Election
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In this case, that’s easy. If ballots aren’t post-marked by election day, then don’t count them. There’s no reason not to count ballots that are postmarked by election day and arrive late.
You still didn’t answer the question. Your vote is due Nov. 3 because your vote is due Nov. 3 is not a reason.
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Every day matters when transitioning power from a Lame Duck to the new President. At least traditionally. Changing the entire federal government isn’t exactly flipping a switch.
Knowing Nov 3 vs knowing Nov 17th is two weeks of transitioning lost. If it was over by Nov 17th. We are talking 11 weeks to get everything in order and we want to dick around counting late votes for weeks. Its stupid.
I can’t believe how much common sense has gone out the window on this. Literally 130M people will vote on time and we are arguing over whether someone should be able to have their ballot in by Nov 3 or not. Whether or not that is a reasonable expectation. It is stupid. Say 20,000 votes don’t get counted because of this. That is going to be .001 percent of votes cast. That means that literally 999 out of 1000 people are able to vote on time. Or another way to put this - 129,980,000 people were able to vote correctly and timely but we are concerned with a crowd of people that wouldn’t even fill a football stadium.
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Congress set the day where the electors are chosen as the Tuesday after the first Monday in November, and electors vote the Monday after the second Wednesday in December. That’s why ballots are due the 3rd. I don’t want SCOTUS rewriting state or federal laws especially when the meaning is pretty obvious. If anything states should significantly reduce the early voting window. In NC, people have been voting since mid-September. Just insane.
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Every day matters when transitioning power from a Lame Duck to the new President. At least traditionally. Changing the entire federal government isn’t exactly flipping a switch.
Knowing Nov 3 vs knowing Nov 17th is two weeks of transitioning lost. If it was over by Nov 17th. We are talking 11 weeks to get everything in order and we want to dick around counting late votes for weeks. Its stupid.
I can’t believe how much common sense has gone out the window on this. Literally 130M people will vote on time and we are arguing over whether someone should be able to have their ballot in by Nov 3 or not. Whether or not that is a reasonable expectation. It is stupid. Say 20,000 votes don’t get counted because of this. That is going to be .001 percent of votes cast. That means that literally 999 out of 1000 people are able to vote on time. Or another way to put this - 129,980,000 people were able to vote correctly and timely but we are concerned with a crowd of people that wouldn’t even fill a football stadium.
Somehow I doubt it’s going to matter with this administration whether the time of transition of power is 2 months or 2 1/2 months. And that is not a good reason to disenfranchise tens of thousands of voters in a swing state that’s important to deciding the outcome of the election.
But I’m curious as to what specifically you think those 2 extra weeks of transitioning (at most) would help with.
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@FarmerJayhawk Why is more opportunities for people to vote bad? Shouldn’t the goal to be to get EVERYONE to vote? I mean, it’s clearly not the goal of one side. But who cares if you vote in September, October or November? I’ve known who I was going to vote for for that long…
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I actually agree with the ruling and the reasoning. There needs to be a deadline. Everyone knows this happens every four years so there is no excuse for not getting your vote in.
I voted today. I do think early in person voting is something that should be available everywhere. As smooth and quick as one could hope.
There is a deadline. Postmarked by Nov. 3rd is a deadline. The sitting government screwing with the post office so that mail is slowed amid a pandemic shouldn’t change that deadline.
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@benshawks08 said in Election:
@FarmerJayhawk Why is more opportunities for people to vote bad? Shouldn’t the goal to be to get EVERYONE to vote? I mean, it’s clearly not the goal of one side. But who cares if you vote in September, October or November? I’ve known who I was going to vote for for that long…
Because people can’t have all the information available (especially for down ballot races) 6 weeks out. Scandals could break, like Cal Cunnilingus here in NC, someone could die, like happened in Minnesota, or a classic October surprise like W. Bush’s DUI arrest breaking. If I vote and the person I voted for turns out to be a criminal, I’ll be very not happy about it and probably regret the vote. I wasn’t voting for Cunningham, but if I was on the fence and did, then found out he was banging a subordinate’s wife, it would certainly change my calculus.
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@FarmerJayhawk that is why no one is required to vote early…
Info like that isn’t necessarily destined for October. People cheat, lie, and commit crimes all year round. If I vote on November 3rd and the person I voted for does any of the things you mentioned I’d still be upset.
