Svi will become Lebron's Steve Kerr.
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@BShark To be completely open, I only watch KU basketball until the tourney or nba finals. I don’t feel like I’m missing out on much.
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@BShark @dylans I used to love the NBA … went to many Kings games until they left. Really enjoyed the NBA through the 90s. After that, no so much. And now, I find the games unwatchable. That’s been the case since for about 20 years. NBA players coast. It’s not full out effort over the course of a game. Lots of walking around. Slow movements. Many uncontested or half contested shots.
The NBA is like coffee to me. I don’t like coffee, but every so often I try it again hoping something will change.
I watch NBA late, a quarter here, a half here. But it’s hard.
CBB, on the other hand, is magic to me. Great competition, full speed, no defensive limitations, strategy, incredible atmospheres – and that’s just the regular season. KU vs. Tennessee Tech? Well, not as attractive. A handful of games are not big deals.
But lots of folks love the NBA. I just want both to coexist, and not try to make one like the other.
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@HighEliteMajor There is definitely some coasting. The playoffs are much better in this regard.
I don’t hate college basketball but I definitely don’t care to watch say, KSU vs ISU in conference season.
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I’ll watch any big 12 conference game with some interest if it’s on. I enjoy getting to know all the kids in our conference. But, I’m with you, I won’t typically seek out the bottom feeders.
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I’m the same way. I watch more NBA than college. My breaking point with the college game came a few years ago while watching a tournament game.
I don’t remember who was playing, I think it was a Big 12 team, but it may have been someone else. It was deeper into the tournament, probably a Sweet 16 game or Elite Eight game.
Either way, someone ran a high PnR, there was some defensive confusion and the other team’s center got switch onto the PG, and the PG got switched onto the C.
Obviously, this is a matchup you want to attack immediately, either using the PG’s quickness advantage on the perimeter or throwing the ball inside to let the C use his size. Instead, the PG backed the ball out and called a play that the coach was screaming from the sidelines. That delay gave the defense a chance to switch their matchups so that there weren’t any mismatches.
I couldn’t believe what I had just seen. The coach had willingly forfeited a MUA so that he could run a specific play. It bothered me so much I had to quit watching the game.
Probably the next week I was watching an NBA game and a similar thing happened. High PnR, got the switch. Literally before I could even think mismatch the ball was in the hands of the big man (pretty sure it was Dirk Nowitzki) and he was scoring over the mismatch. The PnR created the mismatch, the offense pressed the advantage and scored, all in less than three seconds. It was beautiful to watch.
I will watch KU and the tournament, but it is hard to watch other games.
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What’s this NBA everyone is talking about?
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@BShark I started watching the NBA again when I started entering teams in Draft Kings. I flat loved the old Lakers and Celtics Finals with Bird and Magic.
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Back in the day, you were either a Bird guy, or Magic guy. You could not be both. I’ve come to appreciate Bird and the Celtics, over time. Kind of. But I was a 100% Magic guy. When you talk greatest players of all time, taking into account everything on the court, Magic is it for me.
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Again, your logic does not add up. Ever since LeBron went to Miami he made sure he would have the handpicked best team in the Eastern Conference and he did the same thing when he moved back to Cleveland where he had an almost All-Star team and this is why he ended up in 8 finals and even then, if the Celtics did not have its two top players injured they beat Cleveland in 5 games considering that without its top two players the series went the full 7 games.
With the “current” Laker team no way he makes it to the finals the upcoming season since it means the Lakers would have to beat the Rockets and the Warriors and that just will not happen with their current personnel…including LeBron. After next season, when a number of free agents are available and the Lakers have a large cap and get 2 or 3 top players to go along with James then it will have a better chance.
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@JayHawkFanToo Just because it went a full 7 doesn’t mean they WOULD have beat them. That is flawed logic on your end.
Taking Hayward into account on a team where he only played 5 minutes the entire season and may never be the same is also flawed logic.
