Need Games To Start
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Hi. New contributor, but long term lurker here. Testosterone is an iffy guide to sex determination. There is a wide range of normal testosterone levels in people, with many women in the upper level of normal having higher levels than men at the lower level of normal. And suppressing testosterone can have serious health consequences; what might be a population-wide normal level may not be adequate for an individual. I often told my students that strict on/off, yes/no, this or that situations are rare in biology. The species concept, for example, is a human construct for making classification easier; in nature there are often intermediate forms between two species and where we draw the line is arbitrary. Likewise for testosterone (and many other hormones that can affect athletic performance), there is less difference between males and females than many suspect. While we need rules for who plays on which sports teams, any rules we make will be arbitrary and there will always be special cases that just don’t fit. And yes, I did study biology (immunology and microbiology) at KU!
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Nikki Hiltz the American 1500m olympic trials winner is transgender and in the Paris Olympics. Hiltz was born female and cannot receiver gender affirming care including testosterone to be able to compete. The East Germans doped up their men and women athletes with steroids and dominated the Olympics with 519 medals with 409 in the summer games and 110 in the winter games. I see that we are retesting weight lifters samples from past Olympics and one year they retested for and they took away the gold medal and declared the next medalist the winner and then guess what? They went down to about 14th place to get a final medal awards.
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@BShark from what I remember from the other gal, she did not know she had male organs that failed to come down. It was very embarrassing that everybody found out when she did. Sad.
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@dylans right and wrong is whatever you want it to be, brother. Or sister. Or whatever you are today.
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@ImmunoHawk said in Need Games To Start:
Hi. New contributor, but long term lurker here. Testosterone is an iffy guide to sex determination. There is a wide range of normal testosterone levels in people, with many women in the upper level of normal having higher levels than men at the lower level of normal. And suppressing testosterone can have serious health consequences; what might be a population-wide normal level may not be adequate for an individual. I often told my students that strict on/off, yes/no, this or that situations are rare in biology. The species concept, for example, is a human construct for making classification easier; in nature there are often intermediate forms between two species and where we draw the line is arbitrary. Likewise for testosterone (and many other hormones that can affect athletic performance), there is less difference between males and females than many suspect. While we need rules for who plays on which sports teams, any rules we make will be arbitrary and there will always be special cases that just don’t fit. And yes, I did study biology (immunology and microbiology) at KU!
Welcome aboard!
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@ImmunoHawk welcome to our community! You’re going to need to dumb it down considerably for me though! Lol
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The Turkish hitman was impressive! One hand in his pocket looking bored, acting like Dash from the Incredibles - don’t do too well just take silver.
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@nuleafjhawk I have a bad case of professorial verbosity, not sure if it’s curable.
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@ImmunoHawk Hmm. I understood “bad” and “curable”.
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@ImmunoHawk did you go to medical school?
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@Crimsonorblue22 No, I did grad school in the KU microbiology department. Then spent 30 years teaching undergraduates, most of whom were planning on going to medical school. Had that dream job of teaching (mostly) highly motivated kids with excellent character.
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@ImmunoHawk Thanks for your c0ntribution! Hoping your immune system is strong enough to keep you healthy after dealing with all the parasites, viruses and bacteria infesting my comments and several others here!
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Since there’s a little Olympic chatter here I’ll give my olympic rant of the day now. We’ve all heard the names Simone, someone who couldn’t handle the stress at the last olympics and quit and Shakari, a sprinter who never made it to Tokyo because she failed a drug test. But I was shocked yesterday to watch the 30 seconds of coverage of mens shot put and see an American named Ryan Crouser win his 3rd gold in a row. That’s 8+ years of dominance in his sport and unknown to probably many of us reading this today. NBC coverage is really pretty annoying.
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@wissox https://www.cnn.com/. You have to scroll down to find the articles. Simone Biles gets up to almost 11 ft in the air, the men, 10. Getting the twisties could be life altering! She’s one of a kind! I watched all track and field. Saw the womens 100 and the mens shot. 1, 2 and 4!