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@benshawks08 said in Election:
@FarmerJayhawk that is why no one is required to vote early…
But lots of people do, with actual consequences. And there’s no undo button. We should be in the business of having a more informed electorate, not less. By voting in September people are devaluing information about the candidates.
Voters should really use the FarmerJayhawk test, which necessitates voting very near or on Election Day. 1) does the candidate have the character requisite to the office he or she seeks? If not, doesn’t get my vote. 2) if yes, does the candidate align with my political views and priorities? If yes, I can vote for the candidate. By voting early, people are bypassing step 1 (e.g. the Corrupt Cal affair).
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@FarmerJayhawk Perhaps we should work at creating a political system that doesn’t magically reveal a candidate’s character mere weeks before an election. If we know something in July, maybe don’t hold on to it for an “October surprise.”
To me more people voting is always a good thing. Should voters be as informed as possible? Of course. But turn out is the biggest issue for me. Their are too many systemic barriers that make voting more difficult for some than it is for others. They are there on purpose and doing exactly what they are designed to do. Anything that helps people get around or over those barriers is good to me. Early voting does that.
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I can understand the argument for reducing the early voting window, except for people who need it for some reason, because it makes sense to wait until you have the most information about the candidates to cast your vote. I have yet to hear a decent argument as to why ballots postmarked prior to the election day should not be counted when we are in a pandemic and are having postal service delays.
And if we’re going to narrow the window for voting, we should probably also try to:
- Not have places where in-person voting takes all day
- Not limit ballot boxes to one per country
- Not destroy thousands of mail-sorting machines for no reason
- Not intentionally cause mail to be slowed down
- Stop rejecting ballots with mismatched signatures
- Allow curb-side voting for disabled persons
Among other things.
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@benshawks08 well, we don’t have that so I’m working with what is, not what I want to be. Not even sure how you’d force campaigns to release the oppo they have?
To me, it’s not a clear good. I don’t want a bunch of nincompoops canceling out my vote when half the country doesn’t know who the VP is. That’s just being intentionally ignorant and lazy and I don’t want those people voting. Sometimes I think having people take the citizenship test to be able to vote isn’t a bad idea.
@KirkIsMyHinrich I’m ok with ballots postmarked before the election being counted, so long as that’s state law. They can arrive by the Friday after the election and still be counted in Kansas, and they don’t have issues with it. There’s no doubt local governments screwed up in estimating the demand for voting when early voting started. They generally suck at that kind of thing.
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@FarmerJayhawk Yeah. You don’t get to decide who are nincampoops. Sorry if you don’t like the way they vote but that’s democracy.
Your vote isn’t more important or better than anyone else’s.
Citizenship tests for voting is a TERRIBLE idea. Now a test for the candidates I could be down for.
If I have to pass a certification test to teach I could get behind a certification test to take public office.
The problem is who writes the test? Every test is biased and that could be a big problem considering the current state of biases in the US.
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@benshawks08 said in Election:
@FarmerJayhawk Yeah. You don’t get to decide who are nincampoops. Sorry if you don’t like the way they vote but that’s democracy.
Your vote isn’t more important or better than anyone else’s.
Citizenship tests for voting is a TERRIBLE idea. Now a test for the candidates I could be down for.
If I have to pass a certification test to teach I could get behind a certification test to take public office.
The problem is who writes the test? Every test is biased and that could be a big problem considering the current state of biases in the US.
I don’t think I ever said I wanted them barred from voting. Just they should really take it a lot more seriously. And we do decide who gets to vote. We literally changed it like 40 years ago to include 18-20 year olds. There’s a movement to drop it to 16. Some states (wrongly, IMO) exclude felons. A fundamental part of the system is setting up the rules we use to choose our elected officials.
I’m totally ok with them taking the exam (https://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/document/questions-and-answers/100q.pdf) we give to immigrants wanting to become American citizens. Take it when you register and then you’re good to go. I’m not talking the old literacy tests, those were gross and obviously discriminatory. But if you don’t know the branches of government, might want to sit this out.
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I don’t think the American History section after question 56 should matter at all to citizenship or the right to vote.
