New teammate for Wiggy
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@truehawk93 You may think it would be silly to trade Wiggins for Love, but remember Cleveland is a town that hasn’t seen a championship in any sport in like 50 years. If you have LeBron, who I don’t think anyone would argue is the best player on the planet right now, you try and do everything you can to win in the window you have him. I don’t think that’s silly.
And waiting for Love to hit the open market on the presumption he’s going to the Cavs is the kind of front office optimism that just sunk Miami. There will be many suitors and many who will likely be able to offer more. And in the interim you risk him being traded to Golden State or some other team that he really likes and re-signs there.
I’m not one who is advocating such a trade. In fact, I’m 100% hoping that trade doesn’t happen, because he has a better chance to win in Cleveland and the TWolves are garbage. But a lot of people need to take their crimson & blue colored glasses off and ask yourself if you’re the Cleveland GM, where winning just one championship would make you a god in that town, do you not pull out all the stops?
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Reading that LeBron signed only for two years raises a few red flags. To me it means that he wanted a place where he could park his game for two years and get top dollar while waiting for the next TV contract, which will raise the cap by quite a bit, and then sign his final 5 year contract for an insane amount of money with whatever team wins the next LeBron sweepstakes; after all he is 30 years old and thinking about his future. Cleveland was a convenient spots that allowed him to create lots of good will.
While he could be considered the best active basketball player, he is also one of the most disliked celebrities. Going to Cleveland for 2 years was a masterful move, which now appears a little more selfish than it did before.
Same for Carmelo. As much as he kept saying he wanted to play for a contender, in the end he chose the money. Most every other team that pursued him was/is in better position to contend but not all could offer the money the Knicks could and he opted to take the money.
Now, if you are the Cavs GM you have to ask what will happen in two years? Will LeBron resign or will he takes his talents to a higher bidder? Love is in the same situation Dwight Howard was and he went to the Lakers, played for one year and then he was gone. Love will likely not sign an extended contract with Cleveland unless he has assurances that LeBron will be there for more than two years. At this point, no team will touch him unless he agrees to a contract extension, so he has de-facto veto power over any potential trade; the Howard situation created a precedent that most teams are likely not willing to address.
In short, I believe the Cavs keep Wiggins since he represents the long term future. The Cavs will try to get Love, but I don’t believe Wiggins will be part of the trade in the same way that the Warriors were unwilling to give up Klay Thompson; they do have several other players the would let go before they do Wiggins.
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Most of our concern is for Wiggins future, as how he does will for a while reflect on KU. And he is a great kid. Yes, I will be a Cavs fan if LBJ went back there, especially if they keep Wiggins.
What I’d love to see is Wiggins stay in Cleveland and play at the 2, and be a 6’8 quiet-professional Kawhi Leonard type of player, whose offense develops without pressure, as he plays lockdown-D alongside the star-attention LBJ will get. Whereas in Minnesote, he’d be thrown to the wolves, and have to be the supastar from day 1, maybe he is ready for that, I’m not certain…
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A big loser in all this is the Heat, Pat Riley, and DWade. Suddenly, DWade is on the outside, looking in…he is damaged goods. I dont think my man DWade can carry a team anymore, nor is it wise for him to try. Knees dont just miraculously turn into 22-yr-old-knees again. DWade is now a role player, at best. At worst, he is a role player that cannot turn it “on”, as he had nothing/zero/nada/zilch in crunchtime.
Stated another way: DWade was the NBA’s highest FG% guard this past season. It used to be he was somewhat of a “volume shooter” back in his heyday. But now that he’s taking less shots, and hitting more, its OK…until the night that you face a determined defender, and your shots arent dropping–> what to do? Got to turn on the “volume shooter” approach, but he couldnt. Explosiveness of the blow-by is gone. Defensively struggling. Was painful to watch…just as this is painful to summarize right now, talking about one of my favorite NBA players of the last 10yrs. I wish DWade the best in all this, hope he lands on a team that can maximize whatever he has left to give…
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@JayHawkFanToo I read that about his contract too. A couple of things. First, I don’t think it makes him come off as selfish. Did you know that until this year with the Cavs he had never even been the highest paid player on his own team? To be in the league 12 years or whatever it has been and for that to just now be the case for him is ridiculous. If in 2 years he’s still the best player in the league, I wouldn’t have a problem with him commanding another max contract.
