Agbaji/Next Year's Team
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Crimsonorblue22 said:
Self had him play a lot of pt at USA games and he did pretty good but he just took everyone to the hole.
Yeah, he can’t pull that off at the B12 level.
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Grimes and his folks would have to be among the stupidest people alive if he goes pro. They aren’t loaded but they aren’t poor. He’d be lucky to be the next Selby and get picked late second round and bounce around the G league for a couple of years before disappearing forever.
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BShark said:
So more about next year in general but Ryan posted on the phog that…
Dedric is gone
Silvio is gone unless there is a miracle where he gets to play next year in which case he would stay.
Doke’s people will likely want him to start getting pro checks but his gut says Self finds a way to keep Doke for his SR year.
Grimes GONE.
Dotson and Agbaji staying.
KJ staying but says this one is just a guess, no info unlike the others.
Chuck likely gone.
Mitch and McCormack 100% staying, locked into the program.
I agree with all of this except Grimes and KJ. I think KJ is gone and Grimes is back.
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@Kcmatt7 Would take.
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If Grimes stays, with the other guard we signed I see no way Chuck stays and with Braun, I don’t see KJ getting a ton of minutes.
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@Kcmatt7 Do you see KJ transferring again?
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If dedric leaves which is expected I think KJ Looks to grad transfer as he could be on track to graduate by spring or with summer classes
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Why would KJ leave? Don’t we kind of need him? If Doke and Dedric don’t come back…don’t we need his experience…and can maybe play the 4?
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Why would Grimes leave for a second round contract? That’s assuming he can play his way into a contract in the league. Why not do that at Kansas where a first round contract is still in play?
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He isnt getting a ton of playing time this year. Despite injuries even they haven’t called his number much. I also think him and dedric are a package deal like they have been at each stop. Could be wrong here
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@Hawk8086 if we ever get to the point where we need KJ for more than a couple of minutes at a time, God help Kansas basketball.
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@BeddieKU23 imo KJ has trended in the right direction and could be a 7th or 8th rotation guy. It depends on what returns. If Dave and Mitch are the only bigs that return and we miss on Hurt, are we going to be able to recruit over KJ? Seems like his leaving would be highly contingent upon Doke and Silvio leaving.
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@kjayhawks Agree that we wouldn’t want him to be a major player…but a rotational player for 10 mins or so? I don’t see why not.
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@Hawk8086 I think he’s the worst player on the team that’s scholarship personally. I hate saying it because I feel he does give good effort. Maybe he improves.
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I have no issue with KJ most of the time. He has his weaknesses as we have all seen. I haven’t seen anything saying so but I’d like to know whether he is on track to graduate this yr given it’s his 4th yr in College. That could factor into his own decision if his brother does leave. We saw how the Morris twins left together. The Martin twins at Nevada stayed even though one would probably be drafted but the other wouldn’t. So theres a history of brothers sticking together and either staying or going as a package. I only gave a few examples but I think its difficult for those who are used to spending every day together and then bam one goes off on their own. Usually doesnt happen from what I’ve seen. Do we even land Dedric if we didnt take KJ?
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Million dollar question with Grimes. Preseason expectations have not matched the season. I wouldn’t be surprised if his family “planned” for him to be gone after the year regardless. When your projected preseason top 10 its extremely unlikely that agents and those kind weren’t already in contact with them about his next step in 8 months… Happened to Cliff, but his mom didnt hide it well. Just saying we may not know what his family has already set in motion… I’m also not saying that’s the case but just a thought we usually dont think about
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BeddieKU23 said:
I have no issue with KJ most of the time. He has his weaknesses as we have all seen. I haven’t seen anything saying so but I’d like to know whether he is on track to graduate this yr given it’s his 4th yr in College. That could factor into his own decision if his brother does leave. We saw how the Morris twins left together. The Martin twins at Nevada stayed even though one would probably be drafted but the other wouldn’t. So theres a history of brothers sticking together and either staying or going as a package. I only gave a few examples but I think its difficult for those who are used to spending every day together and then bam one goes off on their own. Usually doesnt happen from what I’ve seen. Do we even land Dedric if we didnt take KJ?
Well said. I’d be fine w/ KJ on the team next year but it feels unlikely.