Do we need to know who Henry Ford was to get a driver’s license?
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going to vote tomorrow - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@KirkIsMyHinrich YOU don’t think it is a good reason. But you are the one who wants to change the rules when the rules are that ballots are due by 8PM on Nov 3. Anyone doing an absentee ballot knows that is the rule. Not getting it in on time is their own fault and they disenfranchised themselves.
Here is my question to you, how do you know when votes are done showing up? When do you call the election? If there are another 100k absentee ballots that were requested but never returned, how do you know when no more of them are coming? How long do you wait? Because no matter what you want to do, there is going to be a drop dead date at some point of when you stop counting votes. Even if they were post-dated correctly.
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@benshawks08 No the deadline is that your ballot has to be in by Nov 3 by 8PM in Wisconsin. Not postmarked. That is what you personally would like to see.
Those are the rules that were set. Everyone knows the rules. And if you don’t, you disenfranchised yourself.
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Well done my civic duty as an American. Went in and cast my vote at the Election office this morning. Pretty painless , they opened at 8 nice line fairly long but went smoothly.
Everybody needs to make sure get out and vote, whether we agree on WHO to vote for , you need to vote for your right to be able to do so.
There are so many People who run their mouths about the President , who ever it may be at the time - -they don’t bother to excercise their right but still spill off at the mouth. - - You don’t vote - - then you have no right to complain,
I wished so many People understood that how many People around the World would love the chance to be able to vote but can’t - their countries ran by Dictatorships or whatever - would give their arm to be able to be given the chance to vote. we have people who have THAT chance and don’t
OK enough rambling just please vote my friends I’m sure all do here couldn’t say for 100 % that we do but Hell your Crimson & Blue so ya I know you do the right thing. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@KirkIsMyHinrich YOU don’t think it is a good reason. But you are the one who wants to change the rules when the rules are that ballots are due by 8PM on Nov 3. Anyone doing an absentee ballot knows that is the rule. Not getting it in on time is their own fault and they disenfranchised themselves.
Here is my question to you, how do you know when votes are done showing up? When do you call the election? If there are another 100k absentee ballots that were requested but never returned, how do you know when no more of them are coming? How long do you wait? Because no matter what you want to do, there is going to be a drop dead date at some point of when you stop counting votes. Even if they were post-dated correctly.
Again, you’re not answering the question. It’s due Nov. 3rd because it’s due Nov. 3rd is not a reason. Cuz it’s the rules is not a reason.
Count the votes that are postmarked before or by election day. If 100k absentee ballots were requested, but not filled-out and postmarked by election day, then don’t count them. We’re talking about ballots in Wisconsin that have been turned into the mail/submitted to the postal service prior to or by November 3rd. Those ballots should count. You wait the days it takes for those ballots to arrive and you count them. If it takes an excessively long time for those ballots to arrive, then that’s a different problem entirely. It shouldn’t take a long time for those ballots to arrive by mail.
Not counting ballots that are postmarked by election day when we are having postal service delays is stupid. Forcing people to vote in-person because their votes won’t be counted by mail because they won’t arrive in time during a pandemic is stupid.
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@KirkIsMyHinrich Because it is the rules is absolutely 10,000% a legitimate reason. You just don’t like the rules.
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Im not sure everyone knows the rules @Kcmatt7 as you have suggested. Assuming that people don’t realize that this is the rule, common sense would suggest that getting it postmarked before election day would mean a counted vote, to @KirkIsMyHinrich s point, I think.
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Well fellow Bucketeers, I did my duty and voted. Biden for POTUS, Tillis for Senate, Cooper for governor, and OH MY GOD is our ballot long. Two full pages, everything from POTUS to governor to Senate to statewide offices to state legislature to Supreme Court to lower courts to county commissioners to the water and soil board. So as a word of caution, if you see a shatload of stories about long lines to vote in NC, it’s in part because there are over 30 races on the ballot.
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I hear minority turnout appears softer than Bidens camp hoped for in Florida so far. Election day could be madness.
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@approxinfinity Think we need to prepare ourselves for election WEEK as results may not be conclusive when we go to bed on Tuesday or Wednesday or even Thursday.
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Just curious. Anyone here vote for trump in 16 but Biden this year? Or Clinton in 16 and Trump this year?
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