KU Sports - Oct 29: Matt Tait's Postgame Analysis
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Gary Bedore’s Recap: Andrew Wiggins’ acrobatic dunk highlights KU’s exhibition win over Pitt State
Bill Self Post-Game Interview Podcast
Players Post-Game Interview Podcast Ellis, White III, Tharpe
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You’ve got the midas touch bskeet thanks!
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My thoughts - From the untrained eye perspective. I’m hoping HEM, Drgnslyr, Ralster, etc. will provide a more technical analyis.
- Wiggins had his moments, but definitely seemed nervous. I thought he settled for some threes that he shouldn’t have. Hoping he would attack the rim as his first and second options.
- Selden looked good on defense and the potential on offense scary good. Was surprised that he didn’t play as much or score more.
- Tharpe & Ellis were as consistent as you would hope the leaders to be. So that was a good sign.
- Black exceeded my expectations on some counts, but fouling was a problem.
- Jamari showed improvement and energy off the bench.
- AWIII has turned into a beast. Bigger, Stronger, and attack mentality to go with it.
- Embiid - The potential ceiling was evident, as was his green-ness. I think he will improve at faster than expected rate though.
- Frank Mason is fast! The back-up spot is in safe hands as well as KU’s PG future.
- Brannen Greene can play and will also get better very quickly. I don’t see him redshirting at all. I think he will continue to push AWIII for back-up minutes.
- Conner Frankamp - leading Redshirt candidate. Being a three-savant, and it being the only card to get minutes, has its pressures and it showed. We saw this with AWIII last year. It’s difficult to do. A RS will do wonders for him.
- Landen Lucas did better than I thought. Don’t see him cracking the rotation this year, but the future looks bright.
Again, just my 5000 feet level impressions from the first game. It looked sloppy as expected, but the defensive potential and the depth is unlike what we’ve had in a long time.
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Couple things I thought during the game:
- @FarSideHawk is definitely right about Wiggins’ nerves, he seemed very timid in the first half. But I think in order to get him really going we are going to have to run the offense through him more, at least get him a touch each possession.
- Rebouding and Defense are a concern. HEM was right when he was concerned about our rebounding. Although Black picked it up in the second half, rebounding against a bigger and more skilled team is going to be hard. I think if a big like Lucas or Traylor can establish himself has a rebounder the minutes will sky rocket. The defense needs to get better obviously, there were spurts where we looked good, but 85% of it was sloppy and slow. No way a D2 team should get to the basket that easily.
- Embiid has a long way to go, but watch out when he gets there. Man that is an athletic big!
- Selden may have been the most nervous, I think AWIII and Brannen Greene may be challenging him for minutes right now. Both of them looked confident with the ball and ready to score.
- Perry is going to be awesome! I see him as the rock and foundation of this team.
- Most impressive thing I saw was the flashes of absolute shut down defense from Wiggins. I think it was one of the last plays he was on the court he challenged Branch right at half court and showed how truly athletic and quick his feet are.
I am excited and worried at the same time. Huge strides need to be taken in order to be ready for Nov 12
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Good points @BaltimoreHawk. It was interesting to see Wiggins guarding the PG at times, when we had the ‘long’ lineup in.
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This team can/may/will be SCARY GOOD in a couple months!!!
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The number switching this year made it difficult for me to keep track of who was on the floor. Everytime I saw number 1 I kept saying to my wife that didn’t look like Tharpe and then she had to remind me that numbers changed.
Has this gone on in the past and I just didn’t catch it, cause I sure don’t remember players switching numbers from year to year in the past.
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Far- I’ll never understand why people defer to HEM, slayr, and Ralster. Your points are pretty accurate. Not sure what you mean by a “more technical analysis.” Good points all…
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We are given our name upon e-birth. And as the great philosopher Uncle Ben Parker once said: “With great power comes great responsibility.” With that in mind, I CivilHawk, feel it is my job… no, my duty… to remind everyone to keep it civil. So…
Hey! Everyone! Keep it civil!
(My work here is done)
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@truehawk93, I think they seem to have a better understanding of the X’s and O’s type of stuff, perhaps some experience in coaching. I’m just a simple fan, enjoying the game and don’t pay attention to nitty gritty details. But I do find those points and discussions interesting and valuable.
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My notes from the game:
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We may run into some foul trouble in the post this year. Black and Embiid seem to be candidates for creating lots of fouls, especially with the new rules in place.
