Defense? We Don't Need No Stinking Defense!
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Thx for noticing DG coming up short.
The strength of this team was never Frank, OR Devonte. It was Frank AND Devonte!
Got to get DG to a witch doctor to cast a good spell on his wheels.
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@jaybate-1.0 That was an enjoyable story! There are big chunks that seem quite a stretch, but I enjoyed reading it
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@jaybate-1.0 @StLJhawk I enjoyed it also. Reminds of the play āOf Mice & Menā - except Lenny would probably say āWe aināt got no stinking defense !ā
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@jaybate-1.0 As always, I agree Self is a genius, I enjoy your take on things, and I hope youāre right!
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@jaybate-1.0 DAM Devonte first TWO games in Big 12. - - - - 28.5 fg % - -6-21 , - - - 28.5 3pt% - - -4-14 - -ONE Steal that plus the defensive effort - - -well hell the WHOLE TEAMāS Defensive effort, then there you go boys and girls I mean - - -JUMPIN - - GEE - - HOSSA - - -FATS - - -REALLY? -Again when is the last time an opposing team came in and shot over 50% for the game against us in the Bill Self era? - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@jaybate-1.0 iirc, hasnāt Devonte always worn various supports around his knees?
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Donāt think so. I only recall him wearing a ton of stuff on his legs during those occasional stretches when Self would have everyone wear them to try to mask which guy was playing underreported. Heās not doing that right now. And as I said, there are just lots of times when Devonte is not leaping as he used to do. That is always a sign that a guy his saving his hops for key plays, because his springs hurt.
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Two straight 28% games on a good shooter signal unreported injury.
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Have you seen the warm up videos? He is hitting from half courtā¦hard to do if you are injured.
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@jaybate-1.0 still donāt agree fully with you. Compare what he is wearing last year in the Big 12 tournament to the last game against TCU. Very similar.
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@JayHawkFanToo exactly. The theory is not matching the facts.
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@jaybate-1.0 Sorry, what I was trying to get across is that for the first TWO games in conference he is shooting 28.5 deom the field AND shooting 28.5 % 3pt shooting, Kind of odd shooting the same pct in the tfirst two but not very good - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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On the injury thing, @jaybate-1.0 is usually quick to pin things on injuries. Many times heās right. Here, Iām skeptical.
On the defense thing, I firmly believe that your scheme and approach is premised on your personnel. That includes defensive acuity. If you are not up to par defensively, the world does not end. The game is won based on only one ultimate factor ā who scores more.
As untenable as a 90-88 score may seem to Self, it counts the same as the 65-60 score he seems to enjoy.
We just have to cover our limitations. I had mentioned in a recent post the 2013-14 Jayhawks after we lost Embiid. Focusing on our strengths, understanding our defense was compromised, called for an all out approach to outscore the opponent, understanding weād give up points. Not a "who caresā approach to defense, but maybe a āitās not the end of worldā approach. Energy focused on offense and more possessions.
We are much in the same boat inside defensively now. Opponents will simply try to foul up Lucas. I say, so what?
There will be bad matchups. But unless there is a bull inside and the opposition plays zone (or a very nimble/quick big), our perimeter players are so good we can create the advantage. Hard for big guys to keep up with the high quality smaller players (and to help) than the other way around (where itās easier to trap on the box or double low). If we can shoot over a zone, we can beat anyone.
No approach is completely reliable.
@wissox asked if Doke made that big of a difference. Losing Doke was huge. It limits our options. But we still are a top 5 team, and a team that can win the NC.
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@HighEliteMajor Good point, and really, wouldnāt we rather watch a 90-88 game instead of a 60-57 game?
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@HighEliteMajor I know we are only talking 2 games hereā¦but we have had 2 close games with good, but not really good teamsā¦in large partā¦because of our defenseā¦ isnāt that cause for concern in March? The teams we will play in March will be considerably better than TCU and KSU.
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I think weāre cakewalking. I can understand why the guys look at K-State as a bye week. Weāll get better defensively- Devonte is saving his body for the big games, imo. Frank as well.
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@KUSTEVE you know, I kind of had that feeling also. Our returning starters know that they can get the job done in the tourney as they went to the elite eight last year. In theory, there is little use in blowing out K State and getting even more worn out. Now none of us like games like last night, but in the larger sense blowing them out last night has zero impact on how we play at Ames.
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@KUSTEVE a lil to close for me!
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I think Self is taking a similar approach this year that he did in 2012 when he had a really short bench. That was an offensively challenged team, but an elite defensive team so Self relied on their defense to win games.
