Diallo/Bragg Vs. Top 25 Recruits & Cutting The Rotation
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Does it matter to anyone if one player for KU only wants to raise his nba stock and another will do anything to help his team?
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There’s a tear in my eye. That’s the most credit you’ve given to Coach in three years. Yes I agree, he has put together a fine bunch of players.
Also, did you ever notice that if you are a top recruit at the Three position that you will start at Kansas as a Freshman. Jeff W. was a transfer Bench warmer. Cole Aldrich sat on the bench and finally got to play in the second to last game of the National Championship. JoJo was the only one.
Speaking of practice, Petro, on Friday was talking about being at a Jayhawk practice. The “Aw Shucks”, Will Rogers, happy, family friendly, Okie routine goes out the window and Bill Self become more of a Frank Martin than Frank Martin. Practice standards seem to be a high priority for the Coach and probably a good indicator of who should and who shouldn’t be getting big “Trust” minutes.
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@Crimsonorblue22 Would it be like comparing Xavier Henry vs Thomas Robinson?
Overall I think any kid that plays college ball has a dream of getting to the NBA and wants to improve their stock to do so. But those guys that get what “team” really is, be it OADs or 4 year guys are special to have.
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KC Star 2014
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@jaybate-1.0 - you are so resourceful, whether or not you involve in writing a book or not. Thanks for the guidance.
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Great post, @HighEliteMajor - it’s pretty sad that PER is not being considered when choosing which player should be on the floor. Your point #3: “Self is having issues playing post players that make mistakes and who need that trial by fire to develop” is still not obvious to me whether it’s D or O mistakes. Diallo was left alone - he took a J, it’s short. He made the right call, I think. Coach might’ve taught the opposite. But I hope he won’t get benched because of that. Getting comfortable (thus, player’s confidence) in shooting in a game is very important. The only way to improve his confident level is in a real game. Now, I’m not so sure how to improve his D by just watching from the bench. I would think it’s a fundamental and has been repeated through practices. A simulation - as JB suggested - would really prepare him.
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@wrwlumpy said:
Also, did you ever notice that if you are a top recruit at the Three position that you will start at Kansas as a Freshman.
Position is a crucial driver on when high ceilinged players can quickly learn to perform at a D1 level and when they cannot.
Either front court position in a high low means an OAD not only has to have strength, and basketball skills, to go with high ceilinged athleticism, but also requires a player be able to deal with enforcers using intimidation and cheap shotting that can be XTRemely dangerous to a young person physically and/or mentally that is not savvy enough and mean enough to protect themselves.
In the High Low, Self can, if he has a strong front court, scope the role of 2, or 3, to limit how much a 2, or 3, has to go up against the blue meanies. Sometimes he protects them, as he did with Xavier, and sometimes the players handlers appear to limit the amount of risk the player is willing to take, as appeared the case with Andrew Wiggins. Other times, as with Josh Selby, Self appears to say this guy is ready to go to the rim almost from the first tip.
In the High Low, there is no protecting a 4, or a 5, from the blue meanies. They are there in the paint and guarding Self’s freshman 4s and freshman 5s seeming more and more frequently and more and more aggressively as the season progresses. It has been a VERY, VERY tough game in the paint during the Self tenure. Self’s philosophy of play it any way they want means Self really cannot protect 4s and 5s on the floor from opponents that choose to play in a highly aggressive and physical way. Self’s 4s and 5s, be they freshmen, or fifth year seniors, have to play man 2 man defense and have to knock blue meanies off spots on defense, and on offense they have to fight for spots and fight to stay on them. Absolutely crushing forearm smashes, and face punches, and throws to the floor, and so on occur at a level of intensity and degree of aggressiveness that todays OADs that have not grown up in play ground ball have even a clue about how to both protect themselves from, and skillfully counter attack, and on occasion preemptively attack. Anyone that watches the game for awhile in the paint knows that it frankly takes guys with almost a football level of aggressiveness to play front court in D1. To send green bean poles like Carlton Bragg and Cheick Diallo on to the floor against 3rd, 4th and 5th year blue meanies that being sent out to intimidate them, because they ARE green, and then to actually hurt them, if they prove that they can handle the intimidation…“is a sin, Mr. Finch. Its a sin to kill a mocking bird, that’s what it is.” And sending green OADs, especially those with high ceilings, that didn’t grow up tough on the play grounds to play against 3rd, 4th and 5th year guys that often did grow up on the playgrounds, and are playing not because they are so talented, but because they know how to break up an opposing team’s rhythm with physical play; that’s a sin in my book.
