2012 vs. 2017



  • Same name, same coach, different styles.

    2012 had a top tier defense with a tree in the middle, but the offense was pretty mediocre.
    2017 has an incredible offense with 4 guards and excellent perimeter shooting but defense overall wasn’t so great.

    Which do you prefer?
    Great defense, bad offense or great offense, bad defense?

    I personally think it is more enjoyable to watch a great offense.



  • Less frustrating more nerve racking. We’ve seen enough close games for one season. I’m ok with KU blowing out the competion the rest of the way.



  • @Eric-san love to see some trob and BIFM together



  • I’m still not used to having a legit post presence on a Bill Self Kansas squad. Every game I worry about going cold from the outside. I’m starting to believe that the penetration that Frank and Devonte provide really does make up for it though. They draw fouls and/or score, or kick it out to guys who get wide open threes. In 2012 I worried about not having the consistent outside game to open it up for the bigs down low. I think Id rather have great guards in the tourney so I vote 2017!



  • @BigBad Purdue seemed to think we have a legitimate post presence by dbl teaming Landon. He could get 14-16 pts if ignored, so that keeps them honest inside. Thing is, we don’t absolutely need that many pts from him. He can get 6 to 10 on putbacks and an occasional post feed, and the rest are more than made up for by the freedom he creates for the guards to set up outside and on drives.



  • That 2012 team is very special to me. They were tough, poised and made timely plays against really good teams. This years team has so much more firepower offensively and can be great if they decide to play defense and win the rebounding battle.



  • @Eric-san

    The defense Coach Self and the team have unveiled for the Tournament is like nothing we have seen before and a thing of beauty. They were saving the best for last and it is giving the other teams fits since scouting would have indicated that KU’s defense was the weak link.



  • This is best KU team under Self since 2008, that’s how I feel.



  • @AsadZ I agree. I am slightly concerned that the team we saw loaf around and be lackadaisical will show up again. It obviously hasnt, but it makes me wonder.

    A lot of people in the media (like every Espn segment about the tournament, around the horn, pti, laphonso ellis, Sean farnham) are wondering that also and they are saying we are just on a hot streak - they also say the winner of the south will win the championship. Hope our guys are listening.



  • @HawkChamp

    This team is on a mission…

    We are in a mission from God KU.jpg



  • @JayHawkFanToo hope so



  • @JayHawkFanToo It was almost like Self purposely suspended JJ and purposely lost against TCU to rest up and work on defense. Removing tinfoil hat now.



  • What’s our tournament points per possession defense? I’d bet it’s impressive.



  • Beyond the dominant defense (2012) v. strong offense (2017) difference, there exists a disparity of clutch scorers between the two KU teams. In 2012, we have two great guards in TT and EJ, but they are not as clutch as DG and FM. (EJ was 'Big Shot EJ against Purdu(2012), but mysteriously elected to pass the ball to Nadir for the last shot against Michigan (2013) at the end of the regulation.) Both Frank Mason and Devonte Graham are comfortable taking the big shots. Plus, this year we also have JJ who also is a cool customer. In the sense of having clutch, this year’s team is more like the 2008 team which has Mario and Sherron for clutch.

    Also, the defense has drastically improved. In both of the blowouts, we scored a lot of the points off run outs from defensive stops/steals. In the 2nd half, we have stopped both M. St. and Purdue from scoring. I think Purdue scored only 24 points in the 2nd half last night. That my friend, is a good (much improved) defense. Another sign of a much improvement in defense is that none of our last 3 opponent’s big man had a ‘career day’ against us. A real positive sign for our interior D.

    RCJHGKU!



  • @chriz It is. We only allowed Purdue to score 24 points in the 2nd half last night.



  • Ya, “hidden” by the gaudy offensive stats and the pretty, pretty perimeter passing and unselfishness, is the fact we have been very focused on D and rbds.

    The “last 27min of the Purdue game, KU outscored them (70s to 30ish)”. Cant do that without D & rbds & blocks.

    All of Self’s little lessons finally coming home to roost for this roster. And 80% FTs in tourney vs 66% during reg season.

    As we posted a few days ago: look what happens when a 1seed w/HOF coach and a bad taste in their mouth…gets an 8 day break before the 6game Tourney run. This is BillSelfTeam’s usual notable efficiency jump that happens over Xmas Break, except they got to do it again, version2.0, right before this run. Its almost unfair…



  • @HawkChamp I can understand your concern and anything can happen in the tournament. I feel that this team is on a mission and all players has bought in the team first concept. They have learned the lesson from past mistakes and they are determined in achieving their goals. I also feel that Self has changed a lot this year in that he is letting them play with a free mind. This has been a huge factor in the success this season. Self’s coaching has been brilliant.


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