we had 21 offensive rebounds and 4 second chance points. Wow!

Yep. This defined the game and it's stunning.

If you look at this team's record with these remarkably anomalistic, highly improbable and statistically aberrational numbers, you might be tempted to throw a couple of these losses out.

They are pretty good if you take away the weirdness. Or is it weirdness? What is the norm?

It's just hard to know whether this team can still gel and harden and normalize into its full potential at this point.

One thing that I think has to be resolved is the way the offense flows through DP at all times... even on breakaways. Watch the 2nd half when DP is on the floor and compare to when he isn't on the floor. After a defensive rebound, when DP is off the floor, Council pushes down the court and gets a shot at the rim. When DP is on the floor he pushes up the court, gets to the lane, stops and kicks the ball out to DP.

It happens too frequently to be the player's decision. It looks like this is how the team has been told to construct every offensive possession. They need to get back to everyone taking the best shot, no matter who that is. Sometimes that means kick out to DP, but sometimes that means drive to hoop and get 2 (or 3, if the refs don't have their heads too far up their butts, because Council gets hacked on those layups more often than not.)

I see the same thing and it’s a major problem, it maybe why we look worse most the time with DP on the floor at this point in the season. DP brings the ball up the floor for his personal benefit, to get his shot (this is okay at times, just not all the time). Council brings it up to get his teammates involved. I personally thought DP was better last night at this and had a season high 4 assists but it creates tension on the team. Why work my ass off to get open or hustle after that rebound if I have very little chance to get rewarded for doing such? I think that’s why so many of the guys just stand on offense when he has ball because they think he won’t pass it to him. It needs to be a 50/50 split at whom brings the ball up imo DP is most likely to play SG in the NBA than PG. He’s not a great athlete, passer or got great handles or anything that says NBA PG to me.

Not so fun with the box score!

Seems like a general repeat of the last KU loss:

FTs

KU -- 11-16

ASU -- 24-30

All the other main stats are similar. ugh.

Both teams were really terrible most the night shooting wise. Them getting 8 freethrows off of 3 techs and a laughable intentional foul when Elmarko hit the dang ball ( the guy double dribbled if you watch the replay to begin with.) was a huge factor in the games outcome. Probably one of the most insane stats I’ve ever seen is we had 21 offensive rebounds and 4 second chance points. Wow! My biggest issue we could’ve very easily overcame all of this if we just played hard the first 20 minutes. That’s probably what I’m most upset about.

It happens too frequently to be the player's decision. It looks like this is how the team has been told to construct every offensive possession. They need to get back to everyone taking the best shot, no matter who that is. Sometimes that means kick out to DP, but sometimes that means drive to hoop and get 2 (or 3, if the refs don't have their heads too far up their butts, because Council gets hacked on those layups more often than not.)

@bskeet We beat 2 of those 4 #1 seeds.

Right. And we lost to 2 of those 4 #1 seeds.

So is your glass half empty or half full with this team?

Yes... Sometimes I wonder... if DP traded for more minutes but at reduced aggressiveness?

-- Tiller: ok, we've seen enough of that spin move in the lane where you lose the ball behind you a lot, which leads to a breakaway and possibly a foul. no mas.

-- Tre: Be stronger at the rim. Stop these wimpy up and unders that don't seem to succeed much. Be strong in the lane. Get a foul called.

DP does not even look 80% out there. We are not seeing much benefit to him on the court anymore on either end. The situation is what it is. Given how tired this bunch looks or whatever is ailing them the benefit at this point is simply that he plays so Mari and Elmarko do not have to play even bigger minutes. We haven't seen whatever version of Peterson we were supposedly supposed to have in weeks now.

Poor Council has brought the juice in most games and it shouldn't be on all him. Kids a warrior and has kept this thing afloat when it might have fallen apart sooner.

This has been a fun year... hope we aren't sizzling out. Sure looks like there is some discontent on this team suddenly. Suck it up, boys!

Seems like a general repeat of the last KU loss:

FTs

KU -- 11-16

ASU -- 24-30

All the other main stats are similar. ugh.

@approxinfinity

We are seeing what kind of team this is, everything that was built has unraveled and happened quickly. If the only time they can play well is at home their fate will find a swift exit next week and the following one.

Officiating hit a new low last night but having 1 coach ejected and another T'd up before halftime is unacceptable and controllable behavior.

There seems to be stuff going on behind the scenes that we are not seeing that are playing out on the floor. Not connected, guys are playing me ball and you're not seeing the energy on either side of the ball. This is truly shocking to see after so much growth and development from this bunch.

They lack energy is really the nail on the head. Really need Council to set the tone. Pick up right at half court. Push the ball on rebounds and stress the defense.

The other thing is easy and that is DP needs to quit trying to draw fouls and start playing to and through contact. Refs let ‘em play late in the year. Always goes like that. He needs to adjust

@Tallturd1 I know what I’m thinking this morning and it isn’t good. But it’s the same feeling I had around this time of year the last two seasons. We are headed down the same path as Indiana basketball and Nebraska football.

UGH!

That was a fuc*ing embarrassment on every level. Players, refs, coaches. You name it.

Beat down by 20 in the first half? Against ASU? What the hell kind of team is this?

That’s the biggest issue for me is that before the refs could make them game all about them. We came out of the gate with zero energy whatsoever.

We are seeing what kind of team this is, everything that was built has unraveled and happened quickly. If the only time they can play well is at home their fate will find a swift exit next week and the following one.

Officiating hit a new low last night but having 1 coach ejected and another T'd up before halftime is unacceptable and controllable behavior.

There seems to be stuff going on behind the scenes that we are not seeing that are playing out on the floor. Not connected, guys are playing me ball and you're not seeing the energy on either side of the ball. This is truly shocking to see after so much growth and development from this bunch.

Beat down by 20 in the first half? Against ASU? What the hell kind of team is this?

With this being our 9th loss and 4 out of the last 6 being Ls, who here thinks this team is lost and done? Bill Self in his first 20 years at Kansas had zero teams lose 11 or more games. This year barring the biggest miracle in sports history it will be 3 consecutive years of 11 or more games. Kansas has made it out of the first weekend but 1 time in the last 7 years. It’s time to ask difficult questions. The first one is should Bill Self be coaching Kansas going forward?

I can honestly say I hope he not is back next season. I don’t think he had the right mindset to coach in this era of college sports. Yes I’m well aware we won a title technically in the NIL era but it was with guys that were upper class men he developed here, not a team that returns 2 guys that have seen the floor every season.

Old Goats got one more in ‘em.

Also just look at Indiana, UK and UCLA. Only way you move on is if you have a top guy lined up like Otz. And even then no guarantees.