Oklahoma Whiz Kid Revisited
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Skeptical Master jaybate 1.0, this post is for you. The Sooner Phenom racked up some special stats last nigh vs. Mr. Drew’s hapless Baylor Bears. He hit a total of 6 threes from beyond 30 ft. I just heard on Sports Center that no NBA player in the past 20 years has hit more than 4 of those in one game. WOW!
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I watched the game. Those three point shots were amazing! I would like him better if the announcers and ESPN didn’t act like he was the only person on the floor. I expect that very soon they will flood the basketball court and Trae will dribble, pass, and shoot while running on the water.
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@REHawk He also has his 4th 40 pt game, which is a B12 record. Career, or season? Dunno which. Still lots of points.
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Young is better than I ever would have imagined. PG is the hardest position to play level to level, but he made the transition no problem, and did it without being an athletic freak. I thought he would be solid. He’s the most impactful player in the country.
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I saw that and I think there is waaaaaay too much hype. The 3 point line in college is 20’-9" and the NBA 23’-9" from the center of the rim. I saw a compilation of the long 3s he hit and the graph on the screen showed 32’ or 33’ that means means he was about 12’ outside the college 3 point line…which he was not, he was a couple of feet outside of what would be the NBA line or about 6’ outside the college line or 26’ or 27;, perhaps a little more, but certainly not 32’ or 33’; that is big difference. In comparison, the FT line is 15’ from the backboard, double that distance and add another 3’ and that is 33’…or maybe my eyes are playing tricks on me…
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Bill Self wanted Trae Young to go to Oklahoma if guard didn’t pick Kansas
Once Bill Self found out Young wasn’t coming to Kansas, however, he was incredibly gracious to Trae’s father, Rayford. In a feature by Bleacher Report’s Jason King, Rayford Young talked about the conversation he had with Self.
“I was like, ‘Bill, you know you’re not going to let him play like that,’” Rayford said, according to King. “Eventually [Self] was like, ‘I guess you’re right, but promise me one thing: If he doesn’t come to Kansas, make sure he goes to OU. It will be good for the state. It will be good for the league.’”
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@BeddieKU23 nice find!
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@REHawk Wow. Consider me impressed. Especially considering Steph Curry. I am actually doubting that stat for a bit.
Effing people on sports media talking about Trae being better than Steph as a freshmen. Sure, I’ll buy into that. Barely. I haven’t gone back to look at Steph’s stats his first year but I bet they aren’t as impressive. BUT, for people to say he will be a better pro is down right insane.
I am saying right now that Trae will not be a better pro than Steph. Nope. I just don’t believe it. Soooo many things have to fall into place for that to happen. Its bonkers to suggest otherwise.
Some here may say, hey dude why so high on Curry?
I dunno. I just like the guy. I’m sure part of my feeling on this has to do with the fact that he had a pro game against KU and we still beat him in 08.
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Believe he averaged close to 20 a game as a freshman. He was good but young definitely has surpassed what he was able to do at the same stage. Agree it’s redicilous to expect young to be a better pro then curry is. He does look as if he will have a good career at the next level though
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Translation: please don’t go to Kentucky/the Squid.
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Lulufulu said:
@REHawk Wow. Consider me impressed. Especially considering Steph Curry. I am actually doubting that stat for a bit.
Effing people on sports media talking about Trae being better than Steph as a freshmen. Sure, I’ll buy into that. Barely. I haven’t gone back to look at Steph’s stats his first year but I bet they aren’t as impressive. BUT, for people to say he will be a better pro is down right insane.
I am saying right now that Trae will not be a better pro than Steph. Nope. I just don’t believe it. Soooo many things have to fall into place for that to happen. Its bonkers to suggest otherwise.
Some here may say, hey dude why so high on Curry?
I dunno. I just like the guy. I’m sure part of my feeling on this has to do with the fact that he had a pro game against KU and we still beat him in 08.I’m with you, I would take Steph Curry 10 times out of 10 . - -Trae to me impressed me much more when we played Oklahoma then the way Trae played last night - -once again launching up low pct shoots, you can talk to me until your blue in the face - -any Coach who is a Coach will tell you that those ARE NOT high percentage and would much rather that you NOT shot that kind of a shot.
