Rocktagon the Chalktagon



  • @BigBad Dunno. I haven’t followed the Pistons since Marcus was there for a few games, I think.



  • @mayjay heard he was traded, didn’t know where.



  • Gotta guard the corners better (Vick). Obviously Lawson can’t dribble through a quick team like K-State. Honestly, I think we win this game with Garrett. That way we get less turnovers, a more rested Dotson, and more assists. Guard play in defense was just not disciplined enough.



  • Jeff gueldner holding zero back on Vick



  • betterfireE said:

    Gotta guard the corners better (Vick). Obviously Lawson can’t dribble through a quick team like K-State. Honestly, I think we win this game with Garrett. That way we get less turnovers, a more rested Dotson, and more assists. Guard play in defense was just not disciplined enough.

    Good point re Garrett.



  • Would this team be better off in the long run had Vick not returned ?



  • @Blown i guess it depends on who would have gotten his scholarship



  • @Blown Doubtful with how Grimes, KJ and Ochai played especially in the second half. Its really disturbing to see our lone Senior play like that in a rivalry game.



  • Vick must have done something on the bench.



  • Looking at the boxscore its really on on the TOs, shot better and out rebounded them.



  • Self on benching Lagerald and if it was related to production: “There was other reasons why.”



  • @Crimsonorblue22 The biggest issue with this team is that there are not any upperclassmen spreading the culture. Self put Devonte on the phone for the Tech game pregame hype. Vick is our lone senior and he has had effort issues since day one. Not a great example for the young guys to follow.



  • Quentin Grimes: 2 baskets, 1 rebound, 0 assists, 0 steals, 5 turnovers, 4 fouls.



  • It wouldn’t surprise me at this point if Vick just up and leaves the team.



  • I have no doubt that we would be better off without Vick, had we recruited a top 40 shooter. We would have lost a couple more preconference games but we would have won today. And we wouldn’t have an idiot hothead hamming it up after made baskets instead of getting back to play d, and making no look passes to the 5th row with a road win within reach.

    Mindnumbingly stupid. Done with Vick.



  • I think I’m getting more angry by the minute, KSU has completely owned us in most sports this year. Absolutely unacceptable.



  • Son of a sheep lover…this team. SO many turnovers. Jeebus. I’d say that was pretty much the game. The harsh realization is that we have nearly zero ballhandlers. Even Dotson struggles when pressed. Grimes is kinda comical he’s so bad. How that guy even got a scholarship at a major program…hmmm. Hoping he stays and shows massive improvement next year.

    On the bright side, Our defense was impressive for awhile. Albeit against a previously offensively challenged K-State team. Zone! Where’d that come from? Self is an enigma this year. Why go away from the plan/players that were keeping us in the game? Mitch, Charlie, etc.

    K State once again game planned Vick out of the game. Self needs to do a better job of getting his guys in position to score.

    Vick was benched the second I started screaming at the TV for his complete lack of effort or give a shit on D. I’m assuming that’s why. Anybody know otherwise?

    The top moment of the game? When Mitch and Charlie bonked heads in the lane. Sums it up nicely.



  • @mayjay That’s a good spot for him. He’ll carve out a larger role in Detroit.



  • @jayhawkcsg You should yell at the TV earlier.



  • kjayhawks said:

    We were basically down 2 starters friends and showed our youth at the guard spots. Let’s take out some anger on OSU Saturday.

    There is also a major bone to pick with OSU after their sweep last year, first in the HCBS era.



  • Well if what I heard was right as I didn’t bother to watch the very end for just the reason I heard took place - -and that is that their so called fans rushed the floor and acted like idiots - -If that is the case - - - - -

    Then in reality they are making themselves look really bad - - -even more so then our play. Cause as I’m sure we have all heard that when fans storm their court like that - -it detracts from what their team did ON the floor - -it’s like dis respecting your own guys , saying that they didn’t expect to win the game. - - It’s pretty classless ,people could and have been hurt. - -You remember when Jamari showed great restraint ? - and THAT was at K-Straight – I mean come on act like you belong - - act like you actually feel like you felt you could very easily win the game - -. - -this is just showing your ignorance. your taking away from what your team accomplished.