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@BeddieKU23 As did, fortunately, the progeny of the evil turncoat Carl Henry.
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Josh Jackson… Easily my favorite one and done. Probably my favorite freshman player honestly.
Agbaji… Is pushing this “favorite freshman” thing for me. I love his game. I’d like to see it continue and dare I to hope, even elevate some. He shoots my game winner every time right now
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Apparently from here on out I need to say how bad KJ is (has a big game afterwards). In all reality if we could have either him or Charlie, at least one show up from here on out, it would nice. Moore has ticked me the last two games and has really only had 2 good games.
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BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
I have no issue with KJ most of the time. He has his weaknesses as we have all seen. I haven’t seen anything saying so but I’d like to know whether he is on track to graduate this yr given it’s his 4th yr in College. That could factor into his own decision if his brother does leave. We saw how the Morris twins left together. The Martin twins at Nevada stayed even though one would probably be drafted but the other wouldn’t. So theres a history of brothers sticking together and either staying or going as a package. I only gave a few examples but I think its difficult for those who are used to spending every day together and then bam one goes off on their own. Usually doesnt happen from what I’ve seen. Do we even land Dedric if we didnt take KJ?
Well said. I’d be fine w/ KJ on the team next year but it feels unlikely.
Well not 100 % sure but from what I had heard is that KJ will graduate this year for sure on track. I’ve heard the chance more likely then not would be when Dedric leaves KJ will also be leaving. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@BeddieKU23 As of this minute , it would be such a HUGE mistake for Q to leave but as we know we are dealing with what? - -18-19 yr old kids at Q’s present time right? - As I and I think most know or have heard the NBA drafts of potential - -so I’m sure that’s in his parents mind AND his.
Just a side thought I don’t know but maybe Quentin just has never fully connected or invested 100% into College basketball , totally buying into the idea and had in his head that he wasn’t going to be here after this year anyways , so he didn’t fully connect with the team or program , and when he started to struggle those thoughts became stronger - -frustration grew and now - - - -,?
Who knows. Could be - - I’ve also heard people mention also that maybe in reality - -Quentin just might be in the wrong program - -just not a good fit - -guess we fans for sure can’t make that decision as much as he needs to come back - -should come back , I mean I’d take him for sure a 2nd year - -I just have this feel he won’t be back. By this point I’m sure or I think mom and dad are probably supporting him and even telling him – stick it out through this year and then declare - -again NBA is all about potential - -I dunno. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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It might have been said, but KJ would leave because he will have graduated already. This is his 4th year in college. So unless he wants his masters, going and making money playing somewhere overseas seems like a good choice for him.
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I see KJ getting ragged on quite a bit here. IMO, it’s completely unwarranted. What I saw last night, was a calming presence on the court when it mattered most. Obviously it was a team effort, but we do not win that game last night without KJ. I think he could be a solid 6th man next year. In college, he’s a stretch 3. He’s always has played in the shadow of DL and defers to him on the court unequivocally. When he does hunt his shot, he’s pretty effficent. I mean look at the stat sheet last night 16 min 4-6 on the floor, 2-2 from the line, 10 points 3 boards 0 To 0 pf. How is he the worst guy on a scholly? Curious to see what his development would be next year without DL. Regardless, I’d like to see him get more minutes, like at least 10-15 a game. He’s efficient and when the game was on the line, he seemed unfazed by the moment.
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@jayballer73 Q in the wrong program? That’s laughable. They’ve been saying the same thing about our top recruits for 20 years or more. Q dominated everybody until he ran into players that were just as athletic, and it exposed him. He has slow feet, and he doesn’t have alot of quickness, which hurts him defending, and hurts him from separating from defenders. Near the end of the first half, he sank a nice fade away …which in my 6th day of the flu recollection, was the first time all year I can remember that he actually did something on his own to create space.
HEM compared him to a freshman Wayne Selden, and I think that is a very favorable comparison towards Q. Even Wayne shooting the bolo shot from behind his head was more accurate than Q. In my limited basketball strategery, it appears he doesn’t do anything without the ball, and when he does get the ball, he fires away without being set, which makes his shot go long on practically every shot. i mean…let’s get real. If we had built our entire offensive approach around Q from the get-go, would we even have a winning record? The way I look at it is if Q doesn’t have the ability to look honestly at the results, and realize he needs another good year at least in college in order to even sniff time in the NBA, then he probably wouldn’t listen enough to do the things he needs to do to get better at the college game. So, it’s a grow up or die moment, imo.