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@wissox said in Need Games To Start:
Since there’s a little Olympic chatter here I’ll give my olympic rant of the day now. We’ve all heard the names Simone, someone who couldn’t handle the stress at the last olympics and quit and Shakari, a sprinter who never made it to Tokyo because she failed a drug test. But I was shocked yesterday to watch the 30 seconds of coverage of mens shot put and see an American named Ryan Crouser win his 3rd gold in a row. That’s 8+ years of dominance in his sport and unknown to probably many of us reading this today. NBC coverage is really pretty annoying.
Does he come to Mass St when they have their shot put competition? If so he’s fantastic in my books, if not who is this guy? lol shot putters don’t get much shine.
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@dylans they haven’t had the downtown shot for a long time. My son hasn’t been the ast meet director for a long time, either. Covid, they didn’t want to fund the pros anymore.
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Wow, what a finish on Men’s 100m track, Lyles came from behind and pushed it thru to beat Jamaica.
US won after 20 years.
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Concerning Khelif… welcome to the world of complicated sports qualifications. Almost as tricky as what is deemed performance-enhancement drugs. Quite complicated if someone is born with a vagina but also XY and has higher levels of testosterone. Yes, there is an advantage… so is height advantage in our beloved game of bball. When I first read this story… I read misinformation. Of course, I was upset when I read that a trans person gamed the system so a male could beat up a female. But the story was dishonest and who knows what the motivation was… probably political or for profit.
The way I see it… I become a lot less emotional when I find out someone isn’t trying to game the system. It seems Khelif fits into this category. However… it is a challenge to keep sports on the same equal page. I am doubtful that is possible.
Another thing… we all have natural bias. Take our very beloved Simone Biles. She has a natural genetic balance that gives her an advantage in her sport. For once… being small is an advantage. She’s not only small, but packs unusual athletic prowse. If we dug deep enough through her DNA chart I’m sure we would see clear advantages she has (to go alone with her insatiable drive for success). Even her drive will eventually be studied in the genetic world.
What I’m getting at… the world we surround ourselves with plays a huge factor in our success. So does our genes. And we are only at the cusp of realizing genetic advantages and disadvantages. If you follow my drift about now you are realizing the importance of medical ethics.
This discussion will continue… and I hope for all our sakes we are able to find clear information not completely tainted by politics; the pollutant that is poisoning our society today.
Happy harvests…
the garden man
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People are born with natural genetic advantages. Michael Phelps is a perfect example of this. Phelps has a long torso and arms, he’s 6-4 with a 6-8 wingspan, amd has short legs which means less drag. He also has big feet (size 14) and more flexible ankles than other people. Phelps also produces much less lactic acid than others meaning he can push himself longer and harder and need less recovery time. He’s also double jointed in some joints that aren’t typical of even elite swimmers which gave him more power in some of his strokes. He also has double the lung capacity of the average human.
Phelps was essentially the perfect swimmer because of some genetic abnormalities that were beneficial to him as a swimmer. Obviously, he also worked his ass off training to become the greatest swimmer of all time, but he also had some natural genetic advantages.
Imane Khelif was also born with some natural genetic advantages. Based on pictures, it looks like she’s a bit taller than most of her opponents which means she has a longer reach to keep her opponents at bay. She’s not a knock out artist, only 5 KO’s in her career, so her genetic advantages didn’t turn her into 1980’s Mike Tyson when most of his fights weren’t making past the first round.
Just a tiny bit of research would make people realize that Khelif isn’t transgender because she’d currently be in prison for that since that’s the punishment for being transgender in Algeria.
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@dylans Yeah I do understand the media a little bit and Simone is quite a bit cuter!
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At a glance, I approve of Snoop + Martha Stewart.
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Its easy to see Martha Stewart served 5 months in prison but its hard to determine how much jail time Snoop served total. Anecdotally, people say its less.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 I’m a little uncomfortable with your intimate knowledge of Michael Phelps’ body…
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@nuleafjhawk said in Need Games To Start:
@Texas-Hawk-10 I’m a little uncomfortable with your intimate knowledge of Michael Phelps’ body…
There were a lot of studies in why Phelps was able to dominate swimming the way he did shortly after he retired.
This isn’t a French pole vaulter situation.
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@Crimsonorblue22 said in Need Games To Start:
@dylans they haven’t had the downtown shot for a long time. My son hasn’t been the ast meet director for a long time, either. Covid, they didn’t want to fund the pros anymore.