    I thought the conference established fines for when league teams fans did this - -because of what K-Straight did the LAST TIME. RIGHT?

    let me ask you - - how many times have you seen KU storm the court after winning a big game? - - -I mean obviously we sure the hell not going to storm the floor against league opponents - -I mean we beat their as so often - - -BUT how many times have you seen KU storm the court after we beat the likes of Say - - Kentucky ? - - - -N Carolina ? - - - -Michigan State ? – - Duke ? - -have you seen us storm the floor after we beat one of them ? - -the answer is a resounding - - NO - - - - why ? - - Why don’t we ? – - -the answer is simple - -because we have shown we belong - -we belong on the floor with these elite teams - I mean come on you fricken idiots - - so some class - - -some respect - -to us - - hell show it to your own players - - - - -Act like you belong -I’m sure it would be appreciated by ALL



  • Another gem of a game from Grimes. He hit two 3’s. One of those was 10 feet long and banked in off the glass at 100 mph. He had five turnovers. He had four fouls. He had 1 rebound.

    How was this kid the #8 recruit in the country and was a lottery pick on every board before the season started?

    When does Bill put him on the bench? We have seen it before where Bill puts high ranked stars into the deep freeze. Why not Grimes? Not judging. Honestly asking. What is going on here?



  • @joeloveshawks Its tough to see why Self would’t start Garrett over him once healthy. He’s had his time and hasn’t made the best of it. Maybe he would be better off the bench.



  • @joeloveshawks

    Look at the other options. Optics play a part here. Self cant afford to sit a highly decorated freshman for recruiting purposes. This isnt the oubre years anymore, these kids notice. I’m not saying that’s the main reason as his defensive effort is appalling to watch which should piss him off enough to consider other options. I think Grimes is the least of his issues though, Vick again showed why he is not mentally capable of being a teammate and mentor



  • @joeloveshawks Bill read boards past and is letting Grimes play through his mistakes, you don’t want to shatter his confidence, ya know? Lol

    Seriously, I just think Self has too few options on what was supposed to be a deep team. You’ve got to play Vick, or Moore, or Grimes, or KJ, or Mitch. Most games Grimes just disappears. You usually know when the other guys are in. Our McDonald’s AA Center can’t get off the bench even with the two guys ahead of him on the depth chart out for the year. This is not the team America expected last summer.

    No leadership, no chemistry, not good…yet I still hold hope this squad will galvanize. It may be losing the streak on the court (not in the court) will motivate the fantastic fresman core to be dominate as Sophomores (and Juniors if I may be greedy). Heck it may be they figure it out after this loss, but it looked all to familiar for me think a turnaround is that eminent.



  • It really drives me nuts that Weber is allowed to be so far on the floor, hope one of these days someone flattens him.



  • Self hasnt changed with regarding Grimes, he just doesnt have many options. Vick(brain dead), Grimes(Everything), Garrett(cant shoot at ALL), Moore(cant play d or finish at the rim), and Agbaji(young dumb mistakes) all have issues.



  • I think Vick might be attitude



  • I thought we played excellent for a nice stretch. Mainly after Vick and Q were pulled. I liked the way we fought back to make it a game. This loss doesn’t bother me as much as the other ones. A young team playing an E8 team on the road. Their game of the year. Little brother’s break through game. We’ll be lower seeded this year, so no one will expect much from us in the tournament. So, maybe we put together a nice little tournament run, and surprise ourselves.



  • @Crimsonorblue22 Maybe its onus for thinking Vick would be a new man this season. Same old Vick, can be great but only chooses to be 30% of the time.



  • @KUSTEVE

    We gained the lead when Kansas St went over 7 minutes without a field goal. We looked better then the reality of the situation. Once st woke up in the 2nd half there was no hope. That Grimes play where he attempted to bat the ball out instead of grabbing the rebound right in front of his face then fouling was imo the difference in the game. It was a one possession game and everything spiraled from there like brain dead Vick playing 1 on 5.



  • After I saw wade easily take Lawson to the goal more than once, it was over. Dedric can’t bend his knees, or slide his feet. I know he’s a 4, but so is wade. I wish he would be tougher! He’s been w/Hudy 2 years, I expect more out of him. I know he gets fouled, but he seems so weak. I know he’s our go to guy and I love the guy, I just can’t understand why he’s not better, tougher. I thought we looked like a jv. team against a varsity team. I give d dot a pass. Thought we should’ve stayed in the zone? Corner 3’s😡 If we don’t value the ball like that, more losses.



  • @Crimsonorblue22 That’s why I have said he is gone, people think he could improve so much. I don’t think he can athletically, He’s a 4 year junior in the second half of the season, what you get is what you see. Defense against 3s have been terrible all year and it’s just not gonna change at this point unfortunately.



