Ute came to the right place
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@approxinfinity said in Ute came to the right place:
Agree. It makes me sad that I am conflicted about KJ and Dajuan. Kids we should root for without an astericks.
Great kids zero doubt just not starter level KU players
Self never intended to recruit over them and he flat out didn’t. He brought in other players but never guys we knew would take their starting jobs.
It’s been multiple off seasons of “1 and 4 are locked in”. You don’t think recruits and transfers know that - well shoot I have an beachfront property in Kansas to sell ya!
Bill tallied his horses to miniature ponies that he thinks are Clydesdales. He’s too arrogant to about face and hes too sawwfft to do anything about it now.
Next year will be diggy and dp……he loves a good undersized guard who can’t guard or attack the paint - just float around the 3 point line with “energy”
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@kuballin10
Philon would never got double digits minutes playing for HOF BS. It’s certainly a big loss.
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https://www.si.com/college/kansas/basketball/bill-self-rips-team-himself-after-kansas-brutal-loss-to-utah: ^Self didn’t just direct his criticism at the players—he called out the entire program for its inability to rise to the challenge.^
Q: what does he mean by including the entire program here? NIL? recruiting weak-arse guys?
^“I’m tired of regrouping,” Self said. “We don’t need to regroup. We need to be men as an entire organization and do what our job is to do—accept responsibility for everybody when we don’t do it well. We didn’t do it well at all tonight.”^
Q: again, the entire organization… - obviously his staff needs awakening or getting fired… aside from players need to box out more, etc… etc… and of course coaching sucks.
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@jay4ever Good stuff
Self doesn’t need a complete retool philosophically but he needs to adjust heavily
Don’t give up easy baskets and get them makes sense but today I’d rather have a guarded guy go 1 v 1 in the pain than let a dude chuck a wide open 3
The goal in today’s game is to run guys off the line and have them take a bunch of mid range jumpers. Defensively that’s what you want to have happen but we are the opposite as our rotations are such that we don’t recover quick enough and give up open 3
That paired with how we space and move the ball offensively is just brutal. There’s a reason guys come here and their free throw attempts per game plummet because the system has no spacing.
Throw it inside to “open up the 3” doesn’t work anymore because coaches fake double and recover or just let their big guard 1 v 1 and are okay giving up 20 points to Hunter. Granted he misses a ton of bunnies just like kj and a lotta of guys because guys are athletic and guard them straight up wel
Distance to the basket doesn’t always equal better - Self gotta grasp that
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@jay4ever I think this is also him taking some responsibility for the situation. He is the head of the organization. He’s calling himself out. But I do think he still has hope that these guys will figure out a way to motivate themselves. He CANT do it for them.
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@benshawks08 The issue is more-so how he reacts to guys differently based on in game mistakes. That’s caused the serious division on this team.
Rylen and Storr have had some good moments and plenty of awful ones but getting the quick hook to watch the big 3 continually screw up and get dominated creates dissension.
This is all Self inflicted and he used to be able to get away with it via the seniority card but now when seniored guys transfer in who produces well elsewhere and he treats them different it creates exactly what you’ve seen play out.
Guys are pi$$ed and tired of the bs from bs. Treating three guys like they walk on water when in reality they are getting blown out while then defending those three is bad.
I’d be hard pressed not to tell the coach to take a hike as well because he clearly doesn’t have a clue how to handle the squad. He hasn’t gotten through to them but that’s because of his treatment starting early in the season.
Messing with starters, saying he messed up storr, saying storr and Rylan aren’t getting it - same old bs from bs except they were at other programs that recently are more successful than ours. This causes the basketball iq to say this old goat is off his rocker, sawft and we are playing black and white 1950’s ball - I’d be checked out as well after a few quick hooks in Nov/Dec
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@approxinfinity said in Ute came to the right place:
Well. I wish i was within 100 miles of you @drgnslayr i would come hang out and talk about your sons game instead, positively of course
Wish we could post video here. I’d post some examples of fundamental basketball!
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Bill’s lost it. Even his technical was weak and unconvincing at Utah. He doesn’t have fire behind his eyes anymore.
I’ll be shocked if he goes another year. Shocked.
The question is… does he stay and mentor a replacement?
