Poor Silvio
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I just read the story on ESPN. My blood is boiling. Not just because we lose a great player, but because he does nothing wrong, didn’t even know about anything wrong being done, and the NCAA says it doesn’t matter he didn’t know, he’s still responsible. What an injustice.
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@wissox I know it seems like an injustice. I think the second season suspension is over the top. But would the rules be worth anything if a kid could escape sanction when a person he involved in recruiting accepted money on his behalf? That would be free pass. No perfect solution.
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I just went back and read about the Arizona mess last year. It was 97,500$ worse than what happened with Silvio’s guardian, not coach. Sean sat one game. Ayton, no games obviously. How is this even close to being fair?
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@HighEliteMajor I know it sounds like I’m anti rules. But the injustice is more in the inequities in the way the NCAA punishes some and skates on the others. See my post just above on Arizona. Some throw allegations about Duke, and Zion, and his mom, and UNC and their scandal. But we get nailed, and as you said, maybe we get punished too.
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HighEliteMajor said:
@wissox I know it seems like an injustice. I think the second season suspension is over the top. But would the rules be worth anything if a kid could escape sanction when a person he involved in recruiting accepted money on his behalf? That would be free pass. No perfect solution.
ya it’s the 2nd full year that seems like an over the top injustice to me
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Sue the b**tards at the NCAA…
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jayballer73 said:
jayhawkcsg said:
But the good thing is that we now know what we have to work with, and Self can adjust the lineup and offense accordingly. Dunno what he’ll do, but at least we can pretend we have a direction and can stick with it.
you would think wouldn’t you that they just have to try and get Dave more minutes wouldn’t you – stat to develop him more add that other Big - -got to do something
I think so. I would like to see the 2 big offense used more often, including more minutes for Big Dave. that would help in his development, but also light a fire under whatever small ends up on the bench to perform or run their arse off when in the game (hello QG).
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Yea, that second suspended season doesn’t make much sense. There’s something fishy going on. we don’t have all the facts. I feel strongly they are withholding information for some reason. maybe that was agreed upon with KU before releasing their statement. A guess of course. Self IS VERY pissed, which would not back my argument.
It sounds like their enforcement standard begins with “your NCAA career is over” and can be whittled on down to a lesser suspension, which it certainly should have been given the facts involved with only the KU part of the cash flow. I think they are punishing Silvio and sending a clear message to his guardian that you took money from TWO institutions or people with ties to the schools in some fashion. No bueno.
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jayhawkcsg said:
Yea, that second suspended season doesn’t make much sense. There’s something fishy going on. we don’t have all the facts. I feel strongly they are withholding information for some reason. maybe that was agreed upon with KU before releasing their statement. A guess of course. Self IS VERY pissed, which would not back my argument.
It sounds like their enforcement standard begins with “your NCAA career is over” and can be whittled on down to a lesser suspension, which it certainly should have been given the facts involved with only the KU part of the cash flow. I think they are punishing Silvio and sending a clear message to his guardian that you took money from TWO institutions or people with ties to the schools in some fashion. No bueno.
I have to agree on some of this - -I really don’t think Ku is withholding any info - -just wouldn’t make sense for them to immediately appeal and be holding back info - -would REALLY make them look bad to the fans to do that - especially when they are coming out and saying they are appealing and feeling that Silvio got basically screwed
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From fran
There are no coaches I’ve communicated with that are surprised by NCAA’s DeSousa decision tonight. Personally, I wish NCAA had decided on this case sooner & not left everyone hanging. Adults ruined this opportunity for the young man.
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Totally whacked. If the NCAA wants to just go hardball, banning a player from amateur competition PERMANTENTLY makes more sense than a 2-year suspension. Has a two-year ban ever been been done on a player before for something other than drugs? The only guy I can think of was an LSU football player who supposedly cheated on a urine test.
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De Sousa, the NCAA announced, will be required to sit out the rest of the 2018-19 season and for the entirety of the 2019-20 season “because his guardian received payment from a university booster and agent and agreed to receive additional funds from the same person.”
From the NCAA’s release: “According to the facts provided for purposes of the reinstatement request, De Sousa’s guardian received payment of $2,500 from an agent and booster of the school. He agreed to accept additional payment of $20,000 from the same individual and an Adidas employee for securing De Sousa’s enrollment at Kansas.”
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Start him tomorrow
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so was this the Maryland booster? And he was suppose to get additional payments? I thought they agreed those payments weren’t proven?
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@Crimsonorblue22 The NCAA isn’t a court of law though and they only need enough circumstantial evidence to suspect something happened to issue a punishment.
