Tarik Black waived by the Rockets...
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@globaljaybird
One Jayhawk in and one out. Too many injuries for Xavier, I am not sure if there are teams willing to take a change on an oft injured player.
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Xavier can play in the NBA… if he can stay healthy. No one is going to give him a big contract, but he will continue to get opportunities as a minimum salary player until he can prove that he can stay healthy.
Glad for Tarik. He deserves a chance in the NBA. He will never be a star, but he could carve out a nice 8-10 year career if he continues to work hard.
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I agree that Xavier has the tools to play in the NBA but his history of injuries is very concerning. Last season he had a new start with the Lakers and had his best season including the most point and most minutes played, which earned him a contract extension, but the season ended prematurely with an injury and this year he managed to play in 9 games before a season ending injury.
The following is from Marc Stein on Twitter, Dec 28 - 5:21 PM
The Lakers have waived Xavier Henry.
**Henry has really struggled with injuries throughout his career, and he was only able to get through nine games this season before going down with a season-ending Achilles injury. Given his constant struggles with health, it could be difficult for him to find another NBA contract. **
Like I said, he has the tools but the history of injuries will give teams pause, particularly when the injuries are not the result of excessive minutes like Kobe. I often wander if staying an extra year at KU and getting his body ready for the NBA would have helped; young men playing against grown men can bet a bad combination.
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I agree. And I wonder if X should have stayed just to build his body.
If I was Self, I would do a better job of selling Hudy to recruits.
We should be able to recruit even above Kentucky.
I know it is the news none of these kids want to hear, because they are living the dream in “invincibility land.” But these kids have parents. And many of these parents are realistic.
The argument that these kids need to get to the league before getting hurt so they can at least have one big pay day is utter nonsense. There are exceptions, and Embiid might be one of those.
College basketball is 1/10th the stress to the body as the NBA. I’ve read that before. 1/10th! Because the NBA season extends (for many teams) over 100 games per year, including exhibitions. If you do the math and compare it to college, it seems to be just 1/3 tougher. But the effects are cumulative. I even think 1/10th might be conservative.
Now… back to Hudy. She is recognized throughout the USA as one of the premiere strength training coaches. She far exceeds anyone on any NBA team.
If I had a OAD-level kid ready to go to college, I would want my kid at Kansas, and I’d want him playing probably a minimum of 3 years of college ball. It’s a natural step up in talent and speed of the game, and he would have at least 3 years to mature his body. And he would have at least 3 years with Hudy to give him his best odds of making it at the next level.
Many people in here have said it before. It isn’t the initial contract where pros make their money, it is the contract after that and the ones after that.
The more you ease these players into an advanced game, the more time they have to adjust to the speed of the game. Many of the injuries were preventable if the player had the right mentality. There are tricks to playing safe and still performing at a level that will best help your team. If you want a great example, see TIM DUNCAN! That guy has stretched his game out considerably by limiting his movement to “safe moves.” Doesn’t mean he is risk-free… just means he is limiting his exposure.
If you think about all of that carefully, it is hard to not come up with the conclusion about the true ability of a player like Michael Jordan, who brought years and years of “in your face” basketball to the league. I never saw a game where Jordan didn’t take crazy risks with his drives to the goal. That guy put it on the line every single game and was only the second guy to reach 3000 pts in a season, behind Wilt.
To my knowledge, Jordan’s biggest injury was a broken foot he suffered in the third game of his second season.
Those early pro years are very risky for players. Their bodies are young and they don’t have the level of development they need to reduce the risk, and their minds are not focused on playing it safe because they lack experience and are still living in “invincibility land.”
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Cole has put up some monster numbers with NY. 8-9 shooting yesterday with 7 boards and 19 boards the night before. Alas, his team totally sucks, so it hasn’t led to wins unfortunately.
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I completely agree with your statements about injuries and their cumulative effect.
However, I think this adds to the OAD phenomenon. Xaiver is a good example of this. He’s just 23 now. He’s played parts of five NBA seasons. He’s made about $9m in his career, which has been derailed by injury pretty much from the beginning. Let’s say that he had stayed in college. His career may have played out similar to that of Robbie Hummel.