Self is a coach. A coach is a teacher. Teachers are not supposed to teach quantum mechanics to 17 year olds that have not even had a solid calculus course, regardless of how high the kid’s IQ is. Kids need some foundation courses to do well in higher level courses, even if they are smart. Basketball is the same, only more so, because the blue meanies don’t just laugh at you for not being able to hold a spot. They start going through you. And if you go down to the other end and use your athleticism to score a basket over them, as guys with high ceilings, like Diallo, often can do, them the forearm smashes and stiff screens follow. And if you are really good like Joel Embiid, pretty soon you are up ended and floored on your most vulnerable regions. Joel Embiid did not know how to protect himself from the blue meanies, because he had not grown up on a playground playing the game that way. It doesn’t make any difference how high one’s ceiling is, or even how high one’s foundation is, if you don’t know how to keep your nose from being pushed out the back of your head, or don’t know how to shield yourself from a forearm smash to the wind pipe, or how to strike preemptively in a way that makes the blue meanie say, “Okay, that’s it for the rough stuff from me,” then you are just a medical red shirt waiting to happen, or worse.
Out at the 3, or 2, or 1, you can get hurt driving, and you can catch a stiff screen, and the guys that sharpen their finger nails and scratch corneas for fun, they can get you out there, too, but its not an every play risk. And its easier for point guards and wings to run away from trouble, because the position rarely devolves to a muscling contest the way it does in front court.
To me it makes sense that point guards and wings can more often step in and be 20-30 mpg types. And mostly not get stunted. But does anyone remember how Tyshawn ran from contact his freshman and sophomore seasons on back side drives? It took forever for him to work up the courage and strength to go inside where the blue meanies where.
This is one helluva tough game–D1 college basketball–and it gets a lot tougher in the NBA.
And there are some guys that are ready to rock and roll from the very beginning. You remember some of these guys from your high school. They looked 25 years old when they were 18. But mostly guys that were 18 looked like they were 17 and often had about as much moxie as 16 year olds.
If I were Carlton Bragg’s and Cheick Diallo’s parents, I would almost be kissing Bill Self’s hand right now for keeping these two pipe cleaners out of harms way as much as he has been.
Think about it a second.
The averages @HighEliteMajor gave us don’t tell us a thing about any one specific case’s abilities to start and play 20-30 mpg as freshmen.
The averages are by definition composed of the guys that can and the guys that cannot. The averages include the guys that are playing because their coaches have no one as good, or no alternative at all, and the guys that actually would play even if the coach had some alternatives. The averages include everything.
The average tells us that out of all these guys, there is strong probability that your guy could be one of the guys that can do it, and a lesser probability that he is one of those that cannot.
This is the point where the coach’s judgement has to be trusted, or the coach needs to be fired and replaced.
Since Self has started and played several OADs, while limiting and protecting the minutes of others, I have to think that Self has no bias against starting OADs that are ready.
And looking at the way Bragg and Diallo play so far, and given that they play in the front court, I’m thinking maybe these two guys really aren’t ready to be 20-30 mpg players and that Self, the players and we are lucky we have some older guys that can keep Self from having to do to Bragg and Diallo, what he felt he had to do with Perry Ellis. OMG! Think of the difference between Perry Ellis as a senior and Perry Ellis as a freshman. The guy started some and played a ton of minutes, but there was no amount of minutes Perry could have played as a freshman that would have “developed” him into the player he is this season.
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I know board rats worry about Jamari playing a lot, because neither his line score, nor more complicated indices like @HighEliteMajor’s mentioned PER, suggest the Jam Tray is very productive.
But…
It appears to me that Self is already ahead of the curve on Jamari.
Jamari plays about as many minutes against the types of players he should be expected to play against, as one should logically expect.
Jamari plays a lot against short mobile bigs, whom he is well suited to guard, and who are guys that our highly athletic perimeter guys can rebound against to pick up the slack in Jamari’s rebounding ability.
Against the long centers, Jamari tends to play much less, unless one of our long guys is fouled up, sick, injured, suspended, or just stinking up the court. But Self does bring Jamari in against those long centers a few times apparently just to take them out of their comfort zones briefly, and maybe make them run a bit more. I like that.
