Maybe the Two Most Frequent Causes of KU Player Underperformance
jaybate 1.0 last edited by jaybate 1.0
- Guys over-corrected to the point of over-thinking.
We saw this last season with Andrew Wiggins. There came a point where Self said he had to let Andrew be Andrew and quit trying to make him a more emotional player. Andrew began playing more and thinking less about how he was playing. We see it repeated with Cliff Alexander. Self is a perfectionist from the Henry Iba School of Perfectionism. Its a hazard of the coaching style that in “coaching’em up” you can foul them up to the point of not being able to do what they ARE good at, too. We are probably near to an admission by Self that Wayne Selden may have to go back to his old shooting form, and quit thinking so much, also.
- Unreported injuries.
This recurs like that feed you posted of Self pounding the advertising board during the OU game. Tyrel Reed goes inexplicably from a 46% trey shooter his junior season to a 38% trey shooter; then it surfaces he needed a bone spur removed surgically from his foot. EJ’s outside shooting falls way off his junior season, then we find out he has a shoulder separation. EJ’s mobility falls way off his senior year, then we find out he has not recovered from his knee surgery. Kelly struggles early, then we learn he has been wearing a knee wrap hidden under knee lingerie for months. Cliff struggles then we find he has sore legs. Now, Jamari suddenly falls waaaaaaay off from his recent uptick in performance; now we learn he has a hip flexor injury.
Though we live in a probabilistic, even quantum reality, at certain realms, effects still have causes.
@jaybate-1.0 Totally off topic but comparing coaching styles of Henry Iba and Larry Brown and Roy Williams, who do you think Coach Self took more from? And, wouldn’t you also classify Self as being under the original coaching tree of Naismith and Phog allen via Larry Brown and Roy Williams?
JayHawkFanToo last edited by
It depends on how you define a coaching three.
Self payed for Paul Hansen’s Oklahoma State Cowboys and his first coaching job was at KU under Larry Brown when he replaced Calipari, who moved to an assistant coaching position at Pittsburgh. He then went back to Oklahoma State under Leonard Hamilton, followed by Eddie Sutton. He never coached under Roy Williams so it would be a stretch to indicate that Williams was an influence. Like wise with Hank Iba. Sutton was an assistant coach under Iba for one seasons and then he went to develop his own style elsewhere and came back to Oklahoma State 30 years later or 20 years after Iba retired. Iba and Self were and are big fans of playing tough man-to-man defense and Iba favored slowing down the game; of course during his tenure the NCCA had no shot clock. Other than that, Sutton likely had more influence on Self than Iba. Much like Sutton, Self has developed his own system and it would hard to pinpoint if any one coach had a big influence. Just my opinion.
jaybate 1.0 last edited by
This is such a great question and it will take me some time to respond. But I will.
Blown last edited by
Blown last edited by
@jaybate-1.0 And then there are those such as Perry who over think, and those such as B.G. who don’t think. I prefer to be a thinker myself, but all too often get caught up in over analyzing and find it difficult to cease and modify the behavior. Caused me a lot of trouble on the basketball court and negated my speed and athleticism.
drgnslayr last edited by drgnslayr
I think some of our guys over-think. But here is the deal… I don’t want to give any of these guys a crutch to stand on. Basketball is a competitive sport and should be based on players’ desires. There are guys who play through a lot worse stuff than our guys have to deal with (I’m thinking TRob and his loss).
Injuries plague all players. They will never be much if they can’t learn to play through most injuries. That is an area of sports that should be discussed more. The guys with the most desire lift their threshold for pain tolerance and often turn a hampering injury into a positive by playing through the pain and having added adrenaline. I’ll never forget seeing Isiah Thomas’ ankle swollen to the size of a large grapefruit and he went for what… 25 points in that quarter of the playoffs!
Playing through pain is something all athletes have to deal with and there aren’t many (or any) top athletes that fold up easily. We should be looking closer at these guys (beyond concussions) to see when they are making too big of risks for the moment. Self often brings guys back too soon… and all of us frown at that, but Self is a tough hombre and he understands the dynamics involved. Players often make gigantic performance leaps after they conquer their “pain fears.” They pick up tons of confidence in themselves, for pushing through a tough situation and making hay. So it turns out that playing through some pains can bring gigantic rewards… but without question, the risks need to be studied closely!
wrwlumpy last edited by
@drgnslayr Willis Reed.
I think Devonte coming back so quickly might have saved our season. Mari finally gets into the starting line up, then has a hip pointer, he doesn’t realize that keeping quiet can hurt the team. If he’s ready to play, let him play. If only everyone on the team had his energy.
drgnslayr last edited by
"Willis Reed. "
If I could LIKE your post a million times, I’d do it!
If BamBam comes to Austin in the right frame of mind, he can leave that town being MVP of the game where we stomp Texas! An active BamBam on offense is a nightmare for Ridley and for Turner. It’s all about him bringing the ENERGY and running his offense in motion. Few can stop his drives where he finishes off to the side off the backboard. He could draw a lot of fouls!
Please, please… Kansas Jayhawk Players… please use some shot fakes in this game! Texas can be prone to fouls. Draw the fouls, put them in trouble, and hit your FTs and leave Texas with a “W!”
@drgnslayr Seriously! Shot fake!!
@Blown Nah, your right, Roy is not really tied to Coach Self in that way. Only that they both coached here and learned from Larry Brown.
JayHawkFanToo last edited by
Sorry Lulu but Williams did not coach under Larry Brown either; he was an assistant to Dean Smith before coming to Kansas.
KJD last edited by KJD
The problem this year does not seem to be over thinking. The problem seems to be retention and confidence to run the system. Sure, you need a skill set to execute the system. It sure would help to understand the complexity of the plan and have experience running in the system during conference play.
Repetition is great. Repetition is the way you can let go and play with a free mind. With such a young team I don’t expect to see a crew of wise, free minds running Bill Self Ball cohesively as a unit-not this early in the season. It’s college ball and we get to watch kids get an education.
bskeet last edited by bskeet
who do you think Coach Self took more from?
I think Hansen was a big influence because Self play under him and you have to believe that playing in a system will leave some residue forever.
Next, I think Larry Brown was a big influence because that was his first coaching job and Self was probably a sponge at that stage.
Next would be Hamilton and Sutton. I’m not sure which one had more influence here, but Sutton would be the favorite pick because of the pedigree reaching back to Iba.
BTW, I connect Self to Phog thus: Self coached for Brown; Brown played for Dean Smith; Dean Smith played for Phog.
@JayHawkFanToo Hey thanks dude, I got my coaching trees tangled up a bit