What Chief's Game - Baylor Game Thread



  • Mahonnes still in…



  • Too many silly turnovers and missed FTs late, should’ve been a 15 point win. Rebounding was terrible the last 8 minutes.



  • @approxinfinity self knows it. Think they had a really good talk!



  • Take a road win and move along…coach them up



  • @Crimsonorblue22 Agree, it seems like they talked. He was calm this game, came in focused. Was there a report about a talk?



  • @approxinfinity no, just no dumb dribbling into crowds, etc



  • approxinfinity said:

    Really happy for Legerald, warts and all. Absolutely need good Vick to be a factor this year.

    but no more dribbling or passing more than necessary



  • approxinfinity said:

    Lagerald Vick, Player of the Game.

    Player of 36 minutes. That last 4 minutes might have been his worst stretch of the season.



  • Did it look like they flopped a lot? Thought they were rough w/Dedric



  • Damn good effort for 36 minutes today, last 4 overall were worse than the ISU game.



  • as to FT%, apart from Grimes & Dotson, everyone else shot 50% or worse from the line…just edged out 3pt shooting % 59% to 56%…



  • What happened to dot on throws?



  • As @BShark pointed out, FGA disparity was crazy 75-44, almost 30 more for BU. Just wow



  • Rebound margin 50-31 a crazy -19 for KU and on the offensive RB side of the ledger.



  • @Bwag

    Yeah that happens when there was little effort to rebound the ball.



  • In tight games we really dont have a player to count on for ft’s



  • @BeddieKU23 we did! D dot, Lawson’s and Vick too



  • @BeddieKU23 some of boards might be called fouls at other places?



  • @Crimsonorblue22

    Vick is terrible at the line and never gets there anyway. Dot is a freshman but normally is ok. Dedric is hit or miss. We certainly miss the svis, devonte and Frank’s of the world



  • Crimsonorblue22 said:

    @BeddieKU23 some of boards might be called fouls at other places?

    True about 10 muggings missed.



  • Crazy bad as our FT% was, FT’s are what won the game for us. 3pt makes were even at 9. They actually had 1 more made FG overall than us. That leaves FT’s, where we got 27-15 attempt margin and made 16 vs their 9…they edged us by <1% in FT%.

    Crazy statistical game



  • Today’s was Vick’s bday



  • Maybe he’ll get a passing game for it!



  • Or is that mean



  • @Bwag I’d say it’s a good thing🎁🤔



  • @Bwag If Tristan had played we may not have got any rebounds, and very well could have lost. Just pathetic!!!



  • Big Clyde52 said:

    @Bwag If Tristan had played we may not have got any rebounds, and very well could have lost. Just pathetic!!!

    Nah



  • Seriously we put in the B team, drew didnt, next time run up the score. Is that not what happened?



  • @Crimsonorblue22 Could be. But why did we act like we were running the old four corners offense in the last four minutes? Not quite the way you teach your team to finish a game.



  • Crimsonorblue22 said:

    He could send a pic of anyone

    I’d send a picture of Bezos.



  • Bwag said:

    @Bwag @approxinfinity if he’s running point and brings the ball down, is that touch 1?

    I think it is much worse than 'prox says. I am convinced Charlie thinks about stopping to shoot between every dribble, no matter where he is on the court–even after getting a defensive rebound. Heck, he probably think he should shoot when he catches an out of bounds ball while sitting on the bench.



  • Of course for the first 10 minutes we stopped them stone cold and grabbed every defensive rebound.



  • Big Clyde52 said:

    @Crimsonorblue22 Could be. But why did we act like we were running the old four corners offense in the last four minutes? Not quite the way you teach your team to finish a game.

    Bill’s fault.



  • @BShark Yeah, I think he took the blame, as well he should.



  • @Crimsonorblue22 Yep people forget that there run at the end started with Charlie, KJ and David on the floor. Dot missed 2 fts to start it aswell. I dont blame Self, we have a game Monday so getting guys out early and being able to keep them out would be been nice.



  • Well that was an interesting finish! Mother effer. A few things that stood out to me:

    — That’s how to use Vick. Less dribbling, more spot up shooting. Even less dribbling would be better.