Against the older centers that are tough guys, prison bodies, and XTReme Muscle types, whether long or short, Self has a tough call. His high ceilings–Diallo and Bragg–will get him more productivity than some of his low ceilings, but he has to look at himself in the mirror the next day. Self has to ask himself: is it okay to squeeze out some extra points and rebounds and risk the potential season ending, or career ending injury of Bragg and Diallo at the hands of these mugs?
It appears to me that Self has a pretty hard and fast rule and ethic about injury risk.
Self doesn’t appear to think its right to send green kids into situations where they are to young, inexperienced and weak to defend themselves from the violence.
At the same time, once a player is mature enough to take care of himself, Self appears to think that injury is a part of the game and that if you get injured , when you are mature enough to take the risk of injury, you damned well better take the injury risk and play through injury if you possibly can, even if it triggers a shortened career.
I tell board rats: Self is a hard man about injury, but it appears he has a just code about it, whether I agree with it, or not.
Take Jamari Traylor right now. It is pretty clear to me that he is injured again in the legs. He moves around the floor now like a guy that has lost most of his pop. Remember how explosive he was his first two non redshirt seasons? He was quite awesome at times.The first few games he showed a little explosiveness. But now he does not come close to the kind of explosiveness he showed routinely his first two seasons.
It seems to me that Jamari could benefit from sitting for a month or two and hopefully getting some explosiveness back for March. And Self has enough depth to sit him. But Self’s reasoning seems to be that injured, or not, each guys is pencilled into a role on the team for a season. If you can, playing injured, fulfill that particular role, then man up and play injured. Its is a players role that is so vital in Self’s system. Self creates a team that is a bunch of roles. Players are supposed to staff and perform those roles. Jamari’s role is to guard short, mobile centers. Scoring and rebounding is icing. It was like this with Sasha Kaun when he had no knees left his last two seasons. His role was to guard the long post. Scoring and rebounding were icing. Both Jamari and Sasha could fill their roles with while injured; that was all that mattered. Fans worry that Jam and Sasha can’t do much else but their narrow role, but Self doesn’t. Self figures if he can get that role fulfilled, the other players can do the other things he needs. Self runs into real problems only when he has to ask other players to take over Jam’s and Sasha’s roles; that creates a ripple effect throughout the team’s individual roles that Self has to juggle and keep juggling to make work. Self knows if an injured player can keep fulfilling a narrow role, it means everyone else gets to keep doing their roles at a high level.
To me, Self has already narrowed the scope of Jamari’s role before the season started. All that happened was that in pre conference, there were quite a few opponents that either had short, mobile bigs (Aztecs), or that had big tough experienced bigs (i.e., Costello), so Jam played quite a bit.
I expect Jam to play some against Gathers, because Gathers is one tough cookie that could easily bully Diallo into being a fouled up mess, and could bang both Hunter and Landen off spots. I suspect Landen will be our best bet against Gathers, but playing all of C5 him will absolutely help keep him off balance, and so I expect them all to play again. We don’t have a single guy that can shut Gathers down. Keep making him adjust to new kinds of defenders and offenders is the best way to contain him.
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@jaybate-1.0 Mari played pretty good at Baylor last year against their zone. Pretty sure.
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@DinarHawk well, I’m not at practice to see if they are or not.
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@Bwag I’m not either, but I know that from what Coach Self says and what I see in the games, and I see that Diallo and Bragg are not adjusted defensively to what Self wants and Divison 1 ball.
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@DinarHawk Braggs been overall decent. I don’t have a problem with him being pulled out of the game to receive coaching on the sideline. What I don’t like to see is to completely abandon him PT wise. His upside is too great to sit.
Cheick is still green. But elsewhere, I think HEM posted the Player Efficiency Ratings of those two and they surpass JT.
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@Bwag What I am referring to is about Diallo’s inability to play solid defense without fouling and proper defense positioning, both of which he struggles with. As others have said, the NCAA did not do him any favors by not allowing him to play in the exhibitions and the first five games, which could have helped him to be more comfortable.
I saw those numbers that HEM posted, but I care more about what I see, and I see him a little slow to react and confused occasionally. Now it isn’t bad or something that he can’t improve on, but he is not there yet. My point is that Self says he is not there yet, which implies he makes defensive errors in practice also. As the season goes along, like Self said, he will get better and hopefully make an impact for us in the tournament.
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@DinarHawk maybe I’d say he thinks and doesn’t react naturally. The last foul he got was exactly what you are talking about. The steal was there, but he didn’t react, he thought about it and was called for a foul.