This year, this team is an elite offensive team, but not a great defensive team. Self is going to ride this offense as far as he can this year even though it has to be killing him mentally to rely on offense instead of relying on defense.
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First, the loose defensive morals of this basketballl monastery are enough to make me feel I have fallen in with offensive heathen.
SINNERS REPENT!!!
Friar @wissox seems to have become positively reptilian. He would rather win 90-88 than 60-57? OMG! Forgive him Father!!!
Friar @KUSTEVE thinks Devonte is saving his body? This is a sin against basketball manhood and may result in a lightening strike.
Friar @HighEliteMajor is openly skeptical about unreported injury to one of KUās top guards in the Selfian Era after him having two straight 28% shooting nights in Conference and barely being able to jump down the stretch of the KSU game? Ten Hail Jimmies, Brother HEM.
I could go on here, but the point is made.
There is a pox upon our basketball monastery,
A plague of locusts may be coming to devour our gardens and wolves may come to eat our lambs.
90-88 win with a travel and a charge on oneās home floor against a cellar dweller? Against no talent sod busters with milking callouses on their palms and oat hay straw in their hair?
The Lord Basketball god shall ravage you all with hail until thou art beaten birds in the blighted corn and sin of Sodom East of Eden.
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@jaybate-1.0 said
. Nobody wears that stuff, because itās sexy.
Donāt underestimate the sexy feeling of spandex. Especially if a woman provides positiv feedback.
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@HighEliteMajor love the point:
āAs untenable as a 90-88 score may seem to Self, it counts the same as the 65-60 score he seems to enjoy.ā
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@jaybate-1.0 Years of Dick Bennett and Bo Ryan scores Iām ready for some Tarkanian run n gun in Lawrence!
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@HighEliteMajor said:
As untenable as a 90-88 score may seem to Self, it counts the same as the 65-60 score he seems to enjoy
Thinking proportionally, 90-88 is really more like 65-64.98573.
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@jaybate-1.0. 63.555555555555ā¦ (repeating 5ās)
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Self needs to light a fire under Devonte. He canāt make a layup or defend. That guy is playing terrrible and will cost KU games if he doesnāt play closer to his potiental. Hell Iād love last years Devonte. If heās not injured heās tanking for another reason, girl, family, school, maybe Maxwell was his buddy. I donāt know whatās wrong, but Devonte needs to fix it pronto!
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@JayHawkFanToo I can hit a half court shot sitting in a chair. I saw Rod Stewart making threes from the bench while his leg was in a cast. Half court shots prove nothing, but that he likes to screw around instead of practicing a real skill or pushing his teammates to get better.
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@dylans I love that they practice the half court shot. When we make one to win a game all of us will be glad they practiced a seemingly frivolous shot. RCJH
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First, sitting on a chair at half court you probably donāt hit the free throw lineā¦a lot harder than it seems and a trick shot that late and great Pete Maravich would do from the paint while playing donkey and most other players could not
Look at this video of the the 3 point shot at halftimeā¦nothing wrong with himā¦
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@JayHawkFanToo And yet I have and Iām not athletic in the least. You can ignore the rest of my post if you wish, Iām not going to look up video of Stewart to prove my point. Iām not saying Graham is hurt, just that a cripple can make a half court shot.
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Perhaps I did not explain myself well. My point was that contrarily to some posterās assertion that he is injured, he appears to be physically fit, thatās all.
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Nothing wrong with Devonte that 2 working legs wouldnāt cure. The hyperextended left elbow is apparently indirectly influencing his release on his shot. And he canāt fend off with it either. And the scout on him has to read: āhyperextended left elbowānon shooting armāmakes it super tough for him to put it on the deck going to his left. Thus, waaaaaay overplay his right.ā
Oh, and one more thing. Remember that to really play pressure defense on the perimeter, you have to be able to turn and burn, when you occasionally get faked out and the guy gets by you. Devonte is showing no signs of turn and burn; that was really what tipped me off to the bomb pins. He is a good actor. He covers it up well.
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@jaybate-1.0 He isnāt himself.
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āāAs untenable as a 90-88 score may seem to Self, it counts the same as the 65-60 score he seems to enjoy.āā
I question if any of us really know what goes on in Billās head.
I think most of us (myself included) has always viewed Bill as a ādefensive coach,ā meaningā¦ defense first, everything else (including offense) second.
Now we see him as someone who is opening his mind and changing. Maybe he really isnāt changing but we just didnāt know him that well in the first place?
I think of things Bill has said over the years. One thing that stands out now in my memory is, āmargin of error.ā
Perhaps all along Billās main focus is on creating a situation where we have the largest margin to screw up and still win. This idea seems to work with everything he has said historically.