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@kuballin10 Come on… Yes, there are issues, but putting it all on the handling of Storr and Griffen? While Alabama has definitely been better the past three years (remember they lost 12 games last year), Wisconsin has not - they went 22-14 last year. Storr led them in scoring, but was high usage and very inefficient - 43% from the field, 32% from 3, 4 rebounds and one assist per game. Doesn’t defend. He had no shot as a 3 and D in the NBA unless he improved his shooting and more importantly, defense, which is why he came to KU. It appears that he is what he has been, doesn’t have the requisite BBall IQ, or is just unwilling to do what is necessary to become a better player. He was a recruiting mistake much more than a usage one…Griffen is basically a one-dimensional player - a good spot up shooter - who fit well with the other pieces around him at Alabama. Not so much here - Harris isn’t Sears in penetrating and creating opportunities for shooters…
I agree that HCBS has always shown a quicker hook for some players and not others who seemingly make the same mistakes, but in this case, the problem is more a roster construction one than usage…
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I hope your wrong about the end for Bill. Just don’t see him walking away from a down year and bringing in Peterson. He will set the program back further if he leaves now and Peterson bolts, which would happen 100%.
I hear the other side of this argument but I can’t imagine Bill isn’t giving his best efforts and I have no doubts he would hang it up if he didn’t have that desire
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@DCHawker Storr is a black hole- -he gets the ball 85 % of the time it’s not coming back.-- Like the other night , he hits his first shot , very next time down the floor one pass goes to Storr and surprise jacks up another three - -terrible shot.-- He has no desire to play defense , he rivals Dickinson if not worse on the defensive end.- -His shot volume is unreal. Like has been said multiple times hee there is a reason why he has been to so many Schools.
There is a reason he didn’t end up Declaring for the NBA this past year- got to many deficiencies , he won’t play NBA-- he might make some money over seas but for sure he isn’t cutting it in the NBA.
Griffen is better but still has problems just dribbling the ball down the floor without dribbling it off his leg or trying to drive between two/three opposition- - -no matter what some that are obsessed about Firing Bill THIS is far from being all his fault.
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@DCHawker putting it all on those 2 guys? Heck no - I listed 5 when you count how he handled the big 3……
This is well past two players but it’s shown how those guys were successful elsewhere and they come here and struggle
That’s because of Self and his bad system/philosophy
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@BeddieKU23 Bill with DP thinks next year is his year
Book it
Won’t win the big 12
Lose in the sweet 16 to a higher seed
He will have diggy eating minutes and DP throwing it into the post to “run the offense” his way
His brand of basketball has always been unappealing. Roy never won titles but boy were his teams fun to watch.
The 2008/2022 teams almost collapsed multiple times in the tournament to severely lesser teams because of how Bill likes to limit possessions and win rock fights.
It is the exact opposite of what you do if you had his kind of talent. It’d be like Ohio state wanting to slow it down and limit possessions on Notre dame - that’s what Norte dame would have wanted to give them a better chance - shorten the game
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@kuballin10 would you rather Bill be gone instead of one more year, if it means we lose Flory and Dp?
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@drgnslayr said in Ute came to the right place:
Bill’s lost it. Even his technical was weak and unconvincing at Utah. He doesn’t have fire behind his eyes anymore.
I’ll be shocked if he goes another year. Shocked.
The question is… does he stay and mentor a replacement?
He hasn’t lost it, he’s just over this team and this group. This was his response about KU getting off to slow starts and he pretty much threw the team under the bus for their lack of motivation and effort.
“I think you should probably ask the players that. The first possession they score off a simple ball screen, and we’re in a certain coverage. And guys were surprised were surprised we were in it and we’ve only been talking about it for, you know, 24-48 hours. So that’s frustrating. I don’t know exactly what that answer is coming out of a half time different or starting a game differently. I really don’t know what the answer is on that, because it seems to me to start any athletic contest both teams are usually pretty geeked up and on point. Even though you don’t always play well, but usually the mistakes that you make aren’t because you aren’t aware of that. ‘This is how we’re going to try to guard.’”
Most of y’all know I coach at my middle school. I coach football, basketball and soccer there. Every year at the beginning of the first basketball and soccer practices, I ask my team why they’re out there to play (I’m head coach of those sports, not football though). Are they out there for fun or to try and win a district championship? I then explain the differences in how I will coach them depending on what they want their experience to be. After they inevitably choose to go for a district championship, I then explain to them what goes into winning a district championship and if they’re ready to make those sacrifices. Most teams ended up putting forth their best effort to reach that goal and some were successful, some weren’t, but they were better teams and players by end of that season. It’s been a successful strategy with several basketball championships and rebuilt our school’s soccer program from the worst in the district when I took over to a championship team last season.
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@kuballin10 Almost only counts in horse shoes and hand grenades
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@approxinfinity aghhh that’s a tough one
If it is true Oats wants to come here I don’t think we lose DP and Flory. I think Adidas steps up so with or without Bill I don’t think it matters.