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@DinarHawk you won’t get much argument from me on Diallo. He was definitely put behind in development not playing out of the gate.
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I am not sure how many people on this site have changed jobs/professions but for me its been a carousel my whole life. It always seems like total hell when you get out of your comport zone and take on a new profession. There is always an adjustment period and the jobs usually suck until you get used to them OR have done them for enough time to get good at it. There is always training videos involved or classes to take but nothing prepares you for the real deal until you are doing it. The best training you can get is hands on and on the job training to best prepare you for the road ahead. The light will come on ALOT faster if they are getting real experience. If my job only let me work with real customers for 10 minutes a day and watch training videos for the other 7hrs and 50 minutes it would take an eternity to get proficient at my job verses 7hrs and 50 minutes of working and 10 minutes training. That is why CAL and UK is so good with the 3rd season and why HCBS has not been to 4 final fours in the last 5 seasons. If he truly wanted to play better in the 3rd season he should take notes from the guy that has his team firing on all 8 cylinders every March. Just my openion.
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Yes, I recall that two. And I seem to recall that was before injuries began to limit him.
I felt last mid year was the beginning of him reaching the productive part of his KU career, only to be slowed by injuries.
Injuries jump out with highly productive players, because that productivity drops sharply.
We overlook the effect of injuries in less highly productive players, but the injuries are just as limiting and sad.
Jamari may never have become the next Trob, but injuries and lost pop the last season and this seem to have robbed him from being the best he could have been.
Here’s hoping those legs recover their pop.
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Good take.
But for Cal’s way to work for Self, Self would need a similar stack of OADs as that dumped at Lexington, so Self could afford the same high spoilage rate as Cal.
What talking heads and board rats rarely consider is the high spoilage rate at UK.
Cal has more 2ADs, because he has more 1ADs.
And because he has had so many full dump truck loads of OADs for several years (before this apparent penalization for underperforming), the new guys coming in push a lot of one time OAD phenoms into journey men, or, worse, into broken spirits (Dakari Johnsons).
My argument against the NCAA and NBA allowing the OAD dump truck game is because it increases talent waste and makes players and universities bear the increased wastage of the system.
Pre OAD, a high school senior jumped and got big bucks even if he washed out. The system rewarded players for taking the risk of jumping early.
Now the system doesn’t.
If you wash out at college, you pay the cost and the NBA takes less risk.
Worse the dump truck stacking of talent appears to increase wastage.
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@jaybate-1.0 IF Coach Self adopted UK’s playing/recruiting OAD strategy I think KU could have its own personal stack of OAD’s. If Coach Self continues to play seniors over OAD’s then he will continue to have the same success rate recruiting OAD’s. This year Coach Self pretty much exclusively recruited 5 star talent but his 5 stars have had the least amount of PT among the rest of the field. I have stated this before about either adopt the UK handbook or get out of the OAD recruiting game. Go and develop 4 stars and exclusively recruit 4 star talent (or at least recruit 4 star talent). If coach Self thinks he is too good for the 4 star talent and doesn’t even bother to recruit them he is in for a rude awakening. Especially if he isn’t going to play the 5 star talent on his roster until the light comes on. I believe Cheicks Draft stock is going to go down the toilette just like Alexander’s if Coach Self doesn’t play him and develop Cheick while he has him. This years recruiting is a perfect example of why it cant and wont last.
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http://www.nbadraft.net/ranking/bigboard
Cheick has dropped 5 on this board.
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@Statmachine You said, “The best training you can get is hands on and on the job training to best prepare you for the road ahead.” This is seriously just common sense.
Does anyone remember Marquis Teague from Kentucky in 2012? A guy that Cal kept the lineup. When we played UK early in the season, he was really bad. Looked out of place. Turnovers. Had some major struggles. There was a nationally televised game vs. Louisville later in the year. He was absolutely horrible. But Cal stuck with him, kept playing him.
Part of this is that UK didn’t have much choice because Teague was about all they had at PG. But the point is that he improved immensely over the season. And if coach Self simply didn’t have his two security blankets, what would Self be doing right now? What would he have to do?
We’d just be better off in the final analysis if coach Self did not have even have the option of falling back on his security blankets. That’s just my opinion.