Hummel was banged up all through college. He had a couple of pretty devastating season ending injuries along the way. As a result, he was a 2nd round draft choice (remember, X was a lottery pick). Because X was a lottery pick, even though he missed significant time, he was able to get through his rookie deal and bank about $6.5m. Hummel has yet to make more than the league minimum in his two seasons, so he has banked less than a quarter of that (about $1.6m).
Some guys just aren’t durable. They just can’t stand up to the toll of the game. Hummel looks like one of those guys. Xavier may also be one of those guys. Brandon Rush looks like one of those guys. Health is, to some extent, a talent unto itself.
Hudy is very good, but I would hesitate to put her above the professional staff at the NBA level, let alone “far exceeds.” Contracts in the NBA are guaranteed. They invest as much money as possible into keeping their athletes healthy because that is literally millions of dollars.
As for the contracts, the age you are on your first contract determines how old you will be when you sign your last contract.
Because of the way the NBA salary structure is, players are capped on how much money they can make during their first four years in the league. Those years can be age 19-22 or age 22-25. It doesn’t matter. You are capped on the first four years of your contract by the rookie salary scale.
Let’s look at a couple of guys who were drafted in the same year and compare Lamar Odom and Wally Szczerbiak. Odom went 4th in 1999 as a freshman. Szczerbiak went 6th as a senior. To make it fair, we will only compare them through their age 31 seasons (Szczerbiak retired after his age 31 season. Odom was not all that effective after his age 31 season. Odom made about $2m more through his first four years (when salaries are dictated by draft position). However, when the time came to sign the first big contract, Odom was 24 (he was an older freshman) while Szczerbiak was 26. As a result, Odom made $2m more the very next year, followed by $1.5m more, $1.5m more, $500k more, $500k more and $5ook more in the next several seasons. That’s $6.5m more based largely on the fact that Odom was younger. After that, Szczerbiak was done. Odom played well for two more seasons (another $16m) before having two awful years and being waived this summer. Odom’s age was worth about $20m (the higher salary in free agency, plus the extra years) even if we don’t include the two awful years he played after his age 31 season (another $17m).
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@justanotherfan I am a HUGE believer that Health is a talent unto itself. I saw many kids with great numbers come to the KU track team and the workouts ran them into the ground. Some didn’t even finish fall semester. Others were burnt out before the season was over and left KU.
I was fortunate to come from a top high school with great coaching. Even so, our entire workout in high school equaled a college warmup BEFORE practice started. Except for weight training. I would say the difference in weight training days were 1.5x to 2x more difficult in college. Some athlete’s bodies just can’t make that transition. And a high school grad compared to a college junior- about 21 years old. Talk about men among boys. So except for the prime athlete like a Cromwell or Wiggins there is still a big adjustment just to the college level.NOW-throw the NBA level in the mix? I would think 2AD would help protect these athletes. I get they jump for the money-just wish they weren’t in that position. I’d like to see money put into escrow accounts-with some money available immediately for families in hardship cases like McLemore’s situation.
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I think Hudy far exceeds what NBA teams have. Check out her formal background.
NBA front offices focus more in rehab and staffed medical personnel.
Here are a few good reads on Hudy, and why she would be welcome on any NBA staff:
Coaches Corner with Andrea Hudy
Andrea Hudy: KU’s secret weapon
In January 2013, Hudy was named the National College Strength and Conditioning Coach of the Year by the NSCA. This is the same organization that supplies the pool of strength/conditioning trainers for the NBA. Few of these trainers have Hudy’s qualifications.
Many of her pupil athletes (who turned pro) maintain contact with her years after their college days for her support and knowledge.
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@drgnslayr Yeah, to put it succinctly, she is a bad@$$. I hope she never bails for the League.
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X passed the eye test and had a sweet stroke.
The trouble with X has always been that neither D1, nor the pros were an eye test beauty contest for guys with sweet strokes.