As for if I’m the Cavs GM, I wouldn’t have to worry about him taking his talents to the highest bidder because I would be the highest bidder. I’d make sure we had the cap room to offer him the max if that’s what he wanted.
Regarding trading for Love, some of these teams crack me up. I’ve read differing reports on whether Golden State was willing to give up Klay Thompson or whether it was something else that stalled that deal, but say it was that Golden State didn’t want to give him up…are you kidding me? Klay freakin’ Thompson? I see this in baseball a lot. Teams expecting the trade deadline sellers to just hand over their best players but they don’t want to give up their best prospects in return. To get talent you usually have to part ways with something you’d rather keep. No one is just going to take your trash for Kevin Love! It is for this reason that I believe the Love to Cleveland deal will only get done if they include Wiggins. Pretending to be Flip Saunders, there’s no way I can get excited about Dion Waiters or Tristan Thompson, nor can I sell that return to the Minnesota fans. Maybe if the market dries up for Love and they get desperate to move him or lose him, but way too early and still multiple suitors for them to consider such a meager offer from Cleveland (especially considering that now that they have LeBron, all their 1st round picks they’ve been stockpiling have substantially reduced value. Instead of those being lottery picks, they’re now likely early to mid 20s).
Lastly regarding Wiggins himself, it remains to be seen just how good he’ll be in the NBA. Say his outside shot never improves. Or his handles. Then he’s still a very good player - great in transition and the ability to be a great defender. But in that scenario he’s not the future of the franchise. Superstardom is not guaranteed. How many thought Ben McLemore was going to bust onto the NBA with a splash? Instead he struggled, even with his shot. For someone who was compared to Ray Allen in having one of the most pure shots in the game, this illustrates that nothing is guaranteed. Now is Wiggins on another level? We think so; I think so. I think he has the best chance of anyone Self has put into the league. But perhaps we should wait and see him play a few games…
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@ralster Agree on your assessment of Wade.
While following the LeBron free agency saga something that was mentioned a time or two was the idea of the Heat acquiring another capable 2-guard and transitioning DWade to a Manu Ginobili type role to try and maintain a couple more years of effectiveness from him. That was quickly seen as not practical when they were assumed to be re-signing LeBron, as they wouldn’t have the cap space to acquire someone the caliber they would need to move Wade into that role. Now though without the LBJ max contract to deal with, perhaps they have that flexibility, although at least for this off-season I don’t know that there are any 2-guards of that caliber left (or if there were ever any to begin with for that matter), but perhaps down the line that may still be in the works.
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And just a little bit more good news regarding Wiggins staying in Cleveland:
This also confirms what I’ve been saying, and that Minnesota isn’t making the deal without Wiggins.
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@icthawkfan316 Solid synopsis on all of this, agree with everything. Of course as I contemplate a 2guard replacement…I think of our KU guys in the League, but Rush nor McLemore have the handles that DWade has. DWade in his prime could pull up anywhere within 10 feet for a high%finish, or could change direction on a dime, still getting to the rim & finishing from any angle. BMac and Rush do not possess such handles. Wayne Selden & Marcus Smart would do well to study film of what 05-11 DWade did against NBA bigs in the paint, it was amazing to watch. But a 6’4-6’5 guy needs tight handles and a change of direction to do all that. Things beyond the classic2 mold of just a pretty shot.
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@ralster DWade in his prime is easily one of the 5 best 2-guards in the history of the league. Maybe #3 after Jordan & Kobe. Even despite my souring on some of his dirty tactics the past few years, I still count myself lucky to have watched the guy play.
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" However if the Cavs keep Wiggins, with this Lebron decision. I will be buying a CAVS Jersey."
Me, too! It would be the first piece of NBA-licensed gear I ever bought!
“I would think for a guy like Andrew, to have the opportunity to play with arguably one of the best players of all time, and to learn from him and to be tutored by him and to play alongside him – which he will – I gotta think that’s a tremendous boost to his confidence.” – Cavaliers coach David Blatt
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This also confirms what I said that the Cavs will not trade Wiggins.
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Wow!
LeBron just signed with Adidas!
http://www2.kusports.com/news/2014/jul/13/lebron_james_signs_nike_big_spoofarina/
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Other KU related NBA news. Hinrich re-ups with the Bulls and Pierce is headed to Washington.