Now to play the game if the options are Oats and transfers but lose DP and Flory or have Bill and those 2 - I want DP more than Oats so can wait 1 more year lol
Bills gonna butcher it and mess something up about that squad and we won’t run anywhere close to like we should. Good chance the 1 and 4 are young, unproven and will tick Bill off with their play and he will defer to more senior’d guys who are in the right positions (can’t make the plays but hey they are at least standing on the court where he wants them) but limit the March ceiling
My confidence in Bill is below zero much like the current roster
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@Texas-Hawk-10 Setting the expectation upfront….you gotta be in sales too lol
What’s the goal - why are we doing this - make the client/kids tell you and then tailor what you do from there
Genius
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@SlimShaddy54 true dat! Wish we almost had L’s and instead were racking up Dubs!
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@Texas-Hawk-10 said in Ute came to the right place:
@drgnslayr said in Ute came to the right place:
Bill’s lost it. Even his technical was weak and unconvincing at Utah. He doesn’t have fire behind his eyes anymore. I’ll be shocked if he goes another year. Shocked. The question is… does he stay and mentor a replacement?
“I think you should probably ask the players that. The first possession they score off a simple ball screen, and we’re in a certain coverage. And guys were surprised were surprised we were in it and we’ve only been talking about it for, you know, 24-48 hours. So that’s frustrating. I don’t know exactly what that answer is coming out of a half time different or starting a game differently. I really don’t know what the answer is on that, because it seems to me to start any athletic contest both teams are usually pretty geeked up and on point. Even though you don’t always play well, but usually the mistakes that you make aren’t because you aren’t aware of that. ‘This is how we’re going to try to guard.’”
Perfect example for why I said what I said.
He doesn’t have answers anymore. He has the most-senior team in America and they aren’t coachable?
You look at them out there and they are lost. It’s almost March. They didn’t look this lost in November.
I’ve been the biggest supporter of Bill Self going back to Day 1 at Kansas.
It’s time for him to ride off in the sunset.
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@drgnslayr This is the issue with high dollar NIL deals for players who don’t have an NBA future. They don’t care because they got theirs. It happens in the pros a lot to when a player signs a huge contract and their production amd performance drops off a cliff.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 one has to wonder exactly when these kids / man children lost the love for basketball, where that wouldnt be reason alone to give it their all.
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Every team faces the same issue. It’s not a valid excuse when you compete against teams facing that same problem. The problem is he doesn’t know how to reach them, or teach them.
This is the oldest team in college basketball with the most experience. There is no excuse for playing this level of basketball.
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Did ya ever notice how much nicer the posts are when KU is winning?
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Slow dancing.
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@drgnslayr said in Ute came to the right place:
Every team faces the same issue. It’s not a valid excuse when you compete against teams facing that same problem. The problem is he doesn’t know how to reach them, or teach them.
This is the oldest team in college basketball with the most experience. There is no excuse for playing this level of basketball.
How many schools have multiple players on 7 figure, or close to it, NIL deals where those players have zero chance of ever making the NBA? Name them.
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So they get paid more than don’t perform? So you are saying our problems are solved by cutting off NIL money?
Does KJ and Juan make huge NIL money?
Your view of these guys isn’t positive at all. They came here to scam us, huh?
I don’t buy that for a second.
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@drgnslayr There are players that don’t give a dam about the School - they don’t think about the history of the School , the tradition of the Schools. A lot of these players are fringe NBA at best, they make more money in College then they will in G league because that’s where they will end up , or over sea’s, so instead of declaring they come back, they KNOW they are getting bank NIL and that’s all that matters, their thinking is hey I’m making my money I could give a crap less about the game- - lets get this over with
KU has a couple of these guys right now, their focus is crap ---- their intensity is crap -their team concept is crap- - you could ask these guys about unity- -love of the game and they will look at you like what the f - - - are you talking about,-- They actually don’t give a dam - -you wanna pull me- - then pull me I’m still making my NIL- -so ya they do need to get rid of this dam NIL-- it’s ruining the College game
I myself don’t give a dam if other teams players are facing the same thing - - I’m worried about Ku players and only KU players and right now with the approach some players on this team has - - It would be fine if they just kicked their ass out of here, get guys that wanna play for the game , for the School screw the rest
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You could be right… so we suck because we don’t know how to pick players with character. (sarcasm)
I mention all schools in the same boat because it supports the idea that we aren’t cutting the mustard against other schools. Time for an administrative change.
But come on… it’s more than that. I guarantee none of these kids are evil. They came and are getting well-paid and they aren’t secretly flipping off KU.