Injuries are not really X’s problem, at all. If injuries were the thing the teams would keep protecting him since he is only 23.
Bottom line, X has NEVER played up to his hype.
X has always played like an average to good player, looked like a good to great player, and people have always been betting on the come for the good to great player.
But he has never consistently produced more.
His best production has always been average to good.
The dead give away on X was that he could only beat Brady Morningstar out of 20-25mpg, even with Morningstar not having his best season.
Ding, ding, ding, ding,ding, flashing red light, flashing red light!!!
X getting waived is about what he did while healthy, not just about being injured.
X has always been a good open look trifectate that could defend average and rebound a little. He was this way at KU. He has been this way as a pro, when healthy.
There are literally dozens of guys on benches around the L that can give the same, or more.
Whenever he is healthy and a team has a hole, he will catch on.
Whenever he is hurting, at team can always flush him and find someone that gives the same.
His real problem is his game, not his injuries.
He has never raised his game beyond average to good.
P.S.: I am among those that read him wrong. I really thought he sand bagged at KU, but over the long run it has become apparent that he has just been an average to good performer all along. And that there just wasn’t anymore out in the distance waiting to come to fruition.
P.P.S.: the above sounds way more negative than I intended. Being an average to good player in the NBA IS A FINE ACCOMPLISHMENT for any player and something to be proud of. But X was branded and marketed as someone that could be an NBA star. I once thought he could be. Some NBA FOLKS apparently thought so too. But even when uninjured his game never seemed to rise to that level. I am glad he is a Jayhawk and that he made his money. Rock chalk X!!!
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Hudy is super qualified and a great strength and conditioning coach. There’s no doubt about that. Her formal qualifications are top notch. I have no doubt that many teams would hire her if it came to that. She has probably fielded some offers. However, the individuals that are in those positions in the pros are also very skilled. Some have the formal background of Hudy. Others have years of experience. Some have both.
My point wasn’t to try and discredit Hudy, but to say that pro team training staffs are generally top notch. The ones that aren’t are pretty quickly replaced. Is Hudy better than some NBA strength and conditioning people. Most likely. She’s the best in the college world, so I bet she’s better than more than a handful of pro strength and conditioning coaches. Is she better than all of them? I doubt that. Would she be in the top 10? Maybe, but that’s a tough call. I’d guess she’s probably in the top half among the pro staffs, maybe top ten.
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Hudy also is involved in advancing strength and conditioning research. Something you won’t read on many sites until there is more conclusive results. She’s been involved with studies at UCONN and now at KU. I believe she is on her second book now, too, and covers some of her studies results. There are several college (and maybe even some pro) sports teams that have shown interest in our facility and Hudy’s regiment. I’m sure many of those groups have mimicked her approach.
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She was involved in the study regarding stress and athletic performance. That was a very interesting read. I think they are supposed to do a follow up for that.
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She has 4 peer-reviewed publications listed on Web of Science (in case anybody wondered):
Andre MJ, Fry AC, Heyrman MA, Hudy A, Holt B, Roberts C, et al. 2012. A reliable method for assessing rotational power. Journal of Strength and Conditioning Research 26:720-724.
Fry AC, Hudy A, Gallagher PM, Vardiman JP, Kudrna RA, Moodie NG, et al. 2010. Lower body power-load curves for NCAA division I men’s and women’s collegiate basketball players. Medicine and Science in Sports and Exercise 42:65-65.
Lane M, Fry AC, Gallagher PM, Vardiman JP, Hudy A, Graham ZA, et al. 2011. Relationships of lower body power and strength for NCAA division I men’s collegiate basketball players. Medicine and Science in Sports and Exercise 43:398-398.
Lane M, Fry AC, Gallagher PM, Vardiman JP, Hudy A, Graham ZA, et al. 2012. Relationships of lower body power and strength for NCAA division I men’s collegiate basketball players. Journal of General Internal Medicine 27:398-398.
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I am feeling a bit contrary, so I am going to take on Hudy today.
This team looks and plays like wounded soldiers in a MASH tent.
Last years team did, too.