  • It seems like the minute we think we have an answer, something screws up that answer.

    I do know what we haven’t tried – starting and playing McCormack. I can’t say that is the answer. But it is worth a shot at this point. Would work fine in the middle of that 2/3 zone. It is worth a look. But I’m not suggesting it’s “the” answer at all. It’s an option worth exploring because what we’ve seen isn’t the answer.



  • I can’t see all the posts, did anyone say that brown shouted out brannen Greene on his dunk at the end of the game?



  • @Crimsonorblue22 This may have been what you saw. The only comment about Brannen was actually late in the second half when I said the dunk with a minute left did not bother me.

    Texas Hawk 10 said:

    So Barry Brown with the dick move to end the game?



  • He did call it out. I read it on another blog. Just wasn’t sure you guys knew for sure.



  • It was the one that didn’t count



  • He took one dribble and then catapulted up and threw the ball down with one hand, only his shot came after the buzzer.

    “No, no regret at all, man,” Brown said. “Shoutout Brannen Greene.”



  • joeloveshawks said:

    Another gem of a game from Grimes. He hit two 3’s. One of those was 10 feet long and banked in off the glass at 100 mph. He had five turnovers. He had four fouls. He had 1 rebound.

    How was this kid the #8 recruit in the country and was a lottery pick on every board before the season started?

    When does Bill put him on the bench? We have seen it before where Bill puts high ranked stars into the deep freeze. Why not Grimes? Not judging. Honestly asking. What is going on here?

    Who you replacing him with? - -Ochai is already on the court – Garret sure isn’t gonna help on the offensive end - - who else you got?



  • Crimsonorblue22 said:

    I can’t see all the posts, did anyone say that brown shouted out brannen Greene on his dunk at the end of the game?

    YA – Class at it’s finest. - -but what does he have to worry about – Senior - -this is his last year - -he can play the fool - not have to worry - - the Phog Awaits



  • joeloveshawks said:

    Another gem of a game from Grimes. He hit two 3’s. One of those was 10 feet long and banked in off the glass at 100 mph. He had five turnovers. He had four fouls. He had 1 rebound.

    How was this kid the #8 recruit in the country and was a lottery pick on every board before the season started?

    When does Bill put him on the bench? We have seen it before where Bill puts high ranked stars into the deep freeze. Why not Grimes? Not judging. Honestly asking. What is going on here?

    Remember when people said the 2018 class was garbage? They were right.



  • Crimsonorblue22 said:

    He did call it out. I read it on another blog. Just wasn’t sure you guys knew for sure.

    ya been reported also b Chasen that’s what he said on the last sec dunk



  • @jayballer73 that’s where I read it



  • @Crimsonorblue22 @jayballer73

    So, interesting juxtaposition in our last 2 games. We get motivated by Devonte before the game Saturday, and go out and crush TTex.

    Go to Manhattan, and find out that they are motivated by Brannen Greene. And apparently they have figured out how to make virtually our entire team channel our inner Brannen and play as shitty as he did.

    Who ever predicted BG as a key to a KU game in 2019?



  • @joeloveshawks Theory — Adidas paid Grimes. Self knows. Grimes knows Self knows. Leverage. Grimes starts every game. Just a theory to explain the inexplicable.



  • @HighEliteMajor an excellent theory. And probably has weight. And to your earlier point. Why not more Big Dave at this point? I think the kid is good. I’ve been saying for weeks if not months this particular group of kids is better 3 around 2 if for no other reason than lack of great outside shooting. He just needs more time in there to find himself. But doesn’t get it. Why? 4-1 allows for the paid kid to be in more. I’m just done with it. The one time Self should sit the higher regarded (hs ranked) player he doesn’t. Or atleast not enough. Now one could say he should play Grimes more to let the this teams ceiling come to fruition. But I just don’t think he has it. Big Dave does . Give him the time. Idk. I feel each game like I either know less and less about this game, or it’s just changed beyond my comprehension.



  • Lol worried about Greenes dunk from 3 years ago, wow get a life.



  • Grimes is not the same player he was in the USA games. Self is trying to find that guy. Why wouldn’t any other player speak out that has sat? Anywhere!



  • To make matters worse, our girls just blew a 7 point lead in the final 2 minutes and got beat by 10 in OT by KSU. I only watched late but KSU hit a 3 on an obvious walk and had a and 1 without being touched. Don’t know how the rest of the game was called. This team would be on the bubble if they learned to finish games out.


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