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@kjayhawks I’m not understanding or agreeing with the KJ hate at all. KJ won that game for us, period. He hit 2 buckets without flinching when the game was on the line. Your timing to go on a KJ rant is …odd.
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@KUSTEVE It was before the game yesterday, I said he plays hard just not smart most of the time. Happy for him and hopefully he can build from it like Mitch has been the last few games.
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@kjayhawks LOL…oh, ok. That makes sense. Both KJ and Mitch have been MIA most of the year. It is great seeing them contribute.
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I think we may have found a role for KJ last night. When I think of KJ, I think of two things. Slow. Fearless.
It makes him perfect for the 2nd half of games. Once everyone else’s legs are tired, he seems to be able to actually play D and provide a spark on O. As far as fearless, you have to have guys not scared to shoot in order to close out games. He doesn’t play scared and seems to never get shook. So, I’m absolute pro KJ from minutes 25-35 and see if he can help close out a game or provide a nice little spark.
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@Kcmatt7 I’m absolutely 1,000% behind that idea. He did a better Dedric impression than Dedric did last night. This guy has definite clutch tendencies, and for a team starting 4 freshmen, we need all the clutch we can get. Something was different last night. Maybe the guy has finally relaxed, and let the game come to him. He looked like the player we thought we were getting last night. The lightbulb has come on, and I have a good feeling it won’t go off again.
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user_RCJH said:
I see KJ getting ragged on quite a bit here. IMO, it’s completely unwarranted. What I saw last night, was a calming presence on the court when it mattered most. Obviously it was a team effort, but we do not win that game last night without KJ. I think he could be a solid 6th man next year. In college, he’s a stretch 3. He’s always has played in the shadow of DL and defers to him on the court unequivocally. When he does hunt his shot, he’s pretty effficent. I mean look at the stat sheet last night 16 min 4-6 on the floor, 2-2 from the line, 10 points 3 boards 0 To 0 pf. How is he the worst guy on a scholly? Curious to see what his development would be next year without DL. Regardless, I’d like to see him get more minutes, like at least 10-15 a game. He’s efficient and when the game was on the line, he seemed unfazed by the moment.
I couldn’t agree more with everything you have said. - -The way I look at it - all we have seen is some spot minutes from KJ - -some games None at all. - -people are watching and gauging him off very limited minutes. - I don’t think KJ is our worst player by far - -I think far from that.
I think we got more of a REAL look what KJ can do in extended minutes like last night- -he get’s a few minutes during rag tag time at the ends of the games lots of turnovers - -quick shots kind of hard to see the true play of a player - KJ brings things to the table- -I can only hope possibly he will start seeing the floor a little more. - - Actually here again he is even possibly a better option then our Marcus - -NOW I’m talking Offensively - -again Offensively - -I admit defensively not even close to Marcus - -but at least here again when KJ is on the floor - -teams have to play more straight up can’t slack off as much- - Now people can tell me I’m wrong – that’s fine but I’ll stick to he IS NOT our worst player by any means. – - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@KUSTEVE He is not a step slow. He is two steps. And the motor is seriously lacking. Can you imagine how much Och had been outplaying him in practice with Och running on the Red team? The coaches must have been going nuts. To his credit, Q has seemed to welcome Och’s presence and they seem to be playing pretty well together when Q could have responded quite differently.
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@KUSTEVE What if it’s as simple as he has finally accepted his role? He may have come in this year thinking he was gonna get more minutes. Any player would be disappointed by that. But he has hung in and stayed positive and now he may flourish as the 2nd half microwave.
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@Fightsongwriter “… as the 2nd half microwave.” Nice. Vinnie Johnson references always welcome.
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kJ is engaged
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https://twitter.com/franfraschilla/status/1096935574387200001?s=21
I know some people get all bent out of shape about Fran for some reason, but he is really tight with Self and has connections inside the staff. I wouldn’t be shocked at all if this is what he is hearing right now about Ochai, Q, and Dotson.
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@Woodrow because he’s jackass lol, which game was it where Dedric bumped a guy he was like “Lawson absolutely mauls him”. He has some knowledge for sure but he has been a major dick the last 2 years.