And frankly teams the last several years have.
The team that played Kentucky in the finals of 2012 was pretty much playing on joints held together by bailing wire and ankle boots and sexy knee lingerie.
Our guys are gimpier than a bunch of Octogenarian Rockettes.
If science can’t do better than this, then, by god, Chaplain, I want an injury prayer. We shouldn’t have to fight Kentucky and joint problems, too! I’m in good with the almighty, Chaplain. If Hudy’s training regimes don’t keep us healthy, then you write a good injury prayer and I guaran-damn-ty you that the good lord will listen.
That is all.
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@drgnslayr said:
… Hudy’s regiment.
She’s not an Army officer. You mean regimen.
I’m sure you all hate grammar policemen, but this isn’t grammar. I hate losing good words and conflation does that. Compliment <> complement, affect <> effect.
On Hudy, I frankly agree with jaybate: if she’s so great at getting player’s bodies ready, why do we have so many injuries? Why do some players seem to lose athleticism during their careers here?
Maybe protecting the merchandise isn’t such a bad idea.
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I agree with you. Hudy is at the very top of college trainers and being in a university environment she is a logical candidate to be part of research studies.
However, the majority of trainers for professional franchises are equally or better qualified; they just keep a low profile and keep their methods and resources confidential since it gives them an advantage in a world of super high prized athletes. The training they do is also quite different; in college trainers work with young men and the main objective is to smooth the transition from the HS to the college level and develop their young bodies. In the pros they are working with grown men that by and large are, at the peak of their development and the emphasis is keeping them healthy throughout the season. A good number of professional; athletes also have their own (and very expensive) trainers.
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I think the key to that question lies in the emphasis that @JayHawkFanToo pointed out. Hudy is focused on developing strength and power. Her methods for developing more strength and power can be seen in a lot of the research and writings that she has been involved with (very good work, I might add).
However, at the pro level, the emphasis isn’t so much on developing strength as it is on the conditioning/ health side of things. The season is long and hard. Pro strength and conditioning coaches have to make sure their guys (or girls) stay healthy moreso than developing more strength.
I believe this is the difference. Hudy is developing power/strength to assist in athletic development to potentially move an athlete from good to elite… Pro coaches are developing endurance/stamina/ muscle tolerance to help an athlete stay elite.
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@JayHawkFanToo except they are now working more w/19 year old OAD’s. So many injuries this year. What do you attribute that to? I would think it would be easier for a 19 year old to go thru their long and grinding season. So much more physical too! Maybe I’ve just been watching more, just to follow our guys. I can’t even imagine Embiid going a whole season w/out getting injured.
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I still maintain the average 21 year old has a lot over a 19 year old in terms of physical strength and endurance. Yes-some of these athletes bodies have matured further than others in the same amount of time but if you compare photos between these two ages you will see a difference in their muscular build. I think diet plays a part as well. The difference between what mom serves the family at home compared to the training table at a top college program pays huge benefits to the athlete.
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I’ve always wondered if there are any Ankle exercises that would prevent the serious sprain. The problem is that everyone who accidentally steps on another’s foot always ends up screaming and grabbing the ankle.
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“I’m sure you all hate grammar policemen, but this isn’t grammar.”
Sorry… I dropped the ball on that one. Actually, I don’t hate grammar police and appreciate when someone makes corrections.
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We all need to step back and look at this closer (concerning Hudy).
Her job is to increase the athleticism of a teenagers, while trying to limit injuries.
There is a conflict in that statement. By increasing the athleticism in teenagers, it puts them at more risk, too.
When you jump higher you are putting an exponential amount of additional impact on your joints. When you learn to make more aggressive lateral cuts, you are putting an exponential amount of additional stress on tendons, cartilage and tissues.
Now consider that we are also talking about teenagers. They may have the most flexible bones (comparing to older athletes), but many areas of their body have not matured and are vulnerable to injuries.
