Anyone else wonder why Self didn’t play Silvio quite a bit the second half against Nova?
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@HighEliteMajor I agree with most everything you wrote there. I was truly mystified Mitch didn’t even get a sniff. I am sure Self would do many things different if given a chance. I also think when a team is on it is hard to turn the tide. In the past Self would have muddied up the game but this years team didn’t seem to have the right mix for that. This team certainly got better defensively, but it was never the typical KU team that could turn it up and get stops for several minutes in a game. I also think the doubling inside was a big mistake when there was no real inside threat, that made no sense to me.
Still a great year for a team that I think overachieved.
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@Barney Personally, I think Self thought that his best option was to just keep doing what the team normally did. That is reasonable too. That we have cut leads before, CBB can shift on a dime, etc. Just some hindsight hypothesizing. Heck, we could have lost by 30 doing some of that stuff. It would have been more risky. He probably just determined it was the best chance to get back in the game – doing what we do. But dying is dying.
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BShark said:
Sometimes Self makes mistakes. Weird I know.
I don’t find mistakes weird.
I find not making obvious adjustments to mistakes weird.
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The first half yes.
The question is: during a half time, why couldn’t a hall of Fame coach just say, play straight up M2M. No tricks. No reads. Silvio, follow Paschal wherever he goes. Mitch, do the same, whenever Silvio needs a blow.
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SIlvio was too green to guard away from the basket.
I will still say that I think with our limited roster Mitch Lightfoot was our only hope defending Nova’s perimeter 5s.
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HighEliteMajor said:
@Barney Personally, I think Self thought that his best option was to just keep doing what the team normally did.
It may be a little more layered than that.
Self appeared to concoct an unusual defense to compensate for Doke’s immobility and for Vick’s inability to cover Bridges alone. Self appeared to bet Paschal wouldn’t beat KU from three, if KU switched a combo guard on to him most of the time and occasionally left him open when the combo guard stayed and helped Vick with Bridges. It was a good gamble until Paschal shot lights out.
To give Self the benefit of the doubt for a moment, he probably gambled that it was better to have Paschal make some treys than for Bridges to run wild on Vick with an adjustment that left Vick more one on one and Paschal more closely guarded by a combo.
But Self had devised a defense that needed more practice than a day or so. As he said in post game, we devised some stuff that looked good in practice but didn’t work under game conditions. That translates to not enough practice to execute the reads for switching to keep Paschal from being left wide open.
But this switching was only necessary to keep Doke in for his dunking, which never materialized because of his knee and because of all the driving without dishing.
So: Silvio and Mitch should have shared the post the last 20, chased Paschal everywhere, left the offense to DG, Malik, Vick and Svi. And we should have been shooting a ton of treys to compensate for our trough game and to exploit Nova blowing cold the second half.
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Guarding Paschal away from the basket was easy. Run out and get a hand in his face. They never ran action for him. And Paschal couldn’t put it on the deck. Guarding outside just takes speed and mobility. Silvio had that. So did Mitch. Either one would have been able, but with Silvio you get offensive rebounding which we also desperately needed in order to get more FGAs to come back.
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@jaybate-1-0 I mentioned this in another thread a while back … how about Duke’s defense they ran on us? Kind of a match-up, guard the line type zone, with four defenders, and then one protector near the hoop. After seeing that from Duke, I thought that would be a nice fit against Nova. Creative. And particularly with one major M2M liability in Doke.
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jaybate 1.0 said:
BShark said:
Sometimes Self makes mistakes. Weird I know.
I don’t find mistakes weird.
I find not making obvious adjustments to mistakes weird.
Self is frequently stubborn.
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Stubbornness is a double-edged sword for sure.
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@jaybate-1.0 In some instances it has served him well. And of course, he has had a lot of success in general.
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Yes, it would have been a good idea. Leaving trey shooters unattended was less so.
I keep coming back to Self’s demeanor after the game. It seemed so unlike him. No one else seems to have noticed anything unusual, however.
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@jaybate-1.0 His demeaner reminded me a bit of VCU, I don’t believe he ever said it himself, but if memory serves it kind of leaked out some time later that the twins (and others) did not follow the scout and just thought their talent would prevail…
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I think that by halftime Bill Self saw the writing on the scoreboard. If not then, by the 30 minute mark. He then opened his mind to the future, to 1918-19. Doke’s weaknesses got exposed. Doke MUST return. DeSousa need not yet absorb such a scorching. I can’t envision Mitch doing much in that contest. I hope to see Mitch get a red shirt if Doke returns. DeSousa will come back hungry and super focused. McCormack (sp?) will earn lots of minutes.