Now when we ( KU ) played Oklahoma - -I was very impressed with Trae - -he is an outstanding talent , but he was much better in every faucet of the game that night - -getting his team mates more involved - - - sweet passes - -higher quality shots yet not to many - -keeping everyone involved. - -I would much rather watch a player play that way then just come down - -get two - -thre dribbles past half court and launch -to me that’s a very SELFISH play/player.
When he was doing that - -we all heard Jay Bilas - - Jay Williams - - Seth Greenburg - -other commentators - -all talk about his judgement - hell of a talent - - but even with his play of over 40 last night - -they still only won by 2 - -at home - -against Baylor - - -BAYLOR.
I think Oklahoma is playing on borrowed time --I no longer consider then as big of concern as West Virginia - - Texas Tech. - -ESPN has a pretty good article about the concerns of Oklahoma and Kentucky good read. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@Jayballer54 Please don’t overlook the fact that he compiled 9 assists last night. I was able to watch only the second half, but it became obvious that his teammates could not handle several of his hot passes. If Latin could play like that Konate lad of WVU, Trae would have probably logged a half dozen more assists. And I think maybe OU was playing without James last night. The whiz kid has to carry a weary load in order for his squad to stay ultra competitive. In our league I have seen nothing like him since Kevin Durant’s year at Texas. And I have never watched a freshman point guard anywhere with the polish of this kid. He is an absolute gem for the Big 12. If the OU fandom was as rabid as KU’s, they would fill a second field house with folks desperate to watch and bless him in clusters before a giant screen.
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Yes, you are sitting pretty now.
And he is a good long shot, maybe as good as that UM guard that sunk us a few years back.
But we WILL get him and OU on the Back Nine.
And we have more video.
Devonte and this team and GOD will NOT PERMIT THIS TO HAPPEN twice!!!
We only lost by a measly 5 points, because of career bads by Devonte, LaCobra and Doke.
Those 3 having an off game together will not happen again this Century!
Self and sharks never rest.
Defense can always be tweaked.
This is the edge of being a defensive team.
We will keep circling. Closing. He is chum to Self and his team.
All it takes is one off game, one off stretch the second half, one muscle pull in a leg, one hay fever attack, one argument with a girl friend, one tell he doesn’t know he has, and Self Defense will swarm in and eat him alive and leave us with a 15 point win!
The defense never rests.
The morphing zones are probably being expanded in variety precisely for Trae.
“Invincibility lies in the defence; the possibility of victory in the attack.”—Sun Tzu
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REHawk said:
@Jayballer54 Please don’t overlook the fact that he compiled 9 assists last night. I was able to watch only the second half, but it became obvious that his teammates could not handle several of his hot passes. If Latin could play like that Konate lad of WVU, Trae would have probably logged a half dozen more assists. And I think maybe OU was playing without James last night. The whiz kid has to carry a weary load in order for his squad to stay ultra competitive. In our league I have seen nothing like him since Kevin Durant’s year at Texas. And I have never watched a freshman point guard anywhere with the polish of this kid. He is an absolute gem for the Big 12. If the OU fandom was as rabid as KU’s, they would fill a second field house with folks desperate to watch and bless him in clusters before a giant screen.
Ya. - -did you see how empty that arena was last night? - -That is just crazy -you have a top 20 program , - you have what some feel is the best kid walking the earth big time OAD and that arena was really sad. - -just no fire in that place - guess it all still comes down to the perception about Oklahoma being a football school. - -I just don’t understand why schools can’t have both. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@jaybate-1.0 HA! “Career bads” by Bill Self! I have seen Bill allow a few games to slip away merely for the purpose of motivating his minions to listen and learn. But not at that game in Norman. KU really needed that win. Maybe Bill got so caught up in watching that kid that he forgot what Lon was quietly doing to Doke and the scoreboard? Now, as to our future contest with OU at AFH, I think Bill and Co. will be highly motivated to turn the table. Unless that kid gets deadly from 30 ft., or if James plays the kind of game he was supposed to (as heir apparent to Buddy Hield’s winning ways), we likely will shut the Sooners down somewhat in the manner we quieted the crowd at the Octagon of Doom recently. That league title is yet ours to lose. Gotta hope that all involved stay awake and alert.
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@Jayballer54 That was indeed a sorry crowd. Unbelievably void of the type of support which our coaches and players are accustomed to.
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REHawk said:
@Jayballer54 That was indeed a sorry crowd. Unbelievably void of the type of support which our coaches and players are accustomed to.
