Recruiting Thread
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Let’s hope the guys coming in have a competitive nature and want to win games.
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They definitely do. All are really good competitors.
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I’ve heard nothing but good things about Dotson in that regard.
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So reading more about the 6’5 SF – Ochai Agbaji so, seriously - - how of a legit option is he? - -I know we offered yesterday, and how serious do we think he would be considering coming to KU and or committing to us. - -really good 3-4 year player obviously going to rise in the rankings some? - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@Jayballer54 he’s legit pending Vick and Newman’s decisions. As of now, there technically isn’t a spot for him since we’re full. But we almost certainly will since at least one of those guys will leave, and Cunliffe may transfer again too. So he’s a really nice developmental prospect who I’d love to see RS year 1 if he’s like the 12th man. He won’t be in a hurry. He’ll take visits before making a choice, presumably after we know what some guys are doing. Also, he’ll have no impact on Langford whatsoever.
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Glad we finally offered. Let’s see how this plays out. The tea leaves on this one certainly feel as if we are going to see roster turnover on the perimeter and have a need for him. If he’s as good a shooter as his video’s look I definitely see why they are interested
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If I were the kid’s family, I’d look Self in the eye and ask, “If my kid comes to Kansas, works his tail off, and is a starter by his junior year. But you will still look to recruit over him, and you’ll bump him out of the starting lineup, if the next OAD flavor of the month is available, correct?”
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I’d reply, “We will continue to recruit the best players we can to fill out the roster giving us the best chance at a national championship. Competition makes us all better, therefore starting positions are earned not given. If you come in and earn a starting position it’s yours to lose on merit, not to a promise.”
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FarmerJayhawk said:
@Jayballer54 he’s legit pending Vick and Newman’s decisions. As of now, there technically isn’t a spot for him since we’re full. But we almost certainly will since at least one of those guys will leave, and Cunliffe may transfer again too. So he’s a really nice developmental prospect who I’d love to see RS year 1 if he’s like the 12th man. He won’t be in a hurry. He’ll take visits before making a choice, presumably after we know what some guys are doing. Also, he’ll have no impact on Langford whatsoever.
OK , I understand what you saying , or at least I think I do , if Vick OR Newman leaves then we would have that opening for him right? - -However I’m not sure how him committing would not effect Romeo. - -I mean like you said If Vick or Newman leave there is the spot - -BUT if that’s the case he would take the one spot that we would have available right? - Then no spots open for Romeo - -how would that then work out? - -I think with the way thing are going I really am starting to think unless he gets it turned around - -I would think Vick is coming back. - - At this point right now I think a lot more chance Newman leaves then Vick ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@Jayballer54 Point being, you don’t worry about scholarship numbers. If one of Vick or Newman decide to stay, then Ogbaji commits, then Romeo calls up Self and wants to commit, then you make a spot. Scholarships aren’t guaranteed year to year, so Self could pull someone like Sam aside and tell him, “hey, we feel like it would be best for both parties to go our separate ways. Also, you’re getting exactly no PT next season with Romeo, Garrett, Grimes, and maybe Vick ahead of you on the depth chart.” I do agree with you in that it’s more likely Vick comes back than Newman, which at this point I hope Newman comes back over Vick. Could start Newman at PG pretty easily, with he and Grimes splitting time on the ball. Also would be nice to have a veteran presence back there. The possibility of starting 3 freshmen has me really nervous. Also having a lineup of Newman, Grimes, and Langford and all that firepower makes my spine tingle. Come to think of it, that probable starting five is absolutely insane.
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Did you forget Charlie Moore?
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No, if we have all those guys then Moore won’t play much. Same reason I left Ogbaji out.
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@FarmerJayhawk Dotson will be on the ball I would bet, not Grimes.
Forcing a guy to transfer is part of the deal. Self’s pushed guys out before. But Cunliffe has already burned a redshirt year to come here. That would be pretty disappointing if he got pushed out.
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I respectfully disagree. I would not be surprised to see Moore start at PG until Dotson gets acclimated.
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I’m in the camp that thinks Dotson will be too good to keep out of the starting lineup. His ball handling and driving ability will be the best on the team by far.
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I will be completely shocked if Dotson isn’t a starter from Day-1.
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JayHawkFanToo said:
I respectfully disagree. I would not be surprised to see Moore start at PG until Dotson gets acclimated.