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Wow…you are kidding, right? Hayward was a finalist for the USA and Olympic teams and an All-Star that averaged 35 mpg and 22 ppg the previous season and was ranked in the top 20 players in the NBA going into the season and Kyrie is one of the top PGs in the League, an All-Star and USA team member and top 20-25 ranked player and you don’t think they would have made a difference? Either you are not familiar with NBA players or just too much of a LeBron fan and blinded to anything else.
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@JayHawkFanToo I can tell that I know more about the NBA than you.
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It changes the whole make-up of the team. You really can’t say Hayward makes them x amount better for sure. Stats get displaced, they would certainly be different. Perhaps better but how much better is impossible to say.
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@BShark Exactly. The growth of Tatum and Brown could be dramatically different on a team with Hayward. Especially defensively, considering that Hayward is an awful defender.
Same for Rozier.
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I find it hard to believe that if you take not 1 but 2, not journeymen players but All-Stars and ranked in the top 20 players in the entire league and the 2 top players from a team, any team, and it would remain at the same level. Take Graham and Newman or Svi from last year’s KU team or Mason and Graham from the previous year’s team and do you think KU is still at the same level? Definitely not.
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You both make good points about that series. I think it certainly plays out differently if Irving and Hayward are available.
As @BShark said, stats get displaced. Playing time is re-distributed. That changes things.
While Irving is a tremendous offensive player, he is not nearly as stout defensively as Rozier was. Perhaps George Hill or Jordan Clarkson can get their offense going more against Irving than they were able to against Rozier.
Lebron is going to get his against whomever they put on him. But adding a couple of lesser defenders in Irving and Hayward to replace minutes for guys like Tatum, Brown and Rozier means that the Cleveland supporting cast might have added a bit more help. That’s not an insignificant addition in Cleveland’s favor to have Jeff Green or Rodney Hood playing well in that series.
Ultimately, I think the Lebron factor still tilts that Series in Cleveland’s direction. Giving him the potential for a little bit more support helps him conserve energy, which I think helps Cleveland pull through in seven.
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Kcmatt7 said:
@JayHawkFanToo I can tell that I know more about the NBA than you.
Funny, you don’t seem to know who or how good Hayward and Kyrie are…and even funnier, you think the Lakers will beat the Warriors and Rockets to make it to the finals…so much about knowing more about the NBA.
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@JayHawkFanToo I never once said that I think that the Lakers will make the finals. I simply stated you hate LeBron so much your head would explode if it happened.
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suum cuique…
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Diallo is playing now on ESPN u
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Dg is on after that. 4:30. I think cliff is on diallo’s team. Not sure, edit. Cliff is there, scored. I’m anxious to see Perry play today too.
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Congrats to Svi. Got a 3 year 4.6 mil contract today.
http://lakersball.com/threads/sviatoslav-mykhailiuk-thread-3-years-4-6m.3087/page-6
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Coleby is playing for the Pelicans as well.
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@JayHawkFanToo have you seen him play? Malik hasn’t played much either. Wasn’t landen on a team too?
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Coleby has played a total if 5 minutes and shot 0-1 and no points; not looking good for him and will probably end up in the G League.
Newman is averaging 11.5 mpg and 1.5 ppg and shooting 1-7 or 14% from the field and 1-4 or 25% from 3. Looks like Newman will be spending a lot of time in the G League as well before he gets a call.
I thought Lucas was going to play in the Summer League but I have not seen him in any team.
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@Crimsonorblue22 The most curious story of the Self era…why didn’t Diallo ever play?
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KUSTEVE said:
@Crimsonorblue22 The most curious story of the Self era…why didn’t Diallo ever play?
For the same reason that he is playing in the Summer League after being drafted and playing 2 years already.