Why is that? - -I don’t get it - -they have proved their doing good this year - -ranked in the top 25 for most the year – I don’t get it.
That is one thing I don’t understand. - -Then I have another , Different team - -but here is the thing. - -Clemson last night - -ranked - -pretty good club , BUT they beat North Carolina last night - - and what they do? - - -THEY STORM the court. - -I mean come on , act like you belong – your ranked - -your playing on your home court - -North Carolina not as strong in past years - last night was their 7th loss of the season - -yet you storm the court. - -I think that kind of detracts from your win
How many times have you seen KU storm the court? -OR when is the last time KU stormed the court , I honestly can’t remember, - -can you? - - ROCK CHALK ALL DY LONG BABY
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As of January 31st, KU is in first and OU is in second with OU and WVU having to win in AFH to change it.
KU 7-2
OU 6-3
I am at peace and I bet so is Bill.
Nothing Self did, or failed to do, would have cost his team a game, if Devonte, Vick and Doke had not flamed out. Even average games from ONE of them would have iced victory. He and the team know this.
The job now is to prepare defence that moves Trae and does not follow Trae.
Trae’s father betrayed the secret to beating Trae. He wants to play outside and shoot 30 footers. He does not want to guard and fit in a scheme. That is his Achilles heel. Make him guard, recognize, and play inside the stripe.
No dedicated long baller ever beat a team inside.
Thus the continuing elaboration of the multiple defenses, so that he cannot free wheel and so that he will not know when and how Self will steer him where he likes.
Self was right not to go all out in Norman.
He could afford the road loss.
Better to prepare the defenses for return in AFH to guaranty a W and just try to steal one in Norman.
All did not ride on victory—to play otherwise risked later games when amps were necessary.
As well to be in first place by 1 with three horrible performances in the past, than by 2 with those performances to come.
I would not trade places with OU right now, would you?
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The shot chart is one thing. Seeing the shots themselves are another.
The shot above is the circle to the far left of this chart below.
If Young were at the top of the key, that shot would closer than the wing. But let’s estimate from the top of the key, then work across. Look at the defenders feet. If he were to shift over to the top of the key, he would be above the three point line himself, so that’s 21 feet right there. That appears to be 6-4 guard Tyson Jolly defending. He has his arm extended, but isn’t touching Young. At 6-4, his wing span is probably something like 6-6 or so, so I would guess his arm extends out past 24 feet from the hoop if he were at the top of the key. So if that shot were from the top of the key, that’s 25+ easily.
But Young isn’t at the top of the key. He’s well over to the wing. You can see that he’s well above the 28 foot mark, which is 28 feet from the baseline (notice that the official at the top is standing with his right foot just across the 28 foot mark, and Young is completely behind him). Young is easily 30+ feet from the baseline on this shot! Let’s call it 30 just to make this easier. from He’s also well outside the paint.
So we know that the backboard is 4 feet from the baseline. We also know that the lane is 12 feet wide, with another 8 inches for the block. This is where it gets tricky, because the angle doesn’t allow you to see where he is in relation to the sideline, but it looks like he’s more than halfway to the sideline on the left side. Let’s say he’s 14 feet from center there.
Time for some math. So I have him at 30 feet from the baseline, or 26 feet from the backboard. I’ve got him 14 feet from the center of the floor. If you Pythag that out, you get roughly 29.5 feet on this shot!
Now look at that shot on the extreme right of the chart. It’s nearly as deep, plus its right up along the side line. It’s at least 25 feet out, and its at least 20 feet from center, if not more. That’s a 32 foot shot all day long.
And that assumes he’s not deeper than I estimated on the video, or closer to the sidelines than I can tell from the video. That means that at least those three shots are 30 footers or better (the two on the left, plus the one along the sideline on the right).
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He got 44 on 20 shots + ft’s Not many in America can do that
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Just one correction…but a big one. You correctly indicated that the hash mark is 28’ from the “baseline”; however, the backboard is inside the court and 4’ from the baseline and the center of the rim is another foot further inside or app. 5’ from the baseline. The 20’-9" distance to the 3 point line is measured from the center of the rim and not from the baseline, so your measurements are off by 5’. The 28’ foot hash mark is really 23’ from the center of the rim. Here is a schematic that confirms my numbers.