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@JayHawkFanToo Mario resigned, 2 yrs.
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Mario sign 2 year deal with Miami…
I wonder if he had to take a pay cut from his $4M per year contract.
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@Crimsonorblue22 Sorry Crimson, I did not see your post.
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Check out this dunk from Wiggins in warm-ups:
P.S. What’s the key to getting the links properly posted? Right now it’s just copy & paste guys. Sorry!
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@drgnslayr Dude he didn’t sign with Adidas? Or are just trying to get Jaybate’s goat?
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Story on Tarik, classy as always!
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I was going for everyone’s goat.
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Dude, I’m a goat-free board rat.
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@Crimsonorblue22 Man though, that reporter teed it up for him to throw a shout-out and props to KU and instead he lumped us in with Memphis (“two top notch programs” ).
Major faux pas Tarik!
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@JayHawkFanToo Regarding Mario’s deal, Marc Stein is reporting it’s in the $8 mil range ($4 mil/year), so if that’s accurate no pay cut.
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This is how you do it:
You will notice that there are several icons on the top line of the response:
Select the one highlighted ion yellow and you will see:
You will notice that the line has two parts surrounded by square brackets and parentheses.
Now, replace the text of the first part “link text” with whatever name you want to assign to the link, and replace the second part “link url” with the actual link. Be sure to leave the square brackets and parentheses in place.
The resulting line should look like:
In your post, the link will look like:
And that’s all there is to…
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Mario is also being projected as the starting PG for the upcoming season. As far as the Heat, replacing Hasslem with McRoberts is an upgrade. Replacing James with Deng and Grainger is yet to be determined. If they sign Wade, then they have three starting players coming back, one upgrade and one unknown. Depending on how much they pay Wade, they might be able to bring one more quality forward and be in decent shape…not bad considering that they had pretty much nothing a few days ago
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@JayHawkFanToo Thanks for the link posting tutorial. I was close at one time, as I would get blue “clickable” text, but it would never take you anywhere.
The Heat have done about as good a job as could be expected in recovering, especially considering how they kind of got shafted by LeBron’s waiting period. Many players they might have targeted were already off the board and signed, and they were too late to get in on many others (like Pau Gasol). Not sure how wise it was to pay Bosh what they did. They probably wouldn’t have signed Granger at all had they known they had the LeBron money to play with. Gotta wonder if they would have bothered trading up to get Napier. McRoberts is a nice piece, an upgrade over whoever - Birdman, Haslem, Rashard Lewis.
All that being said, I can’t see them being all that close to last year’s team unless Wade dips his legs in the fountain of youth.
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If Napier develops quickly, I can see Mario sliding into the SG slot and taking minutes from Wade.
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@Crimsonorblue22 Class act all around. He was easily my favorite player on the team last year and it’s not even close!
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The Knicks re-signed Aldrich and The Wizards re-signed Gooden for 1 year. I believe all current KU NAB players are accounted for. I have no Information on Tyshawn that last season played, and had a good showing in the Development League or Selby who bounced around Eastern Europe for the last couple of years.
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Riles did exactly what he should have done. After I read up on Cav owner Gilbert and his Rock holdings, no one can dare compete with him until the next crash, maybe not even then. Gilbert is an EMPIRE builder of scary vision and integration.
Riles got Napier and Mario locked in and next drives down Bosh and Wade’s salaries. Next he positions for the next super center, or retires.
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@HawkInMizery did u get married yet?
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@JayHawkFanToo rush signed w/warriors and X Henry hasn’t signed yet.
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How can I miss them? Indeed, Rush has a one year contract with one additional year option he can exercise.
It looks like the Bulls and Pacers, in addition to the Lakers, are interested in Henry who is only 22 years old and had his best season with the Lakers, although injuries limited his playing time.
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I’m practicing linking text and adding photos, etc…
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@drgnslayr Looks like you have the procedure figured out. I can’t wait to hear the comments on the article…lol
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@JayHawkFanToo Multiple sources now reporting the Cavs willing to trade Wiggins to get Love.
Bummer!!!
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@drgnslayr practice makes perfect
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@icthawkfan316 wiggins and Tarik playing now.
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I saw that. ESPN had a roundtable of writers and all but one thought Cleveland should not trade Wiggins for Love…but then, the Cavs have a long history of bad decisions.