If we donāt buckle down on defense now, we reduce our margin of error considerably. We canāt afford to have a bad shooting night, or high TOs, or low rebounding, or bad FT%, or extreme foul troubleā¦
With no defense we canāt hardly afford to have a bad night in any other area and still hope to win.
If we play good defense, we can win almost any situation. This was the lesson from BAD BALL. We didnāt win all the time, but we won a lot of games with a bad offense.
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Well heard something interesting from a sports talk show today. - - kind of interesting - -and really makes some sense. - -The point being made, we hold KU in such high esteem - -so highly accountable that as they stated KUāS lowest Kem-Pom rating for defense under Coach Self was 22nd. - -They right now are at 26. - - like they said, there are 350 teams in College basketball - - WE have a Kem-Pom rating of TWENTY SIX - -and yet HERE WE BITCH. ā WE are TWENTY SIXTH out of 350 schools in defense.- - Do we realize how many teams would love to have a rating of TWENT SIXTH out of 350? I mean Seriously. - -And Yes Iām just as guilty, but IT DOES put some things in perspective - -Are expectations are soooo dam high for these guys, we have gotten soo used to it, itās actually kind of ridicilious. - - -AGAIN TWENT SIXTH in defense in the Nation out of 350 schools. - -Time to breathe & like Aaron Rodgers from Green Bay said - - R - - E - - L - -A - -X we are going to be fine, they WILL get better. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@jaybate-1.0 Sorry to disagree, I was at the game and the scoreboard replay clearly showed that Svi did not travel and if a foul were to be called, it would have been a blocking call on KSU. One of KUās problems was the fact that KSU played some pretty damn good defense (KU did not). How we scored 90 points is a mystery other than the fact it was a really high tempo contest. Hope you donāt give me 20 lashes but this is how I saw the game.
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@jessejayhawk KU scoring a lot of points is no mystery - this is one of the best offensive teams in the country behind Kentucky and UCLA.
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@jessejayhawk coach self said Svi traveled
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@Crimsonorblue22 I donāt know how you can look at the replay and say he did not travel.
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I want you for my Media manager. You almost made it seem all okay. A Kelly Anne Conway level of reassurance and calm. Bravo, sir!
For a second there I blinked and forgot Self said ithis was his worst defense at Kansas.
Alas, they also looked bad defensively the last two games.
And 88 points is a lot to give up on your home floor to a rival that had to scramble just to field a team this season.
What is their KENPOM rating the last two games?
Maybe that 26 rank included the whole season; I.e., before Doke went out and DG started appearing to play unreported?
I thought they were progressing toward being a good defense until recently. I was comfortable that early injuries accounted for some early problems and they were healing. Butā¦
After these lat two games something seems very wrong. Not irreversibly wrong, but concerning enough to Self to call them his worst defensive team in hopes of spurring them back into effective defenders.
I reckon some shorter practices should help, too.
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KU scoring: KU scores well, shot 50%, and they played a weak team; Thanatos explains KUās 90.
Svi traveling: I counted three steps after picking up his dribble. Self says he travelled. Others above saw the travel. Maybe the Washington Post thinks Putin hacked the scoreboard replay as a favor to Svi?
Svi charging: the home team often gets that call, so Iāll be a mensch and write that off.
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@Hawk8086 I say he did
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Podcast with Jesse
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@jaybate-1.0 close win is a win.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 but he may kill some players as he stews in his frustration
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So top 5%. I was thinking same thing as I listened to Jesseās podcast
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Board rats sometimes misunderstand that other board rats are not complaining about the win. I imagine they are quite happy about the win. Rather, they are rationally concerned about the level of defensive play, given the level of the opponent.
I for one would be making this comment whether we won or lost
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@jaybate-1.0 actually your counterpoint is a valid factor. Will our rating fall further minus UA.
Iām highly concerned with our defense. I think weāre going to be bloodied along the way due to that, especially on the inside and our poor FT shooting.
Throw in a rough Offensive night too (for whatever reason) and I donāt know what it could look like. Hopefully wouldnāt occur at an in opportune time that becomes a mental blow that we struggle to recover from. Donāt think thatās highly likely.
Or in the tournament and itās over. Iām still shell shocked from how well Villanova had read our mail and locked us down defensively last year. Itās a one game scenario and even though all our issues, we were still in it with a chance to win, it didnāt matter. Just like kstate game we squeaked one out.
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Middle of our conference schedule is gonna be tough. May determine if we get 13 or not.