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Lucas seems like he’ll be able to give good backup minutes, and will surely have to step in sometimes this season at the 5.
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Traylor looks like he has more confidence and will have more to offer this year, especially on offense.
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Perry is going to have a great year!
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Tharpe may not be the flashiest PG we’ve had recently, but he will be the most-consistent and does a great job of protecting the rock.
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Greene needs some PT… somewhere… somehow. He’s the real deal, but will have to learn to play better d and work harder on the offensive side to generate more for himself and the team.
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Conner looks more and more like a RS.
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AW3 will earn lots of PT this year and all the hard work pays off (from the summer).
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Selden looked tight as drum and we didn’t see the real Wayne-John Wayne last night.
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That other guy… what’s his name… Wiggins… he played through big time pressure and started to loosen up as the game progressed. We still haven’t seen what he can do, but he still managed to knock down 16.
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As of last night, Embiid looks more like a TAD instead of a OAD. His defense reminded me of the early days of Withey… all that height but trailing the ball too far behind to get the block. His timing will improve. We just don’t know how fast he’ll learn the game… maybe he steps it up and becomes an OAD.
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With the rule changes we need to have better penetration.
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I think w\Self having to play so many combos it was hard for them to get in rhythm . I was pleasantly surprised w/Landon Lucas! Perimeter defense was bad, but will get better. At this point it’s hard to see anyone leaving but Wiggins. Embiid will be great, just not sure in a year. Loved him diving on the floor! Connor needs bulk. Black cleaned up under the basket, he impresses me and I’m so glad Self gave him a chance. White is better, I had to see it for myself to believe it. Masons fast but a little out of control at times, just needs to play thru it. Naadir was very impressive! I love Traylor, hope he can see the floor. Lots of players. Can’t wait to see more! Hate that so many fans can’t see these games. Hate it!
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Wigs is going against college players, granted, not D1 last night, but still these guys know how to steal and block shot on the way up. Pitt will be a strong team in their league and have a good coach. The Gorillas were just worn down by superior height, speed and depth. Wigs nerves will settle down with Fort Hayes and Louisiana. But then the DUKE game on National TV in front of 25,000 with millions watching. No wonder Perry, Naadir, White and Black dominated for most of the first half. These are 18 year olds that want to live up to the hype, (Way too much hype) Wigs and Selden talked afterwards about feeling more nervous than they imagined. Wigs dunk and following flex spoke volumes. Watching the scrimmage and last night’s game, Wigs is the type of player where you look up and realize he is the leading scorer and yet be surprised. He got beat on defense early but since the tallest player for Pitt was 6’6" he was able to recover and block. Lots of good educational film to watch this week. Coach will make sure that switching on defense will be stressed this week in practice. No more street AAU ball. Defense shall be played. Finally, did Selden do something wrong? Very few minutes, and very little activity.
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Things that surprised me last night and what it means going forward
- Landon Lucas looked pretty good last night. Granted it was against Pitt St. in an exhibition game, but he made the most of his minutes.
So what? With the new foul rules likely testing everyone’s depth this year, he may turn out to be a valuable 5th big coming in. Who knows, maybe he’ll play his way into that 4th spot?
- Speaking of fouls… did I just hear another whistle blow?
So what? Holy cow this is gonna be rough. Add an extra 30 minutes to your DVR for each game as these new foul rules (specifically the hand check rule) are major speed bumps. Self’s comments that it had more to do with bad defending are only 10% true. The truth is, he’s preparing his team for the new reality by not letting them mentally blame the new rules or refs. But even though there was some lazy defending, the lack of flow to the game sits solidly on the shoulders of the new rules.
- Wiggins is human, and he’s just a kid.
So what? Well I’m talking a little tongue-in-cheek here, but I was mildly surprised he showed as many nerves as he did. Selden too. What does this mean going forward? Probably nothing - especially of we see no hint of it in the next exhibition game. But if Wiggins truly is that “alpha dog” Self said we’ve been missing, then we’ll see none of that vs. Duke and definitely by conference season.
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Some of the less talked about things I thought after last night,
I was happy to see Landen Lucas make the most of his minutes and expect him to get more minutes because he is one of Self’s bigger Bigs. If he keeps his shot percentage up and continues to rebound like he did last night he will garner more minutes than Traylor. Do the math if he had played 30 min he would have had 12 pts 18 reb. That’s impressive!