I agree with you completely, as you know. I would differentiate OADs vs. guys that will stay a second season. Diallo vs. Bragg. It would seem to me that simply avoiding those presumed OADs is really pretty easy to do. But geez, Diallo is being handled like a three year guy right now. Really, why bother? See Cliff – why bother?It’s all a big distraction. It was a big distraction leading up to the season with Diallo. I don’t need it, and I don’t want it.
Truth be told, and sorry about being harsh, but I would have much preferred we not even sign Diallo; but rather, have another non-presumed OAD in the fold.
Maybe I should take my own advice when I suggested in October we act like Diallo doesn’t exist, that we can just win without him?
It brings me back to the Tyler Davis discussion. Simply tell the kid that if he commits and signs, he is our guy. Period. No signing of OADs in the spring. We won’t get sucked in if an opportunity presents itself. Program building recruiting – that fits with our coach’s temperament and requirements.
@DinarHawk - Quick question, remember how Tarik Black struggled with the new rules enforcement in 2013-14? He was a fouling machine early. And really, he learned, as a senior, by experience. By playing and getting used to it. Also, importantly, “experience” makes mistakes too. But guys like Diallo will impact the game with activity and shot blocking, and the “net” might be better even with mistakes. Let’s look at Lucas, our designated post defender. Have you ever seen him really challenge a shot? Is he explosive vertically? Sure, he’s in good position, fundamentally sound. He uses his tools, and he defends with positioning. But that’s really it. I would argue that a guy like Diallo may be out of position more, but he’s quicker, can re-position, and he can better challenge shots. I’m not saying that Diallo is a better defender now than Lucas overall. I’m just saying that it isn’t going to take much for Diallo, with his natural talents and “y-axis” explosion, to surpass the slow footed, “x-axis” Lucas (credit to @drgnslayer on that one). Always appreciate your perspective on things.
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The give away is that OADs that can start at KU do start: Xavier, Selby and WIGGINS.
Self has made it pretty clear with those three that if you come to KU and can start, you start.
Self even made Selby start with a boot!
Self recruits OADs as heavily as anyone.
The problem appears to be they don’t sign as often as with some, so Self cannot start them as often.
And adidas-Self appears to have the same problems signing them that adidas-Pitino and adidas-Ryan have had.
It appears a shoe-brand-agency complex problem.
If you as a coach and school contract with the wrong shoe brand-agency complex, the dump trucks don’t apparently come as often. And when they do come, they more often bring the higher risk OADs.
If the dump trucks don’t come, you don’t have 5 low risk OADs to start. Or 4. At most you have 3, and more likely you have 2, 1, or none sign with you, regardless if your name is Self, Ryan, or Pitino.
In turn you have more 3rd,4th and 5th year guys for the higher risk OADs to have to beat out.
In Ryan’s memorable phrasing, it’s significantly about the “rent-a-players”.
And don’t forget Bo commented tersely on the refereeing at crunch time in the Finals, too.
I suspect the term “rent-a-players” and apparently asymmetric refereeing are ones to keep in mind for coming years.
At least that’s the hypothesis that fits the data so far.
You sign the Selbys, and Alexander’s. You get the OADs that aren’t really OADs at all. They are guys that don’t get drafted low, or not at all, get picked up in the NBA and often wash out shortly, or fill end of bench slots…
Self signs a Wiggins and he starts, gets drafted numerous uno, and becomes NBA rookie of the year.
Self signs Alexander, plays him 15 mpg before losing him to a loan investigation, then he isn’t drafted and sits on a bench in the L.
But either way, the dump trucks don’t come in the big numbers. The problem appears similar in Madison and Louisville.
The adidas conveyor appears the limiting factor for Self, Ryan and Pitino. It appears a pretty low number of players that are raided from the Nike, adidas or UA conveyors during college recruiting. Wiggins, Selby and Jaylen Brown come to mind.
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@HighEliteMajor I realize its common sense. Its also common sense that Coach Self has a Large amount of negative publicity when it comes to PT for OAD’s. I can not wrap my head around Coach Self’s recruiting tactics and PT for OAD’s. Why would one heavily recruit OAD’s and not give them the same advantage of PT that their counter parts in next years Draft have? Common sense would tell me that if you want to continue to recruit OAD talent you would have to give the ones you land every opportunity to prove that they are still OAD talent come the NBA draft. If you are not going to do so they are not going to get in line to play for you! If you are not going to play them and they are not lining up at the door then WHY recruit them so heavily. He pretty much snuffed the 4 star talent on this years ESPN top 100 and we are sitting on a goose egg in the 5 star department and KU spends like 400,000 recruiting (the most in college basketball). We spent 400,000 on Lightfoot! What a bargain! HCBS’s counter parts have pretty much cleaned up all of the 5 star recruits and spent less money doing so. WHY?
