Self is blinded by his love for Traylor
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I guess its going to take Cheick getting cleared to keep Traylor off the court so we can win against top tier teams? KU can not win with Traylor on the roster. Coach Self and Traylor might as well move to Florida and apply for a merrage license! What a let down! Didnt even give Mickelson a chace to defend after MSU got back in the game.
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Yep. 100% on Coach Self. It is like he has a prejudice against Hunter.
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I agree, Mickleson needs more time, Lucas and his consistant misses within 5 feet and Jamari need less time
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@Statmachine yep
Mickelson had 3 minutes.
Our best big (barring ongoing Bragg development) gets 3 fricken minutes.
On Self 100 %
Jamari/Lucas no offense game… how much pressure does that put on our guards who also sucked royally! Better when they don’t have to force stuff.
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Well, add Selden to the list of Self’s “do no wrong” players. I love the kid, but if he’s hurt, PLEEEEEESE play someone else. Obviously he can’t jump as high as my overweight cocker spaniel or defend a limestone post rock right now. If he’s not hurt, then he needs a wake up call to remind him that he’s still in his 20s.
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PLEASE JESSE or other media types
Ask Self about his 5 rotation!
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@DanR Don’t disagree, but why in God’s green earth is Self (inside out man) playing his worst options on the inside, forcing outside players to carry the weight.
It’s inexplicable. Really.
Self has hit my lowest regard ever. I really begin to question his ability to see clearly and adapt.
I don’t give a flying crap at this point about what he sees or doesn’t see in practice. It’s results in games that matter.
Did Seldon play better when Mickelson and Bragg got more PT this summer. Why, yes, I believe he did along with the other guards. So lest’s leave them on the bench for the majority of the game.
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Traylor was NOT the problem in this game. Frank and Devonte had poor games, and the wing position was dreadful as usual. Valentine is everything we wish Selden would have been.
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@betterfireE said:
Traylor was NOT the problem in this game. Frank and Devonte had poor games, and the wing position was dreadful as usual. Valentine is everything we wish Selden would have been.
That’s fine, but must evaluate the play of the individual within the group on the floor.
If your bigs are poor options, what stress does that put on your guards and how does that affect their game. Consider the whole.
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@betterfireE Traylor had 6 points… If that was 12 or 14 which Bragg or Mickelson in combination might have made up with superior offensive game, we’d have won.
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@Statmachine KU’s not winning anything with this front court as is. They can’t rebound for crap. Carlton Bragg did not get a single rebound in 11 minutes. Talk about Traylor and Lucas all you want, but why did Bragg play 11 minutes of basketball that was far less productive than either of those guys. Bragg will be a good player one day, but right now he is one of the skinniest post players I’ve ever seen and gets pushed around way more than even Lucas does. That’s where Mickelson’s minutes really need to come from at this point because Bragg’s body is not ready for high level college basketball yet.
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@Bwag Offensive production isn’t everything. It’s about overall effectiveness.
Wayne Selden played 27 minutes had 12 points, but made 25% of his shots and had only 1 rebound. His counterpart Valentine had 12 rebounds. Traylor played 19 minutes and was fairly efficient except for some fouls. I don’t get it. Yes, we could have played Mickelson over Traylor, but we also could have played Mickelson over Lucas, who had 2 points in 14 minutes in 1 of 5 shooting. All of those misses should have been makes, by the way.
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@Texas-Hawk-10 So you really are going to sit here and argue that Lucas and Traylor are better, right now, than Bragg?
I’m wondering, have there ever been good basketball players that are thin?
And second question, is basketball, above all, a game of skill?
Third question, if Bragg is so skinny and incapable of functioning, how in the world did he get all of those rebounds in the wrestling matches we saw this summer and the WUGs?
Please, tell me again, in black and white, that Lucas and Traylor are better than Bragg, and that Bragg isn’t ready to play at the D-1 level because he’s skinny.
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Honestly, I think we should have won with any of our bigs in. That’s the point. If we are to win in March are bigs and wings will have to play better, period. They’re a small lineup, so we don’t need Hunter. We don’t NEED to win this game. This was about getting our guys accustomed to competition that they should beat without needing a traditional big.
If we can’t beat Michigan St. without Hunter/Bragg, can we really beat teams like Duke and Kentucky?
Most of all, I’m disappointed in our wing play. We simply cannot rely on Wayne Selden, and I’m thinking it might be time to move him down on the depth chart. We need somebody ANYBODY to develop on the wing.
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@betterfireE I don’t disagree at all.
Front court min distribution needs to be different.
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THE REAL FOOLS GOLD
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When it comes to not playing Mickelson, I think people forget that Self only started playing Withey major minutes out of pure, desperate necessity. The big rotation in 2011-2012 (Withey’s breakout season): Robinson, Withey, Young, Lindsay, and Wesley. Young was the backup at the 4, and Lindsay or Wesley were not going start at the 5. Honestly I think if Mario Little had been on that team he would have taken Jeff’s minutes. I think Self just has an affinity for undersized musclemen in the paint, for whatever reason. IDK if it’s a deceiving image thing. Maybe they come off as tougher enforcers, or look like they could rebound well. It took some time for Self to adapt to Jeff’s style of play, though it eventually became very effective. Mickelson is a similar player to Withey, in Self’s own words “a poor man’s Jeff Withey”. But he has other, more Self-ish options available that he is using, to the detriment of the team.
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@Makeshift Good point about Withey. Self was always more than happy to get him out of any game (e.g., Mizzou) when he could have an excuse to play smaller.
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I disagree about 50% with this thread: Traylor has more than Lucas does. He has developed more. He is at least “athletic”.
Lucas should not play, period.
Traylor should be the 4th big (sub for Hunter at the 5).
Ellis starting 4, with similar stretch-the-D-McDAA Bragg as his 15-18mpg backup at the 4.
Personally, I just CANNOT lump moderate-ability Traylor in with no-ability Lucas. Lumping Jamari in with Lucas is not fair to Jamari Traylor. But I do think Jamari should sub for Hunter, who starts at the 5. Hunter has more than Jamari. Bragg could be Ellis next season, and needs 15-18mpg every night!!
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@ralster I would just like Hunter to have more of an opportunity. Save ll for Ridley. I’m w/you on Mari!
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@Crimsonorblue22 Exactly. Hunter needs to start at the 5, and Bragg is a scoring threat FIRST off bench for Ellis. Traylor is the 4th bigman, bring him in for Hunter.
Basically Im saying our #1 and 2 bigs are Ellis + Hunter, and Bragg is the “skilled” sub for Ellis, while Jamari is the “hustle/energy” sub for Hunter.
Lucas is simply a lesser conference type of player. If he hasn’t showed it by now, he just doesn’t have it, folks. Heck, Lucas didn’t show squat in the WUG/Korea, how much more evidence do we need?!
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@ralster I’m not convinced 100% on Hunter, need to see more of him to decide. He’s better than ll, no question!
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@Crimsonorblue22 I amy have miseed something about Hunter’s game skills from last year - I remember he didn’t do much given his limited minutes. but of course in the WUG, he played very well - soI’m surmising that when every here is screaming for Hunter to play more, they are basing it on on his WUG results. so, we shall see as the season progresses.
more random thoughts - how many times did Perry get blocked? Devonte must have been given the green light to shoot otherwise I’m guessing he would have been pulled after some of those wild shots.