Ya I was kind of thinking the same thing. - Would not surprise me at all if Moore at least starts the first few games then Dotson take over the spot a little later in the season.
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I’d be MORE shocked if Grimes didn’t start from day one then I would be shocked with Dotson - - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@Jayballer54 I’m with @BeddieKU23 on this. While Moore could get the nod a few games early, I think the talent difference between he and Moore is more than Grimes perhaps Vick/Newman. But it sounds like we all are expecting a lot from the freshman.
Try this … If Vick and Newman are gone, and no Langford, could Moore, Dotson and Grimes all start? Lots of ball handling there.
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HighEliteMajor said:
@Jayballer54 I’m with @BeddieKU23 on this. While Moore could get the nod a few games early, I think the talent difference between he and Moore is more than Grimes perhaps Vick/Newman. But it sounds like we all are expecting a lot from the freshman.
If Dotson wasn’t the starter at PG to start the season I think it would be Grimes that beats him out. Nothing against Charlie, I just don’t think he’s a point guard yet. He’s an option if we need it and somehow Devon or Quentin was behind Self’s learning curve or he wanted to send a message to them. I’m still kind of puzzled at the Moore signing with how we recruited over him. Charlie has some Frank scoring ability in him and hopefully can become more Nic Moore or Sr Mason later in his career for us.
I know the staff did an unbelievable job establishing relationships with Devon & Quentin but let’s be real, Self doesn’t land 2 McDonald’s All American’s without giving them some kind of promise of playing time. Both of those recruitment’s were contentious and they could have gone somewhere else to play 30 minutes a game.
Try this … If Vick and Newman are gone, and no Langford, could Moore, Dotson and Grimes all start? Lots of ball handling there.
Ouch, small lineup but certainly not out of the realm of possibility. I think Self would sign another guard in that situation because you can’t see Self having no point guard depth again like he’s dealing with this season.
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HighEliteMajor said:
@Jayballer54 I’m with @BeddieKU23 on this. While Moore could get the nod a few games early, I think the talent difference between he and Moore is more than Grimes perhaps Vick/Newman. But it sounds like we all are expecting a lot from the freshman.
Try this … If Vick and Newman are gone, and no Langford, could Moore, Dotson and Grimes all start? Lots of ball handling there.
Oh I agree for sure, and I also agree with what was said, what I was saying that for the 1st few games to start the season you will more likely then not see Moor get the start. I have no doubt it won’t take long for Devon to take hi spot - -Been a big Dotson fan from the get go.
Ya your right I think there is a lot being expected - - I just hope not TO MUCH. pretty easy to expect to much too early.- -no mater the talent - -they are still Freshmen - gonna take a period to adjust no matter what. - -Look at the talent Kentucky has this year with their Freshmen - but still I agree with you 100%
Ya that would be some ball handling for sure - -yet I hope it doesn’t out like that , hopefully Vick and or Langford will be here - -at least one or the other- - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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JayHawkFanToo said:
I respectfully disagree. I would not be surprised to see Moore start at PG until Dotson gets acclimated.
Ah. I probably wasn’t clear. I was assuming in that case Newman would be back and start at PG, sharing duties with Grimes.
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JayHawkFanToo said:
I respectfully disagree. I would not be surprised to see Moore start at PG until Dotson gets acclimated.
Moore isn’t quite Cunliffe but I don’t think he is a guy that ever starts in an ideal world. He just isn’t all that good.
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HighEliteMajor said:
@Jayballer54 I’m with @BeddieKU23 on this. While Moore could get the nod a few games early, I think the talent difference between he and Moore is more than Grimes perhaps Vick/Newman. But it sounds like we all are expecting a lot from the freshman.
Try this … If Vick and Newman are gone, and no Langford, could Moore, Dotson and Grimes all start? Lots of ball handling there.
I think Self would go with Dotson, Grimes and Garrett. I hope it doesn’t come to this though.
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@BShark it shouldn’t. Heard today that Newman has at least expressed interest in coming back, as to tell the staff not to give away his spot. What a coup that would be!
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BeddieKU23 said:
HighEliteMajor said:
@Jayballer54 I’m with @BeddieKU23 on this. While Moore could get the nod a few games early, I think the talent difference between he and Moore is more than Grimes perhaps Vick/Newman. But it sounds like we all are expecting a lot from the freshman.