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The question is not why did Self take what few he could get?
The question is why did any come to Self, Pitino, or Ryan at all?
That reveals what drives the system.
Assuming you and others are right, and Self, Ryan and Pitino won’t start these guys, which I of course think the facts flatly contradict, why do these adidas-lean players go to these adidas-contracted schools and coaches at all???
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@jaybate-1.0 said:
Assuming you and others are right, and Self, Ryan and Pitino won’t start these guys, which I of course think the facts flatly contradict, why do these adidas-lean players go to these adidas-contracted schools and coaches at all???
I was aware AW had potential adidas-contract at the time. my question is how many others are there? it must be only a handful. just curious, JB at UC-Bears, that’s kind of odd, the fact that it’s not one of Adidas territory.
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@Statmachine That is what I have struggled with and, I think, is the crux of the matter. The facts would suggest that we are not the best place for the presumed OAD’s (although Wiggins didn’t hurt himself since he went #1).
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@Hawk8086 or embiid or Ben mac
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@Statmachine Understand that when I said it was just common sense, I was conveying that in support of your sensible post – meaning it’s hard for me to understand how others can’t see your logic.
You also as “why” at the end? It’s easy, if I’m an OAD I wouldn’t want to come to Kansas. As an OAD, I want my draft stock improved. There is just OAD that has ever come here and arguably had his draft stock improved – Embiid. Wiggins held serve. Embiid was still very high (per Pitino’s comment in summer of 2013), Selby dropped, X dropped, Cliff dropped, Oubre dropped. And BMac was not a presumed OAD.
The same qualities that folks are applauding in Self choosing “experience” now is exactly why an OAD would look to other programs. Fine with me. Look somewhere else.
Where Self is really in his zone is with guys like Marcus, TRob, Bmac, Markieff, Cole, Jackson, Arthur, Rush, Withey, etc. You bring in excellent players and they develop. Self will develop a guy when he has them for a couple of seasons. And he can win consistently with them. His 2012 team is the perfect model, in my opinion. 2008 had no OADs, though many thought Rush would turn pro.
To me, that would be a great selling point for the next tier. Just do it his way, the way he does it best.
@jaybate-1.0 The only reason to take a presumed OAD is if you think they will significantly impact your program now. In one year. No “raw”. No massive development curve. Now.
So …. you know my next question, don’t you?
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@Crimsonorblue22 Bmac wasn’t really a sure OAD when we recruited him and he red-shirted.But…those 2 do help the cause if we want to recruit the top guys.
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My hypothesis is : These apparent occasional defections seem to occur around times of reputed changes in net benefi expectations, I.e., around the time of James Harden getting $200M.
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Wild Guess Hypothesis: Diallo chose KU because:
a.) Harden signing shifted the net benefit expectation curve to an adidas school;
b.) KU and Self were most willing and likely influential among adidas schools to expedite getting him cleared;
c.) Self figured the clearance process would set Diallo back long enough to make him need a second season;
d.) Diallo’s handlers figured he might need a second season.
Now, Diallo and handlers have decided his best chance to get drafted early and high is to show he can make the 15 foot j in the 10-15 mpg he plays.
Shooting desperately and struggling with playing within the offense makes the pros less likely to take him.
And the more he shoots it the more Self sits him the second half.
Self is giving him rope.
Self is getting all he needs from him. Self said all he needs to do to help the team is rebound, dunk and bring energy.
Self didn’t say shoot 18 ft Js.
If a choice is to be made on developing Bragg, or Diallo, beyond the narrow roles assigned, Bragg gets the minutes till Diallo and his handlers commit to another season. Commitment will require stopping 15-18 ft jump shooting.
So why did Self want Diallo?
For C5.
Just a hypothesis though.
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HEM,
I doubt Top 25 guys choose based on their rank being improved. They are covering their down sides. If you are as good as your hype, you want two showcase scoring games–one each semester, plus you want to play but not have the saddle and be a target. This was what Self gave Xavier and Wigs. If you are overhyped, you want a place that can afford to let you figure things out, while playing on a winner in the headlines. You also want your flaws coached and masked. Self is giving Diallo this. But he and his handlers appear to want something more now to keep his rank from falling more.