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@JayHawkFanToo We normally play guys that go to the NBA, summer league or not. Diallo not starting was the only time I can remember Coach Self leaving it up to the other starters to choose who they wanted to start. They wanted Lucas, and the rest is history how we recruited a Top 10 forward, and hardly played him. I would love to hear a first hand account on how that all went down. The curious case of Chieck Diallo …
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Diallo missed the entire pre-season and part of the season which put him way behind the learning curve. His athleticism was off the charts but his basketball IQ was extremely low (and still is) and while he was able to overpower HS players, he was lost against the tougher and more capable Division I competition. Hard to play a player that is consistently out of position and has not mastered the playbook. Lucas was not nearly as athletic but had a high basketball IQ and was always at the right place at the right time and this is why the other players chose to have him start and play the lion’s share of time at the position.
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@KUSTEVE I’ve always felt the player decision thing was a bit of a hoax on Diallo. I think it was done by Self, shrewdly, because he knew what he result would be and he wanted that result. Gave him possible cover in putting a top 5 player in hibernation on the recruiting trail. It would also have the effect of helping bond the team more. And, of course, it did – witness the winning streak after scrapping the center by committee thing. On the other hand, we needed a scoring threat low vs. Nova in the EE when Nova schemed against Ellis. He was on the bench. He then played in the NBA a matter of months after Self scrapped him. Lucas, meanwhile, is playing for the Tokyo HamFighters or Dragonflies or a team named after Toyota, or some such nonsense – last I heard.
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@JayHawkFanToo Semi-fiction. Spin. Half-truths. Meaning, it was not nearly as firm and as dire as you suggest. He was raw, of course. No doubt. But many players are raw, and BB IQ is a challenge. But what Self did not do, which other coaches do, which Self has done since (see DeSousa – who looked lost, etc), is give the player regular minutes, and let him play through his mistakes to reach a higher level of play. Take some lumps to get to the goal of a more complete player by March. It was just a choice not to do that because Self had a security blanket, a reliable, smart player who knew what he was doing. Self eschewed the mountain top for a trip to the hills. Lucas flailed against the better D-1 competition you refer to … see the undeniable evidence vs. Nova and then vs. Oregon in EE losses. We had no scoring down low vs. Nova when we couldn’t counter their anti-Ellis defense, and Lucas was out of his league vs. Oregon.
Somehow, this guy you defame has played 70 NBA games in two seasons, and Lucas is, well, you know.
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The biggest evidence that Self messed up with Diallo was proving that he could take a very raw player directly out of HS and turn him into an adequate player and major contributor to a FF run in 3 and a half months.
Another piece of evidence that even Self felt he messed up the Diallo situation was starting Doke, an overweight player that had even less BBIQ than Diallo, over Lucas two seasons ago. Doke would have finished the year starting if he didn’t get hurt.
Self knows he screwed up. It’s ok. The important thing is that he clearly learned from it and got us to another FF.
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No, it is not fiction or semi-fiction, it is reality. Diallo had and still has a low basketball IQ because he did not play basketball until he was fairly old and unfortunately he is a very slow learner.
You are conveniently forgetting Diallo has a 3-year $3.4M guaranteed contract and he gets the money whether he plays or not. Last season he played in 52 games compared to 17 the season before but his mpg, ppg and rpg went down while his tpg and fpg went up, in other words, all the stats went in the wrong direction and the reason he played that many games is because Boogie got injured and the only othre option was 35 year old Emeka Okafor.
Here arethe summary stats for the playoffs for Diallo…
…and here are the stats for the entire team…
As you can see, the Pelicans do not use him that much and I am sure that the 10 points he scored in the 7 games he played had the opponents shaking in their very expensive shoes.
Diallo will make ~$1.5M the upcoming season and while it is a relatively small amount as salaries go I will guess there are no teams interested even at this low cost. The Pelicans have an option next season and whether they exercise it or not will be telling. His career in many ways is similar to that of Julian Wright, an super athletic player that could not stick in the NBA past his initial contract.
You seem to indicate that an outstanding college player should be by extension one in the NBA as well and we both know this is not the case since the college game sometimes does not translate to the NBA. CONSENSUS POY Frank Mason was picked in the second round and is a backup to a OAD player drafted in the same year that was not among the best in college basketball.
