are at risk for long term damage. That damage may show up now, or down the road. You can bet Covid is going to cost us financially for the rest of our lives. We are not even having those conversations yet. Google “long haulers” for a taste of chronic issues.
I am a business owner and I have been heavily impacted financially because of Covid. I totally agree that we need to do whatever we can to keep people from financial collapse. This is where the gov should be of more assistance. I’m not a socialist and have never taken a single free cent from our gov, and haven’t with this either. I don’t want free money. But I see it is necessary to help people at this time. Actually, it fits in my beliefs as a fiscal conservative to rescue people at this time as an investment in our long term stability.
Sometimes being a nation of individualists doesn’t pay off. Sometimes we need to come together with a single purpose. We once were a country that did that… but we aren’t any longer. Consider this virus the warning shot of something much more deadly ahead and we will again not listen to science and all do our own thing.
During WWII, my grandfather took my mother to Los Angeles so he could work for Lockheed Burbank. Because of the threat of Japanese bombings the city was on a blackout. You couldn’t even light a candle. The community came together. Renegades who didn’t follow orders (not many) were flogged. This is the America I like to remember… but it is gone. And if it isn’t this virus with it’s death rate of 1-2% but potential to kill 2+ million Americans, it will be the next one. Perhaps H1N5. We won’t have time to play games with that virus.
Very well said. Great post. I too wear a mask when i DO go out , I mean I’ve not secluded myself because of the virus but really don’t make it out a lot at the present cause of some issues kin of hard to right now. When I do I wear the mask , I have others to think about my Wife is very high risk & I sure don’t want to put her in harms way. - - Like you have had to quarintine 2 times myself because of my Daughter and Nephew not really sure what they are not understanding with this , i think they are like Sooo many others just don’t believe it’s that big of deal or that THEY can’t get it & or are just tired of it and like a lot are now just saying more or less screw it. Not giving any consideration to others.
I wear my mask - -I use the hand santatizer out of respect also, and I fully believe that this is no joke - -OR any kind of hoax. So many have lost their lives and yet people want to say this is a Hoax ? - please wake up , and too I’ve never thought this any political thing some just don’t get it.
Just gonna say again please my friends take this seriously like I said my wife and I both are high risk , her with her breathing issues and on O-2 24/7 every day - - ALL day and lungs being shot and me with Heart conditions and asthma this thing is no joke and NOT going anywhere soon