That’s too bad
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@Texas-Hawk-10 I wa just playing. I didn’t mean to be a turd.
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My favorite Olympic joke. Reporter: “Are you a pole vaulter?” Athlete: “No, I’m Svedish, but how’d you know my name is Walter?” (must pronounce walter with a V for it to make sense.)
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https://share.icloud.com/photos/0aaN_Q19NOpMMD-SpRVpHKFQA Ryan Crouser 2017
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@KU4KU welcome aboard!
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@KU4KU those were such fun times!
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Great read. X-axis theories at work! I wonder if basketball will ever grasp the real potential of mastering lateral motion? My 11-yr old gets it. He’s playing in the post and not that tall but he’s the only one able to get off a shot against bigger competition. He loves Steph Curry and his ability to create scoring space with a simple step in any direction.
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@drgnslayr Im not a big Harden fan but have to give him credit for pushing the limits of what can be done there as a shooter. a big guard with a consistent shot can be practically unguardable.
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@drgnslayr said in Need Games To Start:
Great read. X-axis theories at work! I wonder if basketball will ever grasp the real potential of mastering lateral motion? My 11-yr old gets it. He’s playing in the post and not that tall but he’s the only one able to get off a shot against bigger competition. He loves Steph Curry and his ability to create scoring space with a simple step in any direction.
In middle school our star player kept telling the coach it says two steps, not two steps forward. He always wanted to do what you see today back in the early 90s but coach said it was against the rules. lol
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Saw a twitter thing. Notable coaches records against top 10 teams since 2009. (not sure why they chose that year) Bill Self and Cal are the only two above .500. Call is 31-30 in such games and Bill Self is 43-21. All the other notable coaches below .500. Fran McLaughery at Iowa is 8-41 in these contests.
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@wissox - interesting find! Can you link the tweet or at least who posted it?
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@wissox Bill is truly special for sure
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I’m not seeing any news or discussions about KU Basketball even though Late Night is Oct 18 and the Ark scrimmage is Oct 25. Starters: Dickinson, Adams, Storr, Mayo and Harris? Can AJ Storr take over Kevin’s scoring from last year? First off the bench: Clemence, Griffen, McDowell? Thank goodness KU basketball is getting started.
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Not sure if Clemence or McDowell will get off the bench at all, let alone first.
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@BShark That sounds better already.
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Sure glad we are still in the hunt for quite a few very good quality players, but would sure be nice to get some verbal or SOMETHING other then we made their cut of final twenty eight or Bakers dozen of Schools that were still in the hunt
What ever happened to the days where a recruit would just come out and say I’ve Committed to whoever , without them coming out and saying I’ve cut my list to Twenty four - -or Twelve - -then Eight - -final four - - geez
Now we have the big media announcements -live on 247 -rivals - - -on big 3 . com media circus- - drama- - the featuring of the hats -or stripping down shirts , just crazy bullshit. - just announce THE SCHOOL when your ready- -toss all this other crap of half hour circus before you end up saying , I mean Dam all ready. --come on.
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@BShark said in Need Games To Start:
Not sure if Clemence or McDowell will get off the bench at all, let alone first.
So, Flory Bidunga or Justin Cross will be the first big off the bench? Come on now, don’t leave me hanging. I remember several months back, Coach Self saying Clemence was playing well: something like he was the most improved player. Other than Coach saying Zeke was playing the best and would probably start, I just haven’t heard anything about this years players beyond the injuries.
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@stoptheflop said in Need Games To Start:
I’m not seeing any news or discussions about KU Basketball even though Late Night is Oct 18 and the Ark scrimmage is Oct 25. Starters: Dickinson, Adams, Storr, Mayo and Harris? Can AJ Storr take over Kevin’s scoring from last year? First off the bench: Clemence, Griffen, McDowell? Thank goodness KU basketball is getting started.
Depends who starts between Griffen and Mayo i guess. But main bench options to me are:
Passmoore / Moore when healthy / Bidunga / Griffen or Mayo (depends who starts)
Deep bench: Clemence (will play when Bidunga makes Self angry with Freshman mistake) / McDowell