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@wissox But…they’re a NIKE school, and there are two sets of rules. One for NIKE, and the other for ADIDAS…
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@Crimsonorblue22 i don’t care what he thinks during the games, and I certainly don’t care what he thinks about Silvio.
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@jayhawkcsg The NCAA statement quoted in the LJW article says exactly what you suspected: the punishment for accepting improper inducements starts at permanent ineligibility and can be reduced from there.
The two year ban for SDS says that the NCAA considered the facts as almost bad enough for a permanent ban. It really should not surprise anyone because his guardian was involved in what had to be a slew of transactions to accomplish the several payments and the planned repayment.
I hate their approach of not seeming to care whether Silvio benefitted personally, but this is vastly different from accepting gifts or a training trip or the crap Selby got 9 games for. It involved, if the charges are accurate, not one but two schemes to “pay for play” at 2 different schools. The alleged booster was working to get SDS to KU instead of UMd.
Protecting the eligibility rules is obviously the highest priority of the NCAA–lower schools would scream bloody murder if tens of thousands of dollars were allowed to purchase an athlete’s switch in attendance from a “lower school” to a blue blood and all he had to do to get away with it was to send out the 3 monkey emojis.
The fact is, we all hated the safety net of convenient ignorance that protected Cam Newton. So the NCAA got rid of that precedent. Now we don’t like the consequences.
Haste makes waste, and our desperation to get SDS eligible at midyear may have hindered KU"s due diligence here. I hope it was an excusable oversight, but as it is, labelling the Adidas guy a KU booster means, I believe, that we may be toast.
As to all the whining about UAz and Zion, give it a rest and stop blinding yourself. UAz was a rumor based on unsubstantiated claims of a leaked tape. No direct evidence, as was essentially the case with the Zion family demand revealed (allegedly) by KT (whose failure to back away from recruiting ZW after that is possibly damning in itself).
I wish people would not be so anxious to point fingers based on suspicion and conjecture. KU has long been the butt of speculative jokes about how we must pay urban elites to come out to farm country to a good, but by no means elite, school. Those accusations have infuriated me. Now we see there may be some shadiness after all, and it is scary. But no excuse to act batshit crazy whining that “Johnny didn’t get an 8th hour” like our guy did.
Stand up, face up, take it like adults.
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@mayjay Any precedents for a two-year suspension in this situation?
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@mayjay I thought the 20$ was to pay the Maryland booster back. I also thought KU said when we filed paper work that ncaa had agreed the 20$ had not been proven.
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Mason and dg aren’t exactly urban elites, and Lawrence isn’t exactly farm country. Sorry that bothers you.
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@DanR The best precedent I see was Bowen, who tried to get them to do his as basically a one year ban. He was made inactive before ever playing for UL, and transferred to SC in January that year. SC tried to get him ruled eligible after the standard two semester period for transfers (i.e., at midseason his soph yearl – essentially trying to get credit for not playing his freshman year. The NCAA said being held out wouldn’t matter, and he would be out his full soph year. So he entered the draft after freshman year after all.
The Bowen case seems really close in severity given that his total time sitting after eligibility concerns were raised would have been exactly the same as SDS–2 years bench time. SDS, of course, actually played his freshman year, which I think greatly hurts his case.
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Wasn’t Selby paid like $6000 and only had to sit out for 9 games? Silvio’s guardian was paid $2500 and he has to sit for 2 years? I’m all for playing by the rules, I just wish that the rules were consistent and imposed on every D1 school, including the Nike schools.
I feel bad for Silvio. I wish him all the best going forward.
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@mayjay as I recall, the NCAA cleared Silvio to play last year.
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So they didn’t do their job
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And that’s where this fold up in court like a tent on the NCAA. They can’t be a clearinghouse and enforcer at the same time
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@Crimsonorblue22 Yes, let’s snipe at people on this board who say things that make us uncomfortable.
I heard no rumors about Mason or DG or other hidden diamonds. I have, however, encountered many accusations about claims of KU illegal recruiting going back to Philadelphia native Wilt. I remember comments about Mario’s dad, and then there is Danny. Let’s see–do you buy Shady’s dream? Few people outside KU do. The Morii? I remember all types of comments. For virtuslly every top recruit we have had. Remember a car accident last year we thought saved our bacon?
I am not saying I believe that stuff–only that we cannot defend ourselves successfully by crying a river about equally unproven accusations.
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@HighEliteMajor The trouble is for me is that several Nike schools were listed reports including Dook. They have tapped conversations of what Zion wanted and his mom is in a huge house all the sudden. But the neither the FBI or NCAA has the balls to take on Coach K or Nike. That much seems blatantly obvious at this point. At this point we need to drop Adidas and go with Nike that way we can get the classes that UK and Dook do every year.