After the scrimmage in June I expected Greene to be in the rotation and he very well could work his way into the rotation. With the new rules this teams biggest advantage is going to be depth and Self has more than any team in the league!
I think Selden did just fine and I believe that he was thinking about his teammates and moving the ball forward (you can see he what he is trying to do it just looked ugly last night). He wasn’t taking a bunch of contested shots. He should have been driving to the basket and taking contact though because he could have benefited from the charity stripe.
AW3 has looked good all summer from the televised events I watched and I believe he will get to start a few games until Selden stops making freshman errors and stops thinking. When Selden starts firing on all cylinders AW3 will have the best seat in the house as first off the bench.
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Some thoughts from last night’s game.
- Landen Lucas is playing really hard and pushing for backup minutes, but will he be able to break into the rotation of the bigs? I think the current order is Black, Ellis, Traylor, Embiid, Lucas, but Lucas made a strong push to replace Traylor last night. One thing concerns me is that he didn’t appear as conditioned as Black, Traylor or Embiid. Or is that the others just didn’t show being gassed?
- Andrew White III made huge improvement from last season, appeared to be very confident on offense and hustled on defense. Great to see. Question is “will he be able to replace Selden as a starter?” Guess we have Game 2 coming up and we should see much improved play from Selden. I think Wayne’s performance last night was due to nervousness, and should have it under control after a couple of real games.
- I think Wiggins is as valuable in defense as in offense. His block on the perimeter was brilliant. If White continues his current form, I can see White playing the 3 and Wiggins playing the 2. And it will create a huge advantage for Wiggins to have 3-5 inches of height advantage over the opponent 2 guards.
- Black was good. HEM had an excellent report on his Memphis career in another thread. He didn’t show much in assist or passing in last night’s game, but he rebounded, and played hard though probably was a little reckless. Deserve a blue card.
But I like his shooting form at the freethrow line. Hopefully he will cause more fouls on the opponents than himself and earn more points from the freethrow line.
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@JayDocMD: I did a little number playing with the box score that @bayhawk posted on here from the Xavier vs Ohio game. Yikes 71 fouls, 91 FT’s attempted Last nights game backs up my findings with the increase in fouls. More fouls equal double bonus free throws which led to more TV timeouts. TV timeouts equal cash for SHOECO duopoly and media-gaming complex (jaybate shout out).
edit: I didn’t get to watch the game last night. I went to a Gordon Lightfoot concert and only caught the first half of the first half on the radio. I’m guessing the increase in fouls was because of jitters with being the first game of the season, the new rules, and the first live game using new rules. It’ll take a while for players to get away from their reactive arm bars and hand checks before we see a reduced number of fouls.
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So great to see the team play. No blackouts in PA. What I saw:
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Wiggins is the real deal. You saw flashes of what he can do. He is trying to be “part of the team” and is respecting his teammates. The new hand check rule will play to his game. Coach Self will push him to step up.
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Selden seemed affected the most with the hype, but he should also benefit from the new rules. I expect considerable growth over the season.
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Embiid is fast for his size, but his hands are not up to speed with his feet. Think he will be a 2and done. It will be interesting to see the speed of his progression through the season.
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AWIII: wow. He is ready to play this year. Should compete for real minutes, and will push others to compete for PT.
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Tharpe has locked The PG spot. I was impressed. good decisions. finding players. Should do well not that he knows he doesn’t have to score. I don’t think we will see the forced shots like last year.
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Mason is fast, and should backup Tharpe. I do not think he will pass Tharpe at PG this season. I think we are in good shape for the next few years at PG spot. I think the skill difference will be obvious when he starts as PG in the first game with Tharpe suspended.
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Greene really impressed me. Nice shooting strong. Still needs to learn the system better. Should get minutes.
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Perry continues to improve. Excited about his progress.
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Black is critical for the development of the bigs. Watched him teaching his teammates on the court. This role can be underestimated. Perry just doesn’t have the personality to do it. We need him on the court. Hopefully he can manage fouls.
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Traylor looked solid off the bench. Should be more of a factor this year.
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Lucas: still not sure what to think or how he will fit in the rotation. Will be clearer in the next few games.
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Connor needs to redshirt. Not ready.