Diallo is a year from being a big force in D1.
But he reputedly wants the money end of this season.
As long as Self just uses him for what he can do now we are gold.
There is no dividend to investing more in him, because the investment won’t pay till next season and he has so much raw athleticism the NBA will take him now.
Self is playing this perfectly.
We didn’t get anymore LOW RISK OADs after Wigs started and went first after 1 season.
That’s not how the system appears to work. You get what your shoeco-agency complex conveyor can give, no matter what. Rings didn’t matter after '08. Xavier didn’t matter. Wigs didn’t matter.
You can’t get blood from a turnip and you apparently can’t get 5-10 OADs from an adidas feeder system.
MOST APPEARANCES SUGGEST OADS ARE MARRIAGES OF CONVENIENCE DRIVEN BY SHOECO-AGENCY COMPLEX NET BENEFIT EXPECTATIONS AND SCHOOL/COACH CONTRACTS.
Diallo’s foundation is too low to coach him up to a dominant D1 player better than C5 in one season.
And even if he were, Self has no incentive at all to make the same mistake with Diallo he made with Embiid. He put a saddle on Embiid and that put a target on him, and that injured him, thus killing KU’s ring chances AND Embiid jumped.
So: His highest utility function to the team is what he is doing less the 18 ft Js.
The 18 ft Js appear to be bargaining chips about what his handlers seek for him this season for him to come back next season, or perhaps the light just hasn’t gone on yet?
To reiterate, all OADs appear to be marriages of convenience on both sides.
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I would kick everyone off this team but Diallo and Bragg. They are the only OAD or projected OAD or close enough. Sophomores and Juniors and Seniors are worthless, they did not get drafted so chuck em away.
Self should get rid of projects like Mason and Graham, and replace them with 2 OAD.
Selden should be told to pack his bags and go home because he is a Junior, he is not a OAD.
Svi, Greene, Ellis, all should go. They are not lotto picks. Replace them with projected lotto picks and OAD’s
FIRE BILL SELF.
This whole argument is because you have this entitlement that you should win titles every year or it is a wasted year.
I have been a fan since '92. Point to all these examples of championships we have won in that time. Tell, me, in Kansas history we have 3 championships? What exactly are you pointing to when you voice this entitlement of being a perennial champion. Every year we are competitive. Our conference streak, national tourney appearence streak. Our consistency, with luck, any year Kansas could sneak through. Every 4-5 years we have a real real good chance. That is life, get over it.
Self has won one championship and been to another. Have some faith and some appreciation, how many titles did you see before Self in your lifetime? 1? Some of you are of this awful instant gratification generation. Learn some respect. Have some perspective.
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@Second-Prize feel better now?
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It just funny, it silly. Spastic fans. I guess fan is short for fanatic.
Bill Self has got a raw deal from some of you all from the beginning.
Some of guys do not deserve a title until 2028, Teach you some manners.
Self should win a title this year and walk. Then take over at Duke or Kentucky someday and bring his team to Allen Fieldhouse and roll you. That is what some of you deserve. Teach you some humility.
Do you know Julius Caeser was once kidnapped by Sicillian pirates and ransomed. He was insulted by the ransom, raised it. When it was paid and he was freed, he raised a navy, came back, and killed them all. I hope you guys drive Self off.and he repays you in kind for the insult.
Yankee fans can feel entitlement at least, it not a false entitlement. 29 titles. Montreal in Hockey can feel entitled, title after title.
Show me all this rich history of championships and titles Self is not living up to. He has 1 and been to two finals. We have 3 total? Are you kidding me. We went 20 years without one until he came.
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@Second-Prize - i would save ypur loud n clear statement till the end of season. we’re not that far off, though…
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@Second-Prize Guess you’re not one to discuss the in’s and out’s of game, huh? Just Que sera, sera.
I’d be interested in your jayhawk history.
Personally, I love the give and take of this site and have learned so much. Now I’m able to watch the game with a more discerning eye because people do question moves, point out tendencies and then alternative ways of approaching an issue.
Sure sometimes it gets over the top, but really, why else do come to a site like this? To hear “great game” or “rough game” and the blah, blah, blah of a post-game interview where everyone tries to say nothing.
Great coaches and players watch lots of tape to break down tendencies and strategies. You think Coaches don’t have those same things that become part of the success and failures that teams have. That is what I see occur on this site, breaking down those things in a quest for greater excellence.