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@DanR The initial eligibilty determination has nothing to do with information subsequently received. Now, if SDS or his guardian ever informed the NCAA about the guardian’s shitty discharge of his fiduciary duties, that could be a good basis for an appeal!
Anyway, ask Rose and UMemphis about whether a school can ride an initial clearance into clear skies.
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@mayjay never mind my questions. If you’re going back to wilt then I’m out of my league
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@DanR My point was that other people have long said those things, and I was responding to someone else who brought up our recent AA’s as if that disproved my comment that KU haters say stuff.
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UNC avoided punishment because they offered bullshit classes to everyone.
If KU offered like a $2500 scholarship to all students enrolled in the university, would they avoid punishment?
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Bedore has a really good article on Silvio’s guardian, and of course, I believe him.
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@KirkIsMyHinrich Maybe they could save money by just offering it to the “general students” living in the bb dorm.
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I just can’t really obsorb - - -get it to sink in how the NCAA says the student athlete is responsible for the 3rd party if involved whether he knows anything about what’s going on or not. - - How in the fricking hell can you hold him responsible when he knows nothing about what the 3rd parties shadiness is doing? I just can’t grasp this. – This couldn’t of come at a worse tie with Hurt coming in this weekend - -these findings and the unknowing of if any further punishment coming could very well be enough to run him off - - -Stanley off - - - Precious Off - -but really bad with Hut here this weekend - -perfect timing by the NCAA - -and umm I don’t know possibly laying the screw to KU trying to really screw us good - - grab the ankles boys. - - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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If this is the case were clearly looking at vacating everything he played in last season. This will get bad for us by the end… Coaching, recruiting, history… Damn
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DanR said:
@mayjay Any precedents for a two-year suspension in this situation?
The exact opposite. Austin Wiley got exactly 1 season for getting almost FIVE FUCKING TIMES the amount of money. The NCAA doesn’t have rules, only whims.
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And another precedent. Darnell Jackson got 9 games for taking twice the amount of money. Silvio: 70ish games for 2500. DJax: 9 for 5000. This is a kangaroo court.
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Crimsonorblue22 said:
https://www.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/university-of-kansas/article225440170.html
Yep, this is the truly puzzling piece of the puzzle.
Fenny, if you believe him, is welcoming the NCAA with open arms, saying he’s got nothing to hide — bank statements open to all.
So the NCAA statement/punishment doesn’t really fit what Fenny is saying. Somebody is feeding us some B.S., or as I said earlier, we aren’t hearing all the facts.
There has to be more to this story. Just makes no sense.
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@mayjay Very well stated regarding the fact that the NCAA can only punish on the evidence they have. But I can’t help but feel like many others. It’s tough to be punished when you really believe that others (Duke, Kentucky, whomever) have done similar things, and, for the moment at least, get off scott free. I agree…we need to take our punishment…but fair punishment based on what has happened in other instances.
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I think he is being held responsible for the guardian’s Maryland arrangement as well, not just the $2500. So the amounts discussed about DJ, and others, pale in comparison to the $60K.
Oddly, this initial solicitation by the guardian could be the type of thing that leads to a Zion apocalypse–if KT reveals what he knows about the family seeking money before signing with Duke.
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@mayjay Time to throw Zion under the bus!!
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@Fightsongwriter Maybe a huge tractor trailer. He would probably block the bus, then get replayed on ESPN highlights forever.
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Very harsh commentary from Norlander with some new info:
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Did anybody read the kc article? Fenny said Silvio didn’t need or take online classes.
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All right guys. Time to start a pool. Everyone send a $2500 check to their least favorite basketball team’s star. Hopefully everyone won’t just send Zion money. Of course the NCAA being a fair and just organization will do the correct thing and suspend everyone for 2 years.
this whole process is a joke with no standardized rules. I’d be surprised if the ncaa doesn’t get legitimately sued by one of the screwed student athletes.
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“In my 30-plus years of coaching college basketball, I have never witnessed such a mean-spirited and vindictive punishment against a young man who did nothing wrong,” Self said. “To take away his opportunity to play college basketball is shameful and a failure of the NCAA.”
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Can some one remind me what transpired with Silvio last season? We held him out, the NCAA held him out,? I forget, but didn’t the NCAA then rule he was good to go or was it a transcript issue and not a money issue? I forget.
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@dylans If Silvio was suspended for just this season, would you feel the same way? Do you think Self would have reacted the same way?