    — Statistically Dotson looked good, but I thought he was a bit sloppy. Still love his ability to get to the hoop. His D was off too.

    — 26 offensive rebounds for Baylor? That has to be a typo, or a World Record. Somebody call Guinness. Or the NCAA to get Silvio cleared.

    — which brings me to PT for bigs other than D Lawson…about 20 minutes. Not much. Other guys have to man up and hit the boards.

    — crazy stat line: fg/3pt/ft percentages all in the 50s. Odd.

    — what did Mitch whisper in Self’s ear after he ran into dude’s head?

    — I think we found a worse free throw shooter than Dok (Vital)

    — ochai continues to impress. Looks good across the board. Was the initial red shirt Self’s worst decision since adding Anrio?

    — it’s official: I have decided Grimes simply does not look like a basketball player. Maybe a slugging outfielder?



  • jayhawkcsg said:

    — ochai continues to impress. Looks good across the board. Was the initial red shirt Self’s worst decision since adding Anrio?

    — it’s official: I have decided Grimes simply does not look like a basketball player. Maybe a slugging outfielder?

    This is truly bizarre. Such a quick turnaround too, just his second game in and Self had him inbound the ball in crunch time.

    The sample size is still extremely small but he looks really solid. Not going to take over a game at this point but just really solid. Somehow is ORTG went UP with the Baylor game, and it was 159 after his debut…

    Which leads into Grimes. Watching them play, who would anyone think was the much higher recruit? It’s just kind of sad with Q at this point. I think he swallows his pride and comes back, but we will see.

    Some of Q and Ochai’s stats are similar, but it’s how they get them and the fact that Ochai is MUCH better defensively. Now, obviously Ochai will not end up at 50% from three but it’s all the little things as well. Remarkable to see a FR so far along, let alone one that was taking a RS.



  • @jayhawkcsg I have to believe that it is mostly that Ochai has improved a lot…both Self and Ochai’s mother said as much. However, I agree, the calmness and the basketball IQ stuff must have been there from the start. Puzzling, indeed.



  • Here’s my observations from inside the arena yesterday.

    Agabaji looked like he may have an even bigger impact on this team than Silvio had last year.

    Without Doke, this is a bad rebounding team. Dedric is good rebounder for a 4, but he’s not good when he’s the lone post player. This is a 30+ point win if KU rebounded well yesterday. When Grimes (6) and Dotson (5) are your leading rebounders, that’s not good.

    Grimes needs to come back and he may end up being a 4 year guy. He’s a poor man’s Wayne Selden at this point.

    Marcus Garrett does not get enough credit for what he contributes to this team. He’s not a shooter and that will never be a strength of his and that’s fine. He does other things on offense to contribute. He sets good screens, he protects the ball, makes good passes, and gets others in good spots.

    One thing Insaw a couple of times that I think Self should do more to take advantage of Garrett’s lack of scoring is to stock Garrett in the corner when he doesn’t have ball in his hands. If a defender forgets about him or helps too far away, send Garrett to the basket for an easy lob. I still think Garrett should be running point more to get Dotson off the ball to take advantage of his shooting because he’s the best pure shooter KU has.

    Lagerald Vick was great for most of the game. It was good to see him making shots so hopefully he’s getting on another hot streak. His defense on King McClure was also way better than expected as well. His last few minutes were bad though. He should not be on the floor when teams are pressuring KU because he crumbles the brighter the spotlight.

    Dotson is not going to be a KU for 4 years. His on court leadership is getting better. He definitely still makes his share of freshman mistakes and likely will throughout the year.

    Dedric was Dedric on offense. A big part of the rebounding issues are because of how Dedric was playing defense. He was going for blocks and steals in the paint all game and ended up 5 of each. Those blocks and steals came at the expense of his rebounding though as he only had 3 of them. As great as it was to see Dedric get those blocks and steals, I don’t rebounding tradeoff was worth it though.

    KJ gave some good minutes in the first half and I’d like to see him play some more because I think it’s a matter of time before his offense get clicking and he can become a post scoring option off the bench for KU.