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@Woodrow I doubt if self even knows what they are doing.
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Self will absolutely encourage him to go pro when the time is right for him and his family. He does with all of them, which is something I appreciate. With that being said, I’d think he will be lucky to be a 1st rounder this season because it’s hard to see him be able to contribute for an NBA team in a year. I think one more year makes sense.
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@Kcmatt7 *lucky to be drafted this year. No way he goes first round he’s predicted to go late second round and falling weekly.
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I really like what this team could be next season. Dotson is already arguably the best PG in this conference, Doke if he returns is the best true 5 man in this conference and Ochai could be the best 3 man if he has a good offseason. I hope KJ stays with the way he has shown he can contribute. Grimes could be a solid player if he puts in the work.
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Woodrow said:
https://twitter.com/franfraschilla/status/1096935574387200001?s=21
I know some people get all bent out of shape about Fran for some reason, but he is really tight with Self and has connections inside the staff. I wouldn’t be shocked at all if this is what he is hearing right now about Ochai, Q, and Dotson.
It’s not from Fran but what he quoted but I must say the Ray Allen comp is insane.
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If Fran puts something like that out there, he knows. KU fans can bitch all they want, but Self and Fran are tight. I think it’s why Fran is always so hard on KU. He and Self see how good KU can be and comment as such. Just remember last year when all Fran said was KU was going to play bully ball with Doke and Dedric. Fran knows as much about the program as anyone not employed by KUAD.
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Fran also said today Vick would not be back …
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HighEliteMajor said:
Fran also said today Vick would not be back …
He’s right. Vick isn’t coming back. It’s clear that we’re better off without him and Vick’s family needs him. It’s better for everyone this way.
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@FarmerJayhawk you think self wanted him to announce it? Wouldn’t it be better for their family if he finished school and bb so he could make some kind of living to better help their family?
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Crimsonorblue22 said:
@FarmerJayhawk you think self wanted him to announce it? Wouldn’t it be better for their family if he finished school and bb so he could make some kind of living to better help their family?
Explicitly? If things ended poorly I don’t think Self cares. We also don’t know if Vick graduated in December. It’s entirely possible he did. He can still be on scholarship and get his stipend if he graduated and is enrolled.
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Ok, so at this moment we believe the narrative that his family needed him AND that was the real reason he left? I’m sure there is something that can be articulated there to support that narrative.
But I believe Vick left because of his inability to be a positive member of the team and that the end of the rope was reached.
Look at Self’s post-Vick comments about the positive team dynamic, playing together, etc. That’s no coincidence.
Look at how Self handled his departure last spring and that he required him to sign an agreement to return.
Look at the history with Vick. The benchings, the reasons he was benched (“He has a bad Thursday”, for example), his behavior related issues, etc.
It’s quite obvious.
Remember Tharpe? Leaving due to transfer to be closer to home due to “extenuating circumstances” related to his daughter. Only to sign with the Los Angeles D-League team a few months later.
My topic last season asking whether Newman was a team cancer should have inserted Vick for Newman.
We have all the evidence we need now on Vick.
If Fran makes the comment about him not coming back, and makes no mention of a family situation, he’s relating this to the team dynamic.
Come on. Not born yesterday. Self shields players from direct blame, and this is no different. In house stuff stays in house.
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@HighEliteMajor when Fran was very complimentary of the team and it’s capacity to go very deep in the tourney, my assumption was that he had been spoken to about crapping on Kansas and this was his fake alter ego.
But if Fran is as close to the team as people suggest, do you think that Fran has truly changed his mind about our fortunes based on the Vick departure?
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@approxinfinity The best way to answer that is with a question — how do we all feel about the team now that Vick is gone?
A classic case of addition by subtraction. Chemistry. Team first. Loss of negative energy.
Vick can be really good, but the value of pulling the rope in the same direction outweighs Vick’s inconsistent positive performances. My outlook has totally changed.
One hint was how bad Vick was off the bench. Not, hey, I’m going to prove myself and make up for my screw up. But more like the classic pouter.
We don’t need Vick. I’ll take losing the Big 12 and a first round exit over accommodating me-first knuckleheads that blow the greatest second chance of a lifetime.