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@REHawk I’m putting the o/u on McCormack’s minutes at 5 per game if Doke comes back.
Doke at a minimum will be playing 20 minutes a game (if not more), Dedric I’d put at 25-30 minutes, Silvio even just as a garbage man is looking at 15 minutes and KJ in some capacity is playing at least 20 minutes a night imo and I would bet at least 15 are at the 4. I just don’t see where his minutes come from if Doke is back and I don’t think he is particularly D1 ready year one.
Long term I really like McCormack though. He’s like a ++ version of Landen Lucas. Below the rim bruiser willing to do the dirty work.
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A small part of me wondered during the game if Self wasn’t committed to Doke the second half having ceded defeat and letting Doke play in front of his mom After all she went through to get here. Self commented before the game that there are some things more important than games.
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Blown said:
A small part of me wondered during the game if Self wasn’t committed to Doke the second half having ceded defeat and letting Doke play in front of his mom After all she went through to get here. Self commented before the game that there are some things more important than games.
Just stating facts!
Self left Doke in the second half against OU and we lost. Doke couldn’t make free throws. Self left Doke in against Villanova and we lost. Doke couldn’t guard.
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@Blown I wondered about the pressure to play Doke for his mom also. It probably was not a huge factor but may have been a small one.
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I highly doubt a coach, any coach would sacrifice the rest of the team and a win just to have a player’s mom watch him play; keep in mind that all players families were likely there. On the other hand, the perception that he did could play well with some of the lesser prospects but perhaps not as much with the top prospects families.
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Silvio’s mom travelled in from Angola. Maybe Bill was mad at Silvio and didn’t want him to play in front of his mom? Or maybe the moms didn’t have anything to do with it and Bill simply thought Dok gave Kansas the best shot to win.
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@JayHawkFanToo I said a small factor. I am sure Bill thought Doke was our best option, many here do not agree, we will never now if playing different might have helped. KU might have gotten beaten buy 40 playing another way, who knows.
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“We want to win the game, but is winning the game more important than to make sure there’s not a little distraction for Doke? Of course not.
Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/university-of-kansas/article207345084.html#storylink=cpy
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May have been subliminal.
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Anyone else wonder why Villanova shot 18 (or 19) 3 pointers before we took our first one??
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Gunman said:
Self left Doke in the second half against OU and we lost. Doke couldn’t make free throws. Self left Doke in against Villanova and we lost. Doke couldn’t guard.
We won many with him in late too, but your remark was worth noting.
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nuleafjhawk said:
Anyone else wonder why Villanova shot 18 (or 19) 3 pointers before we took our first one??
This was the nub of it all.
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@Blown interesting hypothesis.
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I think some of it was they guarded the 3 line and worked to make us uncomfortable. We had shots but not free and clear shots in offensive rhythm.
But perhaps there was an element of we would beat them inside philosophy tied to a “they can’t hit them all” line of reasoning.
nuleafjhawk said:
Anyone else wonder why Villanova shot 18 (or 19) 3 pointers before we took our first one??
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@Bwag To my best memory, KU really didn’t shoot well against any team that pressured the guards. Look at all of the big losses.
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@Barney KU was an easy scout. Don’t leave Svi open in the corner, pressure the guards 10ft past the three point line to disrupt the offense, and deny Devonte the ball as much as possible.
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Here’s what I think the plan was going Into the game. First 10 shots by KU all Dok - 8/10 for 16 points cause who’s gonna stop him? And Nova hits their average as well and makes 4/10 threes for 12 points.
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@Barney exactly true. Maybe the WVU games were an exception, but that then was something we spent significant practice time on beating.
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@Bwag We really just pulled out the first 2 against WV.
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I was a big critic of the F4 loss, but Nova destroying Michigan (who played pretty good defense) gave me some perspective.
Pressuring players way outside he perimeter isn’t just a tactic. It’s a domination strategy. It’s like saying “we will win in the trenches” in football. Or “let’s play a 2-4-4 formation” in soccer. Ability to pressure like that out on the perimeter is a special thing that not every team could do. The 2008 team could do that, but they were Bartovik’s 2nd strongest team all time, behind one of the Kentucky teams.
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I think it was Self just trying to buy some last second favor from the NCAA lol
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@HighEliteMajor :”remember the YMCA defense”, ha…you just reminded some of us about the 2013 season…its ok…
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I also agree that Doke should have played 5-10 minutes this game. Silvio should have played the entire game probably. Maybe put Mitch in there, but he can’t really drive it yet either.
We still lose in this game.