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@drgnslayr no they are not evil- - just twisted, it’s all about money- -I’m telling you a lot just don’t give a dam about the school- -they love the bidding war for their so called service.-
The Frank Mason - -Devonte Graham – Christian Braun-- Thomas Robinson - Mark Turgeon days are history- -these guys I mentioned really care- -you could tell they loved the Coach They had true feelings for the School - -Not any more
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@drgnslayr said in Ute came to the right place:
So they get paid more than don’t perform? So you are saying our problems are solved by cutting off NIL money?
Does KJ and Juan make huge NIL money?
Your view of these guys isn’t positive at all. They came here to scam us, huh?
I don’t buy that for a second.
KU’s total NIL budget last season was about $4 million. It’s a similar amount this year. So no, Dejuan and KJ are not making anywhere close to what Hunter Dickinson and AJ Storr are making in NIL money who are taking up well over half of KU’s NIL budget if their NIL deal numbers are accurate. Dickinson and Storr are taking up the largest chunk of KU’s NIL budget. Which two players have been criticized the most this year for not putting forth the necessary effort at times? Storr and Dickinson. Those two do not have an NBA future and making more money in NIL deals at Kansas than they would over in Europe playing pro ball.
Those two got their bag, complacency set in once they secured their bags, and we’re seeing that fruits of two high dollar NIL players without NBA futures.
So again, please tell me another school that has two players making what Dickinson and Storr are making in NIL that do not have NBA futures.
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@approxinfinity said in Ute came to the right place:
@Texas-Hawk-10 one has to wonder exactly when these kids / man children lost the love for basketball, where that wouldnt be reason alone to give it their all.
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
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I just looked at Dickinson’s stats over his college career. He’s up and down in categories over his performance at Michigan, but nothing is glaring. His rebounding #s are definitely up at KU.
I’ll stick with Greenberg’s opinion that he should be spending his time in the low post instead of out on the perimeter.
If we used him right his numbers would be flying off the chart. My question… who decides if he plays down low or up high? Isn’t that Self? If Self designed him in the low post and he refused to do it, wouldn’t Self pull him?
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Listening to anothr KU Pod Cast and they were saying and I had already seen this in person so pretty well knew but people crying and bitching saying Storr should be playing more ? - - – WHY ? what has he done to justify him getting more minutes.?
One thing we do know is - - Storr ranked third- -THIRD ! ! !NCAA/NATION - -in shot attempts to reach 16.0 per game- his shot volume is insane
One thg we do know about Storr is , in the little minutes he has played the first time he catch’s the ball it is going up----- - your not getting it back- - he either clangs it up OR he tries driving the base line.-- It’s like I’m getting mine.
There was an excellent question asked in the pod cast. They said they feel like the Staff should be asking these kids in the portal
Why are you wanting to transfer ?- -Like for Rylan-- Rylan why you wanting to transfer ?-- Your coming off a Season where you wer the starter on a final four program ?
AJ-- ? - -enough sid- -Four diffeent High Schools – Three Colleges ? – umm sorry AJ just don’t think we can use you here lmao
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In our starting lineup we have:
3 players with the experience of a Final Four (2 with a National Championship), and 1 player who is a two-time second-team All-American.
I wish people would stop vilifying our players. This is a team with plenty of talent, enough to be thought to be #1 at the beginning of the season. And it’s more than just hustle or attitude. I can 100% guarantee you can pluck any of these players out of this team and stick them on another team and they will perform at the level that got them to Kansas.
It is pretty obvious these guys aren’t meshing together and some may be bad fits for this team. That still doesn’t explain them only going even with BYU’s 3rd string.
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@drgnslayr Hunt in the post missed bunnies and is often double teamed due to the defense not respecting any of our other players besides Mayo to hit a 3
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@drgnslayr I think you mentioning two players as national title winners but not understanding 1 played maybe what 3-4 minutes all tournament and the others minutes were cut in half from the regular season -
Brings you to the conclusion that the roster is good enough when it isn’t even remotely close
Bill on the other hand can’t maximize his talent unless he’s had them here for 4 years to play “his way”
When DP starts every game feeding the post it is yet again Bill not even grasping how basketball works today. He still thinks you gotta throw it inside to open up the 3
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@kuballin10 that crap ain’t happening next year , you can take it to the bank - - - Not Happening- -more reason then not this year was because supposedly we had this stud muffin 7’2 All American that was automatic from down low , why it was through him 75 % of the time
Turns out that 7’2 All world stud turned to and all nothing creme puff that thought he was Steph Curry. – They ARE NOT going to run the offense through Flory, it will be run or evolve around Darryn. The One position Bill has never had problem and players evolving is Guard position. - Wings possibly- -Bigs maybe --But NEVER had problems involving and guards developing