I like what @justanotherfan said, when comparing college to pros. Pro training is more about maintaining endurance and preventing injuries. Most athletes in the pros are not working hard to increase their vertical by several inches. They are interested in protecting their investment because they are already signed with a club. And these athletes are true adults, matured anatomies that have already established strengths and weaknesses, and these players are heavily coached into paying attention to their bodies to prevent injuries.
College basketball is about development… seeing how much improvement players can make during that period. Add that to their youth and you create additional risk.
Pro ball is about endurance. Long seasons playing way too many games. Their injuries are more a testament of repetitive stresses.
I think Hudy does an outstanding job.
If I have a gripe it is about nutrition. There is not enough focus on contemporary sports nutrition. Kansas could leap over all of college basketball if they got on the stick with contemporary sports nutrition. Get these kids off of sports bars and Gatorade and on to real nutrition. It would impact their health and performance considerably.
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Every year the game is played at a higher level; the average athlete of today is more developed than the average athlete of 30 years ago, so naturally there is a bigger risk if injury, furthermore, 30 years ago, the younger players did not play as much and the upper class-men players carried the load and were better prepared physically to do that; that is no longer the case and first year players are expected to contribute. Also new training methods have helped reduce injuries and if you look at injuries over the years I will guess the number of injuries has not changed dramatically, what has changed is the access we have to information that makes us more aware of them. 30 years ago, the only way to know about injuries was to read the newspaper or listen to sports shows on the radio, now with the Internet, all that information is readily available.
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I don’t know much about HS sports 30 years ago, but 40 years ago there was not club sports in KC year round. You changed sports with seasons so while skill development didn’t happen as quick for a similar sport (say basketball) you had the benefit of a season off to rest certain muscles for a different season. To this day I know football players had to adjust to bBall, just as bBall had to adjust to track, etc, etc.
Playing bBall year round now your skills have a huge advantage over someone who only did it 4 months a year.
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My post was in reference to college basketball and not necessarily HS. There is no question that the college game (and by extension the HS game) is played at much higher level now than it was 40 years ago. With higher level of play there is a bigger chance of injury, however, the better training methods probably offset the injuries, so it is probably a wash, and I would guess the number of injuries has remained the same. Just my personal observation and I could be wrong.
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@JayHawkFanToo Wow, thats very interesting. Adidas is the uniform for the NBA?? Seriously, what does that mean as far as Adidas’ pull on the market…regarding @jaybate-1.0 and his conspiracy theory of the ShoeCos?
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@JayHawkFanToo I see that now-sorry about taking your post the wrong direction.
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@jaybate-1.0 Ok so I posted my last question without first reading your lengthy “hypothesizing” which was very interesting by the way. Leading me to ask some questions about said topic.
Coaches in the L. How are they contracted? They aren’t the athletes out there wearing the flashy brand name shoes for marketing purposes.
The Asymmetries of talent distribution in the L and Div1; Might you elaborate on your theory of that? Let me take a poke at it first though. Since Kentucky is probly a Nike school, the AAU teams funded by Nike $ funnel their players towards that school and vice versa for Adidas schools like KU. I imagine if there are NBA teams that are Nike & Adidas then they might draft players as such also?
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@Lulufulu NBA is adidas.
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If I recall correctly, one of our august members indicated that the NBA apparel is contracted with adidas, but players are free to contract on shoes as they prefer. Right?
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@jaybate-1.0 of course, a million shoe deals there. Well, close!
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Lots. And I do not recall what percent are Nike and what percent are adidas. It would be interesting to see if the proportion were at all similar to proportions of schools, coaches and major summer league teams. or sharply different.
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Correct. If I recall correctly I also posted a link with the player distribution by brand.
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@JayHawkFanToo did you enjoy the game from the comforts of your home? Maybe a little darts at half w/SZ in the bulls eye?
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Sorry I have forgotten it. Thanks for letting me know. If you know where it might be let me know. Thanks.
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I enjoyed the game (and result) on the big screen while staying warm with this blanket my daughter hand made for me for Christmas…I am one happy Jayhawk.
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@JayHawkFanToo that’s an awesome gift! She must really love her dad!
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Thanks.
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4th post from the top, last line…