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@JayHawkFanToo I saw that too. On their website their 5-on-5 article all 5 said they should make the trade. The Grantland article had perhaps the best arguments I’ve seen for keeping him. The article was by the Grantland staff, and they were split about 50-50 on making the trade.
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Hypothesis: Wigs and adidas want out of Cleveland and LBJ’s shoe market shadow. Next.
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I read both and I still believe Cleveland should hold on to Wiggins. Superstars have not always gotten a Championship (Barkley, Ewing, Malone); however, regardless of the supporting cast they usually made the playoffs; in six seasons The Timber Wolfs have missed the playoffs every year. Here is an article that nicely outlines the situation:
I am not convinced on well the LeBron-Love combination would work. Kevin Love is commonly referred as a “stats stuffer” more interested in padding his personal statistics than advancing the cause of the team; also, his defense is sub-par and offers no rim protection like other comparable players do. Of course, it worked OK in Minnesota where he was the alpha dog, but in Cleveland with LeBron and Irving, two renown ball hogs, i am not sure if there are enough plays to satisfy all three.
As I said before, Cleveland has a long history of making bad decisions and this is a s big a decision as they come.
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@jaybate 1.0
Embiid signed with Adidas. The conspiracy continues…
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@icthawkfan316 Since Cavs have not signed Wiggins yet, what would happen if, say, Wiggins’ agent got him a decent contract overseas for a year? Would T’wolves make the deal? If so, for how long would they hold the rights to Wiggins? With no contract, could Wiggins make some money this year in Europe and get re-drafted next year?
Having signed with adidas, would he even be able to sign with a Euroleague team?
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@EdwordL These are good questions that I don’t have the answers to. I’m not sure how long Cleveland would retain Wiggins’ rights should he go overseas, and if Wiggins contract with Adidas is contingent on him playing in the states.
It would also be pretty unprecedented for a North American player to bypass the NBA as a rookie for a gig overseas. Not sure how viable that really is, but it would be interesting if nothing else.
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@JayHawkFanToo Thanks for the link. Good read.
Yeah I’ve been saying for quite awhile (see six days ago on this very thread in a response to HEM) that Love hasn’t made the playoffs and that he is a stat stuffer, so you don’t have to sell me on those points.
As I said on another thread, I think the best course of action is to let this play out a bit. See how LeBron AND Wiggins mesh with the team. If after 30 games or so it is apparent that the one thing missing is a guy like Love, then you make the trade. It’s all about winning that elusive championship, so if that’s what needs to be done…so be it. But at least take the time to find out what you have with this team before shaking it up again.
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I posted just about the exact same thing in a different thread. I don’t believe it would be an issue with Adidas. they rule Europe in soccer and signing Wiggins to play BBAll there would be the greatest coup ever; it would be the equivalent of having the best European soccer prospect come to play in the MSL. It most certainly would throw a monkey wrench in the Cavs plans.
At this point the process is like a chess match where teams need to look not just at the next move a but a few moves ahead. having a good agent is crucial and can make all the difference; helpfully Wiggins has a chess-master of an agent…
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@JayHawkFanToo I’ve said before the only NBA I watch are teams of Jhawks and the playoffs. If many think Lebron would be a great mentor to Wigs, what if your theories are true that he doesn’t want wigs there, for whatever reason? Does he treat Wigs(19) worse than he did Mario? Since Lebron is running the show, could he make wigs life miserable?
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@Crimsonorblue22 I’m with you on watching only teams with Jayhawks on the roster - and honestly, I rarely watch more than a couple of minutes then. I just don’t like the pro game.
It makes no difference to me WHERE Wiggins winds up - I’ll watch two or three minutes of those games and then move on to Survivorman or something.
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I am not sure how that would work out. Mario was a lot more outspoken where Andrew is the quiet type. On the other hand, Mario was a second round pick with a small contract, limited potential and no leverage, who in many ways has overachieved ; Andrew on the other hand is the top pick with a huge upside and a lot of leverage.
As I said before, LeBron’s move to Cleveland was a calculated business decision that he spun into a favorable publicity stunt in an effort to improve public perception. He might be the best active player and one of the more popular players as well but he is also one of the more disliked players.
On a similar note, looks like the Warriors are willing to trade Klay Thompson…go figure…