If Dotson wasn’t the starter at PG to start the season I think it would be Grimes that beats him out. Nothing against Charlie, I just don’t think he’s a point guard yet. He’s an option if we need it and somehow Devon or Quentin was behind Self’s learning curve or he wanted to send a message to them. I’m still kind of puzzled at the Moore signing with how we recruited over him. Charlie has some Frank scoring ability in him and hopefully can become more Nic Moore or Sr Mason later in his career for us.
I know the staff did an unbelievable job establishing relationships with Devon & Quentin but let’s be real, Self doesn’t land 2 McDonald’s All American’s without giving them some kind of promise of playing time. Both of those recruitment’s were contentious and they could have gone somewhere else to play 30 minutes a game.
Try this … If Vick and Newman are gone, and no Langford, could Moore, Dotson and Grimes all start? Lots of ball handling there.
Ouch, small lineup but certainly not out of the realm of possibility. I think Self would sign another guard in that situation because you can’t see Self having no point guard depth again like he’s dealing with this season.
Remember how Nic Moore didn’t really work out at the university games? Admittedly in a small sample size. This is my worry with Charlie.
Everything I’ve read indicates Self promised pt and starting positions to Dotson and Grimes. Some people aren’t going to believe that and I get it. Obviously if things don’t work out, Self can change the line-up. Initially they will start though.
If no Langford, Vick and Newman I definitely see Self adding another guard (plus hopefully Agbaji). No idea who it would be at this point. Maybe a grad transfer but that could be a tough sell for a grad transfer to come somewhere to be depth. We saw how the stache flaked out in that situation.
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FarmerJayhawk said:
@BShark it shouldn’t. Heard today that Newman has at least expressed interest in coming back, as to tell the staff not to give away his spot. What a coup that would be!
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The doge meme is the best non-KU meme and I’ll fight anyone who says otherwise.
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@FarmerJayhawk looks like my dog when he sees the prairie dogs out my car window, or if I crack the window he can hear them squeaking.
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But yeah Newman coming back would be incredible. He has really turned a corner and I could only imagine him after another off season.
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I’d be stoked. If we get Romeo, that’s a great small rotation.
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Moore had a solid freshman year and has one year learning the system. I am not saying the he will be the starter all season but it would not surprise me if he starts a few games until Dotson is used to playing Division I.
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@JayHawkFanToo I just don’t think he is a good fit, but obviously I could be wrong.
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Newman returning would be more important then Vick as it currently stands.
I’m impressed if Malik is actually telling the staff his interest in returning. He’s definitely matured during his time here.
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I think Charlie will do some good things for KU in time. He’s a scorer and that skill alone will probably have some value next season. His slight frame really scares you in situations but hopefully he’s a competitor and plays hard to compensate for it.
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Ryan Noel does not believe Vick will be back. Interesting
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BShark said:
But yeah Newman coming back would be incredible. He has really turned a corner and I could only imagine him after another off season.
I just don’t see him coming back. I just think at seasons end when it’s all said and done , he is gone. – I don’t think he would relish the idea of backing up Grimes and YES Grimes would start over Newman Freshmen or not - like has been mentioned I think even by you yourself- I think Self has given these Freshman time and I think Grimes is just to much of a stud not to start, & I just don’t feel Newman would be ready for that. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@BeddieKU23 Is that based on NBA potential or is that opinion influenced by the latest developments with Vick?
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Hawk8086 said:
@BeddieKU23 Is that based on NBA potential or is that opinion influenced by the latest developments with Vick?
He didn’t elaborate on that line.
If I was to assume, I think he was told Vick wasn’t returning when the season started. That would make sense in the fact that Romeo Langford is considering KU highly but seems to be waiting to make sure (Vick) leaves before announcing his decision. I’m connecting dots, however this could be wrong.
The latest developments certainly could be a factor as well. Jan 1st, Vick is a possible 1st round pick. Feb 1st, Vick has played himself out of both rounds. He’s now been benched twice. I don’t believe Vick’s situation is like Carlton Bragg or Greene for instance where the door was opened for them…
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BeddieKU23 said:
Ryan Noel does not believe Vick will be back. Interesting
Phog post? This move to go to Mitch feels like a long term benefit move and that Vick is done.