    Mitch needs to play alongside either Dedric or McCormack. He’s a great weak side player on both ends. He’s gelreat at helping and getting blocks and rebounds from the weak side. On offense, he’s good on the weak side as well getting easy lay ups and lobs when his man goes to double a second post.

    David McCormack has a very bright future at KU, but he showed yesterday why he’s not getting more minutes yesterday. Both of Baylor’s big runs yesterday started when McCormack was on the floor. He was so far out of position on defense yesterday that he’s why Baykir closed the gap midway through the first half and when Baylor began their comeback at the end of the game. He was also totally useless on offense as well. The two spots he came in for yesterday were ideal situations to try and get him extended minutes, but he was so terrible yesterday he couldn’t stay out there otherwise KU would’ve ended up losing.

    Charlie Moore is just not a good fit for this team. He’s a terrible defender, a ball hog on offense, and is out of control on most of his drives. I really wouldn’t be shocked to see him transfer out either after this season or next year as a grad transfer.

    This is a good team with an insanely high ceiling as the neutral court wins over Michigan St., Tennessee, and Marquette show. This is also a really young team that will have some hick ups and poor games like the end of the ASU and the entire ISU games shown. This isn’t a title team this year, the consistency just isn’t there this year due largely to youth, but should be a favorite next year as almost the entire core of this team will be back next year.



  • @Texas-Hawk-10 Very good summary. I also hope there is good news for SDS next year and Braun and Mackey can push our guards to the extent of their ability. Adding Hurt would be a bonus.



  • @Big-Clyde52 I don’t see Silvio ever playing college basketball again.



  • @Texas-Hawk-10 Fair points all around.

    Ochai is just so poised it’s insane. The opposite of Dave.

    I’ve wanted Dave to play more but when he plays like he did yesterday we see why he shouldn’t. He just isn’t ready.

    Agree on Grimes, will he swallow his pride or end up in Europe after this season? With his family ties to KU, I hope it works out that he sticks around.

    Garrett is very important to this team, the season flashed before my eyes when he was rolling around in pain for a bit. Does everything but shoot well.

    At this point, I’d happily take just a 2nd year from Dotson.

    Mitch as the lone big is very rough, the problem is as mentioned Dave isn’t ready and Silvio isn’t allowed to play. Not a lot of options here for Bill.

    I could see that as well with Charlie. Self clearly trusts Ochai and is giving him minutes. Mostly at the expense of Charlie who has played 10 total minutes (5 per game) in the last two games. His previous season low for a game was 11. Add to this that Self is bringing in two more guards already and is eyeing another combo guard, it’s hard to see how Charlie fits in next season.

    There is a fantasy world where every good player but Vick and Silvio return.



  • I only remember one big out of position error by Big Dave, and that was when we were pressing and he left his guy open under the bucket — or we assume it was his guy. I blame that more on us just putting the press into play, and not practicing much.

    Not his best game, but overblown, I think, to say he’s not ready for more action.



  • @jayhawkcsg Dave out of position a lot yesterday, and that play you specifically mentioned was absolutely his man. In a press, the 5 has under the basket in case someone leaks out.

    Most of his other issues were being slow on switches and other issues like that that aren’t as noticeable to a casual viewer.



  • @BShark My personal take on Charlie is that he’ll be back next year and be a grad transfer after 2020.

    Grimes seems to have a more level head on him tha. Selby did so I think he’ll be back.

    KU already has two committed with the two guaranteed openings. I think KU ends up losing two more with Silvio and Doke. I just don’t see Silvio ever getting cleared and I think he leaves late summer once that becomes the outcome. I think Doke leaves to start his pro career otherwise he might not have one if he comes back next year and has injury issues again.

    KU ends up anywhere between 2 and 6 openings and I think the number ends up being 4.



  • @Texas-Hawk-10 yea, I can’t argue he played well. And I did watch the game at midnight, so I was a bit bleary eyed. But, his performance in other games makes me believe he has earned the right to be on the floor.

    And in general it is fair to say our team struggles with defensive switches all over the floor. Way more so than in previous years.



  • @Texas-Hawk-10 I would be quite pleased with that roster, regardless of which recruits would be added.


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