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Kcmatt7 said:
The biggest evidence that Self messed up with Diallo was proving that he could take a very raw player directly out of HS and turn him into an adequate player and major contributor to a FF run in 3 and a half months.
Another piece of evidence that even Self felt he messed up the Diallo situation was starting Doke, an overweight player that had even less BBIQ than Diallo, over Lucas two seasons ago. Doke would have finished the year starting if he didn’t get hurt.
Self knows he screwed up. It’s ok. The important thing is that he clearly learned from it and got us to another FF.
Nailed it.
@JayHawkFanToo Come on now. The fact is he is sticking around the league for now. TRob and BMac aren’t exactly setting the league on fire either. Self did wonders with TRob and Diallo COULD have contributed well if Self gave him a chance. Like KC said Self has succeeded in a similar situation twice now. Deep down I think Self knows he messed up with Diallo, but he would never admit it.
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I watched diallo play a summer league game, he’s so fun to watch! The coach or owner was being interviewed, he had a lot of nice things to say. Cheick had more opportunities w/boogie going down last season. Still working hard w/his D. Diallo is so appreciative of his time at KU, he comes back, I see pics w/coaches and he went to Selfs HOF induction. I realize I’m in the minority, but I think Self did the right think w/diallo. He needed a lot more than 6 months to help us out, I sure wish it wasn’t true! I hope they continue to work w/him cause he is one cool guy who really deserves it.
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Crimsonorblue22 said:
I watched diallo play a summer league game, he’s so fun to watch! The coach or owner was being interviewed, he had a lot of nice things to say. Cheick had more opportunities w/boogie going down last season. Still working hard w/his D. Diallo is so appreciative of his time at KU, he comes back, I see pics w/coaches and he went to Selfs HOF induction. I realize I’m in the minority, but I think Self did the right think w/diallo. He needed a lot more than 6 months to help us out, I sure wish it wasn’t true! I hope they continue to work w/him cause he is one cool guy who really deserves it.
Diallo definitely is not bitter at Self/KU from what I’ve heard.
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@Crimsonorblue22 @BShark Yea he has just said he understood and that he came in late. Wasn’t Self’s fault, and KU did spend a pretty penny to get him eligible while the NCAA drug their feet.
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TRob and McLemore were orders of magnitude more developed than Diallo during and after they left college. Both were All Conference and TRob was runner up to POY Anthony Davis, one of the better players to come out of college in many years and picked #5 and McLemore was a finalist for the Wooden Award and picked #7 in the draft. Diallo was a second round pick based solely on potential. Diallo would have befitted greatly staying an extra year at KU.
Diallo is entering the last year of his guaranteed contract and he gets paid whether he plays or not and at that cost is fairly inexpensive to keep him on.
Like I said, his career looks a lot like that of Julian Wright who also had a lottery pick guaranteed contract and once it was over so was his career. If NO picks up the option after the next season then he might have a chance, if it does not he is headed overseas.
I really like Diallo and hope he makes it. At times he can do amazing things on the court and other times he is the polar opposite, again, a lot like Julian Wright. Just sayin’
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So how did SVI end up doing last night? - -Watched a little bit of Frank and Wayne–didn’t see how they finished either.- I heard the announcers say that the kings was the only team that hadn’t won a game yet in this summer league. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
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@Crimsonorblue22 If ever there were a foreign project worth developing for 5 years anywhere, he is it.
With a trey, he would be an NBA ALL STAR.
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@Kcmatt7 or, re: Diallo, Silvio’s success proves that Self is capable of developing and using the right talented and raw player, and Silvio got it faster than Diallo did.
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@approxinfinity I don’t think Self gave it an honest chance.
I will say one thing though. Cheick had an ego that De Sousa did not. When Diallo was on the court it felt more like he was auditioning for the NBA. De Sousa felt more like he knew his role was to just be a defender and a rebounder.
That key personality difference definitely could have been something that changed their development path at KU. And why Self let one play through mistakes over the other.
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@jaybate-1.0 I wish he would have let our coaches work w/him a few years, so much talent, but still so green.