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Jayballer54 said:
BShark said:
But yeah Newman coming back would be incredible. He has really turned a corner and I could only imagine him after another off season.
I just don’t see him coming back. I just think at seasons end when it’s all said and done , he is gone. – I don’t think he would relish the idea of backing up Grimes and YES Grimes would start over Newman Freshmen or not - like has been mentioned I think even by you yourself- I think Self has given these Freshman time and I think Grimes is just to much of a stud not to start, & I just don’t feel Newman would be ready for that. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
If Newman stays, I don’t think we get Romeo. I think the starting guards would be Dotson, Newman and Grimes.
Everything I see/read now indicates that Newman is really loving his time here. What a turnaround for this kid. Stay or go, he’s a Jayhawk in my book now.
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BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
Ryan Noel does not believe Vick will be back. Interesting
Phog post? This move to go to Mitch feels like a long term benefit move and that Vick is done.
Yeah it was a phog post.
I think as much as its a long term move, its rewarding those who do what Self wants. He clearly would play 4 guards if the 4 guards were all on the same page with their responsibilities. The 4 guard lineup with our roster is still the most effective lineup we can play. Making this move 23 games into the season is a huge risk. But clearly Self is pissed and sending a message
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If this doesn’t wake Vick up I don’t know what will. Or maybe it’s just too late and Vick is gone anyway.
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@BeddieKU23 Quickly reminded of why I haven’t been on the phog in months as soon as I open some threads. I really can’t believe how many people think McCormack is going to start next year. Is it because he is a McDAA? I have no idea.
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BShark said:
@BeddieKU23 Quickly reminded of why I haven’t been on the phog in months as soon as I open some threads. I really can’t believe how many people think McCormack is going to start next year. Is it because he is a McDAA? I have no idea.
I Think McCormack is going to be a very solid player - - a very solid 4 year player. - I don’t think there is any way in hell that he starts next year. - He is going to be a project player , again solid but the first couple of years is going to take time.
One big reason I don’t think he will be is because more and more thinking really that Doke may just be back - -didn’t think this in the beginning but man Doke still has work to do, which in turn makes McCormack a really good back up to Doke - -let De- Sosua possibly back up Lawson at the 4? - yes? - -no? - then allow Mitch to redshirt. - Just don’t see McCormack in any way starting . - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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BShark said:
@BeddieKU23 Quickly reminded of why I haven’t been on the phog in months as soon as I open some threads. I really can’t believe how many people think McCormack is going to start next year. Is it because he is a McDAA? I have no idea.
Yeah its hard to read stuff on there.
I hope McCormack finds a way to get some minutes next season. He’s got some low post moves I’m excited to see the staff work with him on. People see Burger Boy, from Oak Hill and assume. Maybe he surprises. I don’t know next years squad is going to have a lot of fresh slates to work with
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@BeddieKU23 I don’t see him getting much run if Doke is back.
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BShark said:
@BeddieKU23 I don’t see him getting much run if Doke is back.
Agreed he would have a reserve role if Doke comes back. Anxiously awaiting intel on that one
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BShark said:
@BeddieKU23 Quickly reminded of why I haven’t been on the phog in months as soon as I open some threads. I really can’t believe how many people think McCormack is going to start next year. Is it because he is a McDAA? I have no idea.
The Phog is a total dumpster fire almost all the time. Not sure why I even go over there anymore. Anyway, I don’t think Newman and Langford have much impact on each other. I think we slide Newman to PG and start Grimes and Langford with him. Grimes has enough PG skills to play on the ball, and Newman can in a pinch.
I haven’t heard either way whether Vick is gone or not, only that he’s almost certain to declare and get feedback. I could see him showing out at the combine and getting drafted mid-2nd, but the 1st round chatter is toast.
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Agbaji is wing, that offer doesn’t get made at this point without Self knowing either Newman or Vick are leaving. Newman could go to the NBA and Vick could possibly be getting squeezed out of the program. I would also say that offer is a pretty clear sign that Langford is headed elsewhere.
There’s also minimal chance of McCormack starting or even playing relevant minutes next season. He’s someone who the likely best case scenario is the 4th big overall and 3rd in the low post rotation, but the most likely scenario is he’s the 6th big overall and 4th low post big. That doesn’t equal big minutes.