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A couple of times last night it looked like we had six guys on the floor and none of them knew where they were supposed to be. On the bright side, once they figure it out, it’s going to seem like we have eight guys on the floor.
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I think most of it has been said. But…
Naadir looked great…SharpeTharpe indeed!
Perry was ice cold and is just going to get better!
White and Jamari looked like locks for first 2 off the bench.
Greene looked alot better then I thought. He was very confindant for a freshmen playing his first game.
As others have said Lucas was a pleasant surprize.
The two weird things were how nervous Black looked in the first half as well as Selden. I really did not expect that from either.
Oh well…first game jitters. I just how we can get them out before Duke!
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Got here late today … work interfered. That should not be allowed after a KU game.
But great comments above. I got home and posted at kusports.com on the # of comments vs. last season. Too bad. But this is a great spot. Maybe better when all is said and done.
I guess the things that stood out to me, maybe being a bit repetitive:
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The lackluster rebounding. Not Achilles’ heel level. We’ll know better when we play real teams.
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Selden being a bit underwhelming. Not concerning – better to judge after the next two games heading into Duke.
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White looking terrific (I was beating the drum pretty hard for White last season … as the season progressed, I felt more like I was walking the plank). Great to see. Hat’s off to Self on that one.
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Tharpe looking like the point guard we all have wanted. Assist to turnover was, well, perfect. And Mason looks ahead of where Tharpe was as a freshman by a good bit. Mason looks like a player. I’m excited to see him lead this team when it’s his turn.
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Black looking ok. Prediction alert – Embiid will start by Jan. 15 … ok, maybe. I’m not down on Black at all. But you can see the ceiling there, can’t you? Good, solid player.
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Greene maybe being that guy that deserves to play, but won’t. Man, I like that kid. Really hope that he is patient. I’m more excited about him as a potential 3 or 4 year player than any OAD.
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Traylor appearing to have made an incremental improvement from last season, but nothing spectacular.
Again, the analysis in the posts above is great reading.
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Black’s performance was disappointing. I fear that too much stock has been placed on his age / D1 experience. After all, this isn’t experience playing in Self’s system. As I recall he never really stood out at Memphis - Infact, I believe his minutes were starting to diminish. The idea of him being a banger and allowing Ellis to flourish seems to me like wishful thinking. From interviews conducted by KUsports he seems like a good guy - perhaps he’ll help Embiid and the other younger guys. Time will tell.
The game flowed better when Lucas was in and I like his body language. Not really sure what I mean by body language - but I like the team vibe when he’s on the court. He has good size and a knack for putting the ball in the net.
I can’t say that about Greene. I felt the same way during late night. He seemed to be mouthy and immature. During last nights game I saw that again. With that being said - I think he can flat out ball. His size/length and ability to knock down the outside jumper is fun to watch. He’ll be an absolute monster next year with a season under his belt. Perhaps this will help with what I see as a maturity issue (I’m referring to his mouth, not his playing).
Ellis, Tharpe, and White looked good. White sure can rebound, Tharpe sure can dish out the assists, and Ellis has some sick moves in the paint. While I’m not totally convinced on White, I have little concern over Tharpe and Ellis.
Traylor plays like he’s in his own world and his facial expressions prove it. I don’t think for one second that he’s a selfish player…he just seems to be a motor running around frantically after the ball. I guess that’s not so bad, just expected more out of him by now. To me he has mediocre ability to put the ball in the net around the rim. Everyone seems to talk about his toughness and strength and some even mention they see improvement in his play this year. To me he’s a warm body out there. A VERY muscular warm body that can run the floor.
Wiggins’ first performance was as expected. Everyone talks about his calm demeanor and ridiculous athleticism and that seemed pretty apparent last night. He scored 16 points and looked scared. Not sure of too many other freshman who could put up those numbers, looking and playing like he did in the first half. I’m not worried about Andrew. He’s going to be a monster in a month or so (if not sooner).
If **Embiid **sticks around another year I feel sorry for anyone who steps foot on the court against him. With his size and athleticism and this coaching staff…just stop - It wont even be fair.
The only real disappointment from last night was Wayne. Not sure why I viewed him as the freshman savior who would come in and play like Marcus Smart his freshman year, but I did. His play was abysmal and the ball stuck when he was out there. The only saving grace I have is this: maybe Self’s plan was to focus on Wiggins this game. Maybe the goal was to get Andrew some buckets to help alleviate his nerves and boost KU stock to the world. We all know the whole college basketball world was watching. With so few games to go before we play Duke, perhaps Self was sand bagging with Wayne. Regardless, he played nothing like I thought he would.