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@JayHawkFanToo @justanotherfan figures 4ft for the backboard spacing. You figure 5. Either way he’s nearly 27-30+ ft from the rim or 3 steps + behind the line. It’s a circus shot and he routinely makes it.
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The backboard is 4 feet from the baseline, the center of the rim is 1 foot further in from the backboard or 5 feet from the baseline. All shots are measured from the center of the rim not the baseline. The hash mark is 28 feet from the baseline or 23 feet from the center of the rim. If he is shooting even with the hash mark from the center portion of the court, that would be 23 foot and not a 28 foot shot. If you look at the NBA game in progress right now, you will see that the hash mark is just short of the 3 point line which in the NBA is 23’-9”.
I am not saying that he is not shooting long 3s, I am saying they are more like long NBA 3s in the mid to upper 20s rather than in the low 30s, that’s all.
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Is this ESPN?
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Next the ball brothers?
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@JayHawkFanToo It’s 35’ 9" to the center circle from the center of the rim
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@JayHawkFanToo re-read his explantaion/math. About 2/3rds the way down he clearly states exactly what you are and figures it into his math. Except the 1 foot for the rim. But really WTFC?
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@Jayballer54 OU cares less about bball. They are all football. I tried to talk with all the Sooners and they have no idea what the bball team is doing. They hear about Young, dont understand how he is home grown and landed in OU’s lap. All Kruger had to do to sign Young was to be head coach.
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@JayHawkFanToo you are correct that I left out the rim spacing. Everything else holds, though, because I did account for the backboard.
Ultimately that makes me a few inches off since the distance from the baseline won’t affect the distance from the center.
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IMHO, you are making the calculation too complicated. You have the 3 point as an ideal reference line since it Is a constant 20’-9” from the center of the rim until you get close to the corners when it is closer and we measuring the radius. All you have to to do is estimate the distance he is to the line and add 20’-9”.
I think we all agree they are long 3s, we just disagree on how long they are.
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It’s basic algebra. Yes, the three point line is constant, but with the angle, using it as a constant doesn’t work to get a good estimate. The more accurate calculation is just basic pythagorean theorem. It’s really just a right triangle from Young to the hoop, because we can get pretty good estimates of Young’s distance from the center and his distance from the baseline.
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Actually is not algebra but trigonometry and I am very familiar with both. Also, I try to find the simpler solution; I am funny that way. You have a perfect reference line and plenty of objects of known length (players) to estimate the distance from the line to the shooter without having to resolve the hypotenuse of the right angle triangle using the Pythagorean theorem. Just my opinion.
We all agree that he is not stepping to the 3 point line and shooting from just outside the line like most players and he is shooting long 3s, primarily in the mid to upper 20s in my opinion or much longer in yours. I guess we can just agree to disagree.
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I can only think of three ways to try to stop Trae. Either wear him down so he is less likely to come through in the final 5 minutes… or run offense at him and try to get him in foul trouble… or run offense at him to the point of trying to disrupt his game flow.
I watched a bit of Steph Curry back in 06. Trae is far far beyond Steph as a freshman. I think Trae even passes Steph’s soph and junior years… not as a deep shooter, but his overall game is better. He sees the court better than Steph did and he makes sick drives, much better than Steph did.
If Trae can avoid major injuries I think he will become every bit of what Steph is now in the league. Just imagine him vastly improving from where he is now. He still has a boy’s body. Imagine Trae with strength, not just speed.
Who are you going to believe? Me, or your lying eyes?! lol
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I am deriving a fine set of chuckles from reading these Trae Young posts. I am quite old now, and, to be honest, have grown bored with most college basketball, other than, of course, gametime for the Jayhawks. But this Oklahoma kid is something else. A very rare treat for tired eyes. I watch him every time my tv offers the opportunity. Back in my teen years I got a huge kick out of the Harlem Globetrotters. This kid provides much of the same amazing play…and he is FOR REAL! I hope that I don’t disgruntle too many fellow posters with my worshipful zeal for a non-Jayhawk. I promise faithfully to cheer for his demise when once again we lace 'em up to encounter him. And by gum, I hope that Self and Doke are alert and ready! Lightfoot, too.
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Do not become too disillusioned to keep watching the Hawks, when Trae’s beating time arrives in Lawrence.
He will seem to become one less thing about the game to watch.
But that’s ok!