After watching last nights game it seems there will be lots of fouling this year. No better time for our Hawks to be loaded with big bodies down low. We have a surplus of fresh bodies that should keep our record up to par with what we’ve come to expect from Coach Self.
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Oops…I forgot to add this:
I think this KU team will be stoopid good come tournament time.
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@STOOPS, Black got 11 rebounds in 13 minutes. I’ll take that.
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I like Tarik Black! I can see why Self is high on him. Impressive off the court as well as a hard -working leader on the floor. He’s a Jayhawk now!
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Everyone has bad days and Smart himself had a game vs Tech last year where he went for a whole 3 pts (1-6 shooting). He also went 1-6 in his first game last year. Selden shot 50% and had 5 pts. He was trying to get his teamates involved and only took 4 shots! What would everyone be saying if he was 1-6 last night? Get a grip people!
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All this red shirt talk is really dumb too! When you have 50 fouls a game being called the typicle 8-9 man rotation everyone is having so much fun predicting will expand to 9-10 man rotation due to foul trouble. In 2010-2011 we had 10 guys averaging 10 minutes or more each game and with these new rules I dont see Self rsing anyone. There were 5 guys in foul trouble last night between both teams. I can see 3-4 guys fouling out during the last 2 minutes of 80% of our non conf schedule and Self putting in our best shooters (you know the rs candidates). We had 25 fouls last night and imagine 2 weeks from now against Duke having 25 or more fouls at the 2 min mark down by 2? I can see a few big reasons for not RSing anyone
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Yo Stats. You make a good case for the need for extended depth this season and for being patient with the freshman. I think we will see an aggressive Selden in the next game.
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The game last night was not pretty, not really fun to watch, and KU couldnt get in a rythem. Way too many commertials and it seamed to go on for ever. KU’s freshmen looked sloppy but some how mannaged to win by 40 pts. I am even more excited because I can see we are FAR from a finnished product and have so much room for improvement! Just hope that we can rely on tallent alone to beat Duke because our execution is no good this early on and with this many newcomers!
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Statmachine’s point is a good one here, I think … can we afford a redshirt with the ridiculous foul situation? Meaning we might need that additional perimeter player on any given night.
Heck, look at our first regular season game. Tharpe is suspended. That would make Mason the starter, and Selden (presumably) the next option, if CF does redshirt.
But with redshirts, they can always be pulled. If Tharpe tears an ACL in January, a CF redshirt would likely come off.
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Great points by all above–here’s my take as I was at the game, trying to judge all players:
- Tharpe will be a vital part of our offense, as his experience and leadership will be huge, as it will in training Mr. Mason…
2)TBlack was IN position alot, and rebounds are ALL about effort and positioning. And he was able to get some stickbacks (against a D2 school), so more observation needed to gain an appreciation of what 260lb Tarik can do for us.
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Agree with incremental improvement in Traylor and Lucas. Embiid did everything I expected, good but green at times…Ellis=Ellis, nothing to add.
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Selden played under control and unselfishly, I thought he was NOT looking for his own shot. Liked his energy.
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Wiggins tried a bit of everything, threes, pullupJs, set-play lob dunk, and his patented spin move/drive. 16pts in a herky/jerky sputtering team offense is a good sign.
6)Mason looked serviceable. Liked his play and glimpses of his decision making.
7)Connor Frankamp: looked the most out of place. I watched him on defense meticulously and his head-swivel to look for coming picks was, I thought, “slow”. If I was a quick guard with the ball facing him, I would drive HARD the second Frankamp looked away. He is a defensive liability (but had 1 batted entry pass), and if he cannot hit the set-play 3ball (like Teahan as a frosh), maybe he needs to redshirt just to trade his frosh youth for his age 23 season. He is so thin, and even when he was dribbling, I saw NO attack mentality out of him. Clearly thinking a lot, and is mesmerized by the size of athletes on the floor in a college game, and mostly just on KU’s own roster. Redshirt Connor, and use Niko as the emergency 4th guard (Mason #2, Selden emergency #3, and Niko as last-chance-saloon backup #4). But, Connor could prove me wrong and come out on FIRE against FHSU…so I’ll see what the 2nd impression is